Looking for new functionality

[ernobe]

Hi,

I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
functionality I'm looking for. I don't think it deletes the downloaded
bodies, rather what I think is happening is that the authors of KNode
anticipated that articles could be cancelled or superseded on the server,
and therefore avoided making such marks persistent. But it could check to
see if there is a newer version, and if there is download it in addition
to, not as a replacement of, the existing one. The reasoning behind all
this is that the ability to keep track of what one has already read is
needed to avoid the wasting of time and confusion. The easy way out of
this would be to not exit KNode, because such marks don't disappear within
the same session. But in that case, then if for some reason the computer
looses power, all those marks will be lost.

[Stan Brown]

On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 11:10:39 -0600, ernobe wrote:
> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
> doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
> downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
> KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
> functionality I'm looking for.

Gravity has that. It's freeware, currently hosted at Steve Gibson's
GRC site:

https://www.grc.com/discussions.htm

and scroll down to "Newsgroup Reading Software:"



--
Stan Brown, Tehachapi, California, USA https://BrownMath.com/
Shikata ga nai...

[J.B. Nicholson]

ernobe <ern...@mail.com> wrote:
> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one
> (KNode) doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it
> is, articles with downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but
> this mark disappears when KNode exits. The ability to make such
> marks persistent is the new functionality I'm looking for.

Part of what you're asking about applies to KNode specifically. I
can't address that. It also sounds like you are separating what's
marked as read in a newsreading session (typically the job of a
newsreader) from what is downloaded from an upstream news server and
retain in a proxy's cache.

Consider setting up a proxy server (which downloads article bodies)
and using a newsreader that gets its articles from the proxy instead
of the upstream news server. Whether you choose a program that wraps
up the proxying and newsreading in one program, splits newsreading and
proxying into separate programs, or you use a newsreader which is
configured to get its articles from a proxy is up to you.

slrn[1] with slrnpull (included with slrn) is one of the programs that
will do this. slrn is an online newsreader that works with or without
slrnpull. slrn will keep track of articles you mark read in a session
(and with a macro, like Stickytags[2], slrn will keep articles in a
group marked with an asterisk across sessions).

slrnpull fetches articles, keeps track of what it downloaded, and
offers articles to slrn for your slrn sessions.

slrn, slrnpull, and Stickytags are each free software (you're free to
run, inspect, share, and modify the programs).


[1] http://slrn.sourceforge.net/
[2] https://forestfield.org/slrn/#stickytags

[ernobe]

On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 22:42:03 -0000 (UTC), J.B. Nicholson wrote:

>
> slrn[1] with slrnpull (included with slrn) is one of the programs that
> will do this. slrn is an online newsreader that works with or without
> slrnpull. slrn will keep track of articles you mark read in a session
> (and with a macro, like Stickytags[2], slrn will keep articles in a
> group marked with an asterisk across sessions).
>
> slrnpull fetches articles, keeps track of what it downloaded, and offers
> articles to slrn for your slrn sessions.
>
> slrn, slrnpull, and Stickytags are each free software (you're free to
> run, inspect, share, and modify the programs).
>

A long time ago I used slrn, and would try to configure it with slrnpull
and stickytags as you suggest. If you search this newsgroup you're likely
to find evidences of me bemoaning my plight. If you're the author of
stickytags, thanks anyway for stimulating efforts in the right direction.
But I could never get it to work. If I remember correctly, I had an
external program setup to keep track of the message-ids on slrnpull in
order to supply stickytags with the exact message-ids that slrn should
tag. I had given up trying to tag anything within slrn, because
stickytags was only trying to make slrns' own tags sticky, none of which
referred to the downloaded article bodies in slrnpull. It's actually
quite a simple thing I was trying to accomplish, however without
cooperation with the upstream author it starts to go from interesting
hobby to a real pain.

[ernobe]

Gnus works! I had forgotten this because of the confusing nature of Emacs
itself. The result I was looking for in the first place was simply to
have it remember locally stored articles from one session to another.
It does this, but I became so caught up in the overall configuration of
Emacs, which is not a simple thing overall, that I forgot about it.
Then I was trying other newsreaders, like KNode and Pan, and even
complaining about them on newsgroups, not realizing that the
solution had been found already. If anyone wants to get to set it up
for themselves, you can copy my .emacs and .gnus files:

~/.emacs file:

--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
;
; emacs
;
(defalias 'yes-or-no-p 'y-or-n-p)
(defun roys-kill-buffer ()
(interactive)
(kill-buffer (current-buffer)))
(defun roys-speed ()
(interactive)
(if (display-graphic-p)
(speedbar)
(ibuffer)))

(global-set-key (kbd "<f1>") 'switch-to-prev-buffer)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f2>") 'switch-to-next-buffer)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f3>") 'roys-speed)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f4>") 'query-replace)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f5>") 'set-mark-command)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f6>") 'yank)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f7>") 'copy-region-as-kill)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f8>") 'kill-region)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f9>") 'roys-kill-buffer)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f10>") 'delete-window)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f11>") 'delete-other-windows)
(global-set-key (kbd "<f12>") 'delete-frame)
(global-set-key (kbd "C-c i") 'ibuffer)
(global-set-key (kbd "C-c m") 'menu-bar-mode)
(global-set-key (kbd "C-c k") 'save-buffers-kill-emacs)
(global-unset-key (kbd "C-z"))

(let ((map mode-line-buffer-identification-keymap))
(define-key map [mode-line mouse-2]
'speedbar))

(custom-set-variables
;; custom-set-variables was added by Custom.
;; If you edit it by hand, you could mess it up, so be careful.
;; Your init file should contain only one such instance.
;; If there is more than one, they won't work right.
'(browse-url-browser-function (quote w3m-browse-url))
'(dired-dwim-target t)
'(display-time-day-and-date t)
'(display-time-mode t)
'(fill-column 80)
'(inhibit-startup-screen t)
'(menu-bar-mode nil)
'(mm-text-html-renderer (quote w3m))
'(mode-line-format
(quote
("%e" mode-line-front-space mode-line-mule-info mode-line-client mode-line-modified mode-line-remote mode-line-frame-identification " " mode-line-position " " mode-line-buffer-identification
(vc-mode vc-mode)
" " mode-line-modes mode-line-misc-info mode-line-end-spaces)))
'(read-mail-command (quote gnus))
'(scroll-bar-mode (quote right))
'(tool-bar-mode nil)
'(w3m-bookmark-default-section "Bookmark")
'(w3m-key-binding (quote info)))

(custom-set-faces
;; custom-set-faces was added by Custom.
;; If you edit it by hand, you could mess it up, so be careful.
;; Your init file should contain only one such instance.
;; If there is more than one, they won't work right.
'(default ((t (:inherit nil :stipple nil :inverse-video nil :box nil :strike-through nil :overline nil :underline nil :slant normal :weight normal :height 120 :width normal :foundry "PfEd" :family "DejaVu Sans Mono"))))
'(gnus-summary-high-unread ((((type tty)) (:foreground "green"))))
'(gnus-summary-low-ancient ((((type tty)) (:foreground "yellow"))))
'(gnus-summary-low-read ((((type tty)) (:foreground "magenta"))))
'(gnus-summary-normal-read ((((type tty)) (:foreground "red"))))
'(gnus-summary-normal-unread ((((type tty)) (:foreground "white"))))
'(gnus-summary-selected ((((type tty)) (:background "yellow")))))
; '(mode-line ((((type tty)) (:foreground "green"))))
; '(mode-line-inactive ((((type tty)) (:foreground "white")))))

;; hooks
;
(add-hook 'text-mode-hook 'flyspell-mode)
(add-hook 'text-mode-hook 'auto-fill-mode)
(add-hook 'prog-mode-hook 'flyspell-prog-mode)

;; package repo (do M-x list-packages)
;
(when (> emacs-major-version 23)
(require 'package)
(package-initialize)
(add-to-list 'package-archives
'("melpa" . "http://melpa.milkbox.net/packages/")
'APPEND))

;; init
;
(server-mode 1)
(display-time)

--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8---

~/.gnus file:

--8<---------------cut here---------------start------------->8---
;
; gnus
;
(gnus-add-configuration
'(article
(vertical 1.0
(summary 15 point)
(article 1.0))))
(setq gnus-activate-level 4)
(setq gnus-after-exiting-gnus-hook (quote (delete-frame)))
(setq gnus-always-force-window-configuration t)
(setq gnus-agent nil)
(setq gnus-ancient-mark 32)
(setq gnus-article-mode-line-format "U%U %S")
(setq gnus-fetch-old-headers t)
(setq gnus-group-line-format "%L%S%B %5N:%M:%-5R %* %(%g%) %O
")
(setq gnus-group-sort-function (quote (gnus-group-sort-by-unread)))
(setq gnus-header-face-alist
(quote
(("From" nil gnus-header-subject)
("" gnus-header-name gnus-header-content))))
(setq gnus-interactive-exit nil)
(setq gnus-large-newsgroup nil)
(setq gnus-level-default-subscribed 5)
(setq gnus-level-subscribed 5)
(setq gnus-message-archive-group "my-posts")
(setq gnus-parameters
'((".*"
(display . default))
))
(setq gnus-permanently-visible-groups ".*")
(setq gnus-posting-styles
'((".*"
(name "ernobe")
(address "ern...@yahoo.com")
(organization "World Order of Baha'u'llah")
(signature-file "~/.signature"))))
(setq gnus-score-expiry-days nil)
(setq gnus-score-interactive-default-score 1)
(setq gnus-secondary-select-methods (quote ((nnml ""))))
(setq gnus-select-method (quote (nnspool "")))
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-false-root nil)
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-indent " ")
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-leaf-with-other "")
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-root nil)
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-single-indent nil)
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-single-leaf "")
(setq gnus-sum-thread-tree-vertical " |")
(setq gnus-summary-line-format "%[%U%R%2i%] %B |_%(%f%)%*
")
(setq gnus-summary-mode-line-format "U%U %S")
(setq gnus-summary-thread-gathering-function (quote gnus-gather-threads-by-references))
(setq gnus-thread-hide-subtree t)
(setq gnus-thread-sort-functions (quote gnus-thread-sort-by-most-recent-date))
(setq gnus-treat-hide-citation t)
(setq gnus-unread-mark 42)
(setq gnus-use-adaptive-scoring nil)
(setq gnus-use-cache nil)
(setq gnus-use-dribble-file nil)
(setq gnus-visible-headers "^From:")
;
; nnspool
;
(setq nnspool-active-file "~/spool/data/active")
(setq nnspool-inews-program "sh")
(setq nnspool-inews-switches '("-c" "cat >~/spool/out.going/X$(date +%s)-$$-1.$LOGNAME"))
(setq nnspool-nov-directory "~/spool/news")
(setq nnspool-spool-directory "~/spool/news")
;
; uncomment to enable agent, then invoke gnus with 'gnus-unplugged' (not recommended)
;
;(setq gnus-agent t)
;(setq gnus-agent-expire-days 55)
;(setq gnus-nntp-server "news.eternal-september.org")
;
; uncomment (and edit) for mail
;
;(setq user-mail-address "ern...@yahoo.com")
;(setq smtpmail-default-smtp-server "smtp.mail.yahoo.com")
;(setq smtpmail-local-domain "yahoo.com")
;(setq user-full-name "Roy Fullmer")
;(setq mail-sources nil)
;(setq mail-sources (quote ((pop :server "pop.mail.yahoo.com"
; :port 995
; :user "ern...@yahoo.com"
; :password ""))))

--8<---------------cut here---------------end--------------->8---

As you can see, you must use a spool directory. Install slrnpull, and
configure it to populate it with your favorite newsgroup posts, then
make sure the spool directory setting in my .gnus file above corresponds with
your spool location (also edit the newsgroup name and email settings).


--
https://archive.org/services/purl/bahai

[Sqwertz]

On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 09:27:34 -0800, Stan Brown wrote:

> On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 11:10:39 -0600, ernobe wrote:
>> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
>> doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
>> downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
>> KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
>> functionality I'm looking for.
>
> Gravity has that. It's freeware, currently hosted at Steve Gibson's
> GRC site:
>
> https://www.grc.com/discussions.htm

But Gravity doesn't natively run on Linux (like KNode).

Thunderbird, OTOH, doesn't cache articles between sessions. But
it does remember keep, kill/ignore, and read flags between
sessions. Presumably, Seamonkey any other spinoffs of Netscape 4.x
that include the newsreader would also.

-sw

-sw

[Stan Brown]

On Tue, 14 Feb 2023 03:58:56 -0600, Sqwertz wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 09:27:34 -0800, Stan Brown wrote:
>
> > On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 11:10:39 -0600, ernobe wrote:
> >> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
> >> doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
> >> downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
> >> KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
> >> functionality I'm looking for.
> >
> > Gravity has that. It's freeware, currently hosted at Steve Gibson's
> > GRC site:
> >
> > https://www.grc.com/discussions.htm
>
> But Gravity doesn't natively run on Linux (like KNode).
>

Sorry, I didn't read your mind to know you were on Linux. If I were
familiar with Knode, I might have known that it runs only on Linus,
but I'm not.

[Sqwertz]

On Tue, 14 Feb 2023 02:08:43 -0800, Stan Brown wrote:

> On Tue, 14 Feb 2023 03:58:56 -0600, Sqwertz wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 09:27:34 -0800, Stan Brown wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 11:10:39 -0600, ernobe wrote:
>>>> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
>>>> doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
>>>> downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
>>>> KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
>>>> functionality I'm looking for.
>>>
>>> Gravity has that. It's freeware, currently hosted at Steve Gibson's
>>> GRC site:
>>>
>>> https://www.grc.com/discussions.htm
>>
>> But Gravity doesn't natively run on Linux (like KNode).
>>
>
> Sorry, I didn't read your mind to know you were on Linux.

Why would you read *my* mind? You didn't even know I existed
until 16 hours ago <boggle>.

-sw

[Rockinghorse Winner]

On 2023-02-14, Stan Brown <the_sta...@fastmail.fm> wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Feb 2023 03:58:56 -0600, Sqwertz wrote:
>> On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 09:27:34 -0800, Stan Brown wrote:
>>
>> > On Sun, 12 Feb 2023 11:10:39 -0600, ernobe wrote:
>> >> I'm looking for a newsreader with functionality which my current one (KNode)
>> >> doesn't have, or a way to recompile KNode with it. As it is, articles with
>> >> downloaded bodies can be marked as unread, but this mark disappears when
>> >> KNode exits. The ability to make such marks persistent is the new
>> >> functionality I'm looking for.
>> >
>> > Gravity has that. It's freeware, currently hosted at Steve Gibson's
>> > GRC site:
>> >
>> > https://www.grc.com/discussions.htm
>>
>> But Gravity doesn't natively run on Linux (like KNode).

You may be surprised to learn that Windows is not the only operating system.
:)

>
> Sorry, I didn't read your mind to know you were on Linux. If I were
> familiar with Knode, I might have known that it runs only on Linus,
> but I'm not.
>


--

'Many have sought in vain to tell joyously of the Most Joyous. Now at last It declares
Itself to me, now in this misery.' - Holderlin
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