Please help: Net Abuse by WIGCORP@ISTAR.CA
Anais69
Please forgive the length of the post. It's an excerpt from my recent e-mail
to ISTAR.CA regarding a real nasty at their domain. I am not the only one who
has notified them REPEATEDLY and our ng would welcome any suggestions on
getting this troll out of our hair.
Dear Sirs:
On January 1st, I reported to you this user's libelous, homophobic and
off-topic posts to alt.music.cheap-trick often casting aspersions on others
sexual orientation and using forged headers, and asking that you take action to
curb what is surely a violation of your TOS. I am aware that others who have
received threatening and harrassing e-mail or been "impostered" by this user
have notified you as well.
We have yet to see any action from you, or receive so much as an
acknowledgement of our complaints. Harrassment from wig...@istar.ca has
continued. What follows are excerpts from just a sampling of the posts he has
directed toward women in this newsgroup since we lodged our complaints with
you:
___________________________________________________
In article <34B464...@myass.cum>, Hosebags R Us <C...@myass.cum> writes:
<<Hey, Tiff... I bet your mother is real proud of you. Let me guess,
you're just some dumb, useless piece of dogshit who thinks they are
funny because they can string a few words together and 'pretend' it's a
sentence. Why don't you wrap your Wonder Woman hands around my large
male member and stroke me until I spirt on your ugly face!!! >>
Message-ID: <34B464...@myass.cum>
From: Hosebags R Us <C...@myass.cum>
Reply-To: Di...@yourmouth.cum
Organization: Bite Me, Fuck me and Stroke Me
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts50-13.ott.istar.ca NNTP-Posting-Date:
Wed, 07 Jan 1998 20:24:46 EST
_________________________________________________________
In article <34B494...@istar.ca>, "Marc I. Wigle" <wig...@istar.ca>
writes:
<<Lady!! Lady!! You're far from being considered a lady, even by some
drugged up, drunken prick at a CT concert!! Of course, some people call
females such as you lady but, they usually have 'of the evening' tagged
after. How many 'friends' will you make at TF2? Bring change for all of
those five dollar bills that the guys wil be offering for your 'special'
services.>>
NNTP-Posting-Host: ts29-15.ott.istar.ca
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 23:57:41 EST
____________________________________________________
The latter post was directed at myself. If ISTAR does not wish to
be a party to any legal problems this user may bring upon himself,
enforce your TOS and curb wig...@istar.ca immediately!
Caro
In article <19980110013...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
ana...@aol.com wrote to the newsgroup...
>... excerpt from my recent e-mail
>to ISTAR.CA regarding a real nasty at their domain.
>... I would welcome any suggestions on
>getting this troll out of our hair.
>...What follows are excerpts from just a sampling of the posts he has
>directed toward women in this newsgroup since we lodged our complaints
[snipped obscenities/abuse from "Marc I. Wigle" wig...@istar.ca]
I looked in your newsgroup and noticed that someone apparently posted
this person's employment information and telephone number at work, in
retaliation for his trolling your group. I moderate a newsgroup which
has been the victim of endless pranks (forgeries, impersonations,
fraud, libel, fake emails, threats, hate websites, etc., etc.) by a
gang of trolls. This has been going on for about a year. I recently
began including the names of the abusers in the group's welcome
document so that members of the group I moderate will know who the
malicious pranksters are. In doing this, I've been accused of trying
to get people fired from their jobs, and there are lies circulating
that I've actually contacted the trolls' employers, etc. I came here
to the net-abuse group because one of the trolls was canceling posts
in our group which he considered to contain "private" information
about himself and friends of his. His gang of trolls proceeded to
flood the net-abuse group with ever-increasingly hysterical rants
about me, the vast majority of which I've ignored, and some of which
I haven't read at all. The trolls who have harassed us for a year or
so are trying to start a movement to allow them to cancel posts they
don't like (i.e., those which identify them). There's been scant
interest in that idea, but there has been sympathy for the trolls
who complain that publication of their names is an invasion of
privacy.
The advice you'll be given is to ignore, ignore, ignore, to put
yourself above the usenet war game and act as though the trolls
don't even exist. This isn't bad advice because in most cases a
troll or two who's just looking for a fight will get bored and move
on if he's deprived of attention (shut out by the whole group, if
that's possible). When you have a league of trolling friends who get
together and try to terrorize and intimidate people from posting
to your group in a endless parade of malicious pranks and games,
ignoring becomes a bit more difficult a task.
Good luck.
~Caro
Anais69
Thank you very much for your reply. Yes we recently posted - or rather
"re-posted" this trolls work number. Oddly enough, he is a posting from his
business account and accidentally included the name of his firm, the cities
it's offices are located in and the phone numbers in the sig line of an early
post. As he is apparently the business owner, I'm not very worried that he can
accuse any of us of trying to get him fired. It has however been a matter of
some debate on the ng where we should draw the line on posting personal
information in the future.
However controversial posting this kind of information may be, it seems to have
worked in the case of this particular troll. Anonymity brings out the worst
in some people and apparently the idea being potentially held accountable for
the actions of his "net-life" in the "real" world, was unpalatable.
I am sorry to hear of the difficulties the troll situation on your ng has
caused you.. I am presently suggesting our ng initiate an FAQ which would
debunk the most frequent hoaxes, give e-mail addresses for official sources,
and provide information on the domains/netnames the malicious mischief is
emanating from.
Thanks again.
Theron
On 11 Jan 1998 03:23:34 GMT, ana...@aol.com (Anais69) wrote in
article <19980111032...@ladder01.news.aol.com>:
>Thank you very much for your reply. Yes we recently posted - or rather
>"re-posted" this trolls work number.
I just came across this article and see that it's a dead issue. Your
situation may or may not have involved a situation in which it was
appropriate and I'm not saying you were definitely wrong.
But here's a question: If somebody posts some words that you don't
like to read, that you can easily killfile, why is "No food or rent
money" a just punishment?
Do you feel it is appropriate to risk putting someone out of work just
because he's stupid? Maybe the person is sufficiently mean to deserve
such, maybe not. Are his dependents mean also? What if you
inadvertently get someone else's work number, thinking it's his?
It's very easy to get so mad that you want to make a person
responsible for his actions. But when you bring these things into
real life and cannot foretell the consequences for other people, or
even to be absolutely positive you have the right person, you are
merely escalating from words to real-world hostility. Is it right to
punch someone out because he cusses at you?
If you have a valid grievance against what's emanating from an
*account* then take action against that *account*. If you have a
valid legal grievance, then I'm sorry to say it's up to you to spend
the time and money to address it legally.
<snip>
I've removed the crap posted by the person you've been talking to, but
this is another example of how easily anyone can say anything and be
believed. amet...@nc5.infi.net not only posts people's names,
addresses and places of employment, she outright lies about who did
what. Beyond that, she encourages other people to contact people's
employers to get them fired rather than do it herself. She is the
prime example that led me to examine the - in her case - wrongfulness
and disgracefully irresponsible nature of this entire behavior because
she takes it to an extreme by lying and libeling.
Theron
!!the...@pobox.com
delete !! to email - it's a spam-trap
Theron
On 10 Jan 1998 04:51:39 GMT, amet...@nc5.infi.net (Caro) wrote in
article <696uor$hvn$1...@nw001.infi.net>:
>In article <19980110013...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
>ana...@aol.com wrote to the newsgroup...
>
>>... excerpt from my recent e-mail
>>to ISTAR.CA regarding a real nasty at their domain.
>>... I would welcome any suggestions on
>>getting this troll out of our hair.
>>...What follows are excerpts from just a sampling of the posts he has
>>directed toward women in this newsgroup since we lodged our complaints
>
>[snipped obscenities/abuse from "Marc I. Wigle" wig...@istar.ca]
>
>
>I looked in your newsgroup and noticed that someone apparently posted
>this person's employment information and telephone number at work, in
>retaliation for his trolling your group. I moderate a newsgroup which
>has been the victim of endless pranks (forgeries, impersonations,
>fraud, libel, fake emails, threats, hate websites, etc., etc.) by a
>gang of trolls. This has been going on for about a year. I recently
>began including the names of the abusers in the group's welcome
>document so that members of the group I moderate will know who the
>malicious pranksters are.
That screed is only convincing when people don't have any reason to
believe you're lying through your teeth. You've been posting my name
for months and saying "You can get his name on the Web" and then
posting articles saying, "Yes, all the people on this list should get
fired". I've never done anything even remotely illegal on the
Internet, have done no worse than argue with you - while following
basic rules you ignore - and have ignored you for weeks and months
only to see my name in your FAQ.
You also managed to mistake some guy who had nothing to do with any of
us and libel the holy hell out of him, posting his full name and place
of employment. You bring this stuff to such an extreme that it's
utterly grostesque. If you ever succeed in causing me professional
harm by lying as you've tried to do for months now, I'm going to sue
you right down to your undershorts. Your blanket statements and
idiotic mistakes of identity are so horrendously libelous that you
could easily be a test case for "harassing a person using the
Internet".
> In doing this, I've been accused of trying
>to get people fired from their jobs, and there are lies circulating
>that I've actually contacted the trolls' employers, etc.
When someone asked in alt.fan.keanu-reeves.moderated whether posting
names was a bit much, you said very strongly that everyone in the
newsgroup should try to effect professional reprisals against the
people named. Your psycho buddies continued to whoop it up, most
notably bgr...@ral.mindspring.com, who wanted meetings with the
employer of the guy you mistakenly thought had anything do to with
this part of Usenet. I'm told that bgr...@ral.mindspring.com, who
obtained my name via US mail before I learned she is a lunatic, indeed
paper mailed someone's employer. She has yet to deny it despite my
mentioning it and continues to shout that she wants to do it.
The worst Usenet offense that any of the various "trollers" and
"harrassers" have done is to use email names that resemble those of
others. I don't do that because I'm basically too square. Yet you
continue to damn me and have every hope of causing me proessional
harm.
>I came here
>to the net-abuse group because one of the trolls was canceling posts
>in our group which he considered to contain "private" information
>about himself and friends of his.
The last time we showed up in this newsgroup it was because you were
THIRD-PARTY CANCELING OTHERS' ARTICLES, including MINE. The posts
were examined and and the cancelations found to be utterly
indefensible. You simply ignored the rules.
>His gang of trolls proceeded to
>flood the net-abuse group with ever-increasingly hysterical rants
>about me, the vast majority of which I've ignored, and some of which
>I haven't read at all. The trolls who have harassed us for a year or
>so are trying to start a movement to allow them to cancel posts they
>don't like (i.e., those which identify them). There's been scant
>interest in that idea, but there has been sympathy for the trolls
>who complain that publication of their names is an invasion of
>privacy.
I don't expect any sympathy for having bickered with you in more
newbie days, or for my foolishness in letting my name get out when
psychos like you are wandering the Net.
But this crap about your being victimized in some fashion has only the
barest shreds of truth to back it up. You've actively disrupted
alt.fan.keanu-reeves almost since you got there, and only leave off
doing it when your behavior is so utterly obvious that even a casual
onlooker would condemn it.
>
>The advice you'll be given is to ignore, ignore, ignore, to put
>yourself above the usenet war game and act as though the trolls
>don't even exist. This isn't bad advice because in most cases a
>troll or two who's just looking for a fight will get bored and move
>on if he's deprived of attention (shut out by the whole group, if
>that's possible). When you have a league of trolling friends who get
>together and try to terrorize and intimidate people from posting
>to your group in a endless parade of malicious pranks and games,
>ignoring becomes a bit more difficult a task.
>
>Good luck.
>~Caro
That's the only thing that works, good advice I generally take with
regard to YOU and YOUR TROLLING and HARASSMENT. There is such a huge
paper trail of your deceit, irresponsiblity and wild, loose-cannon
hostility in real life that you should give up on playing the victim.
So far as I know, nobody is doing anything to actively interfere with
your right to have a moderated newsgroup. So why don't you enjoy the
little fantasy you've created and leave other people the hell alone.
If you manage to make any progress in screwing up anybody's income you
are going to get sued.
freespe...@aol.com
It appears that this guy is Marc Wigle and he now is doing the same to
us. Anything you can offer would be appreciated..
http://freespeechstore.com/Qresults.asp?Search_Keyword=wigle&btnSearch2=Find+Speech
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=wigle+freespeechstore&qt_s=Search+Groups
Anais69 wrote:
> Please forgive the length of the post. It's an excerpt from my
recent e-mail
> to ISTAR.CA regarding a real nasty at their domain. I am not the
only one who
> has notified them REPEATEDLY and our ng would welcome any suggestions
on
> getting this troll out of our hair.
>
> Dear Sirs:
>
> On January 1st, I reported to you this user's libelous, homophobic
and
> off-topic posts to alt.music.cheap-trick often casting aspersions on
others
> sexual orientation and using forged headers, and asking that you take
action to
> curb what is surely a violation of your TOS. I am aware that others
who have
> received threatening and harrassing e-mail or been "impostered" by
this user
> have notified you as well.
>
> We have yet to see any action from you, or receive so much as an
> acknowledgement of our complaints. Harrassment from wig...@istar.ca
has
> continued. What follows are excerpts from just a sampling of the
posts he has
> directed toward women in this newsgroup since we lodged our