What They Broke in 6.1 Messenger (NEWS)
michael
michael wrote:
> Longtime netscape fan here. Here's what no longer works for me in 6.1
>
> Please let me know if there is a workaround for any of these issue, or
> if I just have to suck it up and contemplate going back to version 4.7x
>
>
> 1. You can no longer follow threads backwards by clicking on the
> hyperlinked numbers of the preceding messages in the thread, because
> those hyperlinked numbers no longer exist.
>
>
> 2. Loss of all ability to specify where you want your text to wrap.
> Well, you can, and I always want it to wrap at 60 characters, but it
> only works when I'm typing in the message window, but once I hit send,
> the message will look different and not wrap at 60 characters, but will
> spread all the way across the screen.
>
> 3.In v 4.7x, you would have a caret at the top of your message pane,
> which would indicate to you where your text was going to wrap. That is
> also gonzo like alonzo mourning
>
> 4. You can select multiple messages in binary groups and save as *.uue,
> effectively making netscape useless with respect to many binary groups.
that should read "can't"
> 5. I can't seem to find a way to open the drafts folder in another
> window, so I can preview my message, without affecting the group that
> I'm currently reading, but I could do that easily in version 4.7x
>
>
>
> But the most important thing to me, is the message preview. I really
> want to be able to see what the person on the other end will see, before
> I hit send, and I want to be able to control where the text wraps. I've
> attached a .gif (whiners will be ignored) of what this message looks
> like as I'm typing it. I just want to know how to get it to look that
> when it arrives on the newsgroup.
>
> thanks!
>
>
> this is Michael
> reporting live...
> http://dogtv.com
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> broken.gif
>
> Content-Type:
>
> image/gif
> Content-Encoding:
>
> base64
>
>
NLReisner
how to request a 'return receipt' when sending e-mail?!?!? Seems missing
to me???
Thx...Nancy
Fulvio Perini wrote:
> michael wrote:
>
>> Longtime netscape fan here. Here's what no longer works for me in 6.1
>>
>> Please let me know if there is a workaround for any of these issue, or
>> if I just have to suck it up and contemplate going back to version 4.7x
>>
>>
>> 1. You can no longer follow threads backwards by clicking on the
>> hyperlinked numbers of the preceding messages in the thread, because
>> those hyperlinked numbers no longer exist.
>>
>>
>> 2. Loss of all ability to specify where you want your text to wrap.
>> Well, you can, and I always want it to wrap at 60 characters, but it
>> only works when I'm typing in the message window, but once I hit send,
>> the message will look different and not wrap at 60 characters, but
>> will spread all the way across the screen.
>>
>> 3.In v 4.7x, you would have a caret at the top of your message pane,
>> which would indicate to you where your text was going to wrap. That is
>> also gonzo like alonzo mourning
>>
>> 4. You can select multiple messages in binary groups and save as
>> *.uue, effectively making netscape useless with respect to many binary
>> groups.
>>
>> 5. I can't seem to find a way to open the drafts folder in another
>> window, so I can preview my message, without affecting the group that
>> I'm currently reading, but I could do that easily in version 4.7x
>>
>>
>>
>> But the most important thing to me, is the message preview. I really
>> want to be able to see what the person on the other end will see,
>> before I hit send, and I want to be able to control where the text
>> wraps. I've attached a .gif (whiners will be ignored) of what this
>> message looks like as I'm typing it. I just want to know how to get it
>> to look that when it arrives on the newsgroup.
>>
>> thanks!
>>
>>
>> this is Michael
>> reporting live...
>> http://dogtv.com
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> <news://secnews.netscape.com:563/3B9052AD...@home.com?header=quotebody&part=1.1.2>
>>
>>
>> broken.gif
>>
>> Content-Type:
>>
>> image/gif
>> Content-Encoding:
>>
>> base64
>>
>>
> Michael,what you wish will not be granted.Sorry,you are a bad person!
>
> --
> Fulvio Perini
> Omaha,NE 68124
>
> Definition of an upgrade:it fixes some problem,while creating new ones.
>
>
>
michael
for wanting to control my word wrap, I just wanted
confirmation that it was me and not NetZilla that was the
problem.
Hey everybody, maybe The DOJ should sue Mozilla or AOL or
whoever the flock makes this bloated mess masquerading as a
"Communicator" now, to force them to separate into a browser
company, a newsreader company and an email company.
this is michael
reporting live...
http://dogtv.com
Fulvio Perini wrote:
>> <news://us...@secnews.netscape.com:563/3B9052AD...@home.com?header=quotebody&part=1.1.2>
michael
NLReisner wrote:
> As you seem to be aware of what they broke... do you know where to find
> how to request a 'return receipt' when sending e-mail?!?!? Seems missing
> to me???
>
> Thx...Nancy
Not me....
That must be part of some other great new feature.
this is michael
reporting live...
http://dogtv.com
DeMoN LaG
Aug 2001:
> Thanks Fulvio, I figured that I was just a really bad person
> for wanting to control my word wrap, I just wanted
> confirmation that it was me and not NetZilla that was the
> problem.
>
> Hey everybody, maybe The DOJ should sue Mozilla or AOL or
> whoever the flock makes this bloated mess masquerading as a
> "Communicator" now, to force them to separate into a browser
> company, a newsreader company and an email company.
If Mozilla came bundled with over 95% of all new computer purchased,
always ran in the background, and was integrated so tightly with the
system it couldn't be uninstalled than I would agree. otherwise, you
don't like it, don't use it
--
ICQ: 123728792
AIM: FlyersR1 9
email: de_on-lag@ho_e.co_
_ = m
michael
DeMoN LaG wrote:
Well, I was kinda joking there, but not really...
If AONetZiLLa needs to get split up, it's not because they
are abusing monopoly power, it's because they are abusing
usability.
DeMoN LaG
01 Sep 2001:
I completely disagree. The only thing needed to be included for Mozilla
to do mail and news is support for the nntp, IMAP, SMTP, and POP3
protocols. The rendering engine handles displaying the messages, the
GUI is nothing but some small graphics. The overhead in including a
mail/news client in the package is under 2 megs. And as you can see in
the installer, there are options to not install those components. If
you don't want them, don't install them. Easy as that
Joe
Nah, it has to do with money. M$ can afford billions of bucks to work on
the browser, whereas the AOL gang it can only afford millions. That
means 1000 times as many people for MS. I could be a little off in my
estimates, but I would bet they have at least 10 times as many people
working on it. When we get down to one browser, we can start looking
forward to leasing it yearly, or something like that.
Joe
michael
DeMoN LaG wrote:
>>Well, I was kinda joking there, but not really...
>>
>>If AONetZiLLa needs to get split up, it's not because they
>>are abusing monopoly power, it's because they are abusing
>>usability.
>>
>
> I completely disagree. The only thing needed to be included for Mozilla
> to do mail and news is support for the nntp, IMAP, SMTP, and POP3
> protocols. The rendering engine handles displaying the messages, the
> GUI is nothing but some small graphics. The overhead in including a
> mail/news client in the package is under 2 megs. And as you can see in
> the installer, there are options to not install those components. If
> you don't want them, don't install them. Easy as that
And I'm telling you, that in that two megs, there is not
currently much usability. I'm a pretty sophisticated user. I
can build a computer from scratch, install and configure
anything, use any operating system, solve just about any
problem which arises with Windows, etc....etc...I make
Norton Ghost images regularly to rescue myself from any
fiascos quickly and easily...
yet I can't use Netscape 6.1 for mail and news without a ton
of headaches and annoyances, so I'm in the process of
deciding whether to nuke it entirely, or install 4.78, or
leave 6.1 installed for website testing purposes.
this is Michael
Reporting live...
http://dogtv.com
DeMoN LaG
01 Sep 2001:
> And I'm telling you, that in that two megs, there is not
> currently much usability. I'm a pretty sophisticated user. I
> can build a computer from scratch, install and configure
> anything, use any operating system, solve just about any
> problem which arises with Windows, etc....etc...I make
> Norton Ghost images regularly to rescue myself from any
> fiascos quickly and easily...
Before you go shooting your mouth off and looking stupid, I don't care
how sophisticated you are. I'm also "pretty sophisticated", in that I
can put together a computer from scratch (the machine I'm typing on is
completely custom built, by me), install and configure just about
anything (except X in linux, it just does NOT like my video card for
anything more than 640x480x16 color VGA), etc. I don't make ghost
images. I don't need to completely roll back my system to fix a
problem. I've screwed up Windows to the point it was unable to boot at
all, not to normal mode, not safe mode, not debug mode, nor directory
service restoration mode. Nothing. And I fixed it without having to
use an old HD image to undo what was messed up.
>
> yet I can't use Netscape 6.1 for mail and news without a ton
> of headaches and annoyances, so I'm in the process of
> deciding whether to nuke it entirely, or install 4.78, or
> leave 6.1 installed for website testing purposes.
I don't like Netscape 6.1's news or email handling. I don't find it
slow, or unstable, I just have other preferences. I have been using
Eudora for email for a little over 3 years, and I love it to death. I
used to use Netscape 4.x for news, then Mozilla, now X-News. I like X-
News' feature set vs Mozilla's. Mozilla's newsreader is more than
adaquate for the average user though. And again, if you don't like the
mail/news client, when you install mozilla UNTICK the box for Mail/News.
Get a mail and/or news client you like and use it along side
Mozilla/N6.1 as a browser. Perfectly simple to do.
michael
DeMoN LaG wrote:
> michael <c...@dogtv.com> wrote in news:3B90908F...@dogtv.com, on
> 01 Sep 2001:
>
>>And I'm telling you, that in that two megs, there is not
>>currently much usability. I'm a pretty sophisticated user. I
>>can build a computer from scratch, install and configure
>>anything, use any operating system, solve just about any
>>problem which arises with Windows, etc....etc...I make
>>Norton Ghost images regularly to rescue myself from any
>>fiascos quickly and easily...
>>
>
> Before you go shooting your mouth off and looking stupid, I don't care
> how sophisticated you are.
Relax there, handsome
I'm not claiming I'm freakin' Linux Torvalds here, and I'm
not bragging to try to impress people. It's just that I know
what I'm doing and I almost never ask questions on
newsgroups, because I can almost always figure out the
answers myself, or by searching on Google. But Netscape 6.1
has me, not so much stumped, but annoyed enough to simply
not even bother trying to find workarounds to my issues, if
there even are any.
I still have hope for Netscape, but 6.1 is not ready for my
prime time. I did just notice one improvement. You can
actually read the text in the spell checker (it used to be
so small you could barely read it).
Here I go to install 4.78....
Ric Gates
michael wrote:
> this is Michael
> reporting live...
> http://dogtv.com
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> [Image]
Let Netscape know what you want....
http://home.netscape.com/browsers/6/feedback/suggest.html
votes count here.
--
| Later.
| Ric.
|
Fulvio Perini
I mostly agree with you about problems with 6.1,and 4.78 or whatever
4.xx you may have should have staid on the HD.
us...@domain.invalid
Holger Metzger wrote:
> michael schrieb:
>
>> I consider it a terrible thing if I can't control how my messages
>> appear. And I find it extremely annoying, that there is actually a
>> setting, that allows you to set your characters for plain text to 60
>> characters (or whatever you choose) just like there was in versions
>> 4.7x, but that it only applies to your composition window, and not
>> your actual post.
>
>
> Create a plaintext file called user.js in your profile folder and put
> the following lines in:
>
> ,----
> | -
> | user_pref("mail.quoted_graphical", false);
> | user_pref("mailnews.send_plaintext_flowed", false);
> | user_pref("mailnews.display.disable_format_flowed_support", true);
> | user_pref("mail.quoteasblock", false);
> `----
Thanks, but no thanks, and I could easily do that, and make
the fixes for all my other issues, but I have enough things
to worry about, rather than having to program my newsreader.
> This will deactivate format=flowed completely and you in the newest
> Mozillas you will have the ">" back.
>
> I really think this should be a GUI setting. Many users I know are
> confused by format=flowed and want the classic way back, especially
> newbies are confused by the non-breaking of lines and think Mozilla is
> somehow broken.
It is broken, if Netscape 6.1 is an "upgrade" to the
previous versions, which the popup ads keep telling me it
is, but which people in this group keep saying it isn't. And
I'm not confused at all by the loss of the ability to format
my text. And the loss of ability to search for newsgroups,
and save binaries and preview my posts accurately before I
send them, etc...etc...etc...etc...and this silly
UNKNOWN ERROR 80004005 which keeps popping up every five
seconds.
Annoyed by a very flawed product, yes, confused, no.
this is michael
reporting live...
http://dogtv.com
> Holger
Jim Webster
> Maybe I am confused here?
>
> Somebody explain to me what the feature in the attached
> image means?
>
> Wait a sec, now that I'm back to using Netscape 4.78, let me
> go preview this bad boy before I actually send it. There,
> that's better, see that caret up there, it tells me where my
> text is going to wrap. Very convenient feature that I lost
> with the muddled, bloated mess that is Netscape 6.1.
With reference to your first gif there is a wrap text setting its in
Edit / Preferences / Mail and Newsgroups / Message Composition
Shame about the caret though but then why do you need it when the text
wraps automatically?
TTFN
Jim
michael
I'm back to using 4.78 happily (actually, it's the first
time I've used it, because I never upgraded past 4.74
before, because of the ridiculously non smart "smart
download" process Netscape used and all the hoops you had to
jump through to download some software.
But I'm happy with 4.78, as I downloaded it from an FTP
site, with none of the stupid "smart" download shenanigans.
Hey, I'm a Netscape fan, and always have been, and I'm
really glad there is an alternative to MS Outlook/outlook
express which I REALLY detest (except for their binary
handling, which is pretty good) but I won't be using NS 6.1
or Mozilla for news or mail any time soon.
Ben Bucksch wrote:
>
> michael wrote:
>
> >Anyway, here's an example of another annoying feature I'm
> >really glad they did away with: The ability to easily click
> >backwards to the beginning of a thread by simply clicking on
> >hyperlinked numbers.
> >
> Common, nobody "did away with it" (especially not "they"), but it just
> wasn't implemented. You realize that Mozilla (and Netscape 6) is a
> completely new program, do you? The feature will in some form or the
> other probably come back some day, just that it takes time to implement
> that stuff.
>
> You are welcome to help, if you have "JS coding skills".
>
> Oh, and the n.p.mozilla.* groups are not about Netscape 6.x.
--
jesus X
>
> Longtime netscape fan here. Here's what no longer works for
> me in 6.1
This is the wrong place to bitch about Netscape products. A better place is
netscape.public.general
Anything with mozilla in the newsgroup name is for the Mozilla.org project. YEs,
NS6 is based on Mozilla, but honestly we don't really care about the problems of
NS6. We want a lot of these things for Mozilla, but that's as far as it goes.
--
jesus X [ Booze-fueled paragon of pointless cruelty and wanton sadism. ]
email [ jesusx @ who.net ]
web [ http://burntelectrons.com ] [ Updated April 29, 2001 ]
tag [ The Universe: It's everywhere you want to be. ]
warning [ War doesn't determine who is right, war determines who is left. ]
Burpmaster
> whiners will be ignored
You're gonna ignore yourself?
Ric Gates
michael wrote:
> Garth Wallace wrote:
>
> > I love how, after you wrote out this whole
> > sarcastic message, you screwed up the posting
> > so there are two copies in the group. That's
> > pretty funny.
>
> That's because I wasn't subscribed to the
> "secnews.netscape.com" server, and my first post didn't show
> up, under my @home server, so I sent it again.
>
> Anyway, here's an example of another annoying feature I'm
> really glad they did away with: The ability to easily click
> backwards to the beginning of a thread by simply clicking on
> hyperlinked numbers.
>
> On my wish list, I hope they bury that about fifty layers
> deep in a .js file, so I can practice my programming skills
> if I want to use my newsreader.
>
> --
> this is michael
> reporting live...
> http://dogtv.com
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> [Image]
"The ability to easily click backwards to the beginning of a thread by simply clicking
on hyperlinked numbers."
That's part of the Full Header.
May be active in the latest Mozilla build?
It is annoying that this stuff isn't done, maybe more volunteers are needed?
On the other hand, if you want a good news reader, maybe you should buy one. I have
two specialized news readers that I paid for.
--
| Later.
| Ric.
|
Holger Metzger
> Maybe I am confused here?
>
> Somebody explain to me what the feature in the attached
> image means?
Netscape 6.1 wraps lines wherever you want it to. The issue you have
problems with is format=flowed. Mozilla/Netscape 6.1 will always wrap
long lines, you can easily check that in the source (Ctrl+U).
Format=flowed:
http://www.eudora.com/techsupport/kb/1626hq.html
or better:
http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2646.txt
See my previous post on how to deactivate format=flowed.
Holger
--
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from
the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent
disinclination to do so. (Douglas Adams)
Netscape 6 Tips deutsch: http://www.hmetzger.de
Michael F Gordon
> the hyperlinked numbers of the preceding messages in the
> thread, because those hyperlinked numbers no longer exist.
This - not showing the References: header - is one of the two big
things that are stopping me using Mozilla as my main newsreader
at home.
The other thing is the fact that there seems to be no way to select
multiple newsgroups. If I don't have much time I'll read the
important groups, then select all the other groups and "Mark as read"
from the right mousebutton menu. It's annoying to have to do this for
each individual group rather than getting them all with one operation.
Michael Gordon
jP
Thanx,
Jack
-- "No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the Legislature is in session." --Gideon J. Tucker, Surrogate Judge, New York, 1866
MICHAEL
"jP" <jpantelias_17ATyahoo.com> wrote in message news:9n0t4c$t0...@secnews.netscape.com...
Yes, that is annoying.
--
Michael
Charlotte, NC USA
mgb...@myrealbox.com
--
__________________________________________________
Orrin Edenfield
>> Relax there, handsome
>>
>> I'm not claiming I'm freakin' Linux Torvalds here, and I'm not
>> bragging to try to impress people. It's just that I know what I'm
>> doing and I almost never ask questions on newsgroups, because I can
>> almost always figure out the answers myself, or by searching on
>> Google. But Netscape 6.1 has me, not so much stumped, but annoyed
>> enough to simply not even bother trying to find workarounds to my
>> issues, if there even are any.
>>
>> I still have hope for Netscape, but 6.1 is not ready for my prime
>> time. I did just notice one improvement. You can actually read the
>> text in the spell checker (it used to be so small you could barely
>> read it).
>>
>> Here I go to install 4.78....
>>
>> this is michael
>> reporting live...
>> http://dogtv.com
>>
> written.
>
> Thanx,
> Jack
>
> --
> "No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the Legislature is in session."
>
> --Gideon J. Tucker, Surrogate Judge, New York, 1866
>
>
Speelchecker in Netscape has nothing to do with Mozilla. Mozilla
doens't come with it (and prolly wont).
jP
I don't know anything about Mozzila. I do know that the spell check doesn't work as it should.
Jack
Pratik
jP wrote:
> *Orrin, **
> **
> **I don't know anything about **Mozzila. I do know that the spell check
> doesn't work as it should.
>
> Jack
> *
I think you're asking in the wrong newsgroup. Mozilla is the open source
codebase that Netscape 6.1 is based on. Mozilal doesn't have a
spellchecker. Netscape took the Mozilla code, added spellcheck and a
bunch of otherstuff and shipped it as NS6.1. Direct your spellcheck
related issues to NS6.1 newsgroups. This newsgroups (n.p.m.mail-news) is
for the mail/news component of Mozilla which doesn't have a spellchecker.
Followup set to netscape.netscape6.windows bcos I think that is more
appropriate for your question.
- Pratik.
Kate Wintjen
>
> michael wrote:
> >
> > Longtime netscape fan here. Here's what no longer works for
> > me in 6.1
>
> This is the wrong place to bitch about Netscape products. A better place is
> netscape.public.general
>
> Anything with mozilla in the newsgroup name is for the Mozilla.org project. YEs,
> NS6 is based on Mozilla, but honestly we don't really care about the problems of
> NS6. We want a lot of these things for Mozilla, but that's as far as it goes.
FWIW, for some reason he posted this to both n.p.m.mail-news *and*
netscape.netscape6.windows. So, it was OT for one group and on topic for the
other. *shrug* You're right it shoulda not been posted to the Mozilla group
though, IMO.
--
************************************************************
E-mail provided is a legit email address that is permanently
"on vacation". Any e-mail sent to it is assumed to be SPAM.
I will post my real email address in a message on request.
(in form username AT server DOT com/net of course).
************************************************************
Jason Bohrer
Nathan R wrote:
> Well I'm Glad I'm not the only one annoyed with the rewrite of the
> Mail/news client in Mozilla / Netscape 6.X
> I really like the Mozilla 0.9.2 or Netscape 6.1 browser, but It really
> looks like they haven't even started looking at the E-mail/news client..
> What I find it funny specifically with the netscape's 6.1 rehash of
> Mozilla 0.9.2 is they really didn't add any functionality to it, all
> those .js options (Many that were accessible in netscape 4.8) are all
> hidden in the .js files were your average L-user will have no clue that
> they are there, and you power user will frustrate themselves trying to
> figure out. it seems all Netscape did was add the spell checker and
> their logo..
>
> well I right now have 2 questions
> 1. look at the image I attached to this post.
> 2. did they bother to implement the Profile Password system in
> mozilla/netscape 6.x that they had in netscape 4.x? If so how do I
> access it?
>
>
> I just wish right now I could take the old netscape 4.8 mail/news client
> and replace the one that mozilla/netscape 6.x comes with, there was
> nothing wrong with the old client why did they have to redesign it so
> badly.
>
>
> to reply to me remove NOSPAM from my e-mail
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Image1.gif
>
> Content-Type:
>
> image/gif
> Content-Encoding:
>
> base64
>
>
Mail window pane sizing is a bug. Some people have problems with it,
others don't. What it does to me is if I open minimized it is all
screwed up, but when I maximize the window it returns to where I like
it. If you ever get it to stay where you like it, never touch it again.
At least that's what I do.
--
Jason Bohrer
Ririe, ID USA
The New Netscape:
ftp://ftp.netscape.com/pub/netscape6/english/6.1/windows/win32/sea
JWBo...@Netscape.net