Elan 1 Midi System
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Jesse Lawson
May 24, 2025, 5:37:23 PMMay 24
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I bought a Neotek Elan 1. It's the second one I've owned. This one is a little different from my previous console.
It has a midi system that should be controlled by a sequencer. I believe this midi system disables the 3 mute groups that I'm accustomed to. I don't really want to use a sequencer. I use tape machines alot and I'm not always using digital. Sounds like a pain and more stuff I need to buy.
Has anyone reverted one of these back to original spec with the three original mute groups and just removed the midi system??
Mike S.
May 24, 2025, 6:21:16 PMMay 24
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Hi
You may want to ask Ike Zimbel if he reverted some, we didn't.
If you look in the schematic for 3 mute, you can see the midi option and the normal standard. You will have to remove some parts and add some.
Same for the input mute function, is an option for midi, you will have to bring it back to standard.
I worked on this console in 1989, so my memory is a little foggy :)
Sincerely
Mike Stoica
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Daniel Hooper
May 24, 2025, 7:05:30 PMMay 24
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My Essence has a MIDI mute system and the mute buttons and mute groups (A, B, C) work independently of it, so from my experience having a MIDI system shouldn't prevent you from using the mute group feature. Maybe something else is wrong?
As Mike said, there are three possible circuits on the channels for different muting configurations. It's not a difficult DIY project (speaking from experience) to just copy what's on the schematic by clipping off/desoldering some parts and adding some new ones. You could try it with a single module and see if that fixes the problem before continuing on.
As Mike said, there are three possible circuits on the channels for different muting configurations. It's not a difficult DIY project (speaking from experience) to just copy what's on the schematic by clipping off/desoldering some parts and adding some new ones. You could try it with a single module and see if that fixes the problem before continuing on.
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Jesse Lawson
May 24, 2025, 7:42:23 PMMay 24
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I appreciate the answers.
Mike-
Thanks so much for replying. Its always nice to hear from you. I'm going to look through my schmatics as soon as I get home to locate the 3 mute schematic. That should help in the repair/restoration.
Daniel-
Nice to know that these two work independently. I would certainly think something else is an issue knowing that.
I also believe the original owner may have mentioned that he disconnected the midi because he had some noise or something like that. I'm kind of foggy as well and its only been two years. Lol. That could turn into a mess but thats the game I chose. I bought it two years ago and the original studio space fell through. Almost two years later, and I'm just now into another space. I'm just starting to test this board.
Do you use the midi functionality?
Ike-
I hope you see this. We have talked previously about the Elan I owned in Arkansas before I moved to Orlando, FL. I have another one. I need another master insert kit. Great mod!!!
If you want to visit the beach and make money come to Florida!!! I'd love to meet ya and tech this thing out.
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Ike Zimbel
May 24, 2025, 8:44:15 PMMay 24
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I’m out of my shop for at least a week but I know I have notes to convert the 3 mute fader card to full manual operation. That said, all of those desks came with that functionality. Can’t remember having to neuter that, but it’s been a while.
~Ike Zimbel~
Wireless frequency coordination specialist.
Manufacturer's Representative
Radio Active Designs (Canada)
FCC:WRBX645
On May 24, 2025, at 7:42 PM, Jesse Lawson <jessex...@gmail.com> wrote:
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Daniel Hooper
May 25, 2025, 4:06:00 AMMay 25
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I didn't want to over elaborate and complicate things in my original email but I did think to mention that I've had mute issues when the associated mute logic cables were disconnected on any channels, but that issue was more specifically about a mute being frozen in the on or off state and unable to be changed with the mute button on the channel itself, something I figure isn't so related to how the mute group logic works. That being said I would at the very least recommend you hook up all the cables you have regardless of whether you intend to then hook up any external MIDI to control anything.
I did use the MIDI feature for fun, I can expand on how it works. Each channel is essentially a different MIDI note number moving up in a sequential order. Starting at C0 or C3 or something like that. Sending a MIDI Note ON message with a low velocity mutes the channel while a higher velocity unmutes it. I may have that backwards, but that's essentially the gist of how it works. With my specific mixer I find that the latency for this is terribly slow, so to get a mute to engage on the beat required using a sequencer that lets me nudge these MIDI note messages slightly forward in time. Depending on your needs and workflow you could do a lot of interesting things like make yourself an infinite quantity of possible mute groups. Rapid muting and unmuting for a gating effect was my primary use case. Another use case I tried out was using MIDI to mute one channel while simultaneously unmuting another, and vice versa, as a method of A/Bing a signal while remaining fully in the analog domain. Ultimately it's very cool to have MIDI mutes in my experience, although seldom used.
My 8 input channels are MIDI mute enabled and hooked up for it, but my 24 monitor/return channels are not. And to reiterate, they both work with the mute group feature in exactly the same way. I actually considered modifying those return modules to also be MIDI enabled, and had started to work on that, but decided against it because of the fear that an additional long ribbon cable might introduce more noise into the system as those long ribbon cables can act as antennas, at least in my system where I'm missing metal panels that help shield the internals of the mixer. That was just a hunch, I'm not sure if that actually would have been the case. It would be a smart idea to take audio measurements before and after the removal of any MIDI systems if you go that route. I can totally buy it that someone else would have removed their MIDI system for this reason.
I did use the MIDI feature for fun, I can expand on how it works. Each channel is essentially a different MIDI note number moving up in a sequential order. Starting at C0 or C3 or something like that. Sending a MIDI Note ON message with a low velocity mutes the channel while a higher velocity unmutes it. I may have that backwards, but that's essentially the gist of how it works. With my specific mixer I find that the latency for this is terribly slow, so to get a mute to engage on the beat required using a sequencer that lets me nudge these MIDI note messages slightly forward in time. Depending on your needs and workflow you could do a lot of interesting things like make yourself an infinite quantity of possible mute groups. Rapid muting and unmuting for a gating effect was my primary use case. Another use case I tried out was using MIDI to mute one channel while simultaneously unmuting another, and vice versa, as a method of A/Bing a signal while remaining fully in the analog domain. Ultimately it's very cool to have MIDI mutes in my experience, although seldom used.
My 8 input channels are MIDI mute enabled and hooked up for it, but my 24 monitor/return channels are not. And to reiterate, they both work with the mute group feature in exactly the same way. I actually considered modifying those return modules to also be MIDI enabled, and had started to work on that, but decided against it because of the fear that an additional long ribbon cable might introduce more noise into the system as those long ribbon cables can act as antennas, at least in my system where I'm missing metal panels that help shield the internals of the mixer. That was just a hunch, I'm not sure if that actually would have been the case. It would be a smart idea to take audio measurements before and after the removal of any MIDI systems if you go that route. I can totally buy it that someone else would have removed their MIDI system for this reason.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neotekusers/CA%2BWuEpu2JT7SNA4f5cZzt_EmG6AH0NGA1mfwJuc9OPkfeq-9Ug%40mail.gmail.com.
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