Group librarian wanted...

[neonixie-l]

Folks,

It'd be great if we could have a volunteer (or two) to consolidate all these interesting PDFs that are around - we have a library section which has loads of space - I just don't have the time at the moment to manage it (see the building project in the workshop thread).

We'd really appreciate if someone could take this on - not too onerous, and think of all the kudos you'd get!

Cheers

Nick

[Tyler Bourne]

I could give the documents scattered around the file drive a sort.  I do IT for a day job and work with Google Drive every day.

[Mac Doktor]

On Jul 16, 2019, at 11:25 AM, neonixie-l <neoni...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

It'd be great if we could have a volunteer (or two) to consolidate all these interesting PDFs that are around - we have a library section which has loads of space - I just don't have the time at the moment to manage it (see the building project in the workshop thread).

Based on prior experience (and I think we discussed this earlier in the NixieBase thread) we should use our own site for this. Group hosts simply can't be trusted. 

All files should be free and clear if for no other reason than that password-protected, "secure" pdf files are NOT secure. There are apps that can decrypt them. I'm thinking in particular of Dieter Waechter's documents at http://www.tube-tester.com.

We'd really appreciate if someone could take this on - not too onerous, and think of all the kudos you'd get!

I'll certainly take all I can get but when I think about such a project my eyes start to glaze over. What I need is encouragement.

I have been thinking a lot about the NixieBase project but that's a topic for a new thread.

Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

[David Pye]

I think the most important thing is some kind of succession planning.

it's pointless to curate a fantastic resource of nixie documents if something happens to the curator, and the whole lot gets lost.

I'm not sure what the solution to such digital obsolence issues are however.....!

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[Tyler Bourne]

A community owned and operated site would be the only way to ensure ongoing availability.  As long as there are at least three administrators it should survive.

Organizing the files in the file section here first would help though and make an eventual move over to a database site easier.

On Tuesday, July 16, 2019 at 5:09:00 PM UTC-4, David Pye wrote:

I think the most important thing is some kind of succession planning.

it's pointless to curate a fantastic resource of nixie documents if something happens to the curator, and the whole lot gets lost.

I'm not sure what the solution to such digital obsolence issues are however.....!

On Tue, 16 Jul 2019 at 21:09, Mac Doktor <themac...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Jul 16, 2019, at 11:25 AM, neonixie-l <neoni...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

It'd be great if we could have a volunteer (or two) to consolidate all these interesting PDFs that are around - we have a library section which has loads of space - I just don't have the time at the moment to manage it (see the building project in the workshop thread).

Based on prior experience (and I think we discussed this earlier in the NixieBase thread) we should use our own site for this. Group hosts simply can't be trusted. 

All files should be free and clear if for no other reason than that password-protected, "secure" pdf files are NOT secure. There are apps that can decrypt them. I'm thinking in particular of Dieter Waechter's documents at http://www.tube-tester.com.

We'd really appreciate if someone could take this on - not too onerous, and think of all the kudos you'd get!

I'll certainly take all I can get but when I think about such a project my eyes start to glaze over. What I need is encouragement.

I have been thinking a lot about the NixieBase project but that's a topic for a new thread.

Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

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[Nick]

Appreciate the offer.

In my book, simple is good and something is way better than nothing.

We have several administrators here and we already shadow the message base to other locations. There's no reason that we can't do exactly the same for the library here.

Google drive works well with Google Groups (they share the members' access rights) - the library here is on Google Drive - we are only using 1.4GB out of 15GB available - almost all of that is the old Yahoo! group's library that I copied over.

For now at least, rather than talking about some ideal hypothetical system and doing nothing, I suggest we get going and start by just collating the available documents in a sensible, simple, directory structure that everyone can use - this is what we used to do in the old Yahoo! Groups days, and it worked fine for many years. We lost no documents (all of them are in the Google Drive for this group) and it is a great resource.

Nick

[Bill Notfaded]

Makes sense to me... Google isn't going away anytime soon. Seems to work pretty well to me.

Bill

[Terry Kennedy]

On Tuesday, July 23, 2019 at 7:30:52 AM UTC-4, Bill Notfaded wrote:

Makes sense to me... Google isn't going away anytime soon.  Seems to work pretty well to me.

Google does tend to apparently randomly decide that some "products" (if you're not paying for it, you ARE the product!) are no longer relevant and kills them off or lets them rot from semi-benign neglect.

I'd rather not find out that features we rely on for a group library have either turned into a paid service or are going away with little to no notice.

I think that something like the multiple distribution mirrors as used (for example) for FreeBSD would be a better idea. I'll volunteer to host the first site if desired - I have a nice system with a 10GbE connection to the Internet backbone.

[Grahame]

This echoes my philosophy - my DropBox is ephemeral - when I'm gone (btw nothing planned) the box will disappear. That is why encourage everyone to keep their own copies. But then we also need a document repository (or several repositories) someone that people can use to retrieve documents. I doesn't hurt to use Google as one of the repositories to start and then have copies.

Just my 6 pennies worth.

Grahame

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[David Pye]

I could host a few GB easily on a fast Linux server with decent Comms.  

Could also keep it in sync with others automatically.

David

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[Nick]

I have asked Tyler to have a first pass. As Google Drive is mapped to groups and shares access rights, the intention is to do a master copy here.

If folk want to shadow it in lots of places, that'd be great - I know I will!

The only important things are not to fragment the exercise by a) over complication or b) updating mirrors rather than the master or c) getting lost in a maze of twisty passages, all alike...

As it stands, all members of neonixie-l have read access to the repository and write access the temp folder, and all the admins (four of us at the moment) have write access to the whole store. All the old Yahoo! files are also already there...

This is a) simple (KISS), b) has multiple members with update rights and c) provides a public reference that anyone and their auntie can shadow should they so wish. Currently, there is 13GB free.

We welcome all contributions... suggestions as to the folder hierarchy too !

Nick

[Grahame]

Nick

Sounds like a plan!

My mirror DropBox will be read only so it can't be updated by others.

Call me Mr Stupid, so I ask a silly question - where is the group
repository?

Grahame

On 24/07/2019 13:11, Nick wrote:
> I have asked Tyler to have a first pass. As Google Drive is mapped to groups and shares access rights, the intention is to do a master copy here.
>
> If folk want to shadow it in lots of places, that'd be great - I know I will!
>
> The only important things are not to fragment the exercise by a) over complication or b) updating mirrors rather than the master or c) getting lost in a maze of twisty passages, all alike...
>
> As it stands, all members of neonixie-l have read access to the repository and write access the temp folder, and all the admins (four of us at the moment) have write access to the whole store. All the old Yahoo! files are also already there...
>

> This is a) simple (KISS) and b) provides a public reference that anyone and their auntie can shadow should they so wish. Currently, there is 13GB free.

[Nick]

It's linked to in the group description - you need to be looking at the "desktop" version of neonixie-l to see that.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BzH-L4OXjfbRYTRHU01jcDk1c3c?usp=sharing

Might do a tinyurl or similar to make it more friendly.

Edit: done - https://tinyurl.com/neonixie-l

Nick

[Grahame]

Nick

Thanks for the link. All my neonixie mail arrives through Thunderbird so
I never look at the desktop.

A quick look through and I see the archive does requires some TLC and
spring cleaning. Although free, 15GB seems very restrictive by modern
standards. I might be repeating earlier threads but has any thought been
given to upping the storage by people making small donations?

Grahame

On 24/07/2019 15:00, Nick wrote:
> It's linked to in the group description - you need to be looking at the "desktop" version of neonixie-l to see that.
>
> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0BzH-L4OXjfbRYTRHU01jcDk1c3c?usp=sharing
>

[Nicholas Stock]

Ha, that's the first time I've ever seen the files and I've been on this group for years.....;-)

I'm up for a small donation if necessary.

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[Dekatron42]

Maybe someone should contact Frank Philipse and/or the Tube Collectors Association and see if they are interested in hosting the material?

/Martin

[Mac Doktor]

On Jul 24, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Nick <gerbilp...@gmail.com> wrote:

We welcome all contributions... suggestions as to the folder hierarchy too !

Here's some blueskying...

Let's get our goals and minimum requirements worked out in so many words first (I'd prefer an outline). After we settle on the "what" we can haggle about "how". Afterwards, hashing out the details may require a separate, special group reporting back to this main group on a regular basis (anyone interested would be welcome to lurk). A committee, if you will. Maybe. 

I want to hear as much info from knowledgeable group members as possible. I certainly don't have the ability to see all of the possible angles and and I'm not at all sure about the best way to maintain and host the files aside from being extremely leery of depending on anything "free" as a long-term solution. I've seen what can go wrong too many times before.

Then there's the NixieBase project which is still in its daydream phase. It has so many potential facets to it that it could easily require a small forum for organizational and support purposes. I agree with others that KISS is preferable but it should be done right the first time. That's another topic entirely so I request that any further discussion about NB be done in a new thread. Let's stick to the topic in this one.

Just my $0.02 based on decades of sometimes really bad experiences online.

[Terry Kennedy]

On Wednesday, July 24, 2019 at 8:11:31 AM UTC-4, Nick wrote:

I have asked Tyler to have a first pass. As Google Drive is mapped to groups and shares access rights, the intention is to do a master copy here.

If folk want to shadow it in lots of places, that'd be great - I know I will!

The Google Drive folder needs to have the "sync" and "syncRoot" properties set to "true" to enable actual synchronizing downloads. Otherwise you get "Provided id is not a sync root directory" errors and you can't sync.

I was able to download the whole thing (but not in sync mode, so it isn't updatable via sync and the file timestamps are the downloaded time instead of the real times. If you're allergic to Google Drive or want faster service, take a look at http://www3.ispnet.net/NEONIXIE-L/ - comments welcome. If we get sync enabled, I'll add a banner saying "This is a mirror of the official data located at X, local copy last updated Y" and so on.

[Tyler Bourne]

While I don't think Google will discontinue Drive any time soon it is a good idea to have a few backups.  We are currently using 2 of 15 GB so it should be some time before we outgrow it.  When that time cones we can either find someone who will host it for free or pay Google to get more space.

In the mean time I'll go through the files and categorize them all and see if I can plan out a consistent folder structure.  Then I can sort it all out.

[Nicholas Stock]

Can someone capture all the clock pictures that were shared in the other thread and put them in a folder too?

I'm more than happy to help out with the endeavor once a concrete plan is decided upon.

(Pharma) Nick

On Thu, Jul 25, 2019 at 2:11 PM Tyler Bourne <speedy...@gmail.com> wrote:

While I don't think Google will discontinue Drive any time soon it is a good idea to have a few backups.  We are currently using 2 of 15 GB so it should be some time before we outgrow it.  When that time cones we can either find someone who will host it for free or pay Google to get more space.

In the mean time I'll go through the files and categorize them all and see if I can plan out a consistent folder structure.  Then I can sort it all out.

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[Nick]

Gratefully noted - thanks Nick.

I like the idea of having multiple repository managers, each with their own area of responsibility... 

Nick

On Friday, 26 July 2019 02:09:23 UTC+1, Pramanicin wrote:

Can someone capture all the clock pictures that were shared in the other thread and put them in a folder too?

I'm more than happy to help out with the endeavor once a concrete plan is decided upon.

(Pharma) Nick

On Thu, Jul 25, 2019 at 2:11 PM Tyler Bourne <speedy...@gmail.com> wrote:

While I don't think Google will discontinue Drive any time soon it is a good idea to have a few backups.  We are currently using 2 of 15 GB so it should be some time before we outgrow it.  When that time cones we can either find someone who will host it for free or pay Google to get more space.

In the mean time I'll go through the files and categorize them all and see if I can plan out a consistent folder structure.  Then I can sort it all out.

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[Bill Notfaded]

Great idea Nick... I've got more to post too. If we all share more it's great for all of us to learn about more neat cool stuff 😁👍👍👍

Good stuff!

Bill

[Terry Kennedy]

Is there still any interest in this project? 

[Nicholas Stock]

I'm still interested in helping out, but unsure as to who is leading the charge....

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[Tyler Bourne]

I offered and am ready to do some sorting.