ga22v10 help

[ZethieTail]

i have some old gold ceramic 22v10 chips, but no way to program them, or now how and such, i downloaded programs, scoured the net but not much out there for these old chips, even more scarce are these from gazelle, not finding anything but a datasheet for them, anyone got any info or used these before?

[ZethieTail]

also, these are one time programmable chips

[RikD]

specsheet says it's factory programmed, by laser etching...

[ZethieTail]

i know, but these are like new in the tube still, im hoping their unprogrammed and new like the listing said where i bought them

[David Pye]

But without the laser etching gear, sounds like you're SOL.

What do you want them to do?

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[ZethieTail .]

well the chips already have a lid on them,so either their programmed already or not but if i cant use em ill just collect em i guess, but still hoping their programmable, but with these ships it would be nice to have one be a shift register or led bargraph driver

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[Ian Vine]

If they are laser etched, that would almost always be performed at manufacture to the customers requirements. 

Cheers

Ian

On 19 May 2020, at 12:08, ZethieTail . <zethi...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[gregebert]

I've never heard of programmable logic that uses a laser; that would require elaborate equipment and defeat the entire purpose of having customizable logic.

Techniques I know of include UV-erasable (hence the window), fuse-based (on-time-programmable, aka OTP), Electrically-erasable, and RAM-based, which requires an offchip storage device (usually serial EEprom).

There were all sorts of inexpensive programmable devices in the 1980's, including the popular 22V10. You would use software, such as CUPL or PALASM to generate the fusing/programming information, then use a programming machine (DataIO was one such manufacturer) to program the device.

Laser-trimming of resistors was once common for precision analog parts; I think it's been largely replaced with fuses.

[David Pye]

Assuming you read the datasheet?

My reading of it is that it is effectively a rapid prototyping chip that they will 'program' via laser with your logic instructions on a 1 week turnaround.

That's certainly what it says towards the end.   And far quicker than custom silicon.

David

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[David Forbes]

From the one data sheet OCR scan that Google offers: "All GA22VP10s are factory-configured by Gazelle 's Quick-Turn laser technology". 

Sounds like it's a pre-programmed museum piece, since the factory is clearly no longer around. 

I did tons of PLD designs for VMEbus computers in the eighties and nineties. There were tricks we employed to squeeze a few nanoseconds out of a state machine design, to make DRAM run faster etc. We never went as far as using GaAs programmable logic, though. Seems like a dead end.

On Tue, May 19, 2020, 2:10 AM ZethieTail <zethi...@gmail.com> wrote:

i have some old gold ceramic 22v10 chips, but no way to program them, or now how and such, i downloaded programs, scoured the net but not much out there for these old chips, even more scarce are these from gazelle, not finding anything but a datasheet for them, anyone got any info or used these before?

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[Mac Doktor]

On May 19, 2020, at 10:02 AM, gregebert <greg...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Laser-trimming of resistors was once common for precision analog parts; I think it's been largely replaced with fuses.

In the mid-Eighties PAiA electronics had an embedded micro-controller for their analog modular synthesizer. Most synths use linear control voltages and modules such as VCOs have on-board exponential converters to control the pitch of a linear VCO. To save money PAiA used exponential control voltages (Volt/Hz) and linear VCOs. The DAC for the MCU was laser-trimmed to make the output perfectly exponential.

Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe: attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion... beams...in the dark in the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time...like tears in the rain." — Roy Batty, Blade Runner