Fwd: [tubecollectorsassociation] Tube anachronism in "Oppenheimer"?

[lai...@wcoil.com]

Quite a discussion and long thread in TCA ( Tube Collectors Association) on the sighting of a Nixie tube countdown timer in the new movie Oppenheimer.  General TCA agreement the prop was a historical error, but information on early Inditron and Nixies was discussed. I attached one message out of the thread that has links to a1934 patent on what would be a Nixie along with multiplexing circuitry.  The patent was using the strike and maintaining voltages to latch the tubes on.  (memory of sorts). Note, each symbol was isolated inside the larger envelope.  A very interesting read. The whole thread has been interesting on the history of nixies.  Tim Laing 

Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

From: "Jim Whartenby via groups.io" <old_radio=aol...@groups.io>
Date: July 23, 2023 at 1:22:20 PM EDT
To: tubecollecto...@groups.io
Subject: Re: [tubecollectorsassociation] Tube anachronism in "Oppenheimer"?
Reply-To: tubecollecto...@groups.io



Well this just proves that IMDb is not above making a mistake.  NIXIE perhaps started out as a brand name but "glow lamp symbol indicator" would be generic.  US Patent 2142106 certainly qualifies as a "neon symbol indicator" which predates WW2.

A movie that strictly follows the facts is called a documentary which most people find boring and uninteresting.  A little dramatic "poetic license" goes a long way in educating the the average Joe or Jane.

From: https://spectrum.ieee.org/nixie-tube

Another inventor, though, had a better idea. Hans P. Boswau, a German immigrant who'd settled in the Lake Erie shore town of Lorain, Ohio, worked as chief engineer at the Lorain County Radio Corp. Through his job, he would have been familiar with many of the latest technological developments of his day. At some point, Boswau decided that he needed a device to display numeric symbols and letters. On 9 May 1934, he filed two U.S. patent applications—No. 2,142,106 [PDF] and No. 2,268,441 [PDF]—which contain the first complete descriptions of what later came to be called the Nixie tube.

Boswau was ahead of his time but he was first.

Regards,

Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.  Murphy

On Sunday, July 23, 2023 at 10:17:11 AM CDT, TCA <tca_ji...@cfl.rr.com> wrote:

So, I guess I sparked a lively discussion… 

For those who say “it is just a movie, not a documentary”, movies set in a specific time period usually try to use period-appropriate props. The Internet Movie Database, imdb.com, chronicles such things as “goofs” for all sorts of fictional movies.

I decided to look at the IMDb entry for Oppenheimer today, what do you know… Under “Goofs/Anachronisms” was the comment:

"Nixie displays weren't invented for another decade. And the ones depicted in the trailer are Soviet IN-14s from the 1970s.”

Jim Cross

On Jul 23, 2023, at 10:58 AM, Instrument Resources of America <IRACO...@HUGHES.NET> wrote:

Those Nixies do NOT look at all crude. They have a very modern day look to them, as does the case, small and compact. Not only there for digitally minded folks, but for the color as well. Bright orange much more pleasing to the camera and the eye than than drab surroundings. I guess we could say that the director took "literary license" in his movie, keeping in mind that it is far from being a documentary. I haven't seen the movie yet, but from what I'm hearing, it is pretty good. Does anyone know if Fermi, was even mentioned or not?

Ira

On 7/22/2023 10:36 PM, Jim Whartenby via groups.io wrote:

Point taken but perhaps some more digging into patent history will find the circuits and other workarounds used to drive the crude neon numeric displays.  

It is humbling to find solutions like this years before they were reduced to reliable practice.  I know solid state devices are somewhat OT on this list but Julius Lilienfeld's 1925 patent on what is now considered to be the field effect transistor prevented Shockley from being the third on the BTL transistor patent.  If materials science had been a little more advanced in Lilienfeld's time, perhaps he would have gained the recognition as the sole inventor of the transistor.

But getting back on track, the NIXIE display used in the movie is there for the movie fan who is digitally minded which is probably everyone under 45.  Goodness knows they would be puzzled by a mechanical count down timer just as they would be puzzled by the dial telephone.  Yes it is a distortion of some facts but I doubt that it takes anything away from the role Oppenheimer played in making the bomb.

Even today, important concepts like Maxwell's famous four equations are not actually his but they are the work of Oliver Heaviside who also coined a lot of the terms we use regularly in electrical engineering.  He even invented the coax cable some 50 years before BTL reduced it to practice.  

No credit is given to Heaviside but few care.  They are still trying to wrap their head around the fact that the information is carried on the outside of the wire conductor, at the speed of light.

Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.  Murphy

On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 10:35:30 PM CDT, Instrument Resources of America <iraco...@hughes.net> wrote:

I can't help but wonder about the supporting equipment for counting, and driving Nixie type tubes being available, in 1938-39???

Ira.

On 7/22/2023 1:21 PM, Jim Whartenby via groups.io wrote:

I looked at Brook's first URL and the first numerical indicator, US Patent 2142106, was filed on 9 May 1934 and granted 3 January 1939 to Hans P. Boswau.  So it appears that the movie is possibly accurate after all!  Who knew?

Another Jim

Logic: Method used to arrive at the wrong conclusion, with confidence.  Murphy

On Saturday, July 22, 2023 at 02:30:36 PM CDT, Brooke via groups.io <brooke=pacif...@groups.io> wrote:

Hi Jim:

I think Nixie tubes are part of the history of NCR breaking the 4-rotor Enigma machine used on W.W.II German subs.  See:
https://prc68.com/I/NCR.shtml#Pat

The timers used for atomic bomb testing were "stop clocks"
https://prc68.com/I/SETC_S-1-24.shtml

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Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
https://www.PRC68.com
axioms:
1. The extent to which you can fix or improve something will be limited by how well you understand how it works.
2. Everybody, with no exceptions, holds false beliefs.

-------- Original Message --------

I just saw a trailer for the new movie “Oppenheimer”, and a brief scene showed a countdown with numerical Nixie tubes. I’m pretty sure these were not around during WWII, nor at any time that Oppenheimer was working for the Government.

Jim Cross

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[peter bunge]

I was very disappointed in the film. It was not historically accurate.

The two bombs were of different designs and the reactors were different and built in parallel to hedge their bets.

The book "The Life and Times of a Technological Fixer" was more interesting to read than watching the film.

My friend who also saw the film feels the same about it. 

A lot of interesting stuff like the ship that delivered it and was sunk on the way back were left out.

It jumped around in time which was confusing. The sound track was terrible.

All I hear are the critics raving about it.

PeterB

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[Jeffry Portell]

Trailers, teasers, clips, stc. are part of the studio machine's arsenal of marketing tools. Usually a trailer is composed of  clips taken from scenes of the movie. The clips highlight pivotal points in the film and aim to atir an emotional reaction that would make you want to see the entire movie. How many times do you feel like you've seen the entire movie, but have only seen various clips and trailers?

Nixie collectors have known for decades that vacuum tubes with numbers inside are sexy. Light'em up and  movie marketers and directors think so as well. Welcome to the latest nixie craze. Clock makers using nixies and nixie clock kit sales are going to skyrocket! Woo-hoo what fun......Hopefully the russian and chinese nixies will keep the vintage nostalgists happy and leave all the good tubes to us.

P.S. : Probably nt a good time to mention you are a nixie collector around the water cooler-just sayin.

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