[NEONIXIE-L] Strange Tubes on Ebay
elsep2337
Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number 400104816737.
Chris
Mike Harrison
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 14:22:24 -0000, you wrote:
>Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number 400104816737.
>
>Chris
My guess is it's a 4x4 dot-matrix display
John Rehwinkel
> Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number 400104816737.
ИТМ2-М, 4x4 multiplexed display, multicolored (red, green, yellow, blue). It seems to be gas discharge (although the page seems to mention electroluminescence as well; my Russian isn't very good). Data here:
http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
and here (these look like bad OCR):
http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
http://promzi.ru/lb-6-165-extr/
Wiki page here mentions them, as non self scanned gas discarge displays that are controlled by taking advantage of the difference between strike and maintaining voltages:
http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Газоразрядный_индикатор
- John
David Forbes
At 2:22 PM +0000 2/21/10, elsep2337 wrote:
>Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting
>tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does
>any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number
>400104816737.
>
>Chris
I'd call it a 2x2 pixel plasma picture tube.
With enough of those tubes, one could make a VERY impressive
flat-panel color TV.
--
--David Forbes, Tucson, AZ
http://www.cathodecorner.com/
Tidak Ada
[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JumboTron ]
eric
-----Original Message-----
From: NEONI...@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of John Rehwinkel
>Snip<
ИТМ2-М, 4x4 multiplexed display, multicolored (red, green, yellow, blue).
It seems to be gas discharge (although the page seems to mention
electroluminescence as well; my Russian isn't very good). Data here:
http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
and here (these look like bad OCR):
http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
http://promzi.ru/lb-6-165-extr/
>Snap<
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couchpilot
On 21/02/2010 11:59 AM, David Forbes wrote:
> At 2:22 PM +0000 2/21/10, elsep2337 wrote:
> >Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting
> >tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does
> >any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number
> >400104816737.
>
> I'd call it a 2x2 pixel plasma picture tube.
>
> With enough of those tubes, one could make a VERY impressive
> flat-panel color TV.
>
As an exercise, here's what I got for a 720p screen using these :)
For a 720 HD TV, at 16:9, that's 1280x720 pixels, for a total of 921,600
pixels. Divide that by 4, and you would need 230400 of these tubes.
At 1.80$ each ( not counting shipping) that's 414,720$ ( with the
advertised shipping, double that)
Now ( and please correct me here if I'm wrong, I haven't done this type
of calculation since high school)
----------------------------------------------------------
Using google to translate the page, if I read it correctly, the tunes
would operate between 120 and 160v
Current would be between 30 and 60 mA.
If all tubes were on , would that mean that there's a draw of 230400 *
0.006 mA = 1382 Amps?
If P=V * I2, that's ( at an average of say 140v) P= 140v * 1382A *
1382A = 267,398,360 or 267.4 megawatts?
That's the power needed for a small town :))
-Benoit
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
tristan....@ymail.com
I too ran across them when having my weekly eBay scavenge and was mad enough to buy despite having no idea how to drive them. It should be an interesting challenge. I'm thinking either a scrolling text display or odd binary clock made from there would be great. The google translation of the badly scanned Russian data sheet doesn't provide much help though. :(
Dieter Waechter
Does anyone know from which books these pages have been scanned?
http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
(¯`.._..´¯`.._..-DIETER-.._..´¯`.._..´¯)
http://www.nocrotec.com/
elsep2337
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "tristan.henderson@..." <tristan.henderson@...> wrote:
>
> I too ran across them when having my weekly eBay scavenge and was mad enough to buy despite having no idea how to drive them. It should be an interesting challenge. I'm thinking either a scrolling text display or odd binary clock made from there would be great. The google translation of the badly scanned Russian data sheet doesn't provide much help though. :(
>
I'm glad you were mad enough to buy them, I chickened out in buying them as I had no info until but i do now. When you get them keep us informed of how you get on with your Binary clock.
Chris
tristan....@ymail.com
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "elsep2337" <elsep2337@...> wrote:
When you get them keep us informed of how you get on with your Binary clock.
>
> Chris
>
Will do. I'm sure more of these will show up on eBay. There's probably a warehouse half full of them somewhere.
I have seen the data liked to here but it's difficult to follow. If anyone has more info/tips please pass it along. The data posted refers to timing diagrams but the diagrams themselves don't seem to be available.
- Cheers, Tristan
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kosbo_com
> Does anyone know from which books these pages have been scanned?
> http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
> http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
>
Yes, I know this book well and use it quite regular. :-) Looks like the scanned pages are just part of this book. Original book is about A5 format and has 432 pages....
Konstantin
www.kosbo.com
- New Members 3
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Tidak Ada
Aftr a trial with Google translate I found the ITM2-M should be a LED array
in a glass envelope.
Sorry I cannot show the translation, because it is translated in Dutch. Not
helpfull for you.
However, translation by Babelfish says 'glow indicator', what sounds more
reliable.......
The problem is that the text is out of the table structure in what it was
ediited originally. That makes the interpretation and translation difficult.
eric
- New Members 3
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bender2114
These are indirect gas discharge displays... basically the Stone-age predecessor to the modern plasma TV's you can buy at Wallmart. Each pixel is a separate trigger tube mechanism with phosphor paint on the top, the tube is filled with gas and the glow discharge inside of each pixel structure excites the phosphor. The IGPP 32/32 is a more common (though expensive!) Soviet display that functions on the same principle. There is no Western direct analog for this tube, US 'jumbotron' displays were constructed out of flood beam CRT's, which contained an electron gun that illuminated a colored phosphor coating on the front of the tube envelope.
They are allegedly a horrible pain to drive... do a search in the archives for IGPP 32/32 to read the horror stories about trying to get one of these Soviet plasma displays working.
Richard Kline
http://www.decadecounter.com
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James
> Soviet display that functions on the same principle. There is no >Western direct analog for this tube, US 'jumbotron' displays were >constructed out of flood beam CRT's, which contained an electron gun >that illuminated a colored phosphor coating on the front of the tube >envelope.
>
I came across a website years ago that showed some of the Jumbotron tubes but I can't find it anymore. I'd love to find a couple of the tubes to play with but I suspect by now most of them are probably long gone as LED really took over.
- New Members 4
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bender2114
> I came across a website years ago that showed some of the Jumbotron tubes but I can't find it anymore. I'd love to find a couple of the tubes to play with but I suspect by now most of them are probably long gone as LED really took over.
>
I think I remember seeing the same site, but it has long been swallowed into the bowels of Interweb history. The earliest Jumbotrons were built using tubular CRT's with no deflection and colored glass envelopes... basically a glorified light bulb as designed by a steampunk madman. Later displays used clear round CRT's that looked like normal scope tubes, except they had no deflection or focusing and the electron gun just sprayed the entire screen to light it up a solid color. Later the manufacturers switched over to square display tubes that had multiple colors in each tube... the Sony tubes had a vertical stripe of red green and blue phosphor and Mitsubishi tubes had an array of 16 colored squares... similar to the Soviet tube at the start of this thread except that the amber sections were replaced with a second set of green sections for enhanced brightness. Mitsubishi multi-phosphor tubes had an array of crossed grids in front of the electron guns to select which tile would be lit. All of these tubes are basically impossible to find today, most CRT based Jumbotrons were sent to the cube-crusher long ago.
John Rehwinkel
> > Does anyone know from which books these pages have been scanned?
> > http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
> > http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
>
> Yes, I know this book well and use it quite regular. :-) Looks like the scanned pages are just part of this book. Original book is about A5 format and has 432 pages....
Any chance you could get us better scans of those pages?
- John
bender2114
The original seller has scans of the datsheets in his auction now, as well as a translation of some of the more critical sections like pinouts.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400108543330
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, John Rehwinkel <jrehwin@...> wrote:
>
> > > Does anyone know from which books these pages have been scanned?
> > > http://wexzone.narod.ru/ntd/wexzone-133-64-index.html
> > > http://promzi.ru/lb-6-164-extr/
> >
> > Yes, I know this book well and use it quite regular. :-) Looks like the scanned pages are just part of this book. Original book is about A5 format and has 432 pages....
>
> Any chance you could get us better scans of those pages?
>
> - John
>
A.J.
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "bender2114" <bender2114@...> wrote:
> The original seller has scans of the datsheets in his auction now,
> as well as a translation of some of the more critical sections like
> pinouts.
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400108543330
BTW, in that translation, capital "B" appearing in several places should instead be a "V" for volts.
A.J.
Ray Fenwick
Just to confirm that, Вв = Vv, Бб = Bb. Also, don't confuse Бб with Ьь. Ьь has no sound itself, it softens the preceding consonant.
HTH
Ray
On 13 Mar 2010, at 07:11, A.J. wrote:
> --- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "bender2114" <bender2114@...> wrote:
> > The original seller has scans of the datsheets in his auction now,
> > as well as a translation of some of the more critical sections like
> > pinouts.
> >
> > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=400108543330
>
> BTW, in that translation, capital "B" appearing in several places should instead be a "V" for volts.
>
> A.J.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Joe
I bought a few of these tubes because of your discovery. They are very cute.
I figured out a basic application circuit. I posted the results at
http://www.radiomuseum.org/forum/itm2m_application.html?thread_id=216472
Thanks for the discovery.
-Joe
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "elsep2337" <elsep2337@...> wrote:
>
> Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number 400104816737.
>
> Chris
>
elsep2337
Iv had a good look at the post and the tubes look really nice, i may have to purchase some of them, i have an idea of a propeller clock of sorts using these tubes, but i don't know if i have the skills or time to give it a go. but they look like they would make a good project ether way.
Thanks for testing them, i wasn't going to buy any but i think i will now, as you have found a way to drive them.
Chris
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "Joe" <JLRMSousa@...> wrote:
>
> I bought a few of these tubes because of your discovery. They are very cute.
> I figured out a basic application circuit. I posted the results at
> http://www.radiomuseum.org/forum/itm2m_application.html?thread_id=216472
> Thanks for the discovery.
> -Joe
>
> --- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "elsep2337" <elsep2337@> wrote:
> >
> > Iv just been doing a scavenge around ebay and found some interesting tubes but have no idea what they are they are marked as ITM2M does any one have any idea what they are? they are in auction number 400104816737.
> >
> > Chris
> >
>
Joe
Chris, I have more concrete data and application circuits for the ITM2M as a new post at this thread:
http://www.radiomuseum.org/forum/itm2m_application.html
I show how to use old CD4000B series logic operating at 15V to drive these tubes.
These tubes are easier to drive than typical nixies, and you have a whole logic family at your disposal to drive them with.
Share the results, if you build something.
-Joe
--- In NEONIXIE-L@yahoogroups.com, "elsep2337" <elsep2337@...> wrote:
>
> Iv had a good look at the post and the tubes look really nice, i may have to purchase some of them, i have an idea of a propeller clock of sorts using these tubes, but i don't know if i have the skills or time to give it a go. but they look like they would make a good project ether way.
>
> Thanks for testing them, i wasn't going to buy any but i think i will now, as you have found a way to drive them.
>
> Chris
Chris Stalin
Looking to chat with you regarding your 4060 driveen ITM2M.
Please see thread started by me.
"Calling on Joe"
Thanks
Christian