Time On Task (TimePanic)
RichardM
I have been a registered user of MLO for eight months. I love it. I
absolutely love every last single little thing about it. Really.
Indeed, I will have achieved my rapture as soon as the PPC sync is
released.
:)
But I also love something else: I love tracking the amount of time
that I spend on each of my tasks, work types, and projects. MLO can't
do that. But the following program can, and it does it spectacularly
well on both the PC and PPC with real-time synchronization: TimePanic,
written by Lionel Spohr. You can find it here:
http://www.timepanic.com/english/
Indeed, I love that program so much that today I purchased a license
for it after completing a fully functional, free, thirty-day free
trial.
And so I recommend TimePanic to you all as well.
MLO Rocks!
:)
-Richard
P.S. I have found Lionel Spohr to be an engaged (and engaging!)
programmer with the same kind of care and concern for his product that,
well, I have seen exhibited elsewhere only by our own esteemed Andrey
and Oleg. Gentlemen of the highest order, all. Kudos.
Trustme
features for a long time. Looks like a solid piece of work. How do you
use it alongside with MLO?
Volkmar
Richard Musselwhite
TimePanic, I used to spend quite a bit of time each day tweaking my
outlines in MLO, reviewing my task lists and selecting my next actions.
This was enormously helpful for the first few months, but eventually I
ran up against the following three limitations:
1) I was spending more time than I would have liked grooming my data in
MLO. This activity actually became a way for me to procrastinate.
2) I was ignoring my intuition, silencing my inner voice. Increasingly,
I realized that I already knew what I needed to be doing in order to
achieve my objectives. Undoubtedly, all of the time that I had spent
with MLO had greatly helped me to clarify my life situations,
obligations, priorities, and next actions. But then the process of
choosing my next actions from MLO's lists increasingly felt
counter-intuitive. I felt that I just knew what I needed to do, and
that interacting frequently with MLO's interface was inhibiting my
ability to hear what wisdom told me.
3) I was still having trouble getting motivated to act on my top
priorities. Even when MLO's recommendations and my intuition agreed on
what needed to be done next, I still did not want to do it.
TimePanic has helped me to solve all of these problems. Now I have
TimePanic setup with a few dozen of my most common tasks. Each task is
assigned a work type and a project. I have designated my most important
tasks as "chargeable hours." Those are my highest priority tasks, the
ones that I have been training myself to spend more time on. On both
the desktop and PPC, TimePanic color codes my "chargeable" tasks
differently, so I can see at a glance how many hours I have spent on my
highest priority items. On the PPC interface, TimePanic even keeps a
running total of my chargeable hours. TimePanic also includes a large
array of completely configurable reports, so at the end of a day (or
week, or month), I can see exactly where my time went by task, work
type, or project.
In this way, TimePanic has given me precisely the kind of behavioral
feedback--behavioral feedback--that I have needed to really get the edge
on achieving my objectives. Now I know exactly where my time has gone
each day, and this heightened awareness has given me the objectivity I
needed to want--positively and without artifice--want to reduce
unproductive activities and replace them with high priority tasks. It
has also given me the freedom to kick up my heels and relax--without
guilt--when I know for sure that I have already completed more
chargeable hours in a day than I realized or needed.
Okay. So where's MLO now? MLO is now my back end for TimePanic. MLO
is an archive of tasks, priorities, notes, and reminders that I check in
with whenever my intuition clues me in to something important there.
MLO is where I do my weekly and monthly reviews. MLO is the bucket (in
GTD terms) where I store my stuff, in order to keep my desk clean. MLO
is where I set my vision. MLO has become my metaphorical
"sub-conscious" to my metaphorical TimePanic conscience. Now, I
generally choose my next actions spontaneously, according to the
guidance given by my intuition, without reference to MLO at the time;
TimePanic serves as my conscience, keeping me real by letting me know
exactly where I am spending my time. This, in turn, is the only method
that I have found thus far that really allows me to know, through
objective measurement of my lived behavior, whether I am actually
steering my life toward attainment of my highest objectives.
And TimePanic makes it so easy. It took me about three days of use to
set it up appropriately for my life, but now, it is never more than two
PPC screen taps or one mouse-click away.
I tend to wax poetic, so I hope I haven't put off any of the left brain
folks here. I can try to write more linearly if there is interest, but
the best thing I can recommend is to check out TimePanic's website, and
try it out yourself on the thirty-day free trial.
http://www.timepanic.com/english/
-Richard
P.S. Lionel is programming TimePanic's printing functionality now. He
says it should be ready in a couple of months. I don't need it, but I
imagine that his corporate clients have been beating down his door for
it. Next up are enhancements to the task selection interface. I don't
have any problem with the current interface, but Lionel plans to have
each task in the selection pane dynamically display the results of
user-configurable report data. I'm sure I'll love it when I see it, but
for me, TimePanic is already a perfect 10 at what it does.
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
scoobie
complimentary to My Life Organised, and very useful for behaviour
modification.
You wouldn't use it to manage your to do list, but it would be very
useful to track time spent and productivity.
Tell me - how are you organising your split between work tasks and
home/life to do's - are they all being tracked in Timepanic or do you
have 2 separate lists in timepanic or are you only using it for work
stuff?
MomGeek
Wow! I downloaded 1/2 dozen time-tracking apps in the past couple of
weeks. I believe you have ended my search. Thanks for sharing! I am
looking forward
MLO's team should look closely at TimePanic when designing the MLM
add-on. Perhaps a partnership could be formed: MLO+TimePanic = killer
app!
Oh my...The names of these two programs couldn't be more yin & yang!
LOL!
Wax forth my friend... your soliloquies could well be mine!
Richard Collings
> that I spend on each of my tasks, work types, and projects. MLO can't
> do that. But the following program can, and it does it spectacularly
> well on both the PC and PPC with real-time synchronization: TimePanic,
> written by Lionel Spohr. You can find it here:
Hmm - interesting but doesn't quite do it for me. What I want but can't find is something that lets me record
my times retrospectively - I want to be able to look back over (say) the last three hours and then split that
down into the various tasks/distractions that I know I have spent time in that period. I don't want (nor need) to
enter start and end times for individual tasks - just the time that I reckon I have spent on each task.
Can't find anything that does it.
At the moment, I use Ecco - I create an appointment specifying the start and end times for the block of time -
Ecco then tells me the total time which I then apportion across the different tasks in that period which I enter as
sub-items to the appointment.
Richard
Richard Musselwhite
as a great compliment to MLO, without duplicating any of its functions.
I track all of my tasks in TimePanic, whether they are work tasks or
not. On the left pane of the program, there is a list of "favorite
tasks." There, I keep a few dozen of my most common tasks. Then I
arrange them into groups, and give each group a distinctive icon. So
the way I have it, all of the work tasks are near the top with a
work-ish icon, then come a group of family tasks with a suitable icon,
then all my chores, then all my leisure tasks, with a cluster of odds
and ends at the bottom. Then, whenever I switch from one type of task
to another, I just pick it from the favorites bar with one click, and
the program does the rest. Because TimePanic assigns each task to a
work type and project, I can generate reports at whichever level I
choose, from the fine-grain detail of task reporting, through activity
types and projects.
If I ever come up with something to do that isn't already on my
favorites, I can add it as a favorite, or simply insert a "new" task and
assign it a task name, activity type, and project designation on the
fly. The task picker on the PPC doesn't have the icons, but the task
list remains sorted according to the sequence on the desktop (which I
have memorized by now), so I have no trouble picking my favorite tasks
quickly.
I have chosen task names for my favorites bar that are appropriate for
the kind of feedback that I want to recieve when I generate my reports.
For example, I don't feel like I need to know how much time I spend
washing the windows versus doing the recycling, so all of my
housecleaning tasks in TimePanic simply get recorded under
"housekeeping." But when I am done, TimePanic does permit me to add
notes to each of my tasks, so I could list my separate activities there.
In contrast, it makes a big difference to me to know what exactly I am
doing on some of my work projects, so I have lots of separate work tasks
listed there.
As for integration with MLO, whenever I am working on a task (like
housecleaning) that has only one task item in TimePanic but several in
MLO (like cleaning windows and doing the recycling), then I check off
each item separately as done in MLO but leave TimePanic's records to
show my time spent simply as housecleaning. I could give each of those
activities a separate task in TimePanic, but in my case, I am not
looking for feedback that is so precise in that area, so I don't bother
to track it closely in TimePanic, but I continue to use my punch buttons
in MLO.
:)
-Richard
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
Richard Musselwhite
to look back over the past few hours (or days) and split that time into
tasks (or distractions) that have already occurred.
Indeed, I do that frequently. On many occasions, I will transit from
one task type to another without remembering to record the change. So
whenever I do remember to make my entries in TimePanic, I begin by
simply adding the first task that I forgot to record. Then I open that
task with a click (or tap), and enter the time that I began it, and the
time that I moved on to something else. Then I enter the next task,
enter its start and end times, and repeat until I have "caught up" to
the current time. It's easy.
Morover, I can go back into a task at any time and change everything
about it, from the times that I completed it, to its name, work type,
project, or notes. I can go back and split a task down into multiple
subtasks, or delete tasks. I don't mean to sound like an infomerical
here, but TimePanic makes all of that seamlessly easy, and it is smart
enough to dynamically adjust the start and end times of every task on
your list to match whatever changes you make to a task.
-Richard
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
Richard Collings
> TimePanic can record time retrospectively, and it does enable the user
> to look back over the past few hours (or days) and split that time into
> tasks (or distractions) that have already occurred.
This sounds interesting but..
<snip>
> Then I open that
> task with a click (or tap), and enter the time that I began it, and the
> time that I moved on to something else. Then I enter the next task,
> enter its start and end times,
I don't want (or need) to enter times for each individual task (often in that period I will have switched between
two or three tasks several times without noticing at all when I switched).
I just want to be able to do the following:
Step 1: define the block of time for which I want to retrospectively record time (eg between 1:00pm and
3:30pm)
Step 2: the program then tells me that this block of time is 2.5. hours long
Step 3: I enter details for the first task in that block of time: a code, a note of what I did and my estimate of
how long I spent (eg 1.75 hrs) - note: no start and end times entered.
Step 4: program tells me that I have 0.75hrs to allocate
Step 5: I then repeat Steps 3 and 4 entering details of (say) the two remaining tasks lasting 0.5 hr and 0.25
respectively; each time I enter a new task (or adjust the time on an existing task, there is something that tells
me the amount of time that I have left to allocate in that block; or if I have gone over, by how much.
It may not be quite so accurate but it does for me and to have to enter times for each task is just going to be
too laborious.
It does look (from the screenshots at least) as if TimePanic can do this (but happy to be proven wrong!)
Richard
Richard Musselwhite
to that logic, but you could make it work if you were will to allow the
program to assign specific times to each task (say, between 12:00-12:45
PM for a forty-five minute activity). That way, you would still be able
to record your tasks in blocks of time and get the benefit of
TimePanic's reports, but you would have to be willing to live with the
fiction that you actually had divided your time up sequentially.
On a minor note, I saw that I mis-typed something in an earlier message.
TimePanic will fill in a lot of your time data for you. So if you
started with an undefined three hour block, and then divided that block
down into smaller segments, you would only need to define your end times
for each task. TimePanic would then dynamically update the start time
of the following task to match.
This may not be exactly what you wanted, but if you are willing to make
a small compromise in how your tasks were displayed (sequentially rather
than simultaneously), I think that the reporting functions would more
than make up the difference.
You could run the program over its free trial period and see, but I know
that finding the right program is often a very personal endeavor. I've
obviously caught the TimePanic bug in a big way, and I know that a lot
of us who use MLO have been looking for a good time tracking program, so
I am just trying to spread the news.
:)
-Richard
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
scoobie
Compared to Timepanic, it does graphs and has some nice icons to start
and stop task time recording which I liked
It not quite a intuitive to get going as Timepanic is though, but I
think it wouldn't take long to pick it up.
Chris
found it and I'm trying it out now. You can get it here:
http://maplexp.veex.net/
Richard Collings
> to that logic, but you could make it work if you were will to allow the
> program to assign specific times to each task (say, between 12:00-12:45
> PM for a forty-five minute activity).
Hmmm - sounds interesting - might just give it a try. One final question - if you adjust the end time of a task
which has following tasks (eg by making it finish later) - what does TimePanic do to the following tasks - push
them down so they all start later; or shorten the following task.
> You could run the program over its free trial period and see, but I know
> that finding the right program is often a very personal endeavor.
All of which takes time (and I tend to get sucked into these things) - which is why I am asking a few questions
before doing anything more (and thanks for your help).
> I've
> obviously caught the TimePanic bug in a big way, and I know that a lot
> of us who use MLO have been looking for a good time tracking program, so
> I am just trying to spread the news.
I have been looking for years and as your description of how you work was similar to my way of working, I was
interested to find out a bit more.
Richard
Richard Collings
per time block.
I really don't understand why nobody has come up with a package which allows multiple tasks per time block.
Most people I know who record their time think - 'Oh dear - haven't done my timesheet for a few hours - what I
have I done? and then just do a rough approximation: I spent half an hour on the phone; took a 15 min coffee
break; spent a couple of hours actually working on what I was supposed to be working on; spent 15 mins being
distracted by my boss; etc; etc.
Richard
Hirsch Technology Solutions
I have those exact same sentiments. I have been searching tirelessly
for a time-tracking solution lately, and have found not a single one
that allows me to work how I want to. I tend to do exactly as you
described - input a block of time, but not necessarily an entire day's
worth. That being said, I also like the ability to very quickly enter a
single item for those times when I remember to record while I'm
working. Currently, I'm using a Excel spreadsheet that I print and
hand-write the information in. Sadly, this has been the most effective
method to date.
I have been seriously considering just spending the time and writing
something from scratch that would take care of it. One of the catches
for me is that I want a single program that will both track all of my
activities and allow me to track billable time and expenses. Most
software on the market will do one or the other very well, but rarely
will it effectively do both.
RD
TimeCompanion from www.inmotion.se. Desktop and Palm versions which
sync nicely. Good printed reports capability.
RD
the old TimeCompanion 1.6 that I use is no longer available. I
certainly dont remember paying that much for it, but the new version
does look good, and would seem to provide some of the features that
some of you have been talking about.
RD
Chris
http://www.inmotion-software.com/DownloadCenter/Files/TimeCompanion%202003.msi
Kenneth S. Rhee
> On 22-Dec-2005 01:04:49, myLifeO...@googlegroups.com wrote:
> Looks cool... their download link didn't work, but this one did:
>
http://www.inmotion-software.com/DownloadCenter/Files/TimeCompanion%202003.m
si
>
Thanks. I found its Palm program and synchronization with Desktop is a plus
for me since I carry and use my Treo 650 everywhere.
Take care,
Ken
Richard Collings
Thanks for the suggestion.
Richard
Richard Collings
Glad I am not alone. And I know other people work in this way as well so I do find it amazing that there is
nothing around that supports this method of time recording.
I do have a sort of solution:
* key my times into an Ecco diary as previously described: specify a block of time as an appointment and then
enter a list of tasks performed in that block of time as a list under that appointment with a time against each
* each project task has a code - I hold the codes for a project in a Clip Cache folder (this works really well and
ensures that I use a consistent coding - Clip Cache is excellent incidentally)
* periodically transfer the times in Timesheet Professional - this displays a list of project tasks down the page
and a list of days across the page. At the moment, I have to manually aggregate the times spent on a task in a
given day and then paste the details into the correct cell in Timesheet which is very painful. I am looking a
writing a Perl script to parse the Ecco appointments and to create a CSV file that can be imported to Timesheet
* use Timesheet's reporting (Crystal reports) to generate billing reports, analyses, etc
Timesheet Professional does provide a powerful (but clunky) ability to categorise tasks - so it is easy to split
work into (in my case): Work: Chargeable; Work: Non-Chargeable; Home; etc
As you can see its a painful process but the fact that you can't find an alternative (I always check out any
recommendations for time recording programs) makes me more inclined to stick with my current 'system'.
PS: I don't particularly like Timesheet Professional. Its just that I have been using it for years and so know my
way around it.
Richard
Richard Musselwhite
I'm happy to answer questions! I used to be a lot more active on this
list, but the past few months absolutely buried me; so I'm glad to have
the chance to participate again. You asked:
> - if you adjust the end time of a task
> which has following tasks (eg by making it finish later) - what does
> TimePanic do to the following tasks - push
> them down so they all start later; or shorten the following task.
TimePanic just shortens the following task. When you adjust the end
time of a task, TimePanic automatically adjust the start time of the
immediately following task, only. When you adjust the start time of a
task, TimePanic adjusts the end time of the previous task, only.
> I have been looking for years and as your description of how you work was
> similar to my way of working, I was
> interested to find out a bit more.
I'm happy to share anything I know!
:)
-Richard
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
James Murphy
<rcol...@cix.co.uk> wrote:
> I really don't understand why nobody has come up with a package which allows > multiple tasks per time block.
Because it doesn't matter - so long as the task and overall totals add
up it doesn't really matter what order it was done in or if it was
done in smaller chunks than are logged because those are the numbers
you're interested in.
--
Murph (oft @ cix)
Richard Collings
Its the fact that I typically fiddle about with the times of the tasks that I think I have done in the time block in
order to get them to add up to the total time in that time block that makes the process fiddly if one has to
specify start and end times for each task.
Typical process:
1. enter start and end times of time block - establish total amount time in time block
2. enter list of things that I think I have done in that time block having a guess at the amount of time I have
spent on each task
3. add times on the individual tasks
4. find that sum of time on individual tasks is a lot less than total amount of time in the block
5. think "Rats - must have done something else" and rack brains
6. if I do think of the 'something else' enter this and go back to 3.
7. if I can't think of anything else, increase times spent on the different tasks until sum of times on tasks =
total time in block.
If you have to enter start and end times for each task in the block, then step 6 and, more especially step 7,
typically become very fiddly when making these adjustments
And its just a pain having to enter a stack of extra data which has no meaning.
Richard
Richard Musselwhite
You probably already saw my earlier post, but just in case you missed
it, I will emphasize again that TimePanic does not have the problem that
you mention. TimePanic never requires fiddling to get the time blocks to
add up correctly. With any task, if you change an end time, it adjusts
only the start time of the following task while leaving that following
task's end time untouched. If you change a start time, TimePanic
adjusts only the end time of the preceding task while leaving that
preceding task's start time untouched.
:)
-Richard M
--
Richard Musselwhite
musse...@letterboxes.org
Richard Collings
> it, I will emphasize again that TimePanic does not have the problem that
> you mention.
I did see that post but in fact decided that this was precisely the behaviour I did not want (but thanks for having another go at
explaining).
I know its way off topic but if I can explain...
Assume that I am trying to work out how I spent my time in a time block between 2:00pm and 4:00pm..
* I create three tasks A, B and C (say) and for each guess at the time spent: 0.5hr, 0.75hr, 0.50hr)
* I add up these times and realise that I am still 0.25hr unaccounted for
* Rack my brains to think if I have done anything else in the time
* Decide that there isn't and decide that Task A is the one that I probably spent the extra 0.25 hr on.
Ideally, I just want to be able to adjust the time for Task A to 0.75hr and I am done.
However, with TimePanic, if I have entered these in order ie (A: 2:00-2:30pm; B: 2:30-3:15pm; C:3:15-3:45pm), then if I adjust
A, it will simply shorten B rather than 'pushing it down' so I then have to go through and adjust the end time for B and then adjust
the end time C to fully account for the 2 hours spent in that time block (and make C end at 4:00pm).
This may seem like a trivial point but it is something that I do all the time (I spend most of my time wondering where the heck the
last 2 hours went and why I have so little to show for it!) and anything that is at all fiddly will be very irritating (and waste time).
Thanks again for the explanations and sorry to be so negative
Richard
Daniel Hirsch
After countless weeks of frustration in finding a solution for tracking
my time spent, the decision has been made to develop a new, home-spun
application. Tentatively called Crunch Time (pending searches for
conflicting products or a better idea), it will be a daily time manager
in the style of Time Panic. I've already begun development, but the
feature list is somewhat wide-open, so I'm offering up the opportunity
for any MLO users to help shape the future. You have all been a
wonderfully helpful and inventive group, so your resources will be
welcomed.
To give everyone a basic idea of where the project is going, Crunch
Time will be structured to track either all or a given subset of your
time (meaning it won't complain about large gaps). It will easily
accomodate entering time as it accrues for users who sit at the
computer and want to enter every so often, as well as going back and
entering large blocks of time easily.
There will be support for predefined activities, associations (ie what
project, person etc..), and classifications. Associations and
Classifications will most likely be 'tag' style where you can assign
mutliple tags to a task.
There will hopefully be a quick task entry dialog (a la MLO), a list
entry, and a calendar view entry (like Outlook) to allow for
repositioning. Start and End times will be available, but NOT required.
There will be a substantial focus on tracking billable time and
expenses as part of all functions.
I really do not want to step on anybody's toes, so I will avoid making
references to the product in this group, but I wanted to invite anybody
who is interested in helping shape the program to discuss it further.
Ultimately, the plan is to release the software as reasonably priced
shareware, but during development it will be made freely available.
If anybody is interested, send me an email to two.o...@gmail.com and
let me know. I'll setup a group or discussion forum at some point soon,
and this way I can let you know.
Thanks,
Daniel Hirsch