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Aaron D
Dec 18, 2008, 4:09:48 PM12/18/08
to Musopen
http://sites.google.com/a/musopen.com/book/Home/table-of-contents
Id like to get thoughts, here are two sample TOC to get started.
Tonal Harmony Kostka, Payne
https://www.box.net/shared/klb6yohyl5
Techniques and Materials of Music Benjamin, Horvit, Nelson
https://www.box.net/shared/4y8iof4p4f
By the way, feel free to start writing one down in the wiki, or
suggest it here.
Aaron
Id like to get thoughts, here are two sample TOC to get started.
Tonal Harmony Kostka, Payne
https://www.box.net/shared/klb6yohyl5
Techniques and Materials of Music Benjamin, Horvit, Nelson
https://www.box.net/shared/4y8iof4p4f
By the way, feel free to start writing one down in the wiki, or
suggest it here.
Aaron
Syrinx
Dec 21, 2008, 10:24:42 AM12/21/08
to Musopen
Hey everyone,
I am not very familiar with the American curriculum of music
theory. I just got a book from a friend who studied composition in US
(Harmonic Practice in Tonal Music, 2nd Edition, Gauldin):
http://www.amazon.com/Harmonic-Practice-Tonal-Music-Second/dp/0393976661/ref=sr_1_30?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229872352&sr=1-30
The book didn't receive very good reviews @Amazon.com, which I sort
of understand. Anyway, I understand that some of you want to include
some sections of acoustics, psychoacoustics etc., but that may also
result in a very large book; and not everything can be covered. But to
me, a basic introduction of the overtones makes sense. Basically
because of its connection with triads and scales.
Anyway, how do you want to get started? I have come to realize that
a certain skill of three-/four-part writing gains a lot to the
student. Cos it's not all about being able to define what kind of a
triad a chord is, but also about knowing the connection between them
(which includes spacing, avoiding of parallels etc.). But the first
chapter is certainly not about these, so I'd like to know how I can be
of any help.
One more comment on examples. e.g. "Musical excerpts showing triads
(and inversions)". Too complex excerpts can make the students feel
lost. And many students want to play them, so difficult examples could
not work as well. What do you guys think?
Selim
I am not very familiar with the American curriculum of music
theory. I just got a book from a friend who studied composition in US
(Harmonic Practice in Tonal Music, 2nd Edition, Gauldin):
http://www.amazon.com/Harmonic-Practice-Tonal-Music-Second/dp/0393976661/ref=sr_1_30?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1229872352&sr=1-30
The book didn't receive very good reviews @Amazon.com, which I sort
of understand. Anyway, I understand that some of you want to include
some sections of acoustics, psychoacoustics etc., but that may also
result in a very large book; and not everything can be covered. But to
me, a basic introduction of the overtones makes sense. Basically
because of its connection with triads and scales.
Anyway, how do you want to get started? I have come to realize that
a certain skill of three-/four-part writing gains a lot to the
student. Cos it's not all about being able to define what kind of a
triad a chord is, but also about knowing the connection between them
(which includes spacing, avoiding of parallels etc.). But the first
chapter is certainly not about these, so I'd like to know how I can be
of any help.
One more comment on examples. e.g. "Musical excerpts showing triads
(and inversions)". Too complex excerpts can make the students feel
lost. And many students want to play them, so difficult examples could
not work as well. What do you guys think?
Selim
Tom Goldie
Dec 21, 2008, 4:50:47 PM12/21/08
to mus...@googlegroups.com
It would be nice in an "online" version of the book to include midis of
the triads and inversions, so the reader/listener could get a feel for
why they're called inversions of the same triad. Having something to
listen to definitely makes the examples more practical.
the triads and inversions, so the reader/listener could get a feel for
why they're called inversions of the same triad. Having something to
listen to definitely makes the examples more practical.
Syrinx
Dec 22, 2008, 7:02:56 PM12/22/08
to Musopen
I agree, and plugins like Scorch (for Sibelius) also makes things
much easier. The reader can follow and listen at the same time. But my
main point was the examples from the musical repertoire. Too complex
examples (even if they include some triads and inversions) can make
the student feel lost.
Are we starting to work on the 1st chapter? I'd be glad to work on
finding some examples.
much easier. The reader can follow and listen at the same time. But my
main point was the examples from the musical repertoire. Too complex
examples (even if they include some triads and inversions) can make
the student feel lost.
Are we starting to work on the 1st chapter? I'd be glad to work on
finding some examples.
Tohm Judson
Dec 22, 2008, 11:08:11 PM12/22/08
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Has anyone taken a look at Noteflight for online scoring? http://www.noteflight.com/
It looks quite promising.
Notation and scoring should probably be moved to another thread...
but...
I have begun working on Basic Acoustics and a Basic note/chord
chapters for my Basic Musicianship (fundamentals through chord
inversions and basic counterpoint) course next semester, in which I
plan to create my own text/examples (see the announcement I made about
scale images, MIDI is ready, just not posted yet). I would be glad to
share them (text, scores, MIDI, MP3) as they become available in the
next week and would love to have all of your comments. I think MP3 is
important because students can then listen away from the computer.
What would be great is if everyone were willing to donate one melody
per chapter, either composed or open source. We could then use these
as either examples, use for analysis by students, use as workbook/
homework examples, or even better as a aural skills portion! With 70+
people on in this, the potential would be outstanding. For example...
the chapter on scales... say, 35 examples of scales in the literature,
and 35 newly composed would be more than most teachers could cover in
3 semesters of theory 1 :)
As an aside, I also plan on having Flash based quizzes with scales,
note recognition, chords with inversions, chord quality listening
finished in 2-3 weeks (just before classes start). Again would love
to share and have comments. I will post as soon as they are ready.
As note, I am trying to put ALL chords (through sevenths), notes, etc
in to these Flash quizzes eventually and will have the images ready to
share. Questions would be random from all available data.
I'll keep you all posted,
Cheers, and happy holidays,
Tohm
It looks quite promising.
Notation and scoring should probably be moved to another thread...
but...
I have begun working on Basic Acoustics and a Basic note/chord
chapters for my Basic Musicianship (fundamentals through chord
inversions and basic counterpoint) course next semester, in which I
plan to create my own text/examples (see the announcement I made about
scale images, MIDI is ready, just not posted yet). I would be glad to
share them (text, scores, MIDI, MP3) as they become available in the
next week and would love to have all of your comments. I think MP3 is
important because students can then listen away from the computer.
What would be great is if everyone were willing to donate one melody
per chapter, either composed or open source. We could then use these
as either examples, use for analysis by students, use as workbook/
homework examples, or even better as a aural skills portion! With 70+
people on in this, the potential would be outstanding. For example...
the chapter on scales... say, 35 examples of scales in the literature,
and 35 newly composed would be more than most teachers could cover in
3 semesters of theory 1 :)
As an aside, I also plan on having Flash based quizzes with scales,
note recognition, chords with inversions, chord quality listening
finished in 2-3 weeks (just before classes start). Again would love
to share and have comments. I will post as soon as they are ready.
As note, I am trying to put ALL chords (through sevenths), notes, etc
in to these Flash quizzes eventually and will have the images ready to
share. Questions would be random from all available data.
I'll keep you all posted,
Cheers, and happy holidays,
Tohm
Syrinx
Dec 25, 2008, 5:46:29 PM12/25/08
to Musopen
Haven't looked at Noteflight deeply, but it looks really ok.
Someone has to have a good look at it.
I agree, MP3s would make many things easier for the student. There
are many Beethoven Sonatas and other piano literature recorded in
MusOpen. I think we would have the right to use them as well, right?
And the idea of melody contribution is really very promising. My
only concern is that we really have to know, for which purpose we are
using those melodies. So we can edit the score accordingly (e.g.
highlighting a suspension, triad inversion etc.). So a greater
knowlegde about the chapters is what we need.
Some suggestions:
- Intervals: We can use one melody for each interval. Or one for
the ascending, one for the descending interval.
- Scales: Examples in melodies/repertoire for scales. Beethoven
sonatas are full with scales :)
If we don't introduce the student with triads in the 1st Chapter,
these two could be a good way to begin.
I really think that it is very important that the student can not
only define a chord/interval/cadence, but also will be able to
understand its effect in the bigger picture.
Selim
Tohm: Looking forward to your quizzes!
On Dec 23, 6:08 am, Tohm Judson <t...@tohmjudson.com> wrote:
> Has anyone taken a look at Noteflight for online scoring?http://www.noteflight.com/
Someone has to have a good look at it.
I agree, MP3s would make many things easier for the student. There
are many Beethoven Sonatas and other piano literature recorded in
MusOpen. I think we would have the right to use them as well, right?
And the idea of melody contribution is really very promising. My
only concern is that we really have to know, for which purpose we are
using those melodies. So we can edit the score accordingly (e.g.
highlighting a suspension, triad inversion etc.). So a greater
knowlegde about the chapters is what we need.
Some suggestions:
- Intervals: We can use one melody for each interval. Or one for
the ascending, one for the descending interval.
- Scales: Examples in melodies/repertoire for scales. Beethoven
sonatas are full with scales :)
If we don't introduce the student with triads in the 1st Chapter,
these two could be a good way to begin.
I really think that it is very important that the student can not
only define a chord/interval/cadence, but also will be able to
understand its effect in the bigger picture.
Selim
Tohm: Looking forward to your quizzes!
On Dec 23, 6:08 am, Tohm Judson <t...@tohmjudson.com> wrote:
> Has anyone taken a look at Noteflight for online scoring?http://www.noteflight.com/
jm...@ic.ac.uk
Dec 27, 2008, 7:52:02 PM12/27/08
to Musopen
Hello!
The idea about giving musical extracts that demonstrate each of the
intervals is interesting. I've been preparing an informal music theory
course for some friends of mine, and I've gone through all the
intervals and their classifications, and found musical examples that
demonstrate most of them. Perhaps I could contribute this! (My
examples don't include one for each ascending and one for each
descending interval; I've put slightly more stress on harmonic
intervals than melodic intervals.)
Also, if we do include audio files for our musical examples, I would
recommend that for the most part we use MIDI rather than live
recordings - which may sound a little odd at first, but there are a
couple of very good reasons for this:
a) It would usually be advantageous for the student to be able to hear
the musical extract at a much slower tempo, so as to make it easier to
hear and to appreciate the relevant feature that's being described.
This is achievable with MIDI, but not with a live recording.
b) In most recordings, I think for a variety of reasons, the melody
dominates very strongly over the rest of the texture, and so - unless
the feature being described is specifically in the melody - again it
will be much harder for the student to hear and appreciate it.
Plus, if we include audio files, I feel that it's important to
stress the advantage of the student actually playing the examples at
the piano rather than just listening to them on the computer: first of
all, you are in total control as you play, and so you can repeat/
isolate/bring out the relevant feature being described; and secondly,
actually being the one whose physical actions are producing the music
significantly increases your appreciation of the music and of what's
going on in the music.
Anyway, does my contributing my thing on the intervals sound good?
Julian
The idea about giving musical extracts that demonstrate each of the
intervals is interesting. I've been preparing an informal music theory
course for some friends of mine, and I've gone through all the
intervals and their classifications, and found musical examples that
demonstrate most of them. Perhaps I could contribute this! (My
examples don't include one for each ascending and one for each
descending interval; I've put slightly more stress on harmonic
intervals than melodic intervals.)
Also, if we do include audio files for our musical examples, I would
recommend that for the most part we use MIDI rather than live
recordings - which may sound a little odd at first, but there are a
couple of very good reasons for this:
a) It would usually be advantageous for the student to be able to hear
the musical extract at a much slower tempo, so as to make it easier to
hear and to appreciate the relevant feature that's being described.
This is achievable with MIDI, but not with a live recording.
b) In most recordings, I think for a variety of reasons, the melody
dominates very strongly over the rest of the texture, and so - unless
the feature being described is specifically in the melody - again it
will be much harder for the student to hear and appreciate it.
Plus, if we include audio files, I feel that it's important to
stress the advantage of the student actually playing the examples at
the piano rather than just listening to them on the computer: first of
all, you are in total control as you play, and so you can repeat/
isolate/bring out the relevant feature being described; and secondly,
actually being the one whose physical actions are producing the music
significantly increases your appreciation of the music and of what's
going on in the music.
Anyway, does my contributing my thing on the intervals sound good?
Julian
Aaron D
Jan 8, 2009, 8:24:24 PM1/8/09
to Musopen
I think interval examples are definitely important and a valuable
contribution.
Id like to see more of the contributions done in the context of some
framework though.
For example, I think interval examples would be good in both a problem
set at the end of a chapter, and also throughout a chapter discussing
different intervals, ideally with examples taken from sheet music.
Aaron
contribution.
Id like to see more of the contributions done in the context of some
framework though.
For example, I think interval examples would be good in both a problem
set at the end of a chapter, and also throughout a chapter discussing
different intervals, ideally with examples taken from sheet music.
Aaron
Tohm
Jan 9, 2009, 10:36:25 AM1/9/09
to Musopen
I agree, the TOC should be setup first...
I have updated the Chapter 1 TOC... its actually very close to the
Kostka/Payne now that I look at it... except I feel rhythm should
always come before pitch (how can something be there if it has no
length?). Thank you Julian for the idea about switching scales and
intervals... Please feel free to edit, change, offer suggestions.
Julian... I would love to see some of the interval excerpts you have
found. I'm thinking that now that we have a storage folder (THANK YOU
AARON!), what would be nice is if we starting putting examples in
these folders. These can then be used in the chapter and in a
"problem set at the end of the chapter" or even a workbook.
As far as the MIDI or MP3... I think we should do both. I think the
more options we have, the farther we can reach... for example, I'm
hoping I can build these quizzes so they can be practiced on cell
phones
By the way, quizzes will be up soon :)
I have updated the Chapter 1 TOC... its actually very close to the
Kostka/Payne now that I look at it... except I feel rhythm should
always come before pitch (how can something be there if it has no
length?). Thank you Julian for the idea about switching scales and
intervals... Please feel free to edit, change, offer suggestions.
Julian... I would love to see some of the interval excerpts you have
found. I'm thinking that now that we have a storage folder (THANK YOU
AARON!), what would be nice is if we starting putting examples in
these folders. These can then be used in the chapter and in a
"problem set at the end of the chapter" or even a workbook.
As far as the MIDI or MP3... I think we should do both. I think the
more options we have, the farther we can reach... for example, I'm
hoping I can build these quizzes so they can be practiced on cell
phones
By the way, quizzes will be up soon :)
Nora Karakousoglou
Jan 11, 2009, 1:18:02 PM1/11/09
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Hi everyone! Do you think we can add examples from the vocal, orchestral and instrumental repertory to demonstrate each one of the categories? (Example: Stravinsky for compound meter, string quartet score or 4-voice choir for the clefs, Grieg string music for inversions, Brahms for syncopations, Messiaen modes etc).
I am following the e-mails, I just don't always have time to respond. The project is moving fast!! great job!
Nora
Aaron D
Jan 16, 2009, 8:41:54 PM1/16/09
to Musopen
Anyone willing to flesh out more of the TOC other chapters?
Id like to get the TOC finished so we can start assigning people to
various chapters.
Aaron
> --
> Nora Karakousoglou
Id like to get the TOC finished so we can start assigning people to
various chapters.
Aaron
> Nora Karakousoglou
Evan
Jan 26, 2009, 9:01:59 PM1/26/09
to Musopen
Hey all,
Finally on board. I'd like to make some suggestions regarding the
table of contents. [It seems presumptuous to just change things
around without having ever posted.]
First, I feel like what are now called "chapters" are really sections
or parts, making the next level of headings chapters. (It gets
confusing when we talk about assigning a chapter to someone...)
Second, I'd like to see the circle of 5ths included in the key
signature chapter.
Third, I'd like to see a separate chapter on "Form," which would
probably mean that the "phrases" and "periods" parts could be moved
there.
(One using the book wouldn't necessarily have to get all the way
through Chromatic Harmony before diving into Form, but it would be
nice to keep things organized)
I can't tell if there was a clear decision made about Roman Numerals,
but I am content with us using upper and lower case.
evan.
p.s., Tohm, fancy meeting you here!
Finally on board. I'd like to make some suggestions regarding the
table of contents. [It seems presumptuous to just change things
around without having ever posted.]
First, I feel like what are now called "chapters" are really sections
or parts, making the next level of headings chapters. (It gets
confusing when we talk about assigning a chapter to someone...)
Second, I'd like to see the circle of 5ths included in the key
signature chapter.
Third, I'd like to see a separate chapter on "Form," which would
probably mean that the "phrases" and "periods" parts could be moved
there.
(One using the book wouldn't necessarily have to get all the way
through Chromatic Harmony before diving into Form, but it would be
nice to keep things organized)
I can't tell if there was a clear decision made about Roman Numerals,
but I am content with us using upper and lower case.
evan.
p.s., Tohm, fancy meeting you here!
Albert Frantz
Jan 27, 2009, 1:47:03 AM1/27/09
to Musopen
Hi everyone,
I'd like to propose that the chapter currently titled "Volume" be
renamed. "Dynamics" refers to relative intensity, not absolute
amplitude or volume levels. I feel it is essential for students to
understand this distinction from the very beginning; the consequence
otherwise is that students learn to associate some musical symbol with
some false absolute ("A forte is a forte is a forte," for instance --
how many players do we know nowadays who play all fortes the same?! --
or even "Mozart's forte is different from Wagner's forte," the error
being the assumption that there exists some definite loudness level
that either composer would identify as "forte" and which they wanted
in all of their works, or even within a single work, categorically).
All truly historical recordings (of 19th-century performers) exhibit
the feature that the peak of a crescendo is not the loudest note.
I call this tacit assumption ("this means that") the ontological
error, as it implies that music "is" black notes on a white page,
hence that music "is" the score, independent of crucial oral-
historical and aural testimony or stylistic parameters. Music is
sound, not a logical-positivistic set of factoids. Thus, musicians
interpreting historical music are bound by stylistic parameters that
far exceed any black-and-white textual evidence we might have (how to
play ornaments, for example).
I'd be happy to volunteer to draft the chapter on dynamics. I
*promise* I won't introduce any confusing academic terms and vow to
keep it simple!
In any case, shall we rename this chapter simply to Dynamics?
Kind regards,
Albert
I'd like to propose that the chapter currently titled "Volume" be
renamed. "Dynamics" refers to relative intensity, not absolute
amplitude or volume levels. I feel it is essential for students to
understand this distinction from the very beginning; the consequence
otherwise is that students learn to associate some musical symbol with
some false absolute ("A forte is a forte is a forte," for instance --
how many players do we know nowadays who play all fortes the same?! --
or even "Mozart's forte is different from Wagner's forte," the error
being the assumption that there exists some definite loudness level
that either composer would identify as "forte" and which they wanted
in all of their works, or even within a single work, categorically).
All truly historical recordings (of 19th-century performers) exhibit
the feature that the peak of a crescendo is not the loudest note.
I call this tacit assumption ("this means that") the ontological
error, as it implies that music "is" black notes on a white page,
hence that music "is" the score, independent of crucial oral-
historical and aural testimony or stylistic parameters. Music is
sound, not a logical-positivistic set of factoids. Thus, musicians
interpreting historical music are bound by stylistic parameters that
far exceed any black-and-white textual evidence we might have (how to
play ornaments, for example).
I'd be happy to volunteer to draft the chapter on dynamics. I
*promise* I won't introduce any confusing academic terms and vow to
keep it simple!
In any case, shall we rename this chapter simply to Dynamics?
Kind regards,
Albert
Tohm
Jan 27, 2009, 8:32:24 AM1/27/09
to Musopen
Evan,
First the shock... How's it going?
Next.. I agree with you. I noticed that last night while I was
looking at it as well. The chapters need to be made shorter and rest
under parts/sections. I thought I had included the Circle of Fifths,
but upon further review, I missed it, hahaha.
Albert,
I am all for changing it to Dynamics. I've been spending a little to
much time working with acoustics lately it seems. If you would like
to start that chapter "Dynamics", that would be fantastic.
Evan.. would you like to start a little something on form? We can
discuss where that should go at a later date.
I think I am going to start a new thread about chapter assignments...
PS I should have the pitch section drafted out this week
First the shock... How's it going?
Next.. I agree with you. I noticed that last night while I was
looking at it as well. The chapters need to be made shorter and rest
under parts/sections. I thought I had included the Circle of Fifths,
but upon further review, I missed it, hahaha.
Albert,
I am all for changing it to Dynamics. I've been spending a little to
much time working with acoustics lately it seems. If you would like
to start that chapter "Dynamics", that would be fantastic.
Evan.. would you like to start a little something on form? We can
discuss where that should go at a later date.
I think I am going to start a new thread about chapter assignments...
PS I should have the pitch section drafted out this week
Albert Frantz
Jan 27, 2009, 9:05:12 AM1/27/09
to Musopen
Tohm,
I'd be happy to draft the chapter on dynamics. I assume it hasn't been
assigned to anyone just yet? We'll all be able to edit, correct and
amend it afterward.
I wanted to make another suggestion: Has anyone considered using
collaborative online document software for this project? Zoho Office
was created especially for tasks such as ours. I also noticed that
box.net now integrates with Zoho. There's an excellent free note
taking program, similar to OneNote, which allows real-time
collaboration. I have a feeling working with it would greatly
accelerate our progress.
Kind regards,
Albert
I'd be happy to draft the chapter on dynamics. I assume it hasn't been
assigned to anyone just yet? We'll all be able to edit, correct and
amend it afterward.
I wanted to make another suggestion: Has anyone considered using
collaborative online document software for this project? Zoho Office
was created especially for tasks such as ours. I also noticed that
box.net now integrates with Zoho. There's an excellent free note
taking program, similar to OneNote, which allows real-time
collaboration. I have a feeling working with it would greatly
accelerate our progress.
Kind regards,
Albert
Tohm Judson
Jan 27, 2009, 9:21:17 AM1/27/09
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Albert,
Sounds great!
I have not gotten a chance to look at Zoho... but I'll take a look
tonight after classes. You had suggested that before, and I just
haven't had the time to dig into it yet. Looks like it could work
nicely.
Tohm
Sounds great!
I have not gotten a chance to look at Zoho... but I'll take a look
tonight after classes. You had suggested that before, and I just
haven't had the time to dig into it yet. Looks like it could work
nicely.
Tohm
Message has been deleted
Aaron D
Mar 9, 2009, 8:00:23 PM3/9/09
to Musopen
Is anyone able to contribute to the table of contents?
Id love to see some more progress on that.
http://sites.google.com/a/musopen.com/book/Home/table-of-contents
For reference, here is a PDF of what someone else is using:
https://www.box.net/shared/klb6yohyl5
Aaron
Id love to see some more progress on that.
http://sites.google.com/a/musopen.com/book/Home/table-of-contents
For reference, here is a PDF of what someone else is using:
https://www.box.net/shared/klb6yohyl5
Aaron
Tohm Judson
Mar 11, 2009, 12:16:59 AM3/11/09
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Sorry, but I have been out for a bit with a family emergency... I
will take a look at it this week...
Are we all agreed on the first part as is? What changes would
everyone like to see? Something we missed?
Albert: how is the chapter on dynamics coming?
Evan: Form sections in the works?
I would like to point out that this format is wonderful for including
any and every subject relating to theory. Since you can pick and
choose which chapters you would like to use in the book, we can
include various things (with in reason of course, don't really need
Lewin in this I think, hahaha).
So please, let us know what we are missing... Or, even better, if you
would be interested in writing a chapter/section!!! We still have a
lot to cover...
Cheers all,
Tohm
will take a look at it this week...
Are we all agreed on the first part as is? What changes would
everyone like to see? Something we missed?
Albert: how is the chapter on dynamics coming?
Evan: Form sections in the works?
I would like to point out that this format is wonderful for including
any and every subject relating to theory. Since you can pick and
choose which chapters you would like to use in the book, we can
include various things (with in reason of course, don't really need
Lewin in this I think, hahaha).
So please, let us know what we are missing... Or, even better, if you
would be interested in writing a chapter/section!!! We still have a
lot to cover...
Cheers all,
Tohm
Albert Frantz
Mar 11, 2009, 2:28:05 AM3/11/09
to Musopen
> Albert: how is the chapter on dynamics coming?
Hi Tohm,
It's on my to do list but I had to put it off until next week since
I'm working day and night on other projects. Assuming I survive next
week's recording session (Alkan...) I should be able to catch my
breath.
Best,
Albert
Tohm
Mar 30, 2009, 9:53:47 AM3/30/09
to Musopen
Major update to the TOC... Please feel free to make changes or make
suggestions...
As always, we could use some volunteers for a chapter or two (or
12) :)
Cheers,
Tohm
suggestions...
As always, we could use some volunteers for a chapter or two (or
12) :)
Cheers,
Tohm
evan
Apr 1, 2009, 4:30:56 PM4/1/09
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Hey All,
I saw this on TED and thought that it was immediately and totally pertinent to what we are doing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPQViNNOAkw
It's 20 minutes and immensely worth it.
evan
I saw this on TED and thought that it was immediately and totally pertinent to what we are doing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPQViNNOAkw
It's 20 minutes and immensely worth it.
evan
Emilio Renard
Jul 21, 2009, 4:43:38 AM7/21/09
to mus...@googlegroups.com
Dear Aaron, I would like know the term of time for load the contents to musopen
Best regards, Emilio |
¡Obtén la mejor experiencia en la web!
Descarga gratis el nuevo Internet Explorer 8
http://downloads.yahoo.com/ieak8/?l=e1
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