Michael Laschober

[Dominique Waller]

A few days ago, I was reading the first issue of Music Notation News (1986). Inside I found a list of inventors, among them Michael Laschober, whom I had briefly met at the Chigaco Conference in 2002. His notation system is called "Puntun" and  described as a semi-tone grid (chomatic staff), with no noteheads and non-traditional timings. Can anyone give me more information on this system ? Just curious.

Thank you in advance

Dominique

[Pashkuli Keyboard]

Couldn't we have them in digital (pdf) format already?

Music Notation News

Music Notation Evaluation Procedure

Music Notation Proposals

Test for New Notation Systems

If someone is willing to send those to me (I live in the UK) I can scan them to pdf.

[Thomas Nguyen]

3JCN music notation has no noteheads and staff lines http://3jcn.us

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[Douglas Keislar]

Scanning all the Music Notation Modernization Association publications to PDF and making them available online is a project we've envisioned for years. I am retiring in a few months and will have time to do this then.

Doug

On Wed, Sep 4, 2024 at 9:07 AM Pashkuli Keyboard <pashkuli...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Douglas Keislar]

Hi Dominique,

Here is a scan from Musical Six-Six Newsletter 13:2 (1984), showing the front cover and Laschober's article. As you can see, Puntun is a simple system for singers, not a general-purpose notation system.

Best,

Doug

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[Pashkuli Keyboard]

Oh, Doug that is great if you could really take the time and scan the papers.

Happy retiring!

I see that Puntun is quite close in resemblance to the MIDI-roll with all the grids and blocks. No wonder since MIDI protocol came out at around 1983.

Makes perfect sense.

[Douglas Keislar]

It's conceivable that Laschober's Puntun was influenced by MIDI, but I suspect not. The first MIDI software using piano-roll style representations appeared around the same time as his article in Musical Six-Six Newsletter (1984):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_roll#In_digital_audio_workstations

but generally notation inventors have been using their notation system for a while before they write an article about it. And of course physical piano rolls had existed for many decades -- though Laschober might not have been influenced by those, either. The concept of a pitch- and time-proportional grid was not new.

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[Pashkuli Keyboard]

Oh, yes

you actually right. MIDI was just a data comm protocol in the '80s at the end there were visual digital representation of it in DAWs. But I was a baby back then (literally!) so for me those become more tangible at the very late '90s (1999~2000 to be more precise when I saw Samplitude v5 24\96 something).

I am really eager to read those booklets from all those who bothered their minds with such subject decades before I did.

I also use the very ancient (~300 BC) concept of Alypian notation but in modern context and rather simplified because of Equal Temperament and unification.

[Waller Dominique]

Thanks Doug.

I quote Wikipedia: “ MIDI files have generally supplanted piano rolls in storing and playing back performance data, accomplishing digitally and electronically what piano rolls do mechanically. MIDI editing software often features the ability to represent the music graphically as a piano roll.”

Whatever it is in the case of Laschober, it’s true that inventors are regularly influenced by new musical machines and/or their interfaces. A century ago, it was the piano-roll and now it’s the computer. A now-old example is Joseph Schillinger. A more recent is Dodeka notation (see added pictures).

            Besides, Doug, have you sold your 6/6 piano?

envoyé : 5 septembre 2024 à 18:53
de : Douglas Keislar <douglas...@gmail.com>
à : musicn...@googlegroups.com
objet : Re: [MNP] Michael Laschober

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[Pashkuli Keyboard]

MIDI is great to handle by software\code.

It is a nightmare as a printed medium for a human to read (and write as well): for example counting grid lines, triplets and rests…

Computers do not interpret visually (at least not just yet) but it will be implemented with ML and AI with better light sensors (artificial eyes).

[Douglas Keislar]

Thanks for the Schillinger example, Dominique. That illustrates my point that a pitch- and time-proportional grid is an old concept.

Since you asked: I gave my 6-6 piano last year to a young enthusiast living in a nearby city.

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[Douglas Keislar]

Computers do not interpret  visually (at least not just yet) but it will be implemented with ML and AI with better light sensors (artificial eyes).

Certainly. Note that already in the early 1980s, there was a keyboard-playing robot that had a limited ability to read a musical score:

https://robotsguide.com/robots/wabot

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[Paul Morris]

Hi Doug, Thanks for being willing to work on this scanning project. I'm happy to help where it makes sense, and where I'm able. It will be great to have those available online.

Paul

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