Offline mode

[Fernando Jiménez Moreno]

Hello folks,

I keep thinking that forcing our sensors to have a WiFi connection is quite limiting.

Apologies if you already discussed about this, but I was wondering if we have considered implementing an offline mode for sensors that do not have access to a WiFi connection (i.e. sensors on a rooftop).

It seems that we are going to implement the communication between the SensorWeb client and sensor stations via BLE for the setup process, so I was thinking that we could take advantage of this communication channel and make the sensor stations store their readings data locally and sync themselves periodically every time the client that they are linked to is around and accessible via BLE.

This way we could have more flexibility about where users can place their sensor stations and the setup process in this case might be simpler (just link the client to the sensor station and no typing of long passwords on tiny keyboards).

Note that I am not suggesting to kill the WiFi mode. I am just suggesting an alternative approach for the use cases where WiFi is not possible.

Cheers,

/ Fernando

[Fabrice Desré]

On 09/12/2016 03:18 AM, Fernando Jiménez Moreno wrote:
>
> This way we could have more flexibility about where users can place
> their sensor stations and the setup process in this case might be
> simpler (just link the client to the sensor station and no typing of
> long passwords on tiny keyboards).

If no phone comes close to the sensor and we run out of storage space we
would lose some data, right? So this solution relies on the expectation
that somehow the phone and sensor get in proximity often enough?
Honestly I don't know if that's a problem or not. Intuitively that could
be ok if the sensor density is high, so maybe in a phase 2?

--
Fabrice Desré
Connected Devices
Mozilla Corporation

[Fernando Jiménez Moreno]

Yes, if we run out of storage space, we would lose some data. But we are talking about air quality information, so I would expect that users won't be much interested in old data. Removing the oldest readings should allow us to make enough space to always have the data from the latest X days.

[Houman Forood]

One use case where historical data is important is in home monitoring case. While the system is armed, the connection drops, whether maliciously or accidentally. The device's siren should still go off even without Internet connection but as soon as connection is restored, the notification should still be sent to the user's phone that motion was detected. In reality, the user should have already received a notification that the device had lost connectivity which may mean nothing. However, coupling that with historical data indicating motion was detected and siren going off, provides the user with a lot better data points.... In this case, offline storage is minimal of course

This is an interesting read along the same line: https://www.wired.com/2016/01/xfinitys-security-system-flaws-open-homes-to-thieves/

Houman

_____________________________
From: Fernando Jiménez Moreno <fmo...@mozilla.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 00:44
Subject: Re: Offline mode
To: Fabrice Desré <fab...@mozilla.com>
Cc: Houman Forood <hfo...@mozilla.com>, <mozilla-de...@lists.mozilla.org>, Cindy H <chs...@mozilla.com>

[Houman Forood]

Another point you are brining up RE: SensirWeb, I forget if we are showing historical data to the user in our user stories? Or better yet, should we? Tiff/Jacqi/Cindy? I think we should and if some data is lost due to long disconnectivity, we could always show data is missing for a certain period of time...

Houman

_____________________________
From: Houman Forood <hfo...@mozilla.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 02:53
Subject: Re: Offline mode
To: Fernando Jiménez Moreno <fmo...@mozilla.com>, Fabrice Desré <fab...@mozilla.com>
Cc: Benjamin Francis <bfra...@mozilla.com>, Cindy H <chs...@mozilla.com>, David Bialer <dbi...@mozilla.com>, <mozilla-de...@lists.mozilla.org>

[Fabrice Desré]

The home space is vastly different. Let's not mix everything up.

On 09/13/2016 02:53 AM, Houman Forood wrote:
> One use case where historical data is important is in home monitoring
> case. While the system is armed, the connection drops, whether
> maliciously or accidentally. The device's siren should still go off even
> without Internet connection but as soon as connection is restored, the
> notification should still be sent to the user's phone that motion was
> detected. In reality, the user should have already received a
> notification that the device had lost connectivity which may mean
> nothing. However, coupling that with historical data indicating motion
> was detected and siren going off, provides the user with a lot better
> data points.... In this case, offline storage is minimal of course
>
> This is an interesting read along the same line:
> https://www.wired.com/2016/01/xfinitys-security-system-flaws-open-homes-to-thieves/
>
> Houman
>
> _____________________________
> From: Fernando Jiménez Moreno <fmo...@mozilla.com

> <mailto:fmo...@mozilla.com>>

> Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 00:44
> Subject: Re: Offline mode

> To: Fabrice Desré <fab...@mozilla.com <mailto:fab...@mozilla.com>>
> Cc: Houman Forood <hfo...@mozilla.com <mailto:hfo...@mozilla.com>>,
> <mozilla-de...@lists.mozilla.org
> <mailto:mozilla-de...@lists.mozilla.org>>, Cindy H
> <chs...@mozilla.com <mailto:chs...@mozilla.com>>

[Houman Forood]

You call it mixing up, I call it planning and thinking it through so we can extract a platform out of our use cases

Houman

On Tue, Sep 13, 2016 at 7:43 AM -0700, "Fabrice Desré" <fab...@mozilla.com> wrote:

The home space is vastly different. Let's not mix everything up.

On 09/13/2016 02:53 AM, Houman Forood wrote:
> One use case where historical data is important is in home monitoring
> case. While the system is armed, the connection drops, whether
> maliciously or accidentally. The device's siren should still go off even
> without Internet connection but as soon as connection is restored, the
> notification should still be sent to the user's phone that motion was
> detected. In reality, the user should have already received a
> notification that the device had lost connectivity which may mean
> nothing. However, coupling that with historical data indicating motion
> was detected and siren going off, provides the user with a lot better
> data points.... In this case, offline storage is minimal of course
>
> This is an interesting read along the same line:
> https://www.wired.com/2016/01/xfinitys-security-system-flaws-open-homes-to-thieves/
>
> Houman
>
> _____________________________
> From: Fernando Jiménez Moreno  

>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 00:44
> Subject: Re: Offline mode
> To: Fabrice Desré >
> Cc: Houman Forood >,
>  >, Cindy H
> >
>
>
> Yes, if we run out of storage space, we would lose some data. But we are
> talking about air quality information, so I would expect that users
> won't be much interested in old data. Removing the oldest readings
> should allow us to make enough space to always have the data from the
> latest X days.
>
> On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 9:47 PM, Fabrice Desré  > wrote:
>
>     On 09/12/2016 03:18 AM, Fernando Jiménez Moreno wrote:
>
>
>         This way we could have more flexibility about where users can place
>         their sensor stations and the setup process in this case might be
>         simpler (just link the client to the sensor station and no typing of
>         long passwords on tiny keyboards).
>
>
>     If no phone comes close to the sensor and we run out of storage
>     space we would lose some data, right? So this solution relies on the
>     expectation that somehow the phone and sensor get in proximity often
>     enough? Honestly I don't know if that's a problem or not.
>     Intuitively that could be ok if the sensor density is high, so maybe
>     in a phase 2?
>
>     --
>     Fabrice Desré
>     Connected Devices
>     Mozilla Corporation
>
>
>
>


-- 
Fabrice Desré
Connected Devices
Mozilla Corporation

[Fabrice Desré]

- At home: your internet almost never goes down for more than a day.
Limited buffering needed, and you don't necessarily go straight from
device to a cloud platform. On the other hand, for sure you don't want
to lose data.
- Crowd sourced public data like sensorweb: you can be out of range from
the sensor for much longer (think vacation, etc.). So if you send
directly from sensor to cloud, which is the direction SensorWeb is
taking, you need to potentially buffer much more. Fernando's point that
we may not need to keep old data in this case is debatable, but this
indeed may be acceptable.

So these are different situations, which are unlikely to be addressed
with the same solution. That may be appealing but it's a bit naive to
believe that we can and even want to use the same platform design for
the public data space and for the home space. One size does not always
fit all and I'm worried that we would end up with a frankenstein
platform if we just go the "one size fits all" route.

[Houman Forood]

You realize SensorWeb is gonna be on home Wi-Fi 

Houman

_____________________________
From: Fabrice Desré <fab...@mozilla.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 08:59
Subject: Re: Offline mode
To: Fernando Jiménez Moreno <fmo...@mozilla.com>, Houman Forood <hfo...@mozilla.com>

Cc: Benjamin Francis <bfra...@mozilla.com>, Cindy H <chs...@mozilla.com>, David Bialer <dbi...@mozilla.com>, <mozilla-de...@lists.mozilla.org>

[Fabrice Desré]

On 09/13/2016 05:38 PM, Houman Forood wrote:
> You realize SensorWeb is gonna be on home Wi-Fi

This thread context is exploring an offline option with data offloading
through BLE to a smartphone.

[Houman Forood]

Corner case alert!

Houman