Turning off OSX and Windows B2G desktop builds

[Ryan VanderMeulen]

Most Gaia testing has been transitioned from the Linux64 B2G Desktop builds to Mulet. Given the intent to deprecate B2G Desktop builds and the fact that we're already running OSX and Windows Mulet builds in automation, I'd like to shut off OSX and Windows B2G Desktop builds now.

Bug 1191359 tracks this work and I will proceed unless I hear something to the contrary by the end of the week.

-Ryan

[Jonas Sicking]

I believe we are running some tests only on b2g-desktop still. There's
work to get all those tests running on Mulet. That work is getting
pretty close, but it's not done yet. Until we have coverage on Mulet I
don't think we can turn off any tests on B2G Desktop.

Should be very soon though!

/ Jonas

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[Ryan VanderMeulen]

We don't run any tests on OSX/Windows.

[J. Ryan Stinnett]

The Firefox OS Simulator add-on is still based on B2G desktop today.

In the past, we've released new add-ons by pulling XPIs from B2G
desktop build runs in automation (for all existing platforms).

There's been discussion about having the simulator use Mulet instead,
but so far no action has been taken. I think we should delay this
until we've moved the Simulator off B2G desktop, or else it could be
hard to get a working build in the future.

I'll work with Alex Poirot and others to see what the plans for this
would look like.

- Ryan

On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 11:54 AM, Ryan VanderMeulen

[Ryan VanderMeulen]

Yes, this should be considered a priority as Mulet is the supported option going forward. Note that most Gaia tests in production have already been ported over.

[Jonas Sicking]

What does it mean to have "Simulator use Mulet"? Why do we need
simulator if we have Mulet?

/ Jonas

[Alexandre poirot]

It shouldn't be an issue to base the simulator on top of b2g-desktop,

it is more a matter of finding time to actually do it.

And as we are already fighting against addon signing...

Otherwise, we we do need simulators. This is the runtime that we distribute via WebIDE.

That will still look like b2g desktop, even if based on mulet, as it would be surprising to spawn

another browser UI, from an existing one. I know this is also disturbing to have two quite different ways to run gaia.

But I don't know what else we should/could do.

Also note that jryans made a really impressive demo of b2g-desktop running within Firefox process, in the responsive mode.

We are far from being able to use this trick, but that would be the ideal way to run gaia from your Firefox.

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[Naoki Hirata]

I think the discussion is that :
Web IDE allows for downloading the simulator which is based on the b2g-desktop.  If we move to mulet, then the simulator will have to move to using mulet. 

[Tim Guan-tin Chien]

`make b2g` on Gaia still downloads a B2G Desktop build and attempts to
run Gij/Gip locally on Windows/Mac.

We'll need to make sure that continue to work even if we don't do that
on TreeHerder.

[Jonas Sicking]

I still don't quite understand why we need simulator? Why does the
user need to be able to do the development in their firefox browser
and have a separate window which displays the FirefoxOS rendering?

Having such a separate window was generally disliked by gaia
developers and a big reason that we created Mulet in the first place.

Why not simply ask developers to download Mulet?

Is the problem that that makes testing on multiple versions of
FirefoxOS too painful?

/ Jonas

On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 2:53 PM, Alexandre poirot <poiro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It shouldn't be an issue to base the simulator on top of b2g-desktop,
> it is more a matter of finding time to actually do it.
> And as we are already fighting against addon signing...
>
> Otherwise, we we do need simulators. This is the runtime that we distribute
> via WebIDE.
> That will still look like b2g desktop, even if based on mulet, as it would
> be surprising to spawn
> another browser UI, from an existing one. I know this is also disturbing to
> have two quite different ways to run gaia.
> But I don't know what else we should/could do.
> Also note that jryans made a really impressive demo of b2g-desktop running
> within Firefox process, in the responsive mode.
> We are far from being able to use this trick, but that would be the ideal
> way to run gaia from your Firefox.
>
> 2015-08-05 22:59 GMT+02:00 Jonas Sicking <jo...@sicking.cc>:
>>

[Alexandre poirot]

I see various reasons:
- the very first is WebIDE. Suggesting to download and use mulet directly means forgetting about WebIDE on desktop and only use it for devices.
- then every WebIDE niceties:
   * ease downloading/running various b2g version
   * it will be soon easier to run simulators against custom, locally built Gaia/gecko (currently preffed off)
   * app templates

Also mulet is weird. I expect Gaia contributors to be less surprised, but may be not broader audience. Mulet does look like a browser, but has various UI glitches (due to some specific graphic prefs). Opening a webpage in it comes with unexpected results.

But I'm not strong minded here, I'm as happy as you with having two environments. Again, we can base the simulator on mulet runtime/binary and at least end up with a single runtime.

[Fabrice Desré]

On 08/05/2015 11:30 PM, Tim Guan-tin Chien wrote:
> `make b2g` on Gaia still downloads a B2G Desktop build and attempts to
> run Gij/Gip locally on Windows/Mac.
>
> We'll need to make sure that continue to work even if we don't do that
> on TreeHerder.

Don't we risk to chase differences in test run behavior? People should
run tests locally with something as close to what we have in automation
as possible.

Fabrice
--
Fabrice Desré
b2g team
Mozilla Corporation

[Jonas Sicking]

On Thu, Aug 6, 2015 at 3:05 AM, Alexandre poirot <poiro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> - the very first is WebIDE. Suggesting to download and use mulet directly
> means forgetting about WebIDE on desktop and only use it for devices.

Doesn't Mulet have WebIDE built into it since it's using the same
frontend code as Firefox Desktop?

> Also mulet is weird. I expect Gaia contributors to be less surprised, but
> may be not broader audience. Mulet does look like a browser, but has various
> UI glitches (due to some specific graphic prefs). Opening a webpage in it
> comes with unexpected results.

Yeah, this is a problem. I assume this is fixable but requires more
people to work on Mulet.

But I don't know if it means that people prefer simulator. I don't
think we should assume that 3rd party developers are for some reason
different from our gaia developers.

Only thing I could think of is that 3rd party developers might care
more about testing in multiple versions of FirefoxOS. Though that's
something that Gaia developers might need to start doing soon too...

/ Jonas

[Bill Walker]

On Thu, Aug 6, 2015 at 9:54 AM, Jonas Sicking <jo...@sicking.cc> wrote:

But I don't know if it means that people prefer simulator. I don't
think we should assume that 3rd party developers are for some reason
different from our gaia developers.

Only thing I could think of is that 3rd party developers might care
more about testing in multiple versions of FirefoxOS. Though that's
something that Gaia developers might need to start doing soon too...

Please do assume that third party Firefox OS developers are quite different from Gaia developers.
* All 3rd party devs are actively targeting Firefox OS 1.3, as that is still the predominant version of the OS in the wild.
* All 3rd party devs are obliged to test against support multiple versions of Firefox OS at once.

* Most 3rd party devs don't know how to build Gaia/Gecko/Mulet, and don't want to learn

I'm pretty sure all of the above means WebIDE + multiple versions of Firefox OS simulator crucial to 3rd party devs.

--

-Bill

[Julien Wajsberg]

Le 06/08/2015 16:31, Fabrice Desré a écrit :
> On 08/05/2015 11:30 PM, Tim Guan-tin Chien wrote:
>> `make b2g` on Gaia still downloads a B2G Desktop build and attempts to
>> run Gij/Gip locally on Windows/Mac.
>>
>> We'll need to make sure that continue to work even if we don't do that
>> on TreeHerder.
> Don't we risk to chase differences in test run behavior? People should
> run tests locally with something as close to what we have in automation
> as possible.
>

Of course the plan is to move this to Mulet as well. This mostly works
already but we need to make sure the scripts get updated.

But Tim is right: we need this to work during the transition. Either
"make b2g" (or we can change the target name too) downloads Mulet, or we
can't disable B2G builds in tree herder.

--
Julien