Moolticute detects new credentials, but...

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William Wicker

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Jul 20, 2021, 11:27:00 AM7/20/21
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As I'm logging in to sites that my shiny Mooltipass BLE doesn't know about, Moolticute detects this. I see the Windows notification "Credentials Detected! Please approve their storage". But I have not been able to figure out how do this. The Mooltipass BLE screen remains blank. (After reading the manual, I expected it to display a prompt "Click to accept")

Am I missing something here? Maybe an option that needs to be turned on/off in Moolticute?

William.

Mathieu Stephan

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Jul 20, 2021, 3:39:22 PM7/20/21
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Hmmm that's very odd indeed. Does this happen with all websites or just some?

David Ehnebuske

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Jul 20, 2021, 10:43:45 PM7/20/21
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Hello William,

I've seen this irregularly when using an old Windows 7 box, but not on any up-to-date Windows 10 system. Any chance that's the trouble?

David

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William Wicker

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Jul 21, 2021, 3:37:18 AM7/21/21
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It's pretty much universal. Lots of moolticute Windows notifications, but no mooltipass activity. (Win10 Pro, if that matters)
I have a couple of credentials that I appear to have harvested early on, but nothing recent. Mooltipass BLE is connected to computer via USB cable.

William Wicker

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Jul 26, 2021, 12:41:14 PM7/26/21
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Possibly related: Now I wonder if I need to take steps to "pair" my Mooltipass BLE with moolticute running on my computer. I figured a USB connection and a PIN entry on the Mooltipass would be enough to get me hooked up. But now when I (e.g.) try to enter credential management mode in Moolticute, it spins off into "wait for device confirmation", while the BLE remains blank. Moolticute DOES detect that the Mooltipass BLE is locked/unlocked as I lock/unlock the device. But nothing else seems to work as I would expect it to. Is there some limitation to the number of computers a single device can be connected to? Or something I need to do to shake things loose so my computer and my Mooltipass BLE can talk to each other (via USB)?

Mathieu Stephan

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Jul 26, 2021, 12:42:59 PM7/26/21
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Hmm I'm wondering if something odd is happening USB-wise on  your computer...
Could you let me know your HW configuration?

William Wicker

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Jul 27, 2021, 2:50:25 PM7/27/21
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It's a homebrew PC with an ASRock Z590M-ITXax motherboard. Lots of USB3 ports.

Further testing suggests you may be right on the money. Moving to one of the front USB ports (instead of one of the rear-facing ports where I was connecting) gets me back to where I can enter/exit credential-management mode just fine. Everything else seems to work also.

Then when I plugged back into the original (rear) port, things kept on working (!!) I guess there was a weird partial-connection thing going on? 

Moral: Device not working? Is it plugged (all the way) in?

Mathieu Stephan

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Jul 27, 2021, 2:52:58 PM7/27/21
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That's.... perplexing....
Would you be able to try with a different OS on the same computer to check if it leads to the same results?

William Wicker

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Jul 30, 2021, 3:53:51 PM7/30/21
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I think I have a clue. It appears that the proper moolticute<->mooltipass behavior depends on the order in which things are done. I have not tested this exhaustively, but if I restart the computer, insert the smartcard into the mooltipass, then connect the USB cable, then unlock the mooltipass, things work as they should. If I get these steps out of order, success is less and less guaranteed. Note that the mooltipass HID behavior is correct regardless of order. It always "types" passwords exactly as it should. It's the moolticute link that's fragile.

William Wicker

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Jul 30, 2021, 3:54:00 PM7/30/21
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Unfortunately, no. It's my work computer. Re-OS-ing definitely frowned on. :)

I could do something like a boot-from-CD Linux, if there's a path towards enlightenment that leads that way.

On Tuesday, July 27, 2021 at 1:52:58 PM UTC-5 mathieu...@gmail.com wrote:

Mathieu Stephan

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Jul 30, 2021, 3:56:31 PM7/30/21
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I think it'd help trying indeed, just to triple check the device isn't at fault.

The internal logic doesn't really depend on connection order actually... but maybe we missed something :)

William Wicker

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Jul 31, 2021, 3:36:24 PM7/31/21
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Did some more testing on work computer. This is what I found: (NOTE: I am using the ability to enter credentials management mode as a quick test to stand in for checking that website logins work, etc.)

Case 1: 
  • Start with mooltipass connected, card inserted, unlocked.
  • Restart computer
  • Use mooltipass to type windows login password
  • Moolticute detects that mooltipass is connected and unlocked. BUT: Can't get into credentials management mode.
  • Remove card (leave USB connected.) Moolticute detects that card is removed
  • Insert card. Moolticute detects card insertion, prompts for unlock
  • Unlock mooltipass. Moolticute detects that mooltipass is ready. BUT: Can't get into credentials management mode.
  • Unplug USB. Moolticute detects device unplugged.
  • Reconnect USB. Moolticute detects device, prompts for unlock.
  • Unlock. HEY! Moolticute is able to enter credentials management mode
Case 2:
  • Start with USB disconnected, card inserted
  • Restart computer
  • Connect USB cable
  • Use mooltipass to type windows login password
  • Moolticute detects that mooltipass is connected and unlocked. BUT: Can't get into credentials management mode.
  • Unplug USB. Moolticute detects device unplugged.
  • Reconnect USB. Moolticute detects device, prompts for unlock.
  • Unlock. HEY! Moolticute is able to enter credentials management mode
Case 3:
  • Start with USB disconnected, card removed
  • Restart computer
  • Connect USB cable
  • Insert card
  • Unlock mooltipass
  • Use mooltipass to type windows login password
  • Moolticute detects mooltipass. BUT: Can't get into credentials management mode.
  • Unplug USB. Moolticute detects device unplugged.
  • Reconnect USB. Moolticute detects device, prompts for unlock.
  • Unlock. HEY! Moolticute is able to enter credentials management mode
Conclusion:
  • It appears that using my mooltipass as a HID to type the windows login password gets it into a state where I am unable to enter credentials management mode without disconnecting and reconnecting the USB cable. 
  • NOTE: Mooltcute still properly detects mooltipass presence, card inserted/removed, locked/unlocked. But when I try to enter credentials management mode, moolticute spins forever, and the mooltipass acts as though the request to enter credentials management mode never happened.
  • I am using the ability to enter credentials management mode as a quick-to-test standin for the ability to edit/save device settings, make use of the Chrome plugin, etc.
  • It might help to test on another computer and via BLE instead of USB. I'll do that soon.

Mathieu Stephan

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Jul 31, 2021, 3:38:57 PM7/31/21
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Thanks a lot for the debugging!
Could you enable moolticute debug logs and send us the logs when you can't enter management mode?
Stupid idea: did you try another usb cable?

William Wicker

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Aug 2, 2021, 1:21:45 PM8/2/21
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I did try another cable. (Our great minds are thinking alike here.) Not the problem.

For the debug log, you mean the "Enable full developer log (restart needed)" setting? Sure. Is that a Moolticute restart or a Windows restart that's required? And where will I find the log file when I'm done?

FWIW: I'm able to duplicate the problem without restarting Windows by:
  1. Quit Moolticute
  2. Disconnect and reconnect USB to mooltipass (just to make sure!)
  3. Unlock mooltipass with PIN. (In my previous use case, this is where I would send my Windows credendials via the HID interface. But it does not appear that any actuall HID transmissions are required.)
  4. Start moolticute. (It complains that the Daemon is not running, then the daemon starts up and moolticute is happy.)
  5. No Credentials Management for me!
On the other hand:
  1. Quit Moolticute
  2. Disconnect and reconnect USB to mooltipass
  3. Start moolticute, wait for daemon to be happy
  4. Unlock mooltipass
  5. Credentials management works fine!
Conclusion:
Either moolticute or the daemon doesn't quite know what to do when the mooltipass is already unlocked when it starts.

Mathieu Stephan

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Aug 2, 2021, 1:30:58 PM8/2/21
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Hello!

I indeed mean the full developer log :). Only a moolticute restart is needed.
You can check the daemon logs by clicking the "view" button in moolticute's settings tab.
Could you give me the logs for the two cases you mentioned? I'm fairly sure we should see interesting things :)

Mathieu
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