[OT] KiCAD vs. DesignSpark
applewiz2000
I'm doing a small exercise of designing a PCB to evaluate a few analog
switches. But want to use a different package from MultiSim/Ultiboard,
which not many people have, though I think it is very easy to use.
But which program to do the work in? The choice is between DesignSpark
(EasyPC) or KiCAD. KiCAD may have got better over the past 2 years,
but TBH that MoBo circuit diagram is a train wreck!
I used EasyPC ages ago and found it good for simple boards, but it is
Windows only. My Windows laptop has only a 13.7" screen. KiCad will
run on the 21.5" iMac here.
73s,
Rob.
Dave
I use KICAD for all my designs. If the circuits doesn't fit well on
a single 8.5 by 11 inch page, I break it into sub circuits, each with
it's own page and make the top page like a block diagram. I also use
the library editor and add 2 fields to each part. One for part # and one
for cost. Makes creating a BOM a push of a button.
I have created a schematic in Windows, then worked on it in Linux,
then looked at it in Apple OSX(I have a quad boot Dell D620 notebook-
XP, WIN7, Linux, OSX).
The learning curve is somewhat steep and I always have to create my
own parts, but it is not limited in size or # of layers and commercial
use is allowed.
Dave - WB6DHW
<http://wb6dhw.com>
John Williams
I was using gEDA on Linux but found it a bit cumbersome to get the
footprints correct. I am a newbie on layout software. The RD16HHF for
instance has a different pinout and I just could not get it right and I
tried for multiple days. I also could not get comfortable with the PDB
layout program. Probably too feature rich for my simple mind.
I finally moved to FreePCB on windows and found it much easier to use
and modify. I sent the board gerbers to hobbypcb and he said they looked
fine. My goal was professional looking results with zero investment in
software. I am happy. I used TinyCAD for the schematic layout with
FreePCB. There was no compatibility in formats between GSchem (gEDA
schematic editor) so I had to re-enter the schematic.
If you have professional EDA expertise then gEDA may work fine for you.
George Boudreau uses it. Jim Veatch suggested and uses FreePCB. He is
the designer of the ARLHBC 50W amp.
FWIW, YMMV, etc
John - ke5ssh
--
John Williams
KE5SSH - ham since 2007
WQKA523 - GMRS for family use on the farm
Edouard Griffiths
for a simple adapter card project but with a lot of small tracks I have
been using gEDA instead of Kicad because unless it was modified recently
Kicad does micro steps on the tracks and in some cases it can cause
micro opens or shorts with adjacent tracks to appear on the final PCB. I
have found gEDA outputs of a much more professional grade. Indeed Kicad
is easier to grab. gEDA is an assembly of different tools that need to
be made talking to each other but provided you spend the time necessary
to learn I think it is more reliable. Also files are in human readable
form and that can help sometimes.
One thing you need to know though is that gEDA (PCB) uses polygons for
the ground plane surfaces (or any surface that is not a track) and the
older photo-plotters do not accept the Gerber files made from it. You
have to ask your favourite PCB shop before investing into a lot of hours
designing your circuit.
Best regards,
Edouard, F4EXB.
applewiz2000
Well I should have know there would be 3 different answers! I have
professional experience of doing >2000 pin layouts using MultiSim/
Ultiboard, which is a nice package. Unfortunately it costs USD $2000
and the version I have was "acquired" not bought. Also the program has
languished since it has come under National Instruments.
I will have a look at gEDA, but very probably will sway towards
DesignSpark, which has the polish of a commercial and mature package.
The registration with RS Components will sicken some, as will the part
numbers linked to them. It claims to import Eagle library components,
which is a star feature. The number-one systems version sells for UK
£550.
Edouard, perhaps you are referring to the gEDA only exporting the
Gerber-X format and not Gerber-D? Every PCB house I have used accepts
gerber-X these days, and also merged polygons seems to be no problem
either.
~Rob
George Boudreau
I may as well add my $0.02 to the pot. As noted earlier I live and breathe gEDA/pcb for all my boards. A thousand years ago I had Orcad for DOS and then I decided to write my own pcb package in Forth (yes.. I am that old) I gave up pcb for a while and finally landed on gEDA for the home jobs.
I have had no problems with board fabrication with the 3 companies I have used in the past. It may not have the slick presentation of some packages but I am interested in the destination and not the journey. Of course I still use the command line when I use Linux so that dates me :)
The only down side is the lack of import/export to commercial packages which can be a deal breaker if you are doing commercial work. I have 4 commercial design jobs that I will do using gEDA/pcb but the customer only wants the final gerbers so I am lucky :)
If push comes to shove and the pockets are deep enough I would give Altium a try. Any job that forces that on me have better pay beaucoup bucks.
George.
applewiz2000
"Beaucoup bucks" sounds a classic Canadian phrase! Where I work now
uses OrCAD/Cadence, which has a hell of a learning curve. They
basically kept all the legacy user interface stuff in that one.
Altium is also regarded as the best by the PCB guys where I work, but
due to the price is best left to designers at Gigabyte or Apple.
Given the general opinions on various blogs, I'll give KiCad a try
instead of gEDA. Perhaps the original MoBo diagram can be salvaged?
~Rob
Graeme ZL2APV
I was a user of expressPCB which was probably one of the most intuitive pieces of software of any kind I have ever used but of course it is somewhat limited but perfect for hobby boards. I switched to KiCad a year ago and found it worked well and was not too difficult to get my head around. The biggest mindset change was understanding that a component footprint and 3d view needed to be assigned to the schematic component instead of the schematic component having a physical component associated as of its inception.
The schematic layout software is pretty good and good BOM's, pricing and part numbers are easy so you can get good ordering data. Adding your schematic to the PCB as a ratsnest goes well. The tracks, pad sizes, fill etc. is all quite good.
The schematic printouts are terrible on my little Brother HL-2040 with 0's and O's being indistinguishable and some alpha/numeric characters quite hard to read. Maybe they come out OK on a post script printer but I don't have access to one.
I looked at whether I should change and part of the criteria was it needed to be at hobbyist prices (I don't mind paying reasonable costs for good software) and had to be cross platform or run in parallels, wine etc. Of the several I looked at I still came back to KiCad and decided to put up with the inferior schematic printouts as the rest was quite good.
73 Graeme
VK5ZAG
As a hobbyist though once a professional in a previous life 80/90s.
I have used mostly Eagle recently. I have a mind to design some
new interface boards. What would be the best for me single side
or double side when necessary. No plate though vias. Kitchen table
chemistry stuff.
Regards 73s Eric VK5ZAG