MOSS as an Maldivian NGO

[rhipha]

To Formulate MOSS initiative as a NGO there are several things we need
to accomplish. first we need a rules of regulation for the
organization, with finalized Logo(i think we can finalize the logo in
the first NGO general assembly have to check), we need to create and
decide on posts of the NGO, we also need an NGO headquarters

- Any lawyers here / anyone with good contact with a lawyer who can
draft a rules and regulations for the MOSS
- can anyone suggest a vacant location as the secretariat of the NGO.
- some posts i suggest for the NGO are.
- Chairman
- Vice-Chairman
- Secretary general
- Registrar
- Event Coordinator
- Financier
- Media and communications officer.

[Yasiph]

I know a lawyer who helped us in preparing our 'hingaa gavaaidhu' for
ADD(Association for disAbilities and Development) named Ahmed Murad from
Mazlan & Murad Law Associates. And i've attached a general 'hingaa
gavaaidhu' for associations which you'll find in the docs section.

we can meet-up, and can include it in the agenda. Discuss and
collaborate using googledoc.

[rhipha]

i think yasiph is a good candidate to work on formalizing the whole
NGO thing as he has previously worked on NGO movements. can you work
things out. what i think is the hingaa gavaaidhu should be very
generalistic so that we dont have much constrains.

[V Shah]

Mailing from mobile here. Right now im in fuvahmulah. Good to see the
mailing list alive. Ill be active after 25th. Have fun hacking.

--
Sent from Gmail for mobile | mobile.google.com

[V Shah]

Does being an NGO necessitate all these job titles?. I think
introducing all these jobs takes away the community aspect.

On 1/22/09, rhipha <rhi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>

[rhipha]

yeah being an NGO really means we need to be organized and should have
a "Hingaa Comity" with the posts specified in the hingaa gavaidhu and
the hingaa comity must be annually / biannually changed in a
democratic manner which should also be stated in the hingaa gavaidhu.
and have to atleast have one general assembly annually and submit
minutes of general assembly and annual report ever year end to the
ministry of home affairs. an NGO basically runs as a Political party
matter of fact initially political parties was formed under the club
jamiyaa jamaaiathaai behey gaanoon. only thing is we dont get annual
income based on the number of members like political parties does. but
as MOSS is yet going to be the only oss movement any funding or
assistance from 3rd party (like UN / CW or other leading organization)
for surveys or related projects could easily be directed towards us.

but to advocate against oss related mandates set by government /
corporates we need to be an official body which will also easily help
in getting funding and other related assistance for events and a lot
more to come. and media also have a tendency to reject statements made
by a group of people but a recognized NGO could make a huge impact.
even with all the magaamu and formal proceedings i think we can run in
a more community and more lenient mood.

[Inash Zubair]

Vishah: it's not our concern of management or the hingaa committee. We should concerned with the technical aspect of how we reach our expected audience, events and what we can demonstrate in educating the community as a whole. A steering committee should be in place and what rhipha suggested is very correct and I support it. By the way, congratulations on your marriage :o.

[aHa]

Team,

I'll call Ali Hashim tomorrow and see if he can make anytime and let
you all know. Before that, I think we ought to finalize a time for
next meeting, so i can ask Ali if he'd be in town.

Salaams,
aHa

[Neo Reeves]

Hello guys,

Just got back from an island. Love to see everyone getting organized. I think running it as an NGO is the best way to reach out to the people. Cause from where I can see a lot of NGO based communities had achieved good accomplishments and people do look up for such NGOs.

- Neo

--
---
Neo

[V Shah]

I support the NGO direction. But let us make a set of guidelines or a
philosophy so that we dont end up stalemated as an organisation due to
conflicting interests or ego clashes between people in these positions
like some other NGOs.

[rhipha]

V Shah general membership can always take a no confidence vote against
the members of the hingaa comitty. by the way care society is an NGO
and governmnet announced last night that they are giving an office
building to care society which will also mean free electricity and
water wow that a cost cutter ;) ekekke... . one way to eliminate the
concerns of Vshah is to have shorter duration for the steering commity
however that will result in disorientation. we can discuss all this on
the 2nd meetup so comment on venue and date time.

On Jan 24, 6:35 pm, V Shah <mvis...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I support the NGO direction. But let us make a set of guidelines or a
> philosophy so that we dont end up stalemated as an organisation due to
> conflicting interests or ego clashes between people in these positions
> like some other NGOs.
>

> On 1/24/09, Neo Reeves <neo.ree...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Hello guys,
>
> > Just got back from an island. Love to see everyone getting organized. I
> > think running it as an NGO is the best way to reach out to the people. Cause
> > from where I can see a lot of NGO based communities had achieved good
> > accomplishments and people do look up for such NGOs.
>
> > - Neo
>

[Vishah]

Ripa.Yes we can discuss about what MOSS should stand for . "Free/Open
Source Software" to what strictness?. Even if it encompasses all FOSS
software, the target being to propagate "linux".

take for example the GNU philosophy .
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html


What I was trying to say is we should agree on what MOSS stands for
before a "hingaa comitty" is even elected.

All Kisses and love..
Vishah.

[Neo Reeves]

Maldivian Open Source Software ???

--
---
Neo

[Vishah]

btw I'm back in male'. great week. updating KDE4 svn. and hopeful to
attend the next meet up.

On Jan 25, 7:46 pm, Vishah <mvis...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Ripa.Yes we can discuss about what MOSS should stand for . "Free/Open
> Source Software" to what strictness?. Even if it encompasses all FOSS
> software, the target being to propagate "linux".
>

> take for example the GNU philosophy .http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html

[Vishah]

Maldives Open Source Society I think. sorry i'm not a native english
speaker. hehe. but I think you can get my message.

[Vishah]

Hopefully a draft of a set of guidelines can be discussed on the
technical side before the next meet up. Then we can discuss, change
and add points there, to make a "Maldives Open Source Society
Philosophy". There are differences in the approach towards FLOSS
software between the Open Source people and Free Software people.
More complications would arise when we open up membership to the
general public. I see Open Source more than as an approach of
developing Software. I believe the ideals of software freedom and
community. Would be great if MOSS includes these ideals in the
guidelines. Anyway it's up to the members to decide. I might be
reading too much Richard Stallman ..maibee.. :)

[chopey]

Vishah, I fully agree wit u on this.

[Inash]

Hello all. The list have been quite idle the past couple weeks. I
believe mostly since we're on the registration process and everyone is
expecting to hear on the progress.

The first phase is complete, meeting with the necessary requirements
for the founding members. The regulation and the manifesto needs to be
composed before finally submitting everything for registration. I
request from the community to respond to this inquiry for those of you
who would like to work closely in achieving these goals.

A meet up can be arranged to close on these issues and a steering
committee needs to be in place. I request from Ripha to organize one
as before. Probably for this Saturday or during the following week.
Cheers.

[chopey]

just got a comment from a friend that the group is closed... might be
a good idea to open for all, instead of registered members?

[Inash Zubair]

Hello all.

I'm following up on the registration of moss. Today we had a small unofficial meeting with some key members in closing the issue of registering moss. We have been able to incorporate almost all the clauses for the operational resolution (hingaa gawaidhu) with a few exceptions that we required to discuss with the community.

The exception is on the clauses for membership and the annual fee. We decided to have 3 types of membership, 2 of which are subtypes.

1. Normal membership for Individuals (100.00).
2. Normal membership for Businesses (1500.00).
3. Privileged membership (sharafveri) (generous donators, sponsors).
4. Student membership (free).

Amounts are in MRF and are entry level for each type. However, anyone could provide any amount no less than that specified minimum. The membership fees are important for the constant administration of the organization as well as for forecasting expenses and overheads on annual terms for planning events, projects and other activities.

We haven't decided on all of the benefits the members will receive yet, however there will be quite attractive incentives. For business members, they will be entitled for certification from the moss organization and community as open source service providers and other corporate and business community benefits.

Student membership will be entitled to anyone who is on academia for a period and should provide a proof of such a term. Individual members can switch to and from student membership when they are on and off from academia, scholarships and courses.

We would like you all to cast your votes for the above selection of membership types and fees before Sunday. We will conclude with the most voted/changed/confirmed types and fees.

By then we will apply for registration and once it gets through will host a general assembly to discuss on a wider mandate and to elect members for the steering commity. As the registration has been mandatory for certain tasks at hand and to go officially in certain endeavors with the government and larger business bodies.

Alot has happened during the past few months and progress has been radical. We're very optimistic about the future and the role of free and open source software in the country and what moss can be as it's main advocate. Your support is much appreciated.

Cheers.

---
Inash Zubair

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Hi

I fully support the fees and division. Accept this as my vote.

However one suggestion, I would like to see the possibility of
financial statements and activities online. A monthly or at least
quarterly financial report should be made available online, as I would
like to know where the my membership fee goes.

Thatz my 2.04 cents!

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[Yasiph]

Hi all,

Here's the 'hingaa gavaaidhu' soft copy. I haven't done the edits that
we discussed in the meetup yesterday. Kept it for Inn as he got the
'unofficial' minutes.

regards
Yasiph

[Ahmed Sujau]

i would like to pay right now for the membership :D, and the registration should be done and we have seen a fast improvement in this group love this.

[Inaz]

Inn..
its a good start. I vote FOR.

I also support the idea of Quarterly Financial Reports (QFRs) and additionally Quarterly Activity Reports (QARs)
This would not be duplication of any work but instead would provide as monitoring of on going works as well as inspiration for future work (like "guys we need to do something about that thing... " kinda approach, considering we are a positive bunch)

erm, yasiph... the hingaa qawaid and unofficial minutes inee konthaakutha?

cheers

Inaz

[Yasiph]

Sorry... didn't attach before! but here it is.

regards
yasiph

[Inaz]

there isn't a point on the quorum of the General Meeting and of the Executive Committee meetings.
Some do it this way:
quorum of a General Meeting is 1/3 of membership. and if its not there after half an hour of scheduled meeting time, the quorum is the presence of atleast 2/3 Executive Committee members and N number of ordinary members.

Inaz

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Are you thinking people will not turn up? :) I too think this is a
valid point!!!!

[Jaau]

Gud to see that things are going on

On Jun 10, 2009, at 9:55 AM, Yusuf Abdulla Shunan <shu...@gmail.com>
wrote:

[Inash Zubair]

Nice. We'll add that to the resolution as well.

--
Inash Zubair

[Inaz]

ehe i am not thinking.. i know :) famous NGOs have had 8 .. 9 members turn up!!! even after radio ads.
a precautionary statement is a good thing to have, as I have learnt

[Ahmed Sujau]

send me a reminder of the meeting, and i would be the first person there :D

[Yusuf]

I don't know about others, but I am willing to miss my funeral to
attend any MOSS meeting! :)

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[Abdul Hameed]

Nice to see things are kicking in.

Inn, if you have submitted the documents to the registration department, how long did they say it'll take? If we can forecast aperiod of time, may be we can tell the guys that we 'll hef the general meeting during that period of time. that way the turn up could be well above our expectations.

salaams,
Hamitte

[Inash Zubair]

Hello Hamitte.

I'm not sure about the duration of the registration period. But what you're proposing is a good idea. I can get back with the estimated registration period tomorrow and let you know on that.

As for the general meeting, there should be an organizing team, perhaps from the operations side. That would fasten the process of organizing the meeting and keep it simple. We would need initial volunteers for that. Cheers.

--
Inash Zubair

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Getting people to gather in one place might be a difficult, give the
face that we all have other commitments. So I would propose that most
of the meetings, unless it is necessary, to be online via IRC.

I think in this age of technology this is the most viable option...
Suggestions welcome...

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

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[Yasiph]

Not all ppl are familiar with irc, specially the new, energetic
youngsters around. Having irc is allright. But it's much better to use
an online conference system for those who cant, to participate. There
would be lots of free services ennu? or am i wrong?

yasiph

[chopey]

Online services are cool, as long as we have a good verification/
authentication system . Example most IRC servers like freenode does
provide these features, so if we are to utilize such services that
mean all members should sign-up for such services and also inform MOSS
respectively.

I am ok with having online meetings, but general assemblies and
important meetings are always best not to.

On Jun 15, 9:12 pm, Yasiph <yas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not all ppl are familiar with irc, specially the new, energetic
> youngsters around.  Having irc is allright. But it's much better to use
> an online conference system for those who cant, to participate. There
> would be lots of free services ennu? or am i wrong?
>
> yasiph
>
> Yusuf Abdulla Shunan wrote:
> > Getting people to gather in one place might be a difficult, give the
> > face that we all have other commitments. So I would propose that most
> > of the meetings, unless it is necessary, to be online via IRC.
>
> > I think in this age of technology this is the most viable option...
> > Suggestions welcome...
>
> > Salam
> > Yusuf Abdulla Shunan
>

> > On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Inash Zubair<inash.zub...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> Hello Hamitte.
>
> >> I'm not sure about the duration of the registration period. But what you're
> >> proposing is a good idea. I can get back with the estimated registration
> >> period tomorrow and let you know on that.
>
> >> As for the general meeting, there should be an organizing team, perhaps from
> >> the operations side. That would fasten the process of organizing the meeting
> >> and keep it simple. We would need initial volunteers for that. Cheers.
>

[V Shah]

Sysadmins at resorts, members different parts of Maldives, Student members overseas etc. The most viable solution to gather all these members is to go for an online service..
Now the question is which service to use?.. irc (text), VoIP, msn(bleh)??.

[Hussain Nashid]

something like dimdim (www.dimdim.com) will be nice. But the free version of dimdim only supports 20 users.

[Inaz]

while the Online option is a definite yes yes (and oftentimes more expressive).. i think the face-to-face meetings are as important. as such, i suggest the first meeting be face to face.. maybe webcasted :o [3G technology?]

registration takes quite sometime.. but at times it takes 2 weeks max..

inaz

[Inaz]

Guys I just met the head of NCIT...

He confirmed that there was a presentation on Open Source that will be held on thursday at 2pm.. i told him that it would be good to get the hard-core poeple of the government in there.. including ppl who like to cling on to what they have.. I suggested a few names i knew from the government who would be important at the meeting. I also suggested that policy level ppl be there! cos they determine where the money goes, and thats where systems are decided.. money decides :D .. [in case of open sourse free software no-money decides :D]
cheers

Inaz

[Haris]

Yasiph: I agree with you, Everyone is not familiar with IRC.

Maybe we can have a Online Conference thing or we can use a Java IRC
Applet on a Website, Maybe something like this: http://mlug.mv/irc/ or
we can just upload applet files to somewhere.

On Jun 16, 11:11 am, Inaz <mohamed.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Guys I just met the head of NCIT...
>
> He confirmed that there was a presentation on Open Source that will be held
> on thursday at 2pm.. i told him that it would be good to get the hard-core
> poeple of the government in there.. including ppl who like to cling on to
> what they have.. I suggested a few names i knew from the government who
> would be important at the meeting. I also suggested that policy level ppl be
> there! cos they determine where the money goes, and thats where systems are
> decided.. money decides :D .. [in case of open sourse free software no-money
> decides :D]
> cheers
>
> Inaz
>

> On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Inaz <mohamed.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > while the Online option is a definite yes yes (and oftentimes more
> > expressive).. i think the face-to-face meetings are as important. as such, i
> > suggest the first meeting be face to face.. maybe webcasted :o [3G
> > technology?]
>
> > registration takes quite sometime.. but at times it takes 2 weeks max..
>
> > inaz
>
> > On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 8:56 AM, Hussain Nashid <nat...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> something like dimdim (www.dimdim.com) will be nice. But the free version
> >> of dimdim only supports 20 users.
>

> >> On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:41 PM, V Shah <mvis...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> Sysadmins at resorts, members different parts of Maldives, Student
> >>> members overseas etc. The most viable solution to gather all these members
> >>> is to go for an online service..
> >>> Now the question is which service to use?.. irc (text), VoIP,
> >>> msn(bleh)??.
>

[chopey]

Cool. I think Shunan is suppose to do this presentation along with
other members of MOSS (we need two more). The day is Monday I
suppose.

We need to have a meeting ASAP on this and pic on the areas that we
need to do the presentation. It should be maybe 30 mins, and another
30 mins for Q&A.

If this is the same presentation which we are talking about. I know
from Shunan that initial proposed day was Thursday.

We need all the ideas and support we can. We really do.....

On Jun 16, 11:11 am, Inaz <mohamed.i...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Guys I just met the head of NCIT...
>
> He confirmed that there was a presentation on Open Source that will be held
> on thursday at 2pm.. i told him that it would be good to get the hard-core
> poeple of the government in there.. including ppl who like to cling on to
> what they have.. I suggested a few names i knew from the government who
> would be important at the meeting. I also suggested that policy level ppl be
> there! cos they determine where the money goes, and thats where systems are
> decided.. money decides :D .. [in case of open sourse free software no-money
> decides :D]
> cheers
>
> Inaz
>

> On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 9:48 AM, Inaz <mohamed.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > while the Online option is a definite yes yes (and oftentimes more
> > expressive).. i think the face-to-face meetings are as important. as such, i
> > suggest the first meeting be face to face.. maybe webcasted :o [3G
> > technology?]
>
> > registration takes quite sometime.. but at times it takes 2 weeks max..
>
> > inaz
>
> > On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 8:56 AM, Hussain Nashid <nat...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> something like dimdim (www.dimdim.com) will be nice. But the free version
> >> of dimdim only supports 20 users.
>

> >> On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:41 PM, V Shah <mvis...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> Sysadmins at resorts, members different parts of Maldives, Student
> >>> members overseas etc. The most viable solution to gather all these members
> >>> is to go for an online service..
> >>> Now the question is which service to use?.. irc (text), VoIP,
> >>> msn(bleh)??.
>

[Yasiph]

I propose another casual meetup to discuss on getting the presentation
organized. Let's meet again and update this thread on things we decide.
We can have ideas from those who cannot attend until then. assigning
roles is also essential. What do you guys say?

yasiph

[Inaz]

we sit, sip coffee and cook ideas?

time?

[Jaau]

I would like to be in this meetup

Sent from my iPhone

[Jaau]

Coffee can help cook ideas how bout some time after the normal office hours?? 

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Hi!

As for the meetings, I guess once or twice a year the general
assembly, for which we will have to invite all our sponsors and
supporters (including companies), as stated by Chopey, need to be
physical. :)

Rest of the general meetings can be done on and off line, and I
believe most of us are disciplined enough and knowledgeable to cope
with IRC (come on!). For all technical meetings we can be online. For
all non-technical meetings with our sponsors and supports we can meet
offline.

I guess like everything else in FLOSS, we can keep this flexible and
decide as when needed!!!! What you say?

As for the meeting with the GOM, Faig did called me today requesting a
good time for a meeting, and tentatively we have a meeting on next
Monday at 2 mf. We will need to come up with a presentation. So as
suggested by Inn let us meet up this afternoon to discuss. I am ok as
long as I get a hour heads-up!

Also find attached the presentation layout that I am proposing. Note
this is a draft and you are free and encouraged to comment, give
suggestions and ideas. As the audience is policy makers, I think we
will have to keep things to a policy level with as little techno stuff
as possible.
--
Salam,
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[chopey]

I think we need to focus more on the advantages of e-governance via
the use of OSS. General OSS advantages is mostly understood, those can
be covered in one slide and most will just agree that cost factor is
the biggest advantage. We really need to focus on that, like we need
to show NUMBERS. Example, estimate the cost of setting up a desktop
(with Windows, Office and Anti-virus) multiply that by an estimated
number of computers owned by the gov. Show that FIGURE! We than move
on to advantages of moving to OSS and that prove it can be done over
night! (why can't it?). We/they installed Vista just over night from
XP. We moved from DOS to Windows 95/98, then to Windows XP. Now we are
talking of moving to Windows 7. The migration need not take 5 years.
It's a call to be made by the policy makers and an organized team of
IT professionals.

We also need to remember we are not only talking of "Linux" here. We
are talking of FOSS in general. How FLOSS can benefit the government.
We also very much need to focus on implementing open standards
government wide in IT. The advantages and why it should be done, etc.
We really need to push and sell the idea that citizen access to public
data in standards-based and interoperable ways is essential at all
levels of government.

We also need to be very clear on what "free" really mean..

I also feel we need to discuss if we want to propose other stuff like
open cloud models for government?. Other topics like to we talk about
government thinking of offering free, transparent governmental
information ?

I feel if we are to sell the idea of OSS, we need to address practical
things and benefits which will politically and financially attract the
decision makers. We need not be too technical or talk about the
advantages of open nature and architectures, etc?

We really need to know who and who are attending too. This is
critical.

HELP? Comments.. ?

We also need to pick on who will join in this presentation. I really
hope someone from the civil service will join , since they know best
how the governments think/work.

>  Hingaagavaaidhu for Associations.odt
> 45KViewDownload

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Hi!

On Wed, Jun 17, 2009 at 10:41 AM, chopey<sof...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I think we need to focus more on the advantages of e-governance via
> the use of OSS. General OSS advantages is mostly understood, those can
> be covered in one slide and most will just agree that cost factor is
> the biggest advantage. We really need to focus on that, like we need
> to show NUMBERS. Example, estimate the cost of setting up a desktop
> (with Windows, Office and Anti-virus) multiply that by an estimated
> number of computers owned by the gov. Show that FIGURE! We than move
> on to advantages of moving to OSS and that prove it can be done over
> night! (why can't it?). We/they installed Vista just over night from
> XP. We moved from DOS to Windows 95/98, then to Windows XP. Now we are
> talking of moving to Windows 7. The migration need not take 5 years.
> It's a call to be made by the policy makers and an organized team of
> IT professionals.

First I think it is wrong to assume that people know about the benefit of FLOSS, especially the social benefits! Actually people are not aware, we have to blame us on that. The economic benefit is some what understood to some extend with the use of the word free, but the FUD factor has created lot of resistance. As for e-governance via FLOSS the GOM really need to be convinced that the country has the capacity to implement and maintain such a system. I know and believe there are lot of individuals who prefer FLOSS over closed systems, but are they willing and capable to carry out this task? We need to be sure on that, GOM need to be sure on that!

I agree on the numbers part, we can easily come up with 50, 100 and 200 computer business models. Which we have already done on the FOSS as an alternative document. If we can get the real figures it would be nice, but if we cannot, I think hypothetical scenarios would also create the desired impact.

I can understand your enthusiasm, but I think pushing for over-night implementation of FLOSS would not work. Mainly due to incompatibilities of closed standards will definitely limit this, it was purposely designed like that. In addition such a migration will incur a lot of hidden costs, both in the implementation and training. Like many offices have small - mid applications running on Windows only environment. These either need to be ported or find a solution. As you said we need to be pragmatic with a prudent transition strategy.

>
> We also need to remember we are not only talking of "Linux" here. We
> are talking of FOSS in general. How FLOSS can benefit the government.
> We also very much need to focus on implementing open standards
> government wide in IT. The advantages and why it should be done, etc.
> We really need to push and sell the idea that citizen access to public
> data in standards-based and interoperable ways is essential at all
> levels of government.

In short I think the GOM have to push this, we can only facilitate and help. NCIT or a separate groups setup exclusively for FLOSS must push this. Including standards. This was planned to be covered in the slide under FLOSS Talent Centers/Activities.

>
> We also need to be very clear on what "free" really mean..
>
> I also feel we need to discuss if we want to propose other stuff like
> open cloud models for government?. Other topics like to we talk about
> government thinking of offering free, transparent governmental
> information ?

I think Open Cloud is the right model to go, but I strongly feel that this will need to be accepted by the GOM, in fact it has to be the GOM who come up with this idea. How? With our help.

In short GOM need to understand and accept the benefits of FLOSS, once they do, they have to come up with a FLOSS Policy. Why? Because if someone did not push this, the implementation would be at snail speed. First, these are mainly due to the limited marketing of FLOSS, who actively market an idea and products which have no financial return? Second, no-body with a sense of profit, the sain man, are and is willing to give attaintion to the non-commercial benefits of FLOSS. I mean we have met with many, no business man will drive this, a free product! Third, there might be legal or internal trade issues, that we might not be aware of. With my limited knowledge on this field, I can't come up with an example even, but what if? These are coverted in the slide under Why we need FOSS Policy? and Why does the Government need to push it?

So in the light of these factors, what I would like to propose is.

1. GOM to create a FLOSS Policy
2. This would include FLOSS targets and goals
3. These can be achived using our help along with Policy makers, FLOSS based businessess and IT staff of GOM
4. In the policy GOM can adher to a FLOSS strategy, either make it mandatory, preferring, mandate open standards or go for individual cases with the best value. Of course FLOSS cannot be beaten when it comes to price.
5. Last, carry out some Pilot programs and with the experience gained go for the transition.

Plus GOM need to concentrate on FLOSS capacity building, training centers and curriculum should include FLOSS if it is to benefit both in the short and long run. They also need to train the GOM IT staff, certificate them. If the GOM can understand and accept the benefits of FLOSS, I believe they are wise enough to undertake and address these issues.

In short, FLOSS is not an over-night solution for all the IT problems, I do belive it has lots of benefits, but in reality the implementation would require some doing. So if we can get the Senior Management and Policy Makers convince about the benefits of FLOSS, I think that is the only way FLOSS can be pushed into this country as fast as we want to make gain its mysterious benefits.

Last the private business should also start giving support and build their business around FLOSS, unless this happens, people will always be scaptic about FLOSS.

>
> I feel if we are to sell the idea of OSS, we need to address practical
> things and benefits which will politically and financially attract the
> decision makers. We need not be too technical or talk about the
> advantages of open nature and architectures, etc?

The benefits of FLOSS cannot be proven until it is seen, of course financial benefits is easy to calculate. What I think we need to show case studies, how things have changed in a certain country by the move of FLOSS. As far as FLOSS is concerned it would be hard to make any promises.

Let us gather and discuss these issues and how to tackle them.

>
> We really need to know who and who are attending too. This is
> critical.

Yes, this is cruicial, I will give a call to Faig on Thursday, and see what I can get any info on that. I think Inn also could do something along that line.

>
> HELP? Comments.. ?
>
> We also need to pick on who will join in this presentation. I really
> hope someone from the civil service will join , since they know best
> how the governments think/work.
>

Spread the word, this is our chance to let the GOM know about FLOSS just the way we want. So if we fail to make the best use of this chance, we will have only us to blame.

I am always ready, for what ever it takes ;)

Just my 2.10 cents...

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[rhipha]

when i am aware of the schedule for the presentation im willing to
participate if i can. and whats the status of the preparation meetup.
lets meet this evening or Friday evening. a preparation meetup is
essential for the success of the whole presentation.

On Jun 17, 12:39 pm, Yusuf Abdulla Shunan <shu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi!
>

[rhipha]

i also believe we need to review some existing ICT policies in the
government and offer some alternative or enhancements for these
policies and make references on existing policies which are hurting
the growth of ICT in maldives. i say this because yesterday afternoon
Minister of civil aviation and communication held a news briefing in
fansavees malam and faig mentioned gov will be transforming to legit
software copies in 3 years period. this is a bold statement he made
infront of the media and with the existing economic hurdles i believe
its gonna a burden for the gov to follow on on this, however we can
state that the wide implementation of floss in the government could
achieve these goals and assist in releasing tension on the budget.

also we would need to introduces some oss businesses and solutions
with estimates of existing support capacity for oss. cause some gov
top officials currently have the implication that the Floss while its
free is not implemented in the gov because of the lack of support so
we need to state otherwise.

[Yusuf]

Hi,

Yes, we definitely need to meet up, but since the time is short we are
in a rush!

Actually the bold statement by Faaig is a good one, somehow if we can
penetrate into the Government with the idea of FLOSS they will have a
reason to move, cost reduction. However, if the Government thinks they
have that much money waste, we have no option but to go for a strike
and voice our opinion... What you say? :)

As for businesses nobody realizes that they can use FLOSS as a
business, mostly for support. Someone need to show them. Mostly
because it is a free product. We will have to make a cultural change,
as when it comes to sharing we have got lot of ideas that we have to
unlearn.

I guess even now the IT staff of the Government can start changing,
they can start with their own desktops and the servers. Than slowly
move on to the clients, as I heard Ministry of Health is doing it. No
law or regulation so far in the Maldives dictates that we have to use
Windows or any other software in the Government. First the IT staff
have to use it and get used to it. So spread the word...

Need help? Ask!

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[Dosbe]

It seems to me that some initiatives considered here are a little too
premature. Others contradict your own goals for MOSS.

Why are you involving the government in any measure of MOSS
activities? You do not need any help nor permission from the
government to undertake free/open-source software initiatives. All the
literature will indicate that these initiatives are based on social
contracts (mostly made in good will). Hence, involving a government
which is heavily entrenched in licensed software (and, in the case of
Maldives, piracy) will hinder your goals.

'Then how can we help the government change its wicked ways?' you ask?
By creating awareness and by applying pressure. Not by allowing the
government to become a stake holder (in any capacity or form) in MOSS.
If you let them have any vested interests in MOSS then they may end up
manipulating your good intentions towards meeting their own ends.

'We are not fools to let that happen!' you say? You are establishing
your organization as the pantheon (ahem) of free/open-source
philosophies. As such your principles will hinge on philanthropic
selflessness in seeding your organization's agenda. The government
will exploit this philanthropy to attain cheap solutions to their
problems (NCIT's unfinished information systems for instance) from
within MOSS. Instead of letting this happen you should look at
building a solid NGO which promotes and advocates the rights of free/
open-source businesses.

Which brings me to your objective of establishing MOSS as an NGO. As
an NGO, undertaking commercial activities will be hypocritical
(because the implicit non-profit nature of such organizations). As an
NGO, MOSS should be helping the growth of businesses which subscribe
to its philosophies, not competing with them. Hence, the talk of
brokering business deals via this newly established organization is a
little unethical.

I suggest that you build MOSS into an authority above the government
of Maldives with regards to free/open-source philosophies. MOSS should
be able to deal directly with local and international bodies to
promote its agenda and apply pressure to squash less optimal
philosophies. It should be able to deal directly with the courts of
law in Maldives in defending its partners and advocates and their
respective agendas (should these agendas contribute to the overall
goals of MOSS).

If the above is MOSS's goals, then one of its immediate objectives
should be to research the government's current information systems
capabilities (especially in terms of ROI). I believe, there is a
clause in the new constitution which allows citizens to attain any
information from the government of Maldives. MOSS should be the first
well-established NGO to force GOM to honour this clause. The only way
you can do this is by becoming an effective member of the legal
cornucopia (which means the first people to consult are the leading
law firms instead of Faiq) and by establishing strong ties with
international media groups who will be willing to lend you a hand in
promoting your agenda.

Cheers!

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Hi Dosbe,

Welcome back. :)

On Thu, Jun 18, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Dosbe <shaa...@gmail.com> wrote:

It seems to me that some initiatives considered here are a little too
premature. Others contradict your own goals for MOSS.

Sorry to see that you see a part of this initiative as premature and in contradiction. Anybody and everybody is free to correct us, if and when we are wrong or out of tuned. However, I see things from a different light. As far as MOSS mission is concerned, it is well document, though yet we are just sparking old and new flames.

= Mission of MOSS =
MOSS is an intiative to provide a collaborative platform and forum to promote and facilitate Linux and Free Libre Open Source Software. MOSS members are from the community, civil society, students, Maldivians abroad, professional bodies and companies who promote the FLOSS concepts. MOSS is aimed to help policy makers, commercial enterprises, and users to take advantage of the benefits of FLOSS. We also facilitate and administer FLOSS based project like localization to Dhivehi various FLOSS based software.

Hence, we always welcome proactive members who adhere by this philosophy and are willing to maintain this flame.

Why are you involving the government in any measure of MOSS
activities? You do not need any help nor permission from the
government to undertake free/open-source software initiatives. All the
literature will indicate that these initiatives are based on social
contracts (mostly made in good will). Hence, involving a government
which is heavily entrenched in licensed software (and, in the case of
Maldives, piracy) will hinder your goals.

As far as I know, we are in no way involving GOM in MOSS either as a stakeholder or member. Nor we are asking for permission! At the same time, I believe we do understand and value what you have to say in this.
 

'Then how can we help the government change its wicked ways?' you ask?
By creating awareness and by applying pressure. Not by allowing the
government to become a stake holder (in any capacity or form) in MOSS.
If you let them have any vested interests in MOSS then they may end up
manipulating your good intentions towards meeting their own ends.

Our meeting with the GOM is only for doing our fair share of enlightenment and pressure. I do understand most of the mature members of MLUG/MOSS are frustrated, I can understand and feel the past 10 years of effort by them, which deserve praise. Said that, this is no time to think of the past and predict the future. I believe it is time to leave all our frustrations aside and move ahead. Things change, people change, and we have to advocate FLOSS in any chance we get may it be an accountant or a senior GOM member. So this meeting is geared towards our cause and you all are invited contribute in anyway you can and want.
 

'We are not fools to let that happen!' you say? You are establishing
your organization as the pantheon (ahem) of free/open-source
philosophies. As such your principles will hinge on philanthropic
selflessness in seeding your organization's agenda. The government
will exploit this philanthropy to attain cheap solutions to their
problems (NCIT's unfinished information systems for instance) from
within MOSS. Instead of letting this happen you should look at
building a solid NGO which promotes and advocates the rights of free/
open-source businesses.

First, what do you really mean by 'you', if you feel you are not part of MOSS, you are invited. Welcome, aboard.

As for GOM making use of us, I will say, it is what our mandate wants. Make use of MOSS, make use of FLOSS and realize the mystries and benefits of openeness. May it be an individual, a business, an organization or the GOM, we are here to help those who are asking. We are here to advise for those who are listening. We are here to fight, those who are fighting. It would be unwise to assume that we have to treat everyone else as enemies.
 

Which brings me to your objective of establishing MOSS as an NGO. As
an NGO, undertaking commercial activities will be hypocritical
(because the implicit non-profit nature of such organizations). As an
NGO, MOSS should be helping the growth of businesses which subscribe
to its philosophies, not competing with them. Hence, the talk of
brokering business deals via this newly established organization is a
little unethical.

MOSS registration is already submitted. It is just a matter of time to get ourselves recognized legally. As for MOSS undertaking commercial activities, where did you got that idea? It is not MOSS, any business who want to take advantage of FLOSS we are here to help them get up and running. We are here to give advise. We are here to open doors.
 

I suggest that you build MOSS into an authority above the government
of Maldives with regards to free/open-source philosophies. MOSS should
be able to deal directly with local and international bodies to
promote its agenda and apply pressure to squash less optimal
philosophies. It should be able to deal directly with the courts of
law in Maldives in defending its partners and advocates and their
respective agendas (should these agendas contribute to the overall
goals of MOSS).

Yes and thanks, but I believe as an NGO, first we have to always take the friendly route, but if the GOM or the private sector fails to realize the benefits and importance of FLOSS, nothing will stop us from taking extreme measures. We see in this time of change, it is crucial for us to be proactive.
 

If the above is MOSS's goals, then one of its immediate objectives
should be to research the government's current information systems
capabilities (especially in terms of ROI). I believe, there is a
clause in the new constitution which allows citizens to attain any
information from the government of Maldives. MOSS should be the first
well-established NGO to force GOM to honour this clause. The only way
you can do this is by becoming an effective member of the legal
cornucopia (which means the first people to consult are the leading
law firms instead of Faiq) and by establishing strong ties with
international media groups who will be willing to lend you a hand in
promoting your agenda.

This has been discussed and I believe we will come up with an action plan in our next offical meeting. All minutes, funding, expenses and activities will be online and open for the public and members.

Last, thanks for your input, we need more of people who are willing to voice their concerns and ideas. Highly appreciated.

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[Inaz]

Enough with the legal community!

They have made all lawyers of Maldivians... not even a brick moves without some legal bs to go with it (or against it)..

As for getting the government on board, I think it is precisely in the vision of the NGO to educate (even) the government.. right now the IT sector within the government is one of the largest single-owned entity (ofcourse with the most disintegration too). This automatically becomes the target for such NGOs to make its mark and make a difference for the better.

Dosbe: there is only one you in this world. the NGO needs you before you die off and become some rotten piece of earth ! hah!
(ps: there is only one of each of us anyway but.. u know...)

[Hussain Nashid]

hi,

the way I see it, MOSS needs to act as change agents.

for diffusion of any technology we need to show them

• the relative advantages - the advantages of adopting FLOSS compared to other propriety solutions. the more advantages they see the faster it diffuses
• compatibility - how it is compatible with the work they are doing now. can they perform all the work they do within a FLOSS environment. (ie. if they do any real work). the more compatible with the current environment the faster it diffuses.
• complexity - if it is complex for the users the slower it diffuses. we need to show them it is not complex using FLOSS solutions anymore.
• trialiability - the act of trying before adopting full FLOSS solutions. I guess it can be done with live CDs now.
• observability - if they see other using FLOSS solutions it helps in the diffusion process.

and for the question of involving the government.

the state needs to provide:

• education and other social effects - we can use their help in this effort
• competition regulation - for all government RFP gives equal opportunity for propriety and FLOSS solutions
• macro-economic conditions - i guess this is covered on the presentation points that sunan attached. But seed funding and venture capital. really? are we in such positions to ask for that.
• financing R&D - they can provide assistance in this area
• information and decision centers - they can absolutely improve this area

I hope it makes sense. this is what I have learned in Technology Management & Innovation :)

regards,

[Hussain Nashid]

also it makes more sense to view FLOSS as a science than a religion. 

there are no enemies

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Thanks those are good and valid points!

Some comments:
Advantages: Though FLOSS has many advantages these can only be seen by using them. If you are stuck with Windows both at home and office, how can someone find these advantages. Generally as we have spoken with many, they already know of the advantages. The socio-economic advantages are numerous! Manly it is the FUD factor that is holding us.

Compatibility: Given that we live in a country were there are no standards, in anything. Compatibility is simply a mystery to people. Something mostly nobody knows that exists. We have become people who just accept what comes with Windows Server or Desktop. If we need any new features, we just play Microsoft will include it in the next release. This is pathetic...

Complexity: It is amazing to find out most people, as far as IT is concerned, are still stuck in the 80s. Everything is a database and once you enter the data into it, the mission is accomplished. Today notably, Linux is as complex as Windows, but most refuse to believe.

Trialability: We are working on this, distributing as many copies as we can to those who want to give a try. Plus all of FLOSS are freely available for downloads, but they still want a CD as Windows always comes in on a CD.

Observability: What can I say, people see what they want to see...

Last I have very few reasons right now to believe the state have any interest in the progress and development of IT industry. It is just not in their best interest for now. Well who can blame, IT is for IT staff who run around reinstalling Windows.

Excuse my frustrations and negativity, we have got lot of work to do to be a change agent. So I will get back to work.

Warm Regards
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

--
Warm Regards,

Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[Naail AbdulRahman]

Wow I'm missing out on a lot of action these days huh? I'll be going
back to Male' soon, hope to meet some of you guys.

> * the relative advantages - the advantages of

> adopting FLOSS compared to other propriety
> solutions. the more advantages they see the
> faster it diffuses

> * compatibility - how it is compatible with the

> work they are doing now. can they perform all
> the work they do within a FLOSS environment.
> (ie. if they do any real work). the more
> compatible with the current environment the
> faster it diffuses.

> * complexity - if it is complex for the users

> the slower it diffuses. we need to show them
> it is not complex using FLOSS solutions
> anymore.

> * trialiability - the act of trying before

> adopting full FLOSS solutions. I guess it can
> be done with live CDs now.

> * observability - if they see other using FLOSS

> solutions it helps in the diffusion process.
> and for the question of involving the government.
>
>
> the state needs to provide:

> * education and other social effects - we can

> use their help in this effort

> * competition regulation - for all government

> RFP gives equal opportunity for propriety and
> FLOSS solutions

> * macro-economic conditions - i guess this is

> covered on the presentation points that sunan
> attached. But seed funding and venture
> capital. really? are we in such positions to
> ask for that.

> * financing R&D - they can provide assistance in
> this area
> * information and decision centers - they can

[Inaz]

precisely!!

They teach u good there, dont they!

[Inash Zubair]

Hello all.

I've successfully submitted the MOSS application for registration as an NGO. Will keep the progress posted.

Cheers.

--
Inash Zubair

[Abdul Hameed]

Inn, your hard work highly appreciated. good job.

Hamitte

[Yasiph]

Hi all

Sorry for being late on uploading the audio notes of Jun 18 meetup at
dharubaaruge but that wouldnt happen again now that i've got the tools
of the trade. Anyway, there is a hissing sound so it's best to hear it
using headphones.

here's the 1:26 minute 19MB audio file
http://www.filefactory.com/file/ag8dg77/n/20090618-Moss_mp3

Inn: feel free to lemme know if u need any manpower

cheers
yasiph

Inash Zubair wrote:
> Hello all.
>
> I've successfully submitted the MOSS application for registration as
> an NGO. Will keep the progress posted.
>
> Cheers.
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 21, 2009 at 1:54 AM, Inaz <mohame...@gmail.com
> <mailto:mohame...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> precisely!!
>
> They teach u good there, dont they!
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jun 19, 2009 at 6:23 PM, Hussain Nashid <nat...@gmail.com
> <mailto:nat...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> hi,
>
> the way I see it, MOSS needs to act as change agents.
>
> for diffusion of any technology we need to show them
>

> * the relative advantages - the advantages of adopting

> FLOSS compared to other propriety solutions. the more
> advantages they see the faster it diffuses

> * compatibility - how it is compatible with the work they

> are doing now. can they perform all the work they do
> within a FLOSS environment. (ie. if they do any real
> work). the more compatible with the current environment
> the faster it diffuses.

> * complexity - if it is complex for the users the slower

> it diffuses. we need to show them it is not complex
> using FLOSS solutions anymore.

> * trialiability - the act of trying before adopting full

> FLOSS solutions. I guess it can be done with live CDs now.

> * observability - if they see other using FLOSS solutions

> it helps in the diffusion process.
>
> and for the question of involving the government.
>
> the state needs to provide:
>

> * education and other social effects - we can use their
> help in this effort
> * competition regulation - for all government RFP gives

> equal opportunity for propriety and FLOSS solutions

> * macro-economic conditions - i guess this is covered on

> the presentation points that sunan attached. But seed
> funding and venture capital. really? are we in such
> positions to ask for that.

> * financing R&D - they can provide assistance in this area
> * information and decision centers - they can absolutely

[MrCrΛft]

Yasiph,

I just visited Ministry of Home Affairs to find about the registration
of MOSS.
They have marked a few clauses requiring amendments. Details about
those changes are given below. I guess it would be better to change
these clauses according to their requirements since it would be
impossible to get this registered without amending as they have
suggested.

1. Members: Clause 8 states that we have 2 categories of members
however we have listed 4 categories.
2. Fee and subscription: They say that we have to mention a
specific amount if we charge anything and if we dont we have to state
so as well. Changes can be annxed later too.
3. Responsibilities of the PR coordinator: It is missing.
4. Logo, Flag, Colour and Motto: Append the sentence "Evves
badhaleh geneveynee Registrar ge huddha libigenneve."
5. Dissolution of NGO: Append the sentence "Evves sarukaaruge
faraathakun jamuyya uvaaluman angavaifi hindeggai jamuyyaa uvaaleveyne
eve.

My suggestions about the point 1 & 2. Me, Shunan & chopey discussed
about them a while back.
1. Clause 8 to specifically state that we have 4 categories of
members.
2. Clause 12,
--Normal members (Individual): MRF 1000.
--Normal members (Business): MRF 1500.
--Sharafveri members: sponsors & donations
--Students: Free
3. PR responsibilities
--Establish a section of the site devoted to press releases a virtual
"newsroom" including an archive of all key press releases
--Issue press releases to Web-only news organizations
--Issue press releases to both the print and Internet divisions of
major and local news outlets
--Ensure that Web site conveys the NGO's mission
--Coordination of meetings with other organisations including public,
private and government
what else?

[MrCrΛft]

Dear all,

MoHA says the MOSS registration will be completed by next Tuesday.
Good news!

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Great!

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[rhipha]

thats good news. . . . so lets start preparation for the general
assembly

[Abdulla Siyaz]

good news...

 

i have been far from gmail for days....

 

how's things going on

 

cangratulations for the work you guys did.

 

finally the MOSS gona be its own...

 

regards

 

[MrCrΛft]

Guys,
We have got the registration!
Wanna see it. Here it is

http://groups.google.com/group/mlugmv/web/IMGP0170.JPG

The letter states that we should hold our AGM within 6 days of
registration!

[Ali Haris]

Thats so cool

[chopey]

congratulations ..

[Yusuf Abdulla Shunan]

Feels good to see that :)

Looking forward for the AGM!

Salam
Yusuf Abdulla Shunan

[V Shah]

This calls for a feast.yay!. Congras to everyone.

--
Sent from my mobile device

[Abdul Hameed]

Sobah,

Is it 6 days or 60 days?

anyways, congrats to all.. this really demands celebration.. oooh yea!

salaams,

[Ibrahim Sobah]

Hamittey.

Just within 6 days!

Overview of yesterday's meeting:
1. About AGM
* Meeting to be held at MSCE or Dharubaaruge on coming Saturday.
* To distribute the application form for members and to collect funds & the forms later
* To plan a refreshment for members

2. Other
* Review of the event completed on World Population Day
*To plan events on OSS awareness
* To get prepared for Software Freedom Day, 19 September

Thanks