Wellington busdriver in intensive care after speeding car rammed into the back of bus!
David McLoughlin
> Absolutely nothing.
What was your opinion of this ghastly ramming of a hapless bus driver by
a motorist who for some as-yet-to-be-explained reason couldn't stop?
I feel strongly for the bus driver, who had just returned to work after
injuring his hand a few weeks earlier and is now in hospital in a
critical condition after being rammed from behind by a car while putting
the poles of his trolleybus back on the wires.
It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
David McLoughlin
Auckland New Zealand
Don Mackie
<davemcl@NO***damned***SPAMiprolink.co.nz> wrote:
> It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
> require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
> trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
> that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
> incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
> buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
> arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
The worrying thing is that it would probably be cheaper (short term
certainly) to dismantle and replace the trolley buses with a diesel
fleet. Which option would you prefer - old trolley system or no trolley
system?
--
"Any PC built after 1985 has the storage capacity to house an evil spirit,"
Reverend Jim Peasboro
David Murray
David McLoughlin wrote:
>
> David Murray wrote:
>
> > Absolutely nothing.
>
> What was your opinion of this ghastly ramming of a hapless bus driver by
> a motorist who for some as-yet-to-be-explained reason couldn't stop?
My opinion is that the driver of the car should be prosecuted for
dangerous driving AND should serve time in prison - and should never get
a licence to drive again!
That poor bus driver - IF he survives - will be a cripple and is now out
of a job as a result of that maniac's dangerous driving.
TTFN
D.
Jerry
"David McLoughlin" <davemcl@NO***damned***SPAMiprolink.co.nz> wrote in
message news:3a28...@news.iprolink.co.nz...
> David Murray wrote:
>
> > Absolutely nothing.
>
> What was your opinion of this ghastly ramming of a hapless bus driver by
> a motorist who for some as-yet-to-be-explained reason couldn't stop?
It happened just past the roundabout, there is good visibility and I can't
see how someone could not see a trolly bus. The skid marks just go about
2-3 meters so he couldn't have been watching where he was going. That
roundabout is usually covered with broken glass anyway, so it isn't the spot
where I would go to sleep.
> I feel strongly for the bus driver, who had just returned to work after
> injuring his hand a few weeks earlier and is now in hospital in a
> critical condition after being rammed from behind by a car while putting
> the poles of his trolleybus back on the wires.
I hope he makes it.
> It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
> require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
> trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
> that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
> incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
> buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
> arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
The busses may get replaced in a few years, but I can't see them going to
the expense of replacing the wiring. It will be the end of the trolly
busses when all the wiring needs replacing.
Jerry
Nathan Mercer
Nathan
(expat Welly person now in (D)orkland)
In article <97574324...@shelley.paradise.net.nz>,
sto...@paradise.nospam.net.nz says...
Jerry
"Nathan Mercer" <nat...@mcs.co.nz> wrote in message
news:MPG.14937529e...@news.paradise.net.nz...
> Which roundabout?
>
> Nathan
> (expat Welly person now in (D)orkland)
At the North end of the airport runway, the roundabout closest to Kilbirnie.
The bus had just left the roundabout headed towards Miramar.
Jerry
Karen Hayward
The one by the Kilbirnie fire station? I remember that the poles used
to fall off regularly at that spot. I think it had something to do
with the switch at that point.
I wonder how the car driver managed to miss a large bus sitting smack
in his/her path. Mind you, a week or so back, I also stood and watched
in amazement, as a car rammed straight into the back of one of those
long ladder fire engines that was stopped at the lights. How could the
driver have possible missed it!
Karen Hayward
Commander Keen
<kiwi...@yellowsub.net> wrote:
> The one by the Kilbirnie fire station? I remember that the poles used
> to fall off regularly at that spot. I think it had something to do
> with the switch at that point.
>
> I wonder how the car driver managed to miss a large bus sitting smack
> in his/her path. Mind you, a week or so back, I also stood and watched
> in amazement, as a car rammed straight into the back of one of those
> long ladder fire engines that was stopped at the lights.
> How could the driver have possible missed it!
>
> Karen Hayward
Blind, stupid, incompetent ..................
--
RK
>
>
> David McLoughlin wrote:
> >
> > David Murray wrote:
> >
> > > Absolutely nothing.
> >
> > What was your opinion of this ghastly ramming of a hapless bus driver by
> > a motorist who for some as-yet-to-be-explained reason couldn't stop?
>
> My opinion is that the driver of the car should be prosecuted for
> dangerous driving AND should serve time in prison - and should never get
> a licence to drive again!
>
He should be run over by a bus.
> That poor bus driver - IF he survives - will be a cripple and is now out
> of a job as a result of that maniac's dangerous driving.
>
> TTFN
> D.
Raymond Kemp
rk...@eyehug.co.nz
RK
> In article <3a28...@news.iprolink.co.nz>, David McLoughlin
> <davemcl@NO***damned***SPAMiprolink.co.nz> wrote:
>
>
> > It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
> > require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
> > trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
> > that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
> > incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
> > buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
> > arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
>
> The worrying thing is that it would probably be cheaper (short term
> certainly) to dismantle and replace the trolley buses with a diesel
> fleet. Which option would you prefer - old trolley system or no trolley
> system?
>
Definately no trolley system. Those buses suck so badly - even going up around
the basin after having turned off the end of adelaide rd they are slow as hell.
I feel sorry for the drivers when they have to get out and deal with those
annoying poles that flick off - the whole system is a failure & should be
dumped immediately.
Look at ChCh with its $20 million state of the art system - GPS tracked buses
with stand-alone electric buses to compliment the diesel.
RK
Raymond Kemp
rk...@eyehug.co.nz
David Murray
RK wrote:
>
> Definately no trolley system. Those buses suck so badly - even going up around
> the basin after having turned off the end of adelaide rd they are slow as hell.
> I feel sorry for the drivers when they have to get out and deal with those
> annoying poles that flick off - the whole system is a failure & should be
> dumped immediately.
The thing that is wrong witht he "system" is all the stupid car-drivers
who think that they have an obligation to travel only at the maximum
speed permitted!
The Trolley buses arerelatively quiet, are comfortable to travel in,
actually have greater pulling power on the hills in comparison to the
diesel buses, and are non-poluting.
The whole system should be improved with state-of-the-art Trolley buses
- most definitely not scrapping them in favour of the diesel buses!
TTFN
D.
Steve Biddle <sbiddle@
RK wrote:
>
> Definately no trolley system. Those buses suck so badly - even going up around
> the basin after having turned off the end of adelaide rd they are slow as hell.
> I feel sorry for the drivers when they have to get out and deal with those
> annoying poles that flick off - the whole system is a failure & should be
> dumped immediately.
>
> Look at ChCh with its $20 million state of the art system - GPS tracked buses
> with stand-alone electric buses to compliment the diesel.
>
The Wellington drivers don't want GPS and new electronic timetables at
bus stops, one of them was quoted in the paper a few weeks ago
complaining about how it would infringe their privacy!
David McLoughlin
> The Wellington drivers don't want GPS and new electronic timetables at
> bus stops, one of them was quoted in the paper a few weeks ago
> complaining about how it would infringe their privacy!
Wow, that's bizarre. Stagecoach, the company which owns the Wellington
and Auckland buses, has had GPS and real-time electronic timetables at
major stops in Auckland for 18 months now. And driver-operated traffic
light pre-emption too on some routes (though not enough).
The drivers even have the same union in both cities (the Tramways
Union).
Dan Langille
<"couldbe>chello.co.nz"> wrote:
> The Wellington drivers don't want GPS and new electronic timetables at
> bus stops, one of them was quoted in the paper a few weeks ago
> complaining about how it would infringe their privacy!
Privacy? When driving public transport? joke.
--
Dan Langille
http://unixathome.org/broadband/ <= New Zealand broadband mailing list
Michael Butler
>
>
> It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
> require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
> trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
> that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
> incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
> buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
> arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
Of course there is a simple solution to the problem. A trial with
fibreglass poles showed that these stayed on the wires much better
since they are lighter. WCT (pre-Stagecoach days) never introduced
them. I suspect that they broke easier than the metal poles and so
the almighty dollar ruled.
I strongly suspect that if the bus involved had been equipped with
fibreglass poles this accident wouldn't have happened.
--
Mike Butler Wellington NZ
Ben BC X New Zealand Dog Agility on the Web
Ella Kelpie Pup http://homepages.ihug.co.nz/~mbutler/nala/
David Murray
Michael Butler wrote:
>
> I strongly suspect that if the bus involved had been equipped with
> fibreglass poles this accident wouldn't have happened.
I strongly suggest that if the car-driver had been driving with his/her
eyes open then this accident wouldn't have happened! The blame for this
accident rests soley on the shoulders of the car driver!
TTFN
D.
Matt Neilson
"Karen Hayward" <kiwi...@yellowsub.net> wrote in message > I
wonder how the car driver managed to miss a large bus sitting
smack
> in his/her path. Mind you, a week or so back, I also stood and
watched
> in amazement, as a car rammed straight into the back of one of
those
> long ladder fire engines that was stopped at the lights. How
could the
> driver have possible missed it!
Sadly in both cases they didn't :)
Cheers, MAtt
David McLoughlin
> Of course there is a simple solution to the problem. A trial with
> fibreglass poles showed that these stayed on the wires much better
> since they are lighter. WCT (pre-Stagecoach days) never introduced
> them. I suspect that they broke easier than the metal poles and so
> the almighty dollar ruled.
That trial, as you said, was in pre-Stagecoach days. It was even in
pre-Volvo days. It was about 1980. The trolleybus fitted with the
fibreglass poles refused to lose the poles on a high-speed trip from
Karori to the city and around the Basin Reserve. This was so pro-trolley
that WCT management suppressed info of the trial, and a pro-trolley
engineer hid the poles after the trial to prevent management destroying
them.
Bizarre that Stagecoach missed all this; they converted to aluminium
poles but never cottoned on that fibreglass was the way to go.
David McLoughlin
Yes, I look forward to charges being laid.
Simon Lyall
>Wow, that's bizarre. Stagecoach, the company which owns the Wellington
>and Auckland buses, has had GPS and real-time electronic timetables at
>major stops in Auckland for 18 months now.
I would hardly call something "real-time" when the clocks are consistanly
5 minutes out. Why they couldn't use a system that would be sync'd to
within a second I have no idea.
--
Simon J. Lyall | Very Busy | Mail: si...@darkmere.gen.nz
"Inside me Im Screaming, Nobody pays any attention." | eMT.
"The slippery KY-covered gerbil seemed, to Patrick, to be eyeing him up
unpleasantly. The gerbil, obviously a veteran of the process, even
looked like he enjoyed it. "
- "The Heimlich Manouvre" staring P Dunford & Doctor von Heimlich.
Christopher Rivituso
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Butler" <mbu...@ihug.co.nz>
To: <tran...@cc.UManitoba.CA>
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 6:19 AM
Subject: Re: Wellington busdriver in intensive care after speeding car
rammed into the back of bus!
> David McLoughlin wrote:
> >
> >
> > It really is about time Stagecoach got some new trolley buses that don't
> > require drivers to get out and put the poles back on (automatic repoling
> > trolleys are in use elsewhere in the world) and it's also more than time
> > that the wire layout in Wellington was modernised to reduce the
> > incidence of poles coming off (in countries such as Switzerland, trolley
> > buses can travel at high speed through the most complicated traffic
> > arrangements without the poles coming off). The technology exists.
One thing I don't understand, however, is how the poles can get back on the
wire themselves. In Moscow, near where I lived, there was a devil's elbow
that caused many a pole to come off, causing the driver to have put the wire
back on. This is because the contact point at the top of the pole pivots and
when the driver has to raise the pole, the contact point may have to be
manually turned or it may have even fallen out of the bracket. In the latter
case, the driver take a mallet to the contact point so that it will go back
in its bracket. Regardless of that, the driver still has to line the poles
up with the wire.
> I strongly suspect that if the bus involved had been equipped with
> fibreglass poles this accident wouldn't have happened.
>
Why is fiberglass better -- sturdy yet flexible, thus holding to the wire?
CR
Mike Cox
"David Murray" <nos...@none.invalid> wrote in message
news:3A29DF4A...@none.invalid...
Bingo !!! The only one at fault here is the blind, intellectually
sub-standard individual who was driving....no excuses I hope they get the
wanker and severely deal to the bastard. People like that have NO right to
be driving....let alone being in any form of a responsible position. Only
fit for lining the bottom of a rubbish bin.
David Murray
Mike Cox wrote:
>
> Bingo !!! The only one at fault here is the blind, intellectually
> sub-standard individual who was driving....no excuses I hope they get the
> wanker and severely deal to the bastard. People like that have NO right to
> be driving....let alone being in any form of a responsible position. Only
> fit for lining the bottom of a rubbish bin.
I learned today a little of the circumstances surrounding the "accident"
The car was speeding to get past another bus that was in the left lane.
The car attempted to overtake but couldn't see enough of the road ahead
to know that the manoeuver would be successful in the amount of clear
road available to him. Thus the car was traveling at speed when it
encountered the intersection where the driver was putting the polls back
on the wires.
Thus, the "accident" is entirely due to impatience and reckless driving
on the part of the moronic car-driver who couldn't wait until he knew
the road was clear before overtaking!
TTFN
D.
David McLoughlin
Wellington NZ
Accident won't halt trolley buses
04 DECEMBER 2000
By JULIET O'CONNOR
Bus operator Stagecoach says it will continue to run trolley buses to
Wellington's eastern suburbs despite calls to stop them after a serious
accident last week.
Bus driver Barry Hollis is still in Wellington Hospital's intensive care
unit today with leg and stomach injuries after he was crushed by a car
on
Wednesday as he tended fallen poles behind his bus at the intersection
of
Cobham Drive and Troy St.
A bus driver and colleague of Mr Hollis, whom The Evening Post agreed
not to
name, said the accident showed it was time trolley buses to the very
windy
eastern suburbs were stopped because tending broken lines around the
busy
airport intersection was dangerous.
"It really was an accident waiting to happen."
The driver said high northerly winds at Evans Bay frequently knocked
trolley
poles off wires, requiring drivers to leave their buses, while motorists
usually just whizzed past.
Stagecoach Wellington manager Nigel Piper said that though Stagecoach
did
replace trolley buses with diesel buses a couple of times a year because
of
high winds, the company would not stop running trolleys east of
Kilbirnie
altogether. "It would be difficult. It don't think it is a very
practical
option."
Passengers would have to transfer from trolley to diesel buses. "That
exposes passengers to risks because they will be getting out on the
road."
However, Mr Piper agreed the area was a danger spot and Stagecoach was
reviewing how this could be improved. Decisions couldn't be made till
the
cause of the accident was known. The injured driver had been wearing a
reflective vest as required, and there was no wind at the time, he said.
Mr Hollis' colleague said: "A lot of the bus drivers have been pretty
shaken
up by this accident."
Another reason to stop buses going beyond Kilbirnie, he said, was
because
electrified trolley lines were close to Wellington airport's runway.
A 1984 Civil Aviation Division Ministry of Transport report cited
trolley
bus wiring, along with vehicle traffic and an underground gas main, on
Cobham Drive as hazards in the event of an aircraft overshoot.
However, Mr Piper said a contingency plan was in place to shut down
lines
and ensure they remained off in an emergency.
David Murray
David McLoughlin wrote:
>
> Evening Post
> Wellington NZ
> Accident won't halt trolley buses
Good - 'coz we like our trolley buses.
We like our bus drivers too, and would want to make it safe for them AND
want to keep out trolleys
WN is one of the few cities in NZ (if not the only one) which has
sensibly kept it's electric transportation infrastructure. We have
electric trains and electric buses which all help to reduce noise and
air polution.
TTFN
D.
David McLoughlin
> WN is one of the few cities in NZ (if not the only one) which has
> sensibly kept its electric transportation infrastructure.
It's the only one. The only other city in NZ which had electric trains
(Chriscthurch) abandoned the service in 1972.
The only other cities with trolleybuses closed them years ago --
Christchurch in 1956, New Plymouth in 1967, Auckland in 1980 and Dunedin
in 1982.
> We have
> electric trains and electric buses which all help to reduce noise and
> air polution.
For now. If you want to keep them, start making a very loud public noise
in their support.
Jerry
"David Murray" <nospa...@none.invalid> wrote in message
news:3A2AEA35...@none.invalid...
>
>
> Mike Cox wrote:
> >
> > Bingo !!! The only one at fault here is the blind, intellectually
> > sub-standard individual who was driving....no excuses I hope they get
the
> > wanker and severely deal to the bastard. People like that have NO right
to
> > be driving....let alone being in any form of a responsible position.
Only
> > fit for lining the bottom of a rubbish bin.
>
> I learned today a little of the circumstances surrounding the "accident"
>
> The car was speeding to get past another bus that was in the left lane.
> The car attempted to overtake but couldn't see enough of the road ahead
> to know that the manoeuver would be successful in the amount of clear
> road available to him. Thus the car was traveling at speed when it
> encountered the intersection where the driver was putting the polls back
> on the wires.
That doesn't quite add up - the bus he hit was in the left lane, and not
actually in an intersection but just past the roundabout. Now if he was
passing a bus in the right lane and moved left before he could see the road
ahead it might make sense.
> Thus, the "accident" is entirely due to impatience and reckless driving
> on the part of the moronic car-driver who couldn't wait until he knew
> the road was clear before overtaking!
Can't argue with that, including your use of the quotation marks.
Jerry
David Murray
Jerry wrote:
>
> "David Murray" <nospa...@none.invalid> wrote in message
> news:3A2AEA35...@none.invalid...
> >
> >
> > Mike Cox wrote:
> > >
> > > Bingo !!! The only one at fault here is the blind, intellectually
> > > sub-standard individual who was driving....no excuses I hope they get
> the
> > > wanker and severely deal to the bastard. People like that have NO right
> to
> > > be driving....let alone being in any form of a responsible position.
> Only
> > > fit for lining the bottom of a rubbish bin.
> >
> > I learned today a little of the circumstances surrounding the "accident"
> >
> > The car was speeding to get past another bus that was in the left lane.
> > The car attempted to overtake but couldn't see enough of the road ahead
> > to know that the manoeuver would be successful in the amount of clear
> > road available to him. Thus the car was traveling at speed when it
> > encountered the intersection where the driver was putting the polls back
> > on the wires.
>
> That doesn't quite add up - the bus he hit was in the left lane, and not
> actually in an intersection but just past the roundabout. Now if he was
> passing a bus in the right lane and moved left before he could see the road
> ahead it might make sense.
I don't even remotely suggest that I have the full - or even the correct
version of events. I am only going by what I was told by a busdriver
whilest I was traveling through Mount Victoria. The exact layout on the
road I couldn't tell you.
> > Thus, the "accident" is entirely due to impatience and reckless driving
> > on the part of the moronic car-driver who couldn't wait until he knew
> > the road was clear before overtaking!
>
> Can't argue with that, including your use of the quotation marks.
:o)
TTFN
D.
Colin Klenner
Steve Biddle <sbiddle@ chello.co.nz > <"couldbe> wrote in message
news:XYgW5.1339$Me3.1...@news.chello.com.au...
The Christchurch drivers thought the same thing, oddly enough. Once the
system came on line they discovered that they could get exact feedback on
their position relative to the timetable, instead of guessing.
Guess what - they are starting to like the advantage it gives them because
they don't get grumbles from the passengers about being early/late etc.
Jerry
"David Murray" <nospa...@none.invalid> wrote in message
> version of events. I am only going by what I was told by a busdriver
> whilest I was traveling through Mount Victoria. The exact layout on the
> road I couldn't tell you.
I have no idea exactly what happened either, but it is obvious exactly where
it happened from the marks on the road. If he was coming from Kilbirnie and
passed a bus in the right lane (by moving into the left lane) coming out of
the roundabout it is possible that the other bus was obscure the trolly bus
until he changed lanes. This is not the correct version of events but just
speculation on my behalf.
Jerry
Bruce Hamilton
>David Murray wrote in message <3A29DF4A...@none.invalid>...
>>I strongly suggest that if the car-driver had been driving with his/her
>>eyes open then this accident wouldn't have happened! The blame for this
>>accident rests soley on the shoulders of the car driver!
>>
>safer for the bus drivers. I do think it was an accident waiting to happen
>as bad drivers are a reality on our roads. People need to be protected from
>the stupidity of others on the road where possible.
Passing the accident on the way to work, it seems likely that the
car driver had approached the roundabout from Wellington and was
watching for traffic on the roundabout, and didn't realise the bus
was stationary just out of the roundabout. Appears the car driver
was unable to stop in the clear space, and thus should get a ticket.
The trolleybus contacts in that area really sparkle first thing in
the morning after a windy night, as the salt encrustation on the lines
is burnt off - makes sodium street lamps look like cheap sparklers.
I'm doubtful that sunstrike is an issue ( as suggested elsewhere)
at that location that early in the morning, but I'm usually going the
other way and don't take much notice of the sun shadow start.
Bruce Hamilton