Routing of Mass Pike
mass...@my-deja.com
wrote in the "Starts & Stops" column:
"Worcester, you may be old enough to remember,
was bypassed when the Turnpike was built back in
the 1950s because of a typical Bay State
political feud."
Does anyone know anything about this? Where might
it have gone? What was the squabble? I always
assumed it was simply geography that ran the road
outside the city (Worcester is very hilly).
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
mass...@my-deja.com
Perry
Worcester a fair distance to the south, rather like the NY Thruway
misses Rochester.
mass...@my-deja.com
kept it out of the city.
In article <39FEF430...@student.berklee.edu>,
Ron Newman
<39FEF430...@student.berklee.edu>, Perry stated...
>
>It went where it is now. The Turnpike as it exists today misses
>Worcester a fair distance to the south, rather like the NY Thruway
>misses Rochester.
It also misses Springfield, and when originally built did not
enter Boston either -- it ended at Route 128.
The philosophy behind toll roads such as the NY Thruway and
Mass Pike was always to bypass cities, not run through them.
The Pennsylvania Turnpike misses Philadelphia, Harrisburg, and
Pittsburgh. The Ohio Turnpike misses Youngstown, Cleveland, Akron,
and Toledo. The NY State Thruway misses not just Rochester but
also several other upstate cities.
--
Ron Newman rne...@thecia.net
http://www2.thecia.net/users/rnewman/home.html
Rick
"Ron Newman" <rne...@thecia.net> wrote in message
news:8tng0...@edrn.newsguy.com...
> On Tue, 31 Oct 2000 11:32:48 -0500, in article
> <39FEF430...@student.berklee.edu>, Perry stated...
> >
State Thruway misses not just Rochester but
> also several other upstate cities.
Yep, like Syracuse, Utica, Schenectady, Albany, Kingston, Poughkeepsie,
Newburgh and White Plans, just to name a few big cities.
I think going through cities wouldn't make these toll roads as much of a
bypass as they are now. Yes, there are already 6 exits for Syracuse along
the Thruway, but if the Thruway did go through Syracuse, there would
probably be a lot more. That's also why there are 9 3di's of 90 in New
York, to reach these cities that bypassed by the Thruway: I-190 (Buffalo,
Niagra Falls), I-290 (Buffalo), I-390 (Rochester, Corning), I-490 (Downtown
Rochester), I-590 (Rochester), I-690 (Downtown Syracuse), I-790 (Downtown
Utica), I-890 (Schenectady, and Downtown), I-990 (SUNY Lockport), as well as
I-787 (Downtown Albany) and I-287 (White Plains)
Robert Cote
<rne...@thecia.net> wrote:
That's funny. My dad went to RIT and he never once said he missed
Rochester. ;-)
These were early implementations of the true concept of thruways.
The Mass Pike provided tremendous benefits and saved cities like
Westfield from being overwhelmed.
The problem came when the fantastic benefits of things like the Pike
and Thruway got the attention of urban politicans. .
MCT
all my life about how the Pike could have come right through Worcester
but the city blew it....the story goes that either the city didn't want
it, or some political squabble resulted in the Pike being re-routed. As
other posters have said, however, it wouldn't seem to have made much
sense for the Pike to have gone directly through Worcester in the first
place:
1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance route, not a
commuter route. It did not originally continue all the way into Boston,
and it skirts most other large cities along the route (i.e., Pittsfield,
Springfield) without actually going through the city proper. As others
have noted, this was typical of toll roads in the pre- or early
interstate era. It would have been odd if the road had been built right
through downtown Worcester. As it currently stands, the turnpike
actually doesn't miss the city limits by much anyway. What is odd is
that there was no exit at MA 146 -- maybe there was some political
reason behind this omission?
2) As has been suggested, the topography of the area would have made a
cross-city routing difficult. There are many hills, and the central
part of the city was densely built up. The main east-west railroad
through this area, the main line of the former Boston & Albany Railroad,
follows a very circutous route through the city, and zigzags all over
the place through the towns west of Worcester. The main US route, US
20, runs along the southern edge of the city, only slightly closer to
downtown than the Pike. MA 9, which is a divided (but not limited
access) highway between Boston and Worcester, uses city streets to get
across Worcester, and is a 2-lane undivided road west of Worcester.
I-290, which goes right through Worcester (albeit not in the exact same
direction that the Turnpike would have gone), was shoehorned through
with many curves and oddly laid out interchanges.
3) If the Turnpike wasn't built through Worcester in the 1950s because
the city didn't want it coming through their backyard, they apparently
had a sudden change of heart and were willing to have plenty of
three-deckers plowed under just a few years later to build I-290, as
well as rip up downown when the Worcester Center project was done. It's
possible that after the Turnpike was built, the city changed its mind
about highways, but if so, it was a sudden and drastic change. Years
after Boston had cancelled much of its planned expressway network,
Worcester was still building I-190 through the northern part of the city
(early '80s). Right now, in 2000, property is being condemned to build
the new MA 146 expressway.
Robert Cote
maggie...@webtv.net (MCT) wrote:
> I've lived my whole life in the Worcester area, and I've been
> hearing all my life about how the Pike could have come right
> through Worcester but the city blew it....the story goes that
> either the city didn't want it, or some political squabble
> resulted in the Pike being re-routed.
That's exactly as I've always heard the story.
> As other posters have
> said, however, it wouldn't seem to have made much sense for the
> Pike to have gone directly through Worcester in the first place:
>
> 1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance route,
> not a commuter route.
This was true but things change over time. In the 60s the concept
of living in Framingham/Natick and working in Boston was silly.
> ... It would have
> been odd if the road had been built right through downtown
> Worcester. ...
> 2) As has been suggested, the topography of the area would have
> made a cross-city routing difficult. There are many hills, ...
> MA 9, which is a divided (but not limited access) highway
> between Boston and Worcester, ...
Bingo! The Route 9 alignment has always been there. The answer
wasn't geography or opportunity.
> 3) If the Turnpike wasn't built through Worcester in the 1950s
> because the city didn't want it coming through their backyard,
> they apparently had a sudden change of heart and were willing to
> have plenty of three-deckers plowed under just a few years later
> to build I-290, as well as rip up downown when the Worcester
> Center project was done. It's possible that after the Turnpike
> was built, the city changed its mind about highways, but if so,
> it was a sudden and drastic change.
You got it. Politics kept Worcester out of the golden age.
> Years after Boston had
> cancelled much of its planned expressway network, Worcester was
> still building I-190 through the northern part of the city (early
> '80s).
Snuck my motorcycle on that part before it opened. Was cool.
> Right now, in 2000, property is being condemned to build
> the new MA 146 expressway.
That's on the south end right?
Mike C
"MCT" <maggie...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:5054-3A0...@storefull-154.iap.bryant.webtv.net...
> I've lived my whole life in the Worcester area, and I've been hearing
> all my life about how the Pike could have come right through Worcester
> but the city blew it....the story goes that either the city didn't want
> it, or some political squabble resulted in the Pike being re-routed. As
> other posters have said, however, it wouldn't seem to have made much
> sense for the Pike to have gone directly through Worcester in the first
> place:
>
> 1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance route, not a
> commuter route. It did not originally continue all the way into Boston,
> and it skirts most other large cities along the route (i.e., Pittsfield,
> Springfield) without actually going through the city proper. As others
> have noted, this was typical of toll roads in the pre- or early
> interstate era. It would have been odd if the road had been built right
> through downtown Worcester.
They could not have fit enough interchanges if they came through the
built-up part of Worcester.
The Turnpike Athority saved themselves the cost of crossing Lake
Quinsigimond by routing the road a few miles to the south. They could have
gone north - but that would have put them into the Wachusett Resivor
watershed, and they wanted to head towards Springfield, not Greenfield.
> As it currently stands, the turnpike
> actually doesn't miss the city limits by much anyway. What is odd is
> that there was no exit at MA 146 -- maybe there was some political
> reason behind this omission?
Worcester had two interchanges on the Pike - MA12 in Auburn and MA122 in
Millbury. When I-290 was being planed, both termini were at the Pike. The
western end was costucted from Auburn more or less as planned. The eastern
end was to have been in Westboro, at the I495/Pike interchange.
Objections from Shrewsbury and Northboro - the planned highway came close to
both town centers - pushed the eastern end of the highway north along 495 to
its present position.
A limited access 146 into Worcester was first proposed in the late 60's, but
at that point the residents of the city would not have stood still for
another round of land takings.
Winston969
>but
>at that point the residents of the city would not have stood still for
>another round of land takings.
Is the Mass 146 expressway going to go beyond the MassPike? I think it should
end at the Pike.
Winston Brownlow
Winston969
>of living in Framingham/Natick and working in Boston was silly.
Hahaha
>> Years after Boston had
>> cancelled much of its planned expressway network, Worcester was
>> still building I-190 through the northern part of the city (early
>> '80s).
I dont see the point of I-290 between Worcester and I-495/Marlborough. I think
that this portion of highway should be dismantled and I-395 extended all the
way from the Conn border to the Mass 2 expressway along I-290 and I-190.
As to Boston's planned expressway system, I would only see a need for a
complete Mass 2 expressway between Greenfield/I-91 and Chelsea/US 1. Also an
upgrade to a full expressway of US 1 from Revere to 128 would be nice. Cant
really see any more expressways needed though.
Winston Brownlow
Exile on Market Street
<tech...@gte.net> wrote:
> In article <5054-3A0...@storefull-154.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
> maggie...@webtv.net (MCT) wrote:
>
> > 1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance route,
> > not a commuter route.
>
> This was true but things change over time. In the 60s the concept
> of living in Framingham/Natick and working in Boston was silly.
Was it really that silly?
ISTR that Shoppers World opened in 1955, and the nearby Natick Mall about a
decade later.
The Pennsylvania Levittown, which is about as far away from Philadelphia
City Hall as Framingham is from Boston Common, is Shoppers World's
contemporary, roughly. That would suggest to me that some folks were
already contemplating living in F'ham and working in Boston by the 1960s.
Or was there something comparable to the USS Fairless Works already in the
area? (This steel mill is not too far from Levittown.)
--
Sandy Smith, University Relations / 215.898.1423 / smi...@pobox.upenn.edu
Managing Editor, _Pennsylvania Current_ cur...@pobox.upenn.edu
Penn Web Team -- Web Editor webm...@isc.upenn.edu
I speak for myself here, not Penn http://pobox.upenn.edu/~smiths/
"Believe me. You wouldn't want to go here if *your* mother was the
president."
--Penn President Judith Rodin on her son Alex, off to Duke
---------------------------------------------(_Philadelphia_, Nov. 2000)--
Robert Cote
> In article <Uh8M5.2523$Vk6.3...@paloalto-snr1.gtei.net>, Robert
> Cote <tech...@gte.net> wrote:
>
> > In article
> > <5054-3A0...@storefull-154.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
> > maggie...@webtv.net (MCT) wrote:
> >
> > > 1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance
> > > route, not a commuter route.
> >
> > This was true but things change over time. In the 60s the
> > concept of living in Framingham/Natick and working in Boston
> > was silly.
>
> Was it really that silly?
IMO, yes.
> ISTR that Shoppers World opened in 1955, and the nearby Natick
> Mall about a decade later.
[Seeing as my grandfather owned some of the bogs where Shoppers
World was built, I feel qualified to answer anecdotally.]
> The Pennsylvania Levittown, which is about as far away from
> Philadelphia City Hall as Framingham is from Boston Common, is
> Shoppers World's contemporary, roughly. That would suggest to me
> that some folks were already contemplating living in F'ham and
> working in Boston by the 1960s.
>
> Or was there something comparable to the USS Fairless Works
> already in the area? (This steel mill is not too far from
> Levittown.)
Nothing of any lasting signifigance at the time unless you used to
like Carling Black Label beer.
In the 50s and 60s, even after the Pike opened, Newton and
Dorchester were the suburbs. Anything outside of where 128 is today
wasn't really even part of Boston. Like I said things change.
mass...@my-deja.com
winst...@aol.com (Winston969) wrote:
>
> I dont see the point of I-290 between Worcester and I-
495/Marlborough. I think
> that this portion of highway should be dismantled and I-395 extended
all the
> way from the Conn border to the Mass 2 expressway along I-290 and I-
190.
Dismantled? Is there a precedent for the process of removing 10 miles
of 6-lane expressway? I am reminded of David Macaulay's
book "Unbuilding," in which the Empire State Building is taken down.
I actually see much more need for 290 all the way through than 190, as
a relief for northeast-bound traffic on 495/90. There's not a whole lot
of cars heading to Fitchburg and Leominster in comparison. I think you
can call 190 an "economic development incentive." Trying to grow
Worcester some suburbs.
>
> As to Boston's planned expressway system, I would only see a need for
a
> complete Mass 2 expressway between Greenfield/I-91 and Chelsea/US 1.
Where would you propose an affordable route for running this expressway
between Alewife and Chelsea?
Also an
> upgrade to a full expressway of US 1 from Revere to 128 would be
nice. Cant
> really see any more expressways needed though.
Moot point, since half this corridor is densely commercialized,
rendering the whole thing impossible. As if we can ever afford another
road in this state.
mass...@my-deja.com
Paul Anderson <paul.r....@compaq.com> wrote:
> In article <20001102190802...@ng-fr1.aol.com>,
> winst...@aol.com (Winston969) wrote:
>
> > Is the Mass 146 expressway going to go beyond the MassPike? I think
> > it should end at the Pike.
>
95
> in Providence north almost to the Mass Pike where it becomes a
divided
> highway with businesses and a signalled intersection in Sutton.
North
> of the Pike it is a local two-lane road, currently a bit messy
because
> of all the construction.
>
> Route 146 will be limited access between the Pike and I-290, so the
end
> result will be a limited access highway between Worcester and
Providence
> with the exception of a few miles near Sutton.
>
> Paul
I recall about 15 years ago an uncle of mine in Sutton talking about
this. He mentioned talk at the time of making it an interstate and
getting the feds to pick up the tab. Is this supposed to happen? I
mean, it does connect two large cities and fill a regional need. You'd
have to build a service road for the places in Sutton (including the
fabulous LaMyer's Auto Parts who have saved my life, so I don't want
them dislocated), but it seems silly to leave those few miles. I'm an
American, I don't want to have to stop at lights!
SPUI
<mass...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8tuv25$m66$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> I recall about 15 years ago an uncle of mine in Sutton talking about
> this. He mentioned talk at the time of making it an interstate and
> getting the feds to pick up the tab. Is this supposed to happen? I
> mean, it does connect two large cities and fill a regional need. You'd
> have to build a service road for the places in Sutton (including the
> fabulous LaMyer's Auto Parts who have saved my life, so I don't want
> them dislocated), but it seems silly to leave those few miles. I'm an
> American, I don't want to have to stop at lights!
There will be a light on 146 just south of I-290 though, so the interstate
would have to end at I-90.
--
Daniel Moraseski - from Orlando FL, originally from Manalapan NJ
Now attending MIT (Cambridge MA (near Boston))
http://spui.twu.net - FL NJ and Boston roads, and a list of SPUIs
Editor of http://roadlinks.cjb.net (highway cat of Open Directory Project)
mass...@my-deja.com
Is the alignment posted on line anywhere?
In article <3a031ffb$0$57...@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu>,
SPUI
<mass...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8tva2k$l0$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Where is that, Millbury St.?
>
> Is the alignment posted on line anywhere?
Not that I know of, but here is the info I got from the state transportation
library:
diamond at 122A/Tainter Hill Rd/McCracken Rd
trumpet at I-90/US 20 connector road
old 146 starts to be the frontage road at US 20, where the only connection
is from old 146 SB to US 20 WB
half diamond at Millbury St
half backwards half diamond at Providence St
light at Maxwell St
SB merge from I-290 SB direct connector
NB exit and SB left turn for I-290 NB (and Ward St/Ashmont Ave)
Winston969
>road in this state.
Well the Commonwealth badly needs a full expressway along US 44 from the RI
border to Plymouth via Taunton. And Springfield's highway system is a mess. But
besides a few things here and there, Mass generally IMO has an excellent
expressway system.
Winston Brownlow
MCT
construction project began. I'm guessing that this light is temporary
and will be removed when the project is done.
IIRC, Maxwell Street is just south of the I-290 junction (Brosnihan
Square), and it's basically a side street. I wonder why there will be
a stoplight there? Through at least part of that stretch, I thought
that the existing Millbury Street was going to be eliminated because
there isn't enough room for the new highway and the surface street
between the Blackstone River/Providence & Worcester {ex-New Haven} RR
tracks on one side, and a steep hill on the other. This would
effectively break Millbury Street -- which is a pretty confusing street
to follow in the first place -- into two or three disconnected parts.
Maybe the stoplight will be there because one of these segments will
begin or end at this location?
SPUI
> There is also a stoplight at US 20 which has been added since the
> construction project began. I'm guessing that this light is temporary
> and will be removed when the project is done.
>
interchange with MA 146. There will be a light on US 20 though (and between
the connector ramp and the I-90 ramp).
> IIRC, Maxwell Street is just south of the I-290 junction (Brosnihan
> Square), and it's basically a side street. I wonder why there will be
> a stoplight there? Through at least part of that stretch, I thought
> that the existing Millbury Street was going to be eliminated because
> there isn't enough room for the new highway and the surface street
> between the Blackstone River/Providence & Worcester {ex-New Haven} RR
> tracks on one side, and a steep hill on the other. This would
> effectively break Millbury Street -- which is a pretty confusing street
> to follow in the first place -- into two or three disconnected parts.
> Maybe the stoplight will be there because one of these segments will
> begin or end at this location?
>
Millbury St will start at Perry Ave and cross Maxwell St. It will become
Ballard St, with the section on the other side of 146 dead ending AFAICT.
It appears Maxwell will be a major connector to MA 122A, maybe even getting
the number.
MCT
like this:
1940...22,000
1950...28,000
1960...44,000
1970...64,000
1980...65,000
1990...64,000
Framingham was a decent-sized place even before suburbanization set in
(it has a old, built-up downtown), but it obviously grew a lot bigger in
the years after World War II. I think the utlying parts of the town
were probably not too developed in, say, 1940.
There used to be a GM plant in Framingham. I'm not sure when it opened,
or how much it may have contributed to the town's postwar development.
MCT
limited access, although much has been done to upgrade the RI portion of
the road.
Right now, 146 in MA is limited access from the MA/RI border to a point
just south of Boston Road in Sutton. Much of this stretch was upgraded
from non-limited-access (or even non-divided) in the late 1970s and
early 1980s.
The stretch from Boston Road to just south of the MA 122A junction in
Millbury is divided but is not limited access, and is not being
upgraded. This stretch includes one stoplight (Boston Rd.) and numerous
streets and driveways running off of the highway.
Before the "little dig" began, the stretch from MA 122A to US 20 (just
south of the Worcester - Millbury border) was similar to the Boston
Road-122A stretch. This is being ugraded to full limited access. An
overpass is being built to connect Main Street (122A) wth McCracken
Road, and any homes and business along the highway are either being
razed or are getting their own frontage road. Side streets are either
being eliminated completely or will connect to a frontage road. An old,
dangerous interchange with US 20 is being completely rebuilt, with
access to the nearby Mass Pike.
The stretch of 146 between US 20 and I-290 (Brosnihan Square) in
Worcester is just city streets, first Millbury Street, then Ballard
Street, then Millbury Street again. For most of this stretch, 146 will
move to a new alignment and the existing street will remain.
Does anyoe know what will happen to 122A? It is currently multiplexed
with 146 between Millbury and the intersection of Providence Street in
Worcester. None of the signs in the area that have been put up since
the project started refer to 122A at all, and I'm not sure if there wil
be direct access from the new highway to Providence Street. Will 122A
be left with two dangling ends?
Paul Anderson
> Is the Mass 146 expressway going to go beyond the MassPike? I think
> it should end at the Pike.
End at the Pike which way? Currently, 146 is limited access from I-95
John F. Carr
Winston969 <winst...@aol.com> wrote:
>>> Years after Boston had
>>> cancelled much of its planned expressway network, Worcester was
>>> still building I-190 through the northern part of the city (early
>>> '80s).
>
>I dont see the point of I-290 between Worcester and I-495/Marlborough. I think
>that this portion of highway should be dismantled and I-395 extended all the
>way from the Conn border to the Mass 2 expressway along I-290 and I-190.
It gets enough traffic to justify its existence and should be extended
to route 128. Road capacity between 495, 128, 90, and 2 is inadequate
and getting worse. Widening these four peripheral roads would not
satisfy the existing demand for travel within this region.
>As to Boston's planned expressway system, I would only see a need for a
>complete Mass 2 expressway between Greenfield/I-91 and Chelsea/US 1. Also an
>upgrade to a full expressway of US 1 from Revere to 128 would be nice. Cant
>really see any more expressways needed though.
Route 3 from 128 to 16, route 16 from route 2 to I-93, and route 2
from Memorial Drive to Alewife (or similar alignments) need to be
four lane high speed roads if not full expressways.
mass...@my-deja.com
maggie...@webtv.net (MCT) wrote:
>Will 122A be left with two dangling ends?
Is this the end for Millbury St.? Will the road ever be done?
Tune in next year... same bat time... oh never mind. It was just such a
cliffhanger, I couldn't resist.
MCT
not part of MA 146, which terminates at I-290. Much (all?) of this
northerly section is one way northbound, IIRC. Millbury Street's
northern end is at Kelley Square.
At present, it is difficult to follow Millbury Street through the
Brosnihan Square area, which is where it meets I-290. The road which
serves as the onramp from 146 north to 290 east is apparently part of
Millbury Street, because the buildings along this stretch have "Millbury
Street" addresses. To follow Millbury Street as you are going up the
onramp, you need to bear left (as if you were going to loop around to
Quinsigamond Ave. and get on 290 west), go under 290, then take a right
turn immediately after you cross under 290. I have no idea what this
area looked like before 290 was built, but I'm guessing that Millbury
Street was easier to follow back then.
Further south, Millbury Street leaves 146, runs through "downtown"
Quisigamond Village, then rejoins 146 again (heading southbound, even
the route through the village can be hard to follow, if you don't know
enough to bear left at the Greenwood Street fork). The section of 146
between those two points is called Ballard Street. Many out of towners
aren't aware that Millbury Street ever breaks off. The reason for all
this confusion is that Millbury Street was the original road through
this area, and Ballard wasn't built until later, in order to bypass
Quinsigamond Village.
All in all a very confusing street...
Here's the plans that I've heard for changes to Millbury Street as a
result of the new 146 expressway:
The portion of Millbury Street between the city limits and Ballard
Street, and the route into Quinsig Village from the south, won't really
be changed. It will, however, be more or less a dead end at the south
end, with no access from 146. There will be an incomplete connection to
US 20 at that location. The new 146 expressway will cross under
Millbury Street near the site of the old U.S. Steel plant, and there wil
apparently be an interchange there.
Continuing northward, where McKeon Road currently runs into Millbury
Street, just before Millbury Street rejoins 146, Millbury Street will be
truncated. McKeon Road will be extended east over the new 146
expressway to the junction of Ballard and Vernon Streets, where Balllard
Street will also end. There will apparently be an interchange at McKeon
Road.
Between McKeon Road and Brosnihan Square, Millbury Street will either
disappear, or be reduced to a few short disconnected sections running
alongside the new 146. There just isn't enough room to build the new
highway and keep the existng street through this area. It looks like
some of the houses on the east side of the street may not be taken,
however, so the street may remain in places. I suspect that one such
section may extend a block of two north from the McKeon/Ballard
intersection, and someone else has mentioned that a section may survive
in the Perry/Maxwell area.
North of Brosnihan Square, the project shouldn't affect Millbury Street,
but it may sever any connection to whatever is left of the street south
of Brosnihan Square.
Ron Newman
to drive between the Mass Pike and Route 146, in all directions, without
stopping at a traffic light?
Ron Newman
smi...@pobox.upenn.edu (Exile on Market Street) wrote:
> > > 1) The Pike seems to have been intended as a long-distance route,
> > > not a commuter route.
> >
> > This was true but things change over time. In the 60s the concept
> > of living in Framingham/Natick and working in Boston was silly.
>
> Was it really that silly?
>
> ISTR that Shoppers World opened in 1955, and the nearby Natick Mall about a
> decade later.
There has been commuter rail service from Framingham and Natick to
Boston for as long as anyone can remember. It predates the MBTA era.
> Or was there something comparable to the USS Fairless Works already in the
> area? (This steel mill is not too far from Levittown.)
There was a large GM automobile plant in Framingham until about
10 years ago.
Sean The Great
>border to Plymouth via Taunton.
I believe they're in the process of building this, aren't they? (At least
through Middleborough.)
You also have to remember that US 44 runs right through downtown Plymouth, and
the historical NIMBYs aren't going to go for a highway coming too close to the
center.
-Sean
JuliaAlphaSlv
who wouldn't want a large motorway tearing apart an historic district. Imagine
a I-64 ripping through the center of Williamsburg, VA, or a US15 freeway
tearing through Gettysburg National Military Park. Would you call people who
would oppose such projects "NIMBYs"?
Anyway, the end of any US44 freeway should be at MA3.
Winston969
Definatley.
Winston Brownlow
Winston969
>
>
Through Taunton, it should swerve to the south a bit. Or perhaps a tunnel could
do the trick right through the centre Taunton. The US 44 does not go through
Raynham. To access Raynham, you have to take Mass 138 throught centre Taunton.
Winston Brownlow
Douglas Kerr
maggie...@webtv.net (MCT) wrote:
> Right now, in 2000, property is being condemned to build
> the new MA 146 expressway.
Will MA 146 being built to Interstate standards, or will it just be
another expressway? I was on MA/RI 146 back in February going between
Oswego and Providence and I felt that if 146 could be upgraded in both
R.I. and Mass., that it should be given Interstate designation (I-390 or
I-595 comes to mind).
mass...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <20001102191348...@ng-fr1.aol.com>,
> winst...@aol.com (Winston969) wrote:
>
> >
> > I dont see the point of I-290 between Worcester and I-
> 495/Marlborough. I think
> > that this portion of highway should be dismantled and I-395 extended
> all the
> > way from the Conn border to the Mass 2 expressway along I-290 and I-
> 190.
>
> Dismantled? Is there a precedent for the process of removing 10 miles
> of 6-lane expressway? I am reminded of David Macaulay's
> book "Unbuilding," in which the Empire State Building is taken down.
>
> I actually see much more need for 290 all the way through than 190, as
> a relief for northeast-bound traffic on 495/90. There's not a whole
lot
> of cars heading to Fitchburg and Leominster in comparison. I think you
> can call 190 an "economic development incentive." Trying to grow
> Worcester some suburbs.
Not for dismantling of freeways usually (I-895 in NY the ONLY exception
IMO), and dismantling a portion of I-290 would seem to bring more bad
than good. I-290 is a useful route between I-495 and I-90 for
commuters, truck transportation and vacationers, among others. I can't
say anything really about I-190 in MA as I don't know much about any
need or the average number of cars that travel on it each day.
--
=Douglas Kerr (dke...@oswego.edu)=
http://members.xoom.com/dougtone
a.k.a. Dougtone- AOL IM . ICQ#- 947029
"I never set out to be a businessman. I just wanted to have fun, bang
chicks
and do drugs." - OZZY OSBOURNE explains his carefully crafted career
plan.
SPUI
"Ron Newman" <rne...@thecia.net> wrote in message
news:rnewman-0411...@ppp39-140.thecia.net...
> When the Route 146 construction is all finished, will it be possible
> to drive between the Mass Pike and Route 146, in all directions, without
> stopping at a traffic light?
No - the Pike offramp will intersect the US 20/MA 146 connector at a light.