Pennsylvania RR Ft. Washington Branch
Stan Feldman
Life In Our Town
By George E. Beetham Jr.
Parts of this old Pennsy branch line are still carrying traffic, although it
is not railroad traffic.When the Fort Washington Expressway, Pa. Route 309,
was constructed in the mid-1950s, engineers used part of the abandoned Fort
Washington Branch for the expressway's route.
That the line even existed has been heavily obscured over decades of motor
traffic plying the route where Pennsy electrics, diesels, and steam engines
once traveled.
There is only one reminder along the auto route, and that is located right
where Willow Grove Ave. crosses Route 309 on a bridge.
That reminder is the old cut leading from the present-day Route 309 off into
the woods. The cut is visible from the southbound lane, but the safest way
to view it is from Willow Grove Ave. above.
The old railroad cut is filled with water and overgrown. A PECO Energy
power line uses the old rail route now.
The Fort Washington Branch left the Pennsylvania Railroad's Chestnut Hill
Branch about three-tenths of a mile beyond the Allen Lane Station, curving
north-northeastward above the Cresheim Creek Valley.
It crossed Germantown Ave. on a bridge, then ducked under the old Reading
Lines viaduct over the valley before ducking under Stenton Ave.
Just beyond Stenton Ave. lie Wyndmoor and Ivy Hill. A small complex of
industries straddles the line between Philadelphia and Montgomery County,
and industries there were served by the Pennsylvania.
From there, the line crossed Cheltenham Ave. at grade. A small quarry
operation along Waverly Rd. in neighboring Cheltenham Township lies next to
the line and may have been a customer.
From Cheltenham Ave., the line curved north and then northwest, following
the alignment now occupied by Route 309.
Near Fort Hill, Route 309 curves eastward today. The Fort Washington Branch
ran straight ahead, joining the Trenton Cutoff that the Pennsylvania built
to carry freight trains to Morrisville and the main line to New York,
bypassing congested city tracks.
On the other side of the Trenton Cutoff lies Fort Hill, which gave its name
to the rail junction.
At one time, Fort Washington Branch trains ran on to Trenton via the cutoff.
But most passenger trains ran westward on the cutoff to White Marsh, located
at the junction of Church Rd. and Bethlehem Pike.
The Fort Washington Branch carried both freight and passenger traffic as
late as 1950. How far the line extended at that date is unknown, but traffic
engineers had begun studies for the expressway by 1947.
What is know is that the portion of the line beyond Cheltenham Ave. was
abandoned first. The section from the Chestnut Hill Branch to Wyndmoor
apparently continued in use a while longer.
The Fort Washington Branch was electrified in 1924, about six years after
the Chestnut Hill Branch.
Whatever stations may have existed on the route are long gone.
Today the only evidence are the railroad grades (which can also be traced on
topographic maps) and the catenary towers that carried the electrical
wires - typical Pennsy towers - between Wynd-moor and the Chestnut Hill
Branch.
At Wyndmoor, various industrial sites have appropriated the right of way,
which now carries PECO lines.
Stenton Ave. now crosses the rail route on an earthen fill instead of a
bridge.
No trespassing signs warn away those who might want to walk the rail line.
In spots, water has ponded in cuts.
Besides the Willow Grove Ave. bridge, the old line can be glimpsed along Ivy
Hill Rd., which runs between Cheltenham and Stenton Aves., and along
Cresheim Valley Drive until the Fort Washington Branch joins the Chestnut
Hill branch just south of the Cresheim Valley viaduct.
Allen Lane Station housed the interlocking tower that controlled the Fort
Washington Branch. The station is located just off Allens Lane west of
Germantown Ave.
The station is a Victorian gingerbread affair, the smell of an electrical
railroad hanging in the air.
Platform canopies and the walkway over the tracks are all in need of at
least a coat of paint, and perhaps more serious restoration. But the station
survived where the branch did not.
From Allen Lane northward, stations serving the Fort Washington Branch and
their mileage from Suburban Station are:
Germantown Ave., 11.0; East Lane, 11.8; Asbestos (Wyndmoor), 12.1;
Hillcrest, 12.7; Laverock, 13.4; Sandy Hill, 13.8; Enfield, 14.3;
Sunnybrook, 15.6; Fort Hill, unknown; and White Marsh, 16.8.
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hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com
> Just beyond Stenton Ave. lie Wyndmoor and Ivy Hill. A small complex of
> industries straddles the line between Philadelphia and Montgomery County,
> and industries there were served by the Pennsylvania.
I don't know the current state of those industries, but they were
served by the line well into in the 1970s.
> The Fort Washington Branch carried both freight and passenger traffic as
> late as 1950. How far the line extended at that date is unknown, but traffic
> engineers had begun studies for the expressway by 1947.
Old Official Guides show only one passenger train.
One psgr source may have been the US Dept of Agriculture research
facility in Wyndmoor; where there was a station. They facility may
have also received coal from the railroad. It was common for
buildings near rail lines to have a siding where bulk coal was
delivered. The facility may have also received express shipments.
> What is know is that the portion of the line beyond Cheltenham Ave. was
> abandoned first. The section from the Chestnut Hill Branch to Wyndmoor
> apparently continued in use a while longer.
It was running in the mid 1970s.
> Besides the Willow Grove Ave. bridge, the old line can be glimpsed along Ivy
> Hill Rd., which runs between Cheltenham and Stenton Aves., and along
> Cresheim Valley Drive until the Fort Washington Branch joins the Chestnut
> Hill branch just south of the Cresheim Valley viaduct.
At Crehseim Valley Dr. and Germantown Ave is the Trolley Car Diner, an
excellent restaurant. They have a PCC trolley in the parking lot used
as an ice cream stand.
MF
:) Right there, Philly ends.
I used to drag race on Ivy Hill Rd when I was a kid. Once, not racing, took
a friend's 63 Plymouth from 0 to 130 in 15 or 16 seconds.
Ah, when life was pure and innocent.
Then, there was no place called Ivy Hill, except the Ivy Hill Cemetery and
Ivy Hill Esso. IMHO there still isn't, tho I see on a google map the most
NW corner of Philly wears the label. It's like sticking the label "bib" on
your left leg and pretending that's what it's called.
<hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote in message
news:c2802019-54f5-402e...@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com
> Then, there was no place called Ivy Hill, except the Ivy Hill Cemetery and
> Ivy Hill Esso. IMHO there still isn't, tho I see on a google map the most
> NW corner of Philly wears the label. It's like sticking the label "bib" on
> your left leg and pretending that's what it's called.
Neighborhood names are funny things. The boundaries are vague, and
some places are known by multiple names, or no name at all. Many
names became obsolete, shown only on ancient maps. Perhaps "Ivy Hill"
was used long ago but never caught on.
The Philadelphia segment up there never had an 'official' name. It
was often called "Mt. Airy", but the real Mt. Airy was actually around
Germantown Ave. I've heard that that section was originally called
"Mt. Airy Park" by developers, but over the time the Park got
dropped. On maps and in newspapers the name is "Cedarbrook" or
"Wadsworth" but most people never use them. Some people use "West Oak
Lane", but that tends to apply to areas closer to Ogontz Avenue and
Washington Lane.
MF
<hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote in message
news:b3311365-beed-4290...@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
On May 27, 12:30 am, "MF" <cheatsandl...@spammersbl0w.com> wrote:
> Then, there was no place called Ivy Hill, except the Ivy Hill Cemetery and
> Ivy Hill Esso. IMHO there still isn't, tho I see on a google map the most
> NW corner of Philly wears the label. It's like sticking the label "bib" on
> your left leg and pretending that's what it's called.
>>Neighborhood names are funny things. The boundaries are vague, and
>>some places are known by multiple names, or no name at all. Many
>> names became obsolete, shown only on ancient maps. Perhaps "Ivy >>Hill"
>> was used long ago but never caught on.
Ivy Hill as a neighborhood name is relatively new. It appears on a Google
map, not an old one. It has to be a recent invention of real estate
agents.
>>The Philadelphia segment up there never had an 'official' name. It
>>was often called "Mt. Airy", but the real Mt. Airy was actually around
>>Germantown Ave.
The segment up there was the real Mount Airy. I was born there, in the
real Mt. Airy, on Michener St. between Mt. Airy and Mt Pleasant Aves over 60
years ago.
Mt Airy Ave runs from Ivy Hill Road to Germantown Ave. The whole area was
Mt. Airy. The zip code for the whole schmear, including Chestnut Hill was
19119. Then the area from Thouron to Cheltenham Aves, Easton Rd. to Ivy
Hill Road began to develop - with a definite tendency to lower
middle--middle class. Started, roughly, around 1949-50.
About that time the folks in Chestnut Hill, even tonier then than now, began
feeling uncomfortable about sharing a zip code with the rabble, and the area
north and west of Stenton Ave was, against the wishes of the people who
lived there, given the zip of 19150. Not long after that, the area became
West Oak Lane.
West Oak Lane was, and should still be but for real estate agents, the area
between Washington Lane and Ivy Hill Road. But, actually, people in the
area below Upsal St. down to Washington Lane and including Ogontz Ave
called it Ogontz.
>>I've heard that that section was originally called
>>"Mt. Airy Park" by developers, but over the time the Park got
>>dropped.
>>On maps and in newspapers the name is "Cedarbrook" or
>>"Wadsworth" but most people never use them.
Originally, Mt. Airy. Then West Oak Lane. Easton Road was renamed
Wadsworth Avenue in the mid-late fifties, early sixties, can't recall
exactly, at the behest of the merchants who had opened stores on Easton Road
between Michener and Cheltenham Ave. Those stores served residents between
Cheltenham and maybe Woolston Aves, Mt. Pleasant Ave. and Ivy Hill Road.
Past Woolston there were stores on Stenton. Below Mt Pleasant, there were
stores on Vernon Rd. At that time there were no stores along Ivy Hill Road
but for a gas station. Behind which the cops almost caught me and a bunch
of guys drinking beer. We were done, the quarts emptied and disposed of,
and I was pulling out in a 55 Chevy with a 57 motor. We got out onto the
street and there were three cop cars stopped, searchlights pointed at the
gas station. I was about to punch it when one of the guys yelled "He's got a
gun!" And there he was, like in the (later) movies, standing in front of
the car pointing the gun at my windshield. I stopped the car. Luckily
life then was pure and innocent, :) and they let us go.
The names Wadsworth and Cedarbrook came considerably later, after the
neighborhood had declined and needed newer better sounding names and
needed to be differentiated from its history. What do I mean by decline?
In the seventies, a neighbor, across the street, murdered his wife. And
around ten PM, one summer night in the 70s, (I was in my 30s and gone from
the neighborhood) there was a bang in the street and a bullet came through
my parents' front door. Luckily, my parents were sitting down and the
bullet, on an up angle, went into the ceiling. It was random, the shooter
was never caught. And yet later, a few murders at Littleton's Diner, on
Cheltenham and Ogontz -- our late night hang out from the time I was 16 till
about 21.
>>Some people use "WestOak Lane", but that tends to apply to areas >>closer
>>to Ogontz Avenue and
>>Washington Lane.
That was a late development. Since I was gone when it happened, it's always
been a mystery to me how the area between Wash. La. and Ogontz got to be
called West Oak Lane. The people who lived in West Oak Lane didn't
particularly want the name when they got it; I wonder if the people who
lived there when it was lost wanted to lose it; and if the people living in
Ogontz wanted to get it. Desires aside, that's what happened.
hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com
> inline<hanco...@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote in message
> Ivy Hill as a neighborhood name is relatively new. It appears on a Google
> map, not an old one. It has to be a recent invention of real estate
> agents.
I didn't see the name on a 1943 map, but it is on a 1984 map. I have
never heard it in practice. The suburban areas were Wyndmoor and
Laverock and the city area was Mt. Airy.
> The segment up there was the real Mount Airy. I was born there, in the
> real Mt. Airy, on Michener St. between Mt. Airy and Mt Pleasant Aves over 60
> years ago.
>
> Mt Airy Ave runs from Ivy Hill Road to Germantown Ave. The whole area was
> Mt. Airy. The zip code for the whole schmear, including Chestnut Hill was
> 19119. Then the area from Thouron to Cheltenham Aves, Easton Rd. to Ivy
> Hill Road began to develop - with a definite tendency to lower
> middle--middle class. Started, roughly, around 1949-50.
Both the 1943 and 1984 PTC/SEPTA maps refer to Mt. Airy as being along
Germantown Avenue. The area closer to Cheltenham Ave was labeled on
a map as Cedarbrook. Some stores used that name.
The area was middle-middle class. Some row house blocks were austere,
but other blocks had nice twin houses which were relatively expensive
and also there were a few blocks with single houses.
The time frame varied. Some blocks were older, dating from about
1940, others were in the mid-1950s or even later.
The 1984 SEPTA map shows "West Mt. Airy" as near Greene Lane and Mt.
Pleasant Ave and "East Mt. Airy" as near Mt. Pleasant and Anderson
(near the Reading tracks). For these purposes I'll take the SEPTA map
over Google.
> About that time the folks in Chestnut Hill, even tonier then than now, began
> feeling uncomfortable about sharing a zip code with the rabble, and the area
> north and west of Stenton Ave was, against the wishes of the people who
> lived there, given the zip of 19150. Not long after that, the area became
> West Oak Lane.
At the time of change from 19 to 50, zip codes did not exist and zone
numbers were not as demographically significant as they are now. The
reason for the change was the opening of a new post office, Wadsworth
Br, which would serve the area. Basically, it outgrew 19.
> West Oak Lane was, and should still be but for real estate agents, the area
> between Washington Lane and Ivy Hill Road. But, actually, people in the
> area below Upsal St. down to Washington Lane and including Ogontz Ave
> called it Ogontz.
The Free Library says West Oak Lane dates from the 1920s real estate
developers and covers the area around Ogontz Ave. The 1943 map
confirms that.
> Originally, Mt. Airy. Then West Oak Lane. Easton Road was renamed
> Wadsworth Avenue in the mid-late fifties, early sixties, can't recall
> exactly, at the behest of the merchants who had opened stores on Easton Road
> between Michener and Cheltenham Ave.
There was a Wadsworth Ave existing in 1943.
> The names Wadsworth and Cedarbrook came considerably later, after the
> neighborhood had declined and needed newer better sounding names and
> needed to be differentiated from its history.
"Wadsworth" as a community name was not used. People in that sector
referred to it as Mt. Airy, though newspapers called it Cedarbrook.
People in that sector and toward Vernon Rd didn't use Cedarbrook
either. To residents, Cedarbrook was seen as suburban, such as the
country club across Cheltenham Ave and later the apt towers and
shopping mall.
No renaming occured after the neighborhood declined. The same names
used years ago are used today (see issues of the WOL Leader).
> was never caught. And yet later, a few murders at Littleton's Diner, on
> Cheltenham and Ogontz -- our late night hang out from the time I was 16 till
> about 21.
I understand Littleton's Diner has been removed.
> That was a late development. Since I was gone when it happened, it's always
> been a mystery to me how the area between Wash. La. and Ogontz got to be
> called West Oak Lane.
As mentioned, 1943 maps have it that way.
> The people who lived in West Oak Lane didn't
> particularly want the name when they got it; I wonder if the people who
> lived there when it was lost wanted to lose it; and if the people living in
> Ogontz wanted to get it. Desires aside, that's what happened.
West Oak Lane was a desirable name.
As mentioned, there are no hard boundaries to such community names.
Ogontz historically refers to a suburban neighborhood near what is
called Elkins park. There were several institutions named Ogontz.
MF
<hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com> wrote in message
news:f18b0cea-1b44-4ab8...@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Ivy Hill as a neighborhood name is relatively new. It appears on a Google
> map, not an old one. It has to be a recent invention of real estate
> agents.
>>I didn't see the name on a 1943 map, but it is on a 1984 map. I have
>>never heard it in practice. The suburban areas were Wyndmoor and
>>Laverock and the city area was Mt. Airy.
You may not have noticed that in the time span I was discussing, '84 is
recent.
> The segment up there was the real Mount Airy. I was born there, in the
> real Mt. Airy, on Michener St. between Mt. Airy and Mt Pleasant Aves over
> 60 years ago.
>
> Mt Airy Ave runs from Ivy Hill Road to Germantown Ave. The whole area was
> Mt. Airy. The zip code for the whole schmear, including Chestnut Hill was
> 19119. Then the area from Thouron to Cheltenham Aves, Easton Rd. to Ivy
> Hill Road began to develop - with a definite tendency to lower
> middle--middle class. Started, roughly, around 1949-50.
>>Both the 1943 and 1984 PTC/SEPTA maps refer to Mt. Airy as being >>along
>>Germantown Avenue. The area closer to Cheltenham Ave was labeled >>on a
>>map as Cedarbrook. Some stores used that name.
What map? The only Cedarbrook in the Philly area was Cedarbrook St., called
that in an effort to cash in on the aura of the Cedarbrook Country Club,
which was right across Cheltenham Ave in Cheltenham Twp., not in Philly.
Nobody ever called the area Cedarbrook until later, for the same reasons, an
effort to elevate the perceived quality of the area. By the time that was
done, the name had spread to and was taken from the Cedarbrook Mall, also in
Cheltenham. Incidentally, there was a Cedarbrook: it was a little
neighborhood in Cheltenham Twp on the other, suburban, side of the country
club.
>>The area was middle-middle class. Some row house blocks were >>austere,
>>but other blocks had nice twin houses which were relatively expensive
>>and also there were a few blocks with single houses.
>>The time frame varied. Some blocks were older, dating from about
>>1940, others were in the mid-1950s or even later.
Why are you trying to tell me what the houses are like? My friends and I
lived in those houses. The area then was lower-middle to middle class. It
sounds to me as if it still is. Look here
http://wadsworthave.com/waba.html for a little actual info, not was Septa
(Septa? An authority on anything?).
Do the problems the WABA site talks about sound like middle-middle class?
Not to me - and they those sorts of problems did not exist in the time frame
I discussed, hence the use of the word "decline." And here's a bit more
along those class lines (lower middle class no longer exists, I see, been
replaced by "moderate income") :
http://www.neighborhoodsnowphila.org/news/?id=1 . None of the discussions
in these links support middle-middle class. The second also has an twist on
the name as follows: "The cedarbrook community of East Mt. Airy." It's Mt.
Airy. All the rest, all the creation of unnecessary names, are to
demonstrate class differences in neighborhoods.
>>The 1984 SEPTA map shows "West Mt. Airy" as near Greene Lane and >>Mt.
>>Pleasant Ave and "East Mt. Airy" as near Mt. Pleasant and >>Anderson
>>(near the Reading tracks). For these purposes I'll take the
>> SEPTA map over Google.
You're not reading very closely. I was not discussing 1984. I was long
gone, and the neighborhood and the names associated with it had changed a
couple of times since the period I was discussing. What I told you, and it
stands, no matter what Septa says, is that the people who lived there called
it Mt. Airy. And, in fact, if you take a look here:
http://www.phillyblog.com/philly/germantown-mt-airy-chestnut-hill/52857-wadsworth-avenue.html
it seems as if they still do.
> About that time the folks in Chestnut Hill, even tonier then than now,
> began
> feeling uncomfortable about sharing a zip code with the rabble, and the
> area
> north and west of Stenton Ave was, against the wishes of the people who
> lived there, given the zip of 19150. Not long after that, the area became
> West Oak Lane.
>>At the time of change from 19 to 50, zip codes did not exist and zone
>>numbers were not as demographically significant as they are now. The
>>reason for the change was the opening of a new post office, Wadsworth
>>Br, which would serve the area. Basically, it outgrew 19.
Okay, wrong appelation, zip. And here's the wrong word on your part: Why do
you think those zone numbers were not "demographically" significant. I was
not talking about "demographics" I was talking about real and perceieved
economic status. Generally known as "class." Can you actually sit there
and think that there was a time back there in Truman/Eisenhower years when
class was not important to people?
> West Oak Lane was, and should still be but for real estate agents, the
> area
> between Washington Lane and Ivy Hill Road. But, actually, people in the
> area below Upsal St. down to Washington Lane and including Ogontz Ave
> called it Ogontz.
>>The Free Library says West Oak Lane dates from the 1920s real estate
>>developers and covers the area around Ogontz Ave. The 1943 map
>>confirms that.
If you look up the references in prose, you will find that it covered the
area from Washington Lane to Ivy Hill Road. If you talk to anyone who was
actually there, you will find that the area between roughly Upsal and Ivy
Hill Rd. was called Mt. Airy. The name West Oak Lane fell into disuse -
until revived later. The Wadsworth branch library was named for the street,
not the neighborhood. You are aware, I trust, that maps are not
necessarily co-equal with what is?
ry. Then West Oak Lane. Easton Road was renamed
> Wadsworth Avenue in the mid-late fifties, early sixties, can't recall
> exactly, at the behest of the merchants who had opened stores on Easton
> Road
> between Michener and Cheltenham Ave.
>>There was a Wadsworth Ave existing in 1943.
The one Southwest of Stenton Ave?
> The names Wadsworth and Cedarbrook came considerably later, after the
> neighborhood had declined and needed newer better sounding names and
> needed to be differentiated from its history.
>>Wadsworth" as a community name was not used. People in that sector
>>referred to it as Mt. Airy, though newspapers called it Cedarbrook.
>>People in that sector and toward Vernon Rd didn't use Cedarbrook
>>either. To residents, Cedarbrook was seen as suburban, such as the
>>country club across Cheltenham Ave and later the apt towers and
>>shopping mall.
That's what I said.
>>No renaming occured after the neighborhood declined. The same >>names
>>used years ago are used today (see issues of the WOL Leader).
It looks as if your years ago do not go all that far back.
> was never caught. And yet later, a few murders at Littleton's Diner, on
> Cheltenham and Ogontz -- our late night hang out from the time I was 16
> till
> about 21.
>> I understand Littleton's Diner has been removed.
Apparently torn down in 07, after having hit the skids bigtime. See here:
http://www.phillyblog.com/philly/germantown-mt-airy-chestnut-hill/40976-littletons-diner.html#post545158
Poster says it was a dump before it went. Too bad.
> That was a late development. Since I was gone when it happened, it's
> always
> been a mystery to me how the area between Wash. La. and Ogontz got to be
> called West Oak Lane.
>>As mentioned, 1943 maps have it that way.
Perhaps, but no one called it that. Microsoft says, authoritatively, that
the boot drive is called the system drive, but no one calls it that except
the people who don't know what it's name actually is, i.e., Microsoft.
> The people who lived in West Oak Lane didn't
> particularly want the name when they got it; I wonder if the people who
> lived there when it was lost wanted to lose it; and if the people living
> in
> Ogontz wanted to get it. Desires aside, that's what happened.
>>West Oak Lane was a desirable name.
No, it wasn't. Who told you that? Were you there? It was desirable to
then as now folks moving out of North Philadelphia, first to white people
moving out of North Philly, then to black people moving out of North Philly.
That is, to people leaving neighborhoods edging towards slum category.
>>As mentioned, there are no hard boundaries to such community names.
Sure enough. Here's a quote from a site that thinks Littleton's was in
Montgomery county:
Littleton's Diner
(215) 424-9040
Montgomery County
8001 Ogontz Ave
Philadelphia, PA 19150
>>Ogontz historically refers to a suburban neighborhood near what is
>>called Elkins park. There were several institutions named Ogontz.
Interesting. I've driven through, driven around, drank in and eaten in
Elkins Park maybe 300 times and have never seen it.
hanc...@bbs.cpcn.com
> What map? The only Cedarbrook in the Philly area was Cedarbrook St., called
> that in an effort to cash in on the aura of the Cedarbrook Country Club,
> which was right across Cheltenham Ave in Cheltenham Twp., not in Philly.
> Nobody ever called the area Cedarbrook until later, for the same reasons, an
> effort to elevate the perceived quality of the area. By the time that was
> done, the name had spread to and was taken from the Cedarbrook Mall, also in
> Cheltenham. Incidentally, there was a Cedarbrook: it was a little
> neighborhood in Cheltenham Twp on the other, suburban, side of the country
> club.
There was the Cedarbrook Pharmacy, on Vernon Road since the 1950s.
PTC maps referred to the area as Cedarbrook, as did side route signs
on Rt S bus. News article about events in the area sometimes used
Cedarbrook, sometimes Mt. Airy. I agree that in common practice no
one used the name in practice except when referring to the Chelt. Twp
community you mentioned, which had a Cedarbrook Jr. High in it.
> >>The area was middle-middle class. Some row house blocks were >>austere,
> >>but other blocks had nice twin houses which were relatively expensive
> >>and also there were a few blocks with single houses.
> >>The time frame varied. Some blocks were older, dating from about
> >>1940, others were in the mid-1950s or even later.
>
> Why are you trying to tell me what the houses are like? My friends and I
> lived in those houses. The area then was lower-middle to middle class. It
> sounds to me as if it still is. Look herehttp://wadsworthave.com/waba.html for a little actual info, not was Septa
> (Septa? An authority on anything?).
I too lived in the area and have many photographs of the area in the
1950s and it was more upscale than you describe. As I mentioned,
while some row houses were austere, there were also very nice twins
and singles in the neighborhood as well. Many of the earliest
residents in 1950 were professionals and business people. To this day
the twin and singles section (near Leeds Jr High/Middle School) look
very nice.
Similar types of houses were built near Cottman Ave in the northeast,
and that area was considered a notch below Mt. Airy; the houses were
cheaper even if physically the same. (I understand that in Wynnfield
similar houses cost more.)
PTC/SEPTA street maps were carefully done and I do consider them an
authority on city geography.
> Do the problems the WABA site talks about sound like middle-middle class?
I am not talking about today's neighborhood, sadly, parts of it has
some serious problems in decay and crime. It was very sad to drive by
the "Fruit Basket" store on Wadsworth and seeing the same sign it had
for years, only now terribly badly faded.
As neighborhoods go, Mt. Airy was actually relatively short-lived as
middle class. An early professional/business class came in when the
houses were new in 1946 but left around 1955 to better houses. The
next class was middle-middle from 1955 to about 1970-1975. Of course
there was variation, on my block we had a streetcar motorman next door
to a architect next to an electronics store owner. Many of the store
owners lived nearby.
Keeping this on railroad issues, the neighborhood was served by the Rt
6 streetcar which originally served Willow Grove Park but was cut back
in 1958 to Cheltenham Ave. Still it enabled many of us to ride a real
trolley car in revenue service. All buses led to Broad & Olney
subway, where we took the ancient Broad Street Subway to town. We
also used the Reading's Chestnut Hill branch and occassionally the
Pennsy's Chestnut Hill branch. Die-hard railfans rode the Rt 23
trolley from Chestnut Hill to South Phila.
> >>At the time of change from 19 to 50, zip codes did not exist and zone
> >>numbers were not as demographically significant as they are now. The
> >>reason for the change was the opening of a new post office, Wadsworth
> >>Br, which would serve the area. Basically, it outgrew 19.
>
> Okay, wrong appelation, zip. And here's the wrong word on your part: Why do
> you think those zone numbers were not "demographically" significant. I was
> not talking about "demographics" I was talking about real and perceieved
> economic status. Generally known as "class." Can you actually sit there
> and think that there was a time back there in Truman/Eisenhower years when
> class was not important to people?
Class was important to people, but the postal zone back then did not
mean as much as zip codes do today.
Actually, I think Chestnut Hill was zone 18, and the split had nothing
to do with Chestnut Hill.
Chestnut Hill was fussy about their telephone exchange, and upset when
Bell switched it from CH to 24-. Phila was the last Bell area to
switch to numbered exchanges.
> >> I understand Littleton's Diner has been removed.
>
> Apparently torn down in 07, after having hit the skids bigtime. See here:http://www.phillyblog.com/philly/germantown-mt-airy-chestnut-hill/409...
> Poster says it was a dump before it went. Too bad.
I ate there, I guess in the late 1990s, and it was ok. Of course I
read in the paper the week after I was there there was a shooting in
it.
My own block had three murders on it after we left. That was a
bummer.
> >>West Oak Lane was a desirable name.
>
> No, it wasn't. Who told you that? Were you there? It was desirable to
> then as now folks moving out of North Philadelphia, first to white people
> moving out of North Philly, then to black people moving out of North Philly.
> That is, to people leaving neighborhoods edging towards slum category.
Yes, I and my family were there. West Oak Lane was a desirable name
years ago. A number of houses were built there at the end of the
Depression before WW II started and they were very substantial.
Washington Lane was a very nice shopping district in 1950. There are
pictures showing very nice stores, very well kept houses.
>
> >>As mentioned, there are no hard boundaries to such community names.
>
> Sure enough. Here's a quote from a site that thinks Littleton's was in
> Montgomery county:
> Littleton's Diner
>
> (215) 424-9040
> Montgomery County
> 8001 Ogontz Ave
> Philadelphia, PA 19150
That's odd, since the listing says Philadelphia on it and 424
(HAncock4) is a Phila exchange.
> >>Ogontz historically refers to a suburban neighborhood near what is
> >>called Elkins park. There were several institutions named Ogontz.
>
> Interesting. I've driven through, driven around, drank in and eaten in
> Elkins Park maybe 300 times and have never seen it.
Ogontz Jr High, Ogontz fire company.