anyone have old Amtrak NEC schedules

55 views
Skip to first unread message

Dave

unread,
Jan 31, 2004, 12:49:32 PM1/31/04
to
I'm looking for any old Amtrak NEC schedules from the early 90's and
all of the 80's. Are they published anywhere on the web?

James Robinson

unread,
Jan 31, 2004, 6:54:09 PM1/31/04
to
Dave wrote:
>
> I'm looking for any old Amtrak NEC schedules from the early 90's and
> all of the 80's. Are they published anywhere on the web?

I have a few in that era. If you have a straightforward question, I
could probably look it up for you.

Dave

unread,
Feb 1, 2004, 8:35:28 AM2/1/04
to
James Robinson <was...@212.com> wrote in message news:<401C4030...@212.com>...


I'm curious of trip times on non-metroliners and metroliners between
WAS-PHL and PHL-NYP during peak and non-peak hours. And, what names
did those trains have that weren't metroliners (i.e. Regional)?

Gram

unread,
Feb 3, 2004, 7:10:49 AM2/3/04
to
"Dave" wrote;

I'm looking for any old Amtrak NEC schedules from the early 90's and all of

the 80's. Are they published anywhere on the web? I'm curious of trip times


on non-metroliners and metroliners between WAS-PHL and PHL-NYP during peak
and non-peak hours. And, what names did those trains have that weren't
metroliners (i.e. Regional)?

================
Here's a few names and numbers first. These are taken from the 1988/89
Washington-New York winter timetable.

12; Fast Mail; Washington - Boston and (412) Springfield.
19/20; Crescent; New York - New Orleans and vv.
40/41; Broadway Limited; NYC - Chicago and vv.
42/43; Valley Forge; NYC - Harrisburg and vv.
44; Big Apple; Harrisburg - NYC
45; Susquehanna; NYC - Harrisburg
46/47; Pennsylvanian; NYC - Pittsburgh and vv.
50/51; Cardinal; NYC- Washington -Chicago and vv.
66/67; Night Owl; Boston - Washington and vv. Also conveyed 866/867
'Executive Sleeper' NYC - Washington and vv.
81/82; Silver Star; NYC- Tampa and (91/92) Miami and vv.
85/86; The Virginian; NYC - Richmond and vv.
87/88; Silver Meteor; NYC - Tampa and (97/98) Miami and vv.
89/90; Palmetto; NYC - Savannah and vv.
94/95; Colonial; Newport News - Boston and (494/495) Springfield.
96; Tidewater; Newport News - NYC
135; Potomac; NYC - Washington
137/188; Embassy; NYC - Washington and vv.
138; Verrazano; Washington - NYC
140; Potomac; Washington - Springfield
141; Bankers; Springfield - Washington
143/148; Connecticut Yankee; Washington - Springfield and vv.
161; Patriot; Boston and - Washington.
167/179; Mount Vernon; Boston and (467/479) Springfield - Washington and vv.
168; Narragansett; Washington - Boston
169/176; Senator; Boston - Washington
170/173; Yankee Clipper; Washington - Boston and (470/473) Springfield
174; Minute Man; Washington - Boston
175; Minute Man; Boston and (475) Springfield - Washington
177/178; Merchants Limited; Boston and (477/478) Springfield - Washington
and vv.
180; The First State; Washington - NYC
181/186; Garden State Special; NYC - Washington and vv.
183; Independence; NYC - Washington
182/185; Congressional; Washington - NYC and vv.
187; Jeffersonian; NYC - Washington
197/198; Benjamin Franklin; Boston and (497/498) Springfield - Philadelphia
461; Nathan Hale; Springfield - Washington
642; Bankers; Washington - Springfield - Boston
647; Charter Oak; Boston - Springfield - Washington
671/674; Bay State; Boston - Springfield - Washington and vv.

There were also about 15 Metroliners running each way between NYC and
Washington on weekdays. The standard timings for the various segments were
as follows;

Metroliner;
-----------
NYC to Philadelphia; 70 to 76 minutes.
Philadelphia to Washington; 99 to 106 minutes.

Similar timings northbound. The average NYC - Washington Metroliner timing
was about 2 hours 55 minutes. The fastest train on the NEC was M280, the
06.50 Washington to NYC, which did the trip in 2 hrs 40 mins. with a single
stop to pick up at New Carrollton. The average speed was 84 mph between Was
and NYC. There were faster short segments such as Wilmington - Baltimore
with a standard timing of 43 minutes (avg. speed of 88mph).

The standard schedule looked like this;

New York Penn. 00.00
Newark Penn. 00.13u
Philadelphia 30th St. 01.11
Wilmington 01.31
Baltimore Penn. 02.14
New Carrollton 02.41s
Washington Union 02.55

Other trains.
------------
NYC to Philadelphia; 80 to 89 minutes.
Philadelphia to Washington; 113 to 119 minutes

The standard schedule looked like this;

New York Penn. 00.00
Newark Penn. 00.13u
Trenton 00.46u
Philadelphia 30th St. 01.17
Wilmington 01.39
Baltimore Penn. 02.25
BWI Airport 02.37
New Carrollton 02.56s
Washington Union 03.13

With both the Metroliners and the other services, there was very little
difference between peak and off-peak trains. The principal cause of the
different schedules was simply the different stopping patterns for each
train. There were some trains, like the Crescent, that took even longer; the
SB Crescent took 4hrs 5 mins.and NB a mammoth 4 hrs.27 mins.(A pitiful
avg.speed, for a line like this, of 51 mph!) How much of that was padding
for delays though?...... or did it really take that long?

Hope that helps,
G.


Dave

unread,
Feb 3, 2004, 3:08:19 PM2/3/04
to
It's interesting to see how creative they were with names for all the
trains that ran the NEC. Much more bland now. Regional. Acela.
Clocker.

It's sad to see that, with all the capital improvements of the past
decade, that trip times haven't changed much. A sub 50 minute
commuter from PHL-NYP would be a cash cow for monthly holders. It's
doable if the ave. speed was about 108. The same arguement could be
made for WIL-BAL runs, etc. People in Japan do it all the time on the
Shinkansen.

HAL

unread,
Feb 3, 2004, 6:50:49 PM2/3/04
to
In article <bvo35m$i0u$1...@news7.svr.pol.co.uk>, Gram
<g...@goawayspambots.freeserve.co.uk> wrote:

> There were some trains, like the Crescent, that took even longer; the
> SB Crescent took 4hrs 5 mins.and NB a mammoth 4 hrs.27 mins.(A pitiful
> avg.speed, for a line like this, of 51 mph!) How much of that was padding
> for delays though?...... or did it really take that long?

The top speed of the Crescent and other trains that went off the NEC
was 90 mph on the NEC back then. Also Metroliners had a 125 mph top
speed while the other NEC trains had a top speed of 115 mph. That
compares with today where both Metroliners and other conventional NEC
trains both have a top speed of 125 mph. Acela can go 135 mph between
NYP and WAS and those trains like the Crecsent that run off the NEC can
run a top speed of 110mph on the NEC.

Sancho Panza

unread,
Feb 4, 2004, 11:55:46 AM2/4/04
to

"HAL" <H...@hal.invalid> wrote in message
news:030220041850494235%H...@hal.invalid...

>Acela can go 135 mph between NYP and WAS

As has been made clear here many times, that figure is valid for an
extremely limited stretch. Implying otherwise is sheer puffery.


Merritt Mullen

unread,
Feb 5, 2004, 3:05:30 AM2/5/04
to
In article <bvr888$et6$1...@news.monmouth.com>,
"Sancho Panza" <otter...@xhotmail.com> wrote:

I think you are thinking of the short 150 mph stretch between Boston and
New York. Between New York and Washington, 135 mph is the standard top
speed for Acela and applies over many segments. The 135 mph limit is
certainly not "puffery" as Amtrak never even mentions it in its
advertising.

Merritt

Sancho Panza

unread,
Feb 5, 2004, 9:50:20 PM2/5/04
to

"Merritt Mullen" <mmull...@mchsi.com> wrote in message
news:mmullen8014-2D86...@netnews.comcast.net...

> The 135 mph limit is certainly not "puffery" as Amtrak never even
mentions it in its advertising.

Maybe not any more. But their public relations machine still keeps grinding
it out, as made clear by the public's continuing use of it.


Dave

unread,
Feb 6, 2004, 1:41:49 PM2/6/04
to
from PHL - NYP, it seems to be 135 from Trenton to New Brunswick, then
it slows a bit for the stretch to Newark.

What stretches of track along the WAS-NYP NEC are optimized for
135mph, and is there any work being done now to get them to handle
150mph? I realize there are funding issues for upgraded catenary,
signals, etc. to make this possible, but is any of that in the works
now, or waiting for that funding?


Merritt Mullen <mmull...@mchsi.com> wrote in message news:<mmullen8014-2D86...@netnews.comcast.net>...

Merritt Mullen

unread,
Feb 6, 2004, 2:27:45 PM2/6/04
to
In article <b45e1530.04020...@posting.google.com>,
phld...@yahoo.com (Dave) wrote:

> from PHL - NYP, it seems to be 135 from Trenton to New Brunswick, then
> it slows a bit for the stretch to Newark.
>
> What stretches of track along the WAS-NYP NEC are optimized for
> 135mph, and is there any work being done now to get them to handle
> 150mph? I realize there are funding issues for upgraded catenary,
> signals, etc. to make this possible, but is any of that in the works
> now, or waiting for that funding?

I can't tell you the details of where the 135 mph speed limit is in effect
(anyone out there know this?), but I can tell you that nothing is
currently being done to upgrade to 150 mph. That would take replacement
of the catenary (constant-tension catenary is needed) and the signal
system. There is simply no funding to do that.

By the way, in my opinion, if such work was done, it would be technically
and economically easy to make the top speed on the NYP-WAS line something
like 160 mph, rather than 150, as this line is much straighter than the
NYP-BOS line. It probably would not be a big issue to qualify the Acela
train sets for the higher speed (assuming all their other bugs can be
worked out).

Merritt

Reply all
Reply to author
Forward
0 new messages