Using Adobe Reader et al. to fill out IRS forms. How?
Bobby
A friend says she used to use Adobe Reader (the free version) to fill
out her taxes from pdf forms provided by the IRS.
She says a few years ago it stopped working. She and I would
appreciate any help you can give her on this.
Now they have a new Adobe Reader X , which Adobe says fills out
pdf forms where that is enabled by the author using Adobe Acrobat or
one other Adobe Product. It says that on one webpage but on another
it includes "or by a similar product".
A) Is that some clever way of saying, Adobe Reader won't usually fill
out a form, because too many people don't use Adobe products to write
the forms?
B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
C) If not, what free or low-cost Windows applications do allow one to
fill in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
What about state tax forms?
D) Is there a way to dl adobe reader 10, X, without AIR? AFAICT, she
has no use for AIR, but it will take up space and confuse things.
Here's a list of ten AIR-based apps, and neither she nor I have any
use for any of them:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-10297798-2.html
E) In order to make the IRS forms adobe-reader-fillable, would the
government have to buy more than one copy of Adobe Acrobat? I know
they have 100's, 100's?, of forms, and probably many are finalized
just in time for various deadlines, like so many months before the
year ends, or before April 15, but surely they wouldn't have to give
every form-writer a fully licensed Adobe Acrobat. Couldn't they have
someone who did nothing but open IRS forms in Adobe Acrobabt and
enable them to be Adobe-reader-fillable? And shouldn't Adobe give the
government a discount or a better deal of some sort anyhow? They are
doing as much as anyone to spread pdf around.
Plus it's just absurd to make them buy a license for everyone who
writes or modifies forms. It drags taxpayers away from Adobe Reader
and Adobe in general, and that is contrary to Adobe's interests.
--
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Seth
Bobby <bob234RE...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>Using Adobe Reader et al. to fill out IRS forms. How?
>
>A friend says she used to use Adobe Reader (the free version) to fill
>out her taxes from pdf forms provided by the IRS.
>
>She says a few years ago it stopped working. She and I would
>appreciate any help you can give her on this.
Does it still work with older forms from the IRS, or does it not now
work at all?
I just grabbed the current 1040 and it's quite fillable. I'm still
using Adobe Reader 9.
>Now they have a new Adobe Reader X , which Adobe says fills out
>pdf forms where that is enabled by the author using Adobe Acrobat or
>one other Adobe Product. It says that on one webpage but on another
>it includes "or by a similar product".
>
>A) Is that some clever way of saying, Adobe Reader won't usually fill
>out a form, because too many people don't use Adobe products to write
>the forms?
It's up to the creator to make a form fillable if he wants. He gets
to specify which fields can be filled, what fonts they use, etc. He
also gets to specify whether the filled-out form can be saved or only
printed.
>B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
>in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
9 does, at least for the latest 1040, because the IRS set the 1040 to
allow that.
>What about state tax forms?
It's up to the state whether the forms were created with the
appropriate fill-in permissions.
>E) In order to make the IRS forms adobe-reader-fillable, would the
>government have to buy more than one copy of Adobe Acrobat?
No, one copy will suffice if they have one person who can create forms
fast enough.
I have no idea what sort of deals Adobe and the various government may
have.
Seth
removep...@yahoo.com
> B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
> in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
Yes. I just saved http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040.pdf. Opened
it using 9.2 free. Filled in some fields, saved them, reopened
files. Works fine.
> C) If not, what free or low-cost Windows applications do allow one to
> fill in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
Search for pdf filling apps in download.com.
There are libraries to fill in form fields too.
> What about state tax forms?
Each is different.
Bobby
>In article <3pctg6hc3op4gdtp6...@4ax.com>,
>Bobby <bob234RE...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>>Using Adobe Reader et al. to fill out IRS forms. How?
>>
>>A friend says she used to use Adobe Reader (the free version) to fill
>>out her taxes from pdf forms provided by the IRS.
>>
>>She says a few years ago it stopped working. She and I would
>>appreciate any help you can give her on this.
>
>Does it still work with older forms from the IRS, or does it not now
>work at all?
I called her for more details. She said her version of Adobe Reader,
which was probably earlier than 9 about two years ago was still
working for earlier tax years, but didn't work for later years.
>
>I just grabbed the current 1040 and it's quite fillable. I'm still
>using Adobe Reader 9.
I've very curious, but it's too complicated now to figure out if she
made a mistake or if something changed, and if so, what, but I'll tell
her it's working now.
>
>>Now they have a new Adobe Reader X , which Adobe says fills out
>>pdf forms where that is enabled by the author using Adobe Acrobat or
>>one other Adobe Product. It says that on one webpage but on another
>>it includes "or by a similar product".
>>
>>A) Is that some clever way of saying, Adobe Reader won't usually fill
>>out a form, because too many people don't use Adobe products to write
>>the forms?
>
>It's up to the creator to make a form fillable if he wants. He gets
>to specify which fields can be filled, what fonts they use, etc. He
>also gets to specify whether the filled-out form can be saved or only
>printed.
>
>>B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
>>in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
>
>9 does, at least for the latest 1040, because the IRS set the 1040 to
>allow that.
Okay. I get that. I was only being suspicious and accusatory to them
when I thought they had effectively eliminated a good feature. But
even if that was true with some other version, it's back to working
now, I see, and that's good enough.
>>What about state tax forms?
>
>It's up to the state whether the forms were created with the
>appropriate fill-in permissions.
Sure. I thought maybe someone had heard, or knew about a state or two.
>>E) In order to make the IRS forms adobe-reader-fillable, would the
>>government have to buy more than one copy of Adobe Acrobat?
>
>No, one copy will suffice if they have one person who can create forms
>fast enough.
If the person could stand the boredom, I would think he could do a
form every 3 or 4 minutes, more or less. Maybe one coudl write a
macro to do it. :)
>I have no idea what sort of deals Adobe and the various government may
>have.
>
>Seth
Thanks a lot.
And thanks to Remove.
W
news:3ca37ac4-4f81-4d34...@z26g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Dec 20, 9:04 am, Bobby <bob234REMOVET...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>
> > B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
> > in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
>
> Yes. I just saved http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040.pdf. Opened
> it using 9.2 free. Filled in some fields, saved them, reopened
> files. Works fine.
>
> > C) If not, what free or low-cost Windows applications do allow one to
> > fill in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
>
> Search for pdf filling apps in download.com.
>
> There are libraries to fill in form fields too.
>
> > What about state tax forms?
>
> Each is different.
Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
Reader edition that is free?
Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
years:
1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
you cannot save it.
2) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Standard or higher, you can both
fill it out and save it.
There are many third party applications that are front ends to the "Reader"
version of Acrobat that trick it into saving forms. These typically cost
$49 or less.
--
W
Seth
W <persis...@spamarrest.com> wrote:
>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>you cannot save it.
Whether or not you can fill it out and/or save it depends on flags set
by the document's creator.
>2) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Standard or higher, you can both
>fill it out and save it.
Even if you have the top version, the creator can set a flag (and
password protection) to prevent saving filled-out forms.
Seth
W
news:iercfn$73e$1...@reader1.panix.com...
> In article <lsydndRqf4x8uYzQ...@giganews.com>,
> W <persis...@spamarrest.com> wrote:
>
> >1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out,
but
> >you cannot save it.
>
> Whether or not you can fill it out and/or save it depends on flags set
> by the document's creator.
I guess, but I have never found any form that will save the changed contents
using the Acrobat Reader product. I have found dozens of forms that will
not save in Reader but will save in Standard.
> >2) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Standard or higher, you can
both
> >fill it out and save it.
>
> Even if you have the top version, the creator can set a flag (and
> password protection) to prevent saving filled-out forms.
Good point. I believe some of the third party products that modify the
behavior of Reader ignore that flag.
--
W
removep...@yahoo.com
> > Yes. I just savedhttp://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040.pdf. Opened
> > it using 9.2 free. Filled in some fields, saved them, reopened
> > files. Works fine.
> Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
> Reader edition that is free?
I have the free edition. Can you save the file http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040.pdf?
Then open it using the standalone editor. Do Help -> About. What do
you get?
Bobby
wrote:
><removep...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:3ca37ac4-4f81-4d34...@z26g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>> On Dec 20, 9:04 am, Bobby <bob234REMOVET...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>>
>> > B) Do the free versions of Adobe *reader* 9 and 10 allow one to fill
>> > in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
>>
>> Yes. I just saved http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1040.pdf. Opened
>> it using 9.2 free. Filled in some fields, saved them, reopened
>> files. Works fine.
>>
>> > C) If not, what free or low-cost Windows applications do allow one to
>> > fill in IRS forms, save them, and print them?
>>
>> Search for pdf filling apps in download.com.
>>
>> There are libraries to fill in form fields too.
>>
>> > What about state tax forms?
>>
>> Each is different.
>
>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>Reader edition that is free?
>
>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
>years:
>
>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>you cannot save it.
I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
Yes, according to what I just read in the PDFill help file, I had it
backwards. I thought she said you coudln't fill out the form, but
what it say It says you can actually fill it out and print it, but you
can't save it locally!! I don't know where "non-locally" is, but most
of us want it in our own computer. And that's where she got messed
up. IIUC and ISRC one year she printed the forms, was in a hurry and
thought she had saved the forms, made photocopies, sent the forms in,
mislaid the photocopies, and until she finds the copies, she has no
record of her taxes for that year!
>2) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Standard or higher, you can both
>fill it out and save it.
>
>There are many third party applications that are front ends to the "Reader"
>version of Acrobat that trick it into saving forms. These typically cost
>$49 or less.
She says that the next year, she bought for 10 dollars an unrelated,
unconnected program that would edit, save, and print irs forms, but
then she migrated to XP and lost the registration number. Although I
installed it too, and my reg numbers are all in one place, and it's
not there, so maybe it didn't work that way. She remembered it cost
only 10 dollars but wanted to look for the reg number more before
paying again, and now it's 20 dollars anyhow! Here is the url.
http://www.pdfill.com/pdf_tools_free.html and so far it does work but
first converts pdf files to pfl files, which is okay of course if
everything works. I think you have to have Adobe Reader before you
can print the pfl files.
It also says, "if the PDF file is a non fill-in form, Adobe Reader has
no way of entering data on the form. The only solution to this up
until now was to dish out more than $500 to purchase the complete
Adobe Acrobat program in order to perform those tasks. But now with
PDFill PDF Editor you can do all these tasks at a fraction of the
cost. Furthermore, you can open PDF file, add commenting annotations
or draw shapes. The edited documents can then be saved directly back
to the original PDF file."
Elsewhere I've learned that an add-on to Open Office, I think it was,
will allow you to fill in and save fill-in forms, or maybe he said
forms, and I didn't think to ask about non-fill-in forms.
>--
>W
OTOH, it sure looks like this works with Adobe Reader 9 also, both
saving and printing, like both Seth and Remove said, so that would
mean I don't have to get Adobe Reader 10, and don't have to worry
about AIR yet.
I'm actually still pretty confused, but one of these two methods
should work for my friend and me.
Pico Rico
>>
>>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>>Reader edition that is free?
>>
>>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
>>years:
>>
>>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>>you cannot save it.
>
> I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
I think you are crazy. With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader 9.0.4,
fill in, and save the filled in form.
Not so with California forms. I think it costs the producer of the forms
more money in licensing fees to enable this feature, so California does not.
Mark Bole
>>>
>>> Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>>> Reader edition that is free?
>>>
>>> Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
>>> years:
>>>
>>> 1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>>> you cannot save it.
>>
>> I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
>
>
> I think you are crazy. With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader 9.0.4,
> fill in, and save the filled in form.
>
> Not so with California forms. I think it costs the producer of the forms
> more money in licensing fees to enable this feature, so California does not.
>
Here's what I know:
1. Many if not most of the California downloadable tax forms are
fillable and savable with free Adobe Reader, have been so for a number
of years.
2. Ditto for IRS forms.
3. There is no need to rush out and upgrade to Adobe X (10), in fact a
quick glimpse at Adobe user forums shows that, as is typical with new
versions, there are still bugs being worked out. I kept using Adobe 7
for several years after it was superseded with no problems.
4. Even if a PDF form is fillable but not savable, there is a fairly
easy workaround. As long as you can print it, you can use any number of
PDF print programs, such as free PDF Creator from
http://www.pdfforge.org, to generate a PDF file containing anything you
would normally send to the printer. So, fill out your non-savable form,
then save it by printing it to a PDF file.
-Mark Bole
Dan Lanciani
In article <ietbc9$sqf$1...@news.eternal-september.org>, Picon...@msn.net (Pico Rico) writes:
|
| >>
| >>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
| >>Reader edition that is free?
| >>
| >>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
| >>years:
| >>
| >>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
| >>you cannot save it.
| >
| > I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
|
|
| I think you are crazy. With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader 9.0.4,
| fill in, and save the filled in form.
FWIW with Reader 6 (I believe the last version that will run on my desktop
system) I can fill in the 1040 form but it pops up a box telling me that I
need one of the non-free versions to save. Perhaps the ability for the
content creator to pay the license fee to allow saving is newer than Reader
6 and thus not recognized?
Dumb question: does 1040 have to be printed in color or is that just
decorative?
Dan Lanciani
ddl@danlan.*com
Arthur Kamlet
>
>In article <ietbc9$sqf$1...@news.eternal-september.org>, Picon...@msn.net
>(Pico Rico) writes:
>|
>| >>
>| >>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>| >>Reader edition that is free?
>| >>
>| >>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
>| >>years:
>| >>
>| >>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>| >>you cannot save it.
>| >
>| > I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
>|
>|
>| I think you are crazy. With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader 9.0.4,
>| fill in, and save the filled in form.
>
>FWIW with Reader 6 (I believe the last version that will run on my desktop
>system) I can fill in the 1040 form but it pops up a box telling me that I
>need one of the non-free versions to save. Perhaps the ability for the
>content creator to pay the license fee to allow saving is newer than Reader
>6 and thus not recognized?
>
>Dumb question: does 1040 have to be printed in color or is that just
>decorative?
Black & white 1040s work just fine.
--
ArtKamlet at a o l dot c o m Columbus OH K2PZH
Pico Rico
"Mark Bole" <ma...@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:ieticd$5eo$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> On 2010/12/22 09:29, Pico Rico wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just
>>>> the
>>>> Reader edition that is free?
>>>>
>>>> Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last
>>>> few
>>>> years:
>>>>
>>>> 1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out,
>>>> but
>>>> you cannot save it.
>>>
>>> I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
>>
>>
>> I think you are crazy. With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader
>> 9.0.4,
>> fill in, and save the filled in form.
>>
>> Not so with California forms. I think it costs the producer of the forms
>> more money in licensing fees to enable this feature, so California does
>> not.
>>
>
>
> Here's what I know:
>
> 1. Many if not most of the California downloadable tax forms are fillable
> and savable with free Adobe Reader, have been so for a number of years.
>>
Some are savable, some aren't.
removep...@yahoo.com
> >Dumb question: does 1040 have to be printed in color or is that just
> >decorative?
>
> Black & white 1040s work just fine.
I did black and white and double sided for my own return once.
Bobby
wrote:
>
>>>
>>>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>>>Reader edition that is free?
>>>
>>>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last few
>>>years:
>>>
>>>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out, but
>>>you cannot save it.
>>
>> I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
>
>
>I think you are crazy.
Then you weren't reading carefully. :) I never said it didnt' work
with this year's forms, but there were a few years in the 80's or 90's
or maybe the 2000's where you couldn't do what you say below. Even
though it had worked in earlier years.
>With IRS forms, I can open using Adobe Reader 9.0.4,
>fill in, and save the filled in form.
>
>Not so with California forms. I think it costs the producer of the forms
>more money in licensing fees to enable this feature, so California does not.
Maybe thats' why the IRS didn't enable it for those years.
BTW, Mark and others, I've found that the Find ommand doesn't work
with Adobe nine. I haven't had reason to find anything on an IRS
form, but in an owners manual for something I own, I searched for
words and it found no instances, even though I was looking at two and
there were more. I checked and it wasn't set for anything special.
No case sensitive or whole words only, and it was a whole word anyhow.
Mark, I have to find myself some old version. When I upgraded, it
ruined the old version iirc.
Pico Rico
"Bobby" <bob234RE...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:0ur5h6lcsqeb4bqs6...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 22 Dec 2010 12:29:40 EST, "Pico Rico" <Picon...@msn.net>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>>>
>>>>Are you sure you don't have Adobe Acrobat Standard edition, not just the
>>>>Reader edition that is free?
>>>>
>>>>Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last
>>>>few
>>>>years:
>>>>
>>>>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out,
>>>>but
>>>>you cannot save it.
>>>
>>> I'm glad to see someone confirm that my friend and I are not crazy! :)
>>
>>
>>I think you are crazy.
>
> Then you weren't reading carefully. :) I never said it didnt' work
> with this year's forms, but there were a few years in the 80's or 90's
> or maybe the 2000's where you couldn't do what you say below. Even
> though it had worked in earlier years.
****Here is how it is supposed to work, and how it has worked for the last
few
>>>>years:
>>>>
>>>>1) If you open up a PDF form with Acrobat Reader, you can fill it out,
>>>>but
>>>>you cannot save it.****
For the last few years, you CAN save it.
rick++
> Using Adobe Reader et al. to fill out IRS forms. How?
There is somethiing similar called Free Fillable Forms from the IRS.
Its basically active versions of IRS forms on the web.
You type numbers in the blanks.
They have minimal internal arithmetic, i.e. adding lines when
specified.
They dont do the compilcated calculations like computer the tax table.
And they link to another form should a line call for it.
And it is automatically efileable.
The tax software packages provide more comprehensive and integrated
tax service.
And they do more calculations.
I just got fed up with the endless solicitations in Turbo Tax to buy
this or that new service
and switched to FFF.
But with FFF its possible to overlook a form. Or compute one of the
more compilcated
procedures incorrectly. And the tax info does not carry over from
year to year.