tractor tires filled with salt solution
Michael Binder
normal for the valve stems to corrode every few years? Is there
such a thing as corrosion-proof valve stems? Will my wheels
corrode prematurely also? Is there anything I can do to
prevent/delay corrosion of the wheels?
Thanks, in advance, for your responses.
Michael Binder / Department of Anatomy
Dartmouth Medical School / Hanover, NH 03755
Michael Binder
the net:
Use antifreeze instead of salt solution.
Walter Vose Jeffries
In article <2usad4$q...@dartvax.dartmouth.edu> (misc.rural),
Be aware that some antifreeze solutions are toxic. Apparently dogs and small
children are prone to drink them and can die from it. This from the warning label
on an antifreeze bottle.
Ricky Roberson
Jesus H. Christ! We're talking about putting it INSIDE a tractor tire here!
Were people born YESTERDAY or what?!?!?!?
Lightning Bolt
(Michael Binder) wrote:
> My tractor's rear tires are filled with salt solution. Is it
> normal for the valve stems to corrode every few years? Is there
> such a thing as corrosion-proof valve stems? Will my wheels
In the 50s when my dad was a distributor for the real / origional ROTO
TILLER ( a one lunger built in Sweeden & always yellow!) we used either
salt or machine tool cutting fluid ( oil soluible in water) for the tires.
Especiall plowing snow it was needed.Dick
Robert F. Enenkel
>In the 50s when my dad was a distributor for the real / origional ROTO
>TILLER ( a one lunger built in Sweeden & always yellow!) we used either
>salt or machine tool cutting fluid ( oil soluible in water) for the tires.
I can't imagine the oil being terribly good for the rubber.
Robert F. Enenkel
>Be aware that some antifreeze solutions are toxic. Apparently dogs and small
>children are prone to drink them and can die from it. This from the warning
>label on an antifreeze bottle.
Well, if your dog or child bites through the tractor's tire (or the radiator
hose, for that matter), and dies, I'm sure you'd have your choice of people
to sue: 1) the tire or hose manufacturer, 2) the antifreeze manufacturer,
3) the guy who posted the suggestion to use antifreeze... :-) :-) :-)
TOM WAGNER, Wizzard of old Audio/Visual Equipment........Nanaimo Campus
If you use conventional anti freeze don't ever get a flat in your garden...
Don't know about some of the new "pet friendly" solutions though.
--
____________ ____________ ____ _____
/_____ ____/ / _______ / / \ ,' /
/ / / / / / / /\ \ ,' ,'/ /
/ / / / / / / / \ \,' ,' / /
/ / / / / / / / \ ,' / /
/ / / /______/ / / / \,' / /
/__/ /___________/ /__/ /_/
_____________________________________________________
/____________________________________________________/
Proud owner of a dog, cat, bird, old Tractor and a British
Car "If Lucas Electric made guns wars wouldn't start"
Ricky Roberson
>In article <2usad4$q...@dartvax.dartmouth.edu>, Michael...@dartmouth.edu (Michael Binder) writes:
>> I've received a good solution via email, which I will share with
>> the net:
>> Use antifreeze instead of salt solution.
>
>If you use conventional anti freeze don't ever get a flat in your garden...
>
No, use the salt solution, and see what THAT does to your garden.
-R
bow...@eisner.decus.org
Don't forget the guy who sold you the hose/tire/'freeze...
and of course the guy who grew the trees the rubber was tapped from..
and probably also the carrier who supplies your 'net feed...
:-) :-) :-)
Back to the tires... Pardon this from "an ignorant city slicker who lives
outside the snow belt"... Why would you want to put anything in them other
than air?
Geoffrey Leach
>My tractor's rear tires are filled with salt solution. Is it
>normal for the valve stems to corrode every few years? Is there
>such a thing as corrosion-proof valve stems? Will my wheels
>corrode prematurely also? Is there anything I can do to
>prevent/delay corrosion of the wheels?
The preferred solution (as it were) is calcium chloride, not salt
(sodium chloride). I've seen specs for concentration, but can't
recall where. Check with the old-timers: where you are, there should be no
lack of them!
ANd for Pete's sake, don't use antifreeze. Not only is it toxic, but
animals seem to be attracted to it. In CA, there have been several
incidents of condors dying after they have injested it from roadside
(illegal) dumping.
--
Geoffrey Leach C/C++/X11/Motif/OpenLook Implementation
ge...@netcom.com Mountain Ranch Software
3351 Alma St., Suite 113
Palo Alto 94306
415-855-9788
Carol Miskiewicz - Orchards
solution? Salt will corrode just about any metal.
Mark Miskiewicz
Ken Latta
In article <1994Jun30.121518.3729@eisner>, <bow...@eisner.decus.org>
writes:
[ clip ]
> > Well, if your dog or child bites through the tractor's tire (or the
radiator
> > hose, for that matter), and dies, I'm sure you'd have your choice of
people
> > to sue: 1) the tire or hose manufacturer, 2) the antifreeze
manufacturer,
> > 3) the guy who posted the suggestion to use antifreeze... :-) :-) :-)
>
> Don't forget the guy who sold you the hose/tire/'freeze...
>
> and of course the guy who grew the trees the rubber was tapped from..
>
> and probably also the carrier who supplies your 'net feed...
>
> :-) :-) :-)
>
> Back to the tires... Pardon this from "an ignorant city slicker who
lives
> outside the snow belt"... Why would you want to put anything in them
other
> than air?
'cause air makes 'em lighter of course and that just ruins traction ;-)
This is of course a reasonable question. A liquid ballast increases the
weight of the tractor, which increases traction, and most usefully it
puts all the added weight on the driving wheels.
Returning to the original question, I recall hearing somewhere that a
solution of calcium carbonate (or something like that) is commonly used
for tire ballast. I don't know what the antifreezing properties of such
a solution would be. I'd suggest asking a tractor dealer or agricultural
tire dealer what they use.
Ken Latta
kla...@pkdla5.syntex.com
Walter Vose Jeffries
In article <2uucd8$p...@bigblue.oit.unc.edu> (misc.rural), rd...@med.unc.edu
> >Be aware that some antifreeze solutions are toxic. Apparently dogs and small
> >children are prone to drink them and can die from it. This from the warning
> >label on an antifreeze bottle.
> Were people born YESTERDAY or what?!?!?!?
Ricky, perhaps you were born yesterday but others of us have seen tires puncture
and valve stems leak. When either of those happen the liquid comes out and is _no
longer_ INSIDE the tire. It is then very accessable to children and dogs. Grow up
- provided you live that long...
Walter Vose Jeffries
> hose, for that matter), and dies, I'm sure you'd have your choice of people
> to sue
Hmmm... Preferable to just prevent the death to begin with. And they need not
bite through the tire. Tires get punctured, valve stems leak, etc...
Andrew Hulse
[...]
>
>This is of course a reasonable question. A liquid ballast increases the
>weight of the tractor, which increases traction, and most usefully it
>puts all the added weight on the driving wheels.
>
It also lowers your center of gravity, YMMV.
>Returning to the original question, I recall hearing somewhere that a
>solution of calcium carbonate (or something like that) is commonly used
>for tire ballast. I don't know what the antifreezing properties of such
>a solution would be. I'd suggest asking a tractor dealer or agricultural
>tire dealer what they use.
>
Actually, I believe the "traditional" solution (back home, anyway) was
calcium chloride. From chemistry, increasing the molality of a
solution (dissolving something in it) lowers the freezing point, so
you're tires don't blow out when the ice expands while you're clearing
snow... That's the theory behind anti-freeze, so you don't blow your
block out when Jack Frost cometh.
Way Back When people used to use alcohol as antifreeze -- how would
that do in the tires? I suppose it would vaporize on hot days, and
maybe explode...
--Andrew Hulse
hu...@ece.ucdavis.edu
Ricky Roberson
I *AM* grown up enough to be responsible for my own actions, whether it's
putting antifreeze in my tractor tires or feeding the stuff to an unwanted
wild dog pack. I can't help it if half the world consists of
irresponsible idiots who don't know how to do anything in a safe and
responsible manner. You people get on ONE subject and hound it to death,
as if it were the only toxic substance in the world. I'd love to see how
many things you people do that are probably MUCH worse than antifreeze
could ever be, and don't have a second thought about it. Get off it.
-R
John Byrnes
single malt Scotch. It won't freeze, won't corrode your tires or valve
stems, and if you ever puncture the tire... well in a very little while
you won't care! (And neither will your pets, children, neighbors, etc.)
John
P.S. An added advantage is that your inlaws will never figure out where
you hid the booze!
Charlie Johnston
> I *AM* grown up enough to be responsible for my own actions, whether it's
> putting antifreeze in my tractor tires or feeding the stuff to an unwanted
> wild dog pack. I can't help it if half the world consists of
> irresponsible idiots who don't know how to do anything in a safe and
> responsible manner. You people get on ONE subject and hound it to death,
> as if it were the only toxic substance in the world. I'd love to see how
> many things you people do that are probably MUCH worse than antifreeze
> could ever be, and don't have a second thought about it. Get off it.
> -R
Ricky,
Perhaps it has been a long week for you, its been hot and that tends to
make people easily annoyed. (Those terse and arrogant responses from the
old bald guy get everyone PO'd irregardless of the weather.)
However....
Most of the posts in this group are cordial and informative.
The thread is on solutions in tractor tires - whether or not we sprinkle
plutonium granules in schoolyards is not an issue.
Your point about salt in the garden is a good one - however salt
is not nearly as toxic as antifreeze.
The tractor dealer I called said they use a METHANOL-WATER solution.
Dontcha think you could lighten up a bit? Some folks here have already
labeled *me* as 'rude' (cheryl?) - we don't want them to think ALL Tar
Heels are so disagreeable, do we? (Maybe its the damned tobacco tax
thing....) ;->
...charlie
Hari Seldon
>
>In article <1994Jun30.121518.3729@eisner>, <bow...@eisner.decus.org>
>
>writes:
>
>[ clip ]
>
hmmmm when added to water does that not produce CO2?
calcium carbide + water = acetalyne not good for tractor tyres.
best verify your calcium componds prior to adding water.
bill 'can i really remember my chemistry' pociengel
so what is the wow wow wibble wobble wozzey woddle woo?
'so what's a flame but a polite message reduced to it's essence?'
lilb pleceoing 'I'm a little confused right now'
Stephen Goddard
: Is it
: normal for the valve stems to corrode every few years? Is there
: such a thing as corrosion-proof valve stems?
If there is a leak anywhere in the tube of your tire (filled with calcium
chloride solution) it will follow the path of least resistance and
ultimately make it out through the hole in your wheel where your valve stem
is. If you are getting a rusty valve stem you probably have a leak in the
inner tube somewhere (unless the vavle stem itself is leaking). It is
worth the pain and expense to fix since it won't be near as expensive as
a new wheel.
-- steve g.
Chris Tilton
|> >[ clip ]
|> >
|> >solution of calcium carbonate (or something like that) is commonly used
|>
|> hmmmm when added to water does that not produce CO2?
|>
|> calcium carbide + water = acetalyne not good for tractor tyres.
|>
|> best verify your calcium componds prior to adding water.
|>
|> bill 'can i really remember my chemistry' pociengel
|>
|>
the calcimite in order to patch the tube etc. They pump it back in when they are finished patching the tire. I don't know if this is a trade name or not.
It is very corrosive, if they spill any on the rim you can see surface
rust very quickly. So I would rinse it off quickly if any spills.
However, if its true that calcium carbide + H2O =acetylyne
that would add new meaning to the phrase: burning rubber...
--
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
J. Chris Tilton "Here's how to handle a mean dog -
Mead Data Central Keep saying, 'Nice Doggie, Nice
(Home of Lexis/Nexis) Doggie' until you get close
profs: jct3 enough to hit him with a big stick"
chr...@meaddata.com
ext. 6042 Will Rodgers
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Ricky Roberson
liberals of this country who continue to find fault in every aspect of
everyday life. Jeeeze, all the man wanted was an alternative to the
corrosive, caustic, rust-inducing calcium chloride solution in his tractor
tires. It's been used in tractor tires ever since rubber-tired tractors
were invented.
So all you people be sure to go out today and sell that slick, shiny car
of yours ... it has that "icky, noxious, toxic, poisionous antifreeze" in
it, and what on earth would happen if rear-end someone on the highway, and
that stuff leaks out onto the roadway? God forbid!
-R
Walter Vose Jeffries
In article <2v147t$j...@bigblue.oit.unc.edu> (misc.rural), rd...@med.unc.edu
> I *AM* grown up enough to be responsible for my own actions, whether it's
> putting antifreeze in my tractor tires or feeding the stuff to an unwanted
> wild dog pack
My Ricky, but you are being rather defensive. My original posting was simple
information for people who might not be aware of something:
>> >Be aware that some antifreeze solutions are toxic. Apparently dogs and small
>> >children are prone to drink them and can die from it. This from the warning
>> >label on an antifreeze bottle.
I was not telling anyone what to do or not do. Just providing some information.
Your strong defensive reaction is rather interesting...
In any case, I stand by the information. You know it. You can do what you want
with the information.
John De Armond
>Actually, I believe the "traditional" solution (back home, anyway) was
>calcium chloride.
True.
>From chemistry, increasing the molality of a
>solution (dissolving something in it) lowers the freezing point, so
>you're tires don't blow out when the ice expands while you're clearing
>snow... That's the theory behind anti-freeze, so you don't blow your
>block out when Jack Frost cometh.
Also true.
>Way Back When people used to use alcohol as antifreeze -- how would
>that do in the tires? I suppose it would vaporize on hot days, and
>maybe explode...
Would work and there's no danger of explosion. The major problem is
alcohol isn't as dense as water so you lose some of the advantage of
filling the tires. Another problem to look out for is the fact that
alcohol can have deletrious effects on some kinds of rubber. I'd
certainly want to consult my tire mfr before using alcohol. The major
problem with using anti-freeze - chemophobes notwithstanding - is that
it is expensive. Were it not for the expense, anti-freeze would be a
better choice than CaCl2. antifreeze is non- corrosive and is only
mildly toxic. More importantly, it will not hurt the soil if leaked
out. CaCl2 WILL spoil the soil where it leaks, at least for a couple of
years until it washes out. If you have the money for anti-freeze, you
can probably afford to add a little more money and use propylene
glycol instead. Works just as good for antifreeze but is non-toxic.
Indeed, it is an approved food additive.
John
--
John De Armond, WD4OQC, Marietta, GA j...@dixie.com
Performance Engineering Magazine. Email to me published at my sole discretion
"Freedom's dirty little secret is that you're on your own." Clarence Thomas
John De Armond
>Ricky,
>Perhaps it has been a long week for you, its been hot and that tends to
>make people easily annoyed. (Those terse and arrogant responses from the
>old bald guy get everyone PO'd irregardless of the weather.)
Guess it makes you use "words" that don't exist like "irregardless", huh?
> Most of the posts in this group are cordial and informative.
>The thread is on solutions in tractor tires - whether or not we sprinkle
>plutonium granules in schoolyards is not an issue.
True, but the chemophobes just had to jump in and sprinkle that word
"toxic" around. THEY made it the issue.
> Your point about salt in the garden is a good one - however salt
>is not nearly as toxic as antifreeze.
About the same, actually, since antifreeze is not toxic. True,
the metabolite in mammals (methanol) is but there is a not-so-subtle
difference between a toxin and something that gets metabolized
into something toxic. Subtlties such as the fact that it has no
effect on things that don't metabolize it. I'd personally MUCH
rather have antifreeze dumped in my garden than salt if I ever had
to make that choice.
> The tractor dealer I called said they use a METHANOL-WATER solution.
That's toxic! At least by chemophobe standards it is.
> Dontcha think you could lighten up a bit? Some folks here have already
>labeled *me* as 'rude' (cheryl?) - we don't want them to think ALL Tar
>Heels are so disagreeable, do we? (Maybe its the damned tobacco tax
>thing....) ;->
Maybe it's the fact that the phobophiles (those who love to fear things,
to coin a word) are ruining this country. I'm damn tired of it.
Meanwhile, around my place, the antifreeze goes on the ground or down
the sewer and the used motor oil goes on the fence row where it continues
to be an excellent weed killer just as it has for decades.
phol...@ocvaxa.cc.oberlin.edu
>Meanwhile, around my place, the antifreeze goes on the ground or down
>the sewer and the used motor oil goes on the fence row where it continues
>to be an excellent weed killer just as it has for decades.
>
>John
>
>--
>John De Armond, WD4OQC, Marietta, GA j...@dixie.com
>Performance Engineering Magazine. Email to me published at my sole discretion
>"Freedom's dirty little secret is that you're on your own." Clarence Thomas
about guarantee that you have a toxic dump on your property. What else do you
do, burn the old plastic containers that all this stuff comes in?
Geez, anti-freeze is TOXIC!!! Just ask any body who's favorite domestic
pet or wild critter has drank the stuff then suffered a horrible death
from renal shut-down (maybe you better read the Merck Veterinay Book
to get all the symptoms). And the used motor oil - why don't you just go
ahead and pour it straight into you well water or whatever water source
you happen to use, because that's what will happen to it - it just seeps
into that water source.
Enough toxic stuff and toxins are floating around the environment - one
does not have to DELIBERATELY had more to the noxious mess
And before I get flamed, yes I do live on a working farm.
Laurie
Charlie Johnston
>> john...@addor.med.unc.edu (Charlie Johnston) writes:
>>...irregardless of the weather.
> Guess it makes you use "words" that don't exist like "irregardless", huh?
Per Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary, page 640...
"ir-re-gard-less adv: regardless"
> ...since antifreeze is not toxic.
> Meanwhile, around my place, the antifreeze goes on the ground or down
> the sewer and the used motor oil goes on the fence row where it continues
> to be an excellent weed killer just as it has for decades.
> John
(same source)
"ig-nor-ant adj: destitute of knowledge or education; unaware, uninformed"
Perhaps you need a dictionary? Huh?
...charlie
Phil Andrews
>Subject: Re: tractor tires filled with salt solution
>Date: Mon, 04 Jul 94 05:28:38 GMT
...
>Were it not for the expense, anti-freeze would be a
>better choice than CaCl2. antifreeze is non- corrosive and is only
>mildly toxic.
I have calcium chloride in all of my rear tractor tyres, and I don't
believe it's cheaper than anti-freeze, The main advantage of calcium is
the reason you put something other than air in your tyres in the first
place; its weight. A calcium-water slurry can be much heavier than the
same volume of water (or water and anti-freeze, for that matter). I
don't have the tables handy, but depending on how much you're willing to
spend, you can increase the weight of your rear wheels significantly.
The alternative is steel tractor weights-also expensive, but weight of
one kind or another could save your life someday. Pulling a baler and
full bale wagon (as I did yesterday) requires as much traction as you
can arrange
Although the calcium is expensive, it can outlast several sets of tyres;
when the tractor tyre guy comes to install your new pair, he pumps the
slurry into a holding tank then back into the new tyres.
-Phil Andrews
David Papworth
<phol...@ocvaxa.cc.oberlin.edu> wrote:
>In article <-l97...@dixie.com>, j...@dixie.com (John De Armond) writes:
>>Meanwhile, around my place, the antifreeze goes on the ground or down
>
>pet or wild critter has drank the stuff then suffered a horrible death
Anti-freeze may be toxic, but it isn't all that toxic. (What's the LD50
for it, Lauren?) From (direct and unscientific) personal experience
I would guess that gasoline, Diesel fuel, and motor oil are way more toxic
than ethlyene glycol. Ask anyone who has inadvertantly tasted such
substances in the process of siphoning gasoline or fixing leaking
automobile heater cores.
The problem with ethylene glycol is not extreme toxicity, but rather its
sweet taste and lack of immediate toxicity. Since it tastes pretty good
(try it sometime) animals can and do ingest quite a bit of it. Since it
has to metabolize into methanol before being toxic, the normal body
mechanisms (such as refusing to drink something that tastes bad and/or
nasea/vomiting as the stomach rejects the substance) don't work to prevent
poisoning.
For a "real" environmental cause attached to ethlene glycol, consider
the following: All that it takes to nearly eliminate the poisoning hazard
of ethylene glycol anti-freeze is to add a bittering agent to it
(make it taste bad enough so that children/animals won't drink too much of
it). It would only add 5 or 10 cents per gallon to the production cost to
do this. Legislation/rule making requiring this was proposed a few years ago,
but defeated, in part due to lobbying by the various chemical companies
that make and productize car antifreeze.
Back to the tractor-tires thread: One significant reason for using
calcium chloride is that the resulting "solution" is heavier than water.
The stuff is usually mixed so that the result is a super-saturated slurry
rather than completely dissolved. As such, it is a least 20% heavier than
plain water, and that much better at providing weight and thus traction.
Robert F. Enenkel
>Back to the tractor-tires thread: One significant reason for using
>calcium chloride is that the resulting "solution" is heavier than water.
>The stuff is usually mixed so that the result is a super-saturated slurry
>rather than completely dissolved. As such, it is a least 20% heavier than
>plain water, and that much better at providing weight and thus traction.
I wonder if there's some way to fill your tires up with sand. That would
sure keep the rear end down. Maybe you could send it in mixed with water
or air or something? Robert Enenkel
artemis
Robert F. Enenkel <ene...@cs.toronto.edu> wrote:
>papw...@ichips.intel.com (David Papworth) writes:
>
>I wonder if there's some way to fill your tires up with sand. That would
>sure keep the rear end down. Maybe you could send it in mixed with water
>or air or something? Robert Enenkel
In very short order you'd have your tires fall off, sand is rather
abrasive. Of course, if you put all your pennies in there too you'd
have the added bonus of them being bright and shiny when your tire
fell off...
--
Anmar Mirza #Chief of Tranquility #Teach the children quietly, for some
EMT-D N9ISY #Base, Lawrence Co. IN #day sons and daughters will rise up and
Sawyer #Somewhere out on the #fight while we sit still. # IU doesn't
Networks Tech.#Mirza Ranch. DoD#1143 #pay me enough to speak for them.
tony j. podrasky
David Papworth <papw...@ichips.intel.com> wrote:
>In article <2v98b5$8...@news.cc.oberlin.edu>,
> <phol...@ocvaxa.cc.oberlin.edu> wrote:
>>
>>Geez, anti-freeze is TOXIC!!! Just ask any body who's favorite domestic
>>pet or wild critter has drank the stuff then suffered a horrible death
>
>Anti-freeze may be toxic, but it isn't all that toxic.
How quickly do you have to die for something to be classified as
"very" / "sorta" / "kinda" / "isn't all that" TOXIC?
o I have a blind Hawk and Phesant - thanx to anti-freeze.
o I lost a Great Heron to it.
o The Sierra Club lost one of their California Condors to it.
o R.P.C. people have lost alot of cats to it.
I'll quit now before I really get into sarcasm mode.
--
Tony J. Podrasky I have a fox fur coat: It's beautiful! - It's warm, it's
to...@convex.com soft, it's cuddly. If you stroke it - it gets playful
San Diego , Ca and nips at you. You see, it's being worn by the original
QSL? QRU? QRZ? owner - which is the way it should be. - tony j. podrasky
Ed Pierce
> I wonder if there's some way to fill your tires up with sand. That would
> sure keep the rear end down. Maybe you could send it in mixed with water
> or air or something? Robert Enenkel
After several frustrating months of dealing with flat tires on my garden
tractor (18 hp), I took the tires to a local tire distributor and had
them filled with polyurethane foam. The foam is injected as a warm
liquid and solidifies into a soft gel. It adds weight to the tires for
stability and traction.
Why so many flat tires, you ask?? Well, here in the Central Texas Hill
Country, the abundance of mesquite trees and prickly pear is a little
overwhelming. The thorns on a young mesquite sprout can reach an inch or
more and can penetrate most automobile tires, and they grow like weeds.
No runs, no drips, no flats.
__ ,--'
| o ~ ~ "I'd rather be ranchin'..." _ ___( /\|
L_|->____I_ ,;`( )_ \ ) ~
_/ \_| ///| // '--;
[L| O |______| \ |
...\___/ (o) ^ ^
--
David Papworth
tony j. podrasky <to...@convex.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Geez, anti-freeze is TOXIC!!! Just ask any body who's favorite domestic
>>>pet or wild critter has drank the stuff then suffered a horrible death
>>
>>Anti-freeze may be toxic, but it isn't all that toxic.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>How quickly do you have to die for something to be classified as
>"very" / "sorta" / "kinda" / "isn't all that" TOXIC?
>
> o I have a blind Hawk and Phesant - thanx to anti-freeze.
>
> o I lost a Great Heron to it.
>
> o The Sierra Club lost one of their California Condors to it.
>
> o R.P.C. people have lost alot of cats to it.
>
>I'll quit now before I really get into sarcasm mode.
>
Agreed: Antifreeze is POISONOUS and causes injures or kills
organisms that ingest enough of it. If it is sitting in a puddle
on the ground, animals will drink quite a bit of it because it
tastes good and it injures or kills them quickly and unpleasantly.
I agree that this is a bad problem, and I sympathize with your losses.
I do not agree that antifreeze is extremely TOXIC. I associate a TOXIC
substance as something that causes harm in small quantities.
Arsenic is toxic. Plutonium dust is toxic. Asbestos is toxic. PCBs are
toxic. Most organic solvents are toxic.
So far as I know, ethylene glycol does not accumulate
in the food chain. It does not cause genetic damage. It isn't
a carcinogen. It doesn't get absorbed through the skin.
It does not cause any physical harm at all in small
quantities. It isn't very likely to cause a problem if it seeps into
the water table, for example. Gasoline and motor oil are more "toxic" than
ethylene glycol. But these substances taste bad and pets don't drink
very much of them.
All of the animal poisoning problems could be fixed with the simple
addition of a bittering agent to make antifreeze taste bad. One lick
would convince kitty not to drink it, and kitty wouldn't be harmed by
the small amount.