can goats defend themselves?
Chuck7
I am thinking about acquiring a few goats for a farm in
Maryland. There aren't too many large predators on the
east coast (no mountain lions, grizzlies etc), I was wondering
if a male and a couple female goats could defend themselves from
foxes (would a fox attack a goat?), or a wandering dog. The farm
would be fenced in, but you never know.
dbessett
injured; your biggest danger would be from a pack of dogs. Even docile
family pets turn into different animals when they form a pack
>
>
tim
poster, I have about 3.5 acres in the middle of my woodlot that I would
like to keep clear with goats as natural brushcutters.
But I know nothing about the critters, before I invest much effort in
finding out, is it feasible to keep them out in a fenced field without
some type of shelter/barn. I'm in Oregon, we get about 40 inches of
rain each winter, but winter lows are normally in the 30s, with an
occassional 14-16 degree night.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
R Bishop
chu...@erols.com (Chuck7) wrote:
Nope, not at all. Goats are easy prey for dogs. You could put a
donkey in there with them. Or a herd guardian dog.
Sue
Official Secretary of OSGSL
Dogs think they're human
Cats think they're God
outd...@my-deja.com
I have friends just outside Olympia, WA. who keep goats. While they do
have a stable, it isn't heated. I think something along the lines of a
cattle shed (3 walls and a roof, just to keep them out of the wind)
might be feasible. What say you, goat keepers?
Patrick T.
dennis shea
Pyrenees dog. They are natural livesock guard dogs. If you can, buy one
young (3 mos) and let him grow up with the goats. They will bond and
protect whatever they are raised with.
dennis shea
denn...@swbell.net
R Bishop
>Not to butt in, but as a related issue, that also may help the original
>poster, I have about 3.5 acres in the middle of my woodlot that I would
>like to keep clear with goats as natural brushcutters.
>
>But I know nothing about the critters, before I invest much effort in
>finding out, is it feasible to keep them out in a fenced field without
>some type of shelter/barn. I'm in Oregon, we get about 40 inches of
>rain each winter, but winter lows are normally in the 30s, with an
>occassional 14-16 degree night.
>
You'll need some kind of shelter. Doesn't have to be fancy, just a three
sided shed facing away from the prevailing wind is fine.
You might check around and see if you have a neighbor who'd like to
pasture his goats on your land.
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
Sue
scr
>You wouldn't have any problems with foxes unless you had an animal sick or
>injured; your biggest danger would be from a pack of dogs.
Right. A pack of dogs will attack any accessible mammal.
scr
Jim
fences, but if you can get past that problem, a horned goat can do a job
on a dog, as our dog found out. We have pygmy goats. Cute critters.
Can't keep them in a fence, though. Those goats must be made of rebar!
Jim
Sean Mc Govern
dbessett <dbes...@fhcrc.org> wrote in message
news:01bf103d$41a5d620$a872...@DBESSETT.FHCRC.ORG...
> You wouldn't have any problems with foxes unless you had an animal sick or
> family pets turn into different animals when they form a pack
>
> >
old billy goat.he will defend himself against his owner as well.Take it from
one who was "pucked" by a goat.BTW keep them out of any herbage you dont
want removed,especially a garden.You wont have anything left by the
following day.!!!If U let them run wild,have fun trying to catch them,only
way then is to shoot them.I advise plenty of calibre,as they can take some
hits before they drop. Hope this helps Sean
--
"They say one learns from ones mistakes.I prefer to learn from the mistakes
of others" Otto Von Bismarck "
Keep on rocking in the Free World" ReM
Strider
Chuck7 wrote in message <37fbb4bc...@news.erols.com>...
>
>I am thinking about acquiring a few goats for a farm in
>Maryland. There aren't too many large predators on the
>east coast (no mountain lions, grizzlies etc), I was wondering
>if a male and a couple female goats could defend themselves from
>foxes (would a fox attack a goat?), or a wandering dog. The farm
>would be fenced in, but you never know.
>
>
adult. They are way too small to be a threat. Coyotes are another question,
though. He might give even a large Billy some problems.
Strider
CAVM
can defend himself against a dog but not more than one dog or coyote at a time
since their tactic is to confuse and wear out their prey.
Goats do not need much cover to be kept in a field but a simple roof and at
least one wall would be sufficient. They do not need heat.
What goats need is a very tight, tall fence. And, if kept in a small area, they
need an old tire or something to climb on. They get very nervous if they can
not climb a little.
Goats are browsers, similar to deer. They are not grazers like sheep or
cattle. They like to nibble here and there at a variety of feed.
Male goats can be agressive. Females (does) usually are not aggressive unless
with their young offspring.
The fences are the really big part of goat keeping.
Cornelius A. Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc
R Bishop
"Sean Mc Govern" <omegar...@esatbiz.com> wrote:
>
>dbessett <dbes...@fhcrc.org> wrote in message
>news:01bf103d$41a5d620$a872...@DBESSETT.FHCRC.ORG...
>> You wouldn't have any problems with foxes unless you had an animal sick or
>> injured; your biggest danger would be from a pack of dogs. Even docile
>> family pets turn into different animals when they form a pack
>>
>> >
>> Goats will defend themselves very well against dog attacks.Especially an
>old billy goat.he will defend himself against his owner as well.Take it from
>one who was "pucked" by a goat.BTW keep them out of any herbage you dont
>want removed,especially a garden.You wont have anything left by the
>following day.!!!If U let them run wild,have fun trying to catch them,only
>way then is to shoot them.I advise plenty of calibre,as they can take some
>hits before they drop. Hope this helps Sean
No goat can defend him/her self against dogs. You are totaly mistaken.
Dogs can easily destroy a goat, avoiding the horns.
Sue
>--
> "They say one learns from ones mistakes.I prefer to learn from the mistakes
>of others" Otto Von Bismarck "
>Keep on rocking in the Free World" ReM
>
>
Official Secretary of OSGSL
dlp
they should be able to answer this question.
Jerry
Patrick Creamer
have a good fence for them. You should use field fence, as high as you can
get (about 4 feet or so) and make sure there are no spaces between the
bottom of the fence and the ground. I have kept goats for 10 years and
initially lost a lot of them to stray dogs. I keep good fences and shoot
strays on sight.
Jim <w7...@blarg.net> wrote in message news:37FC1920...@blarg.net...
> Let them keep their horns. They can be a hassle with getting stuck in
> fences, but if you can get past that problem, a horned goat can do a job
> on a dog, as our dog found out. We have pygmy goats. Cute critters.
> Can't keep them in a fence, though. Those goats must be made of rebar!
> Jim
>
> Chuck7 wrote:
>
Nick Hull
> Let them keep their horns. They can be a hassle with getting stuck in
> fences, but if you can get past that problem, a horned goat can do a job
> on a dog, as our dog found out. We have pygmy goats. Cute critters.
> Can't keep them in a fence, though. Those goats must be made of rebar!
> Jim
>
Goats can also kick very well with their front feet, well enough to
disassemble a dog.
--
Committees of Correspondence Web page:
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/
- free men own guns, slaves don't
Canopy Co Tulsa OK
First he will cut you up real good with those sharp pointy front hooves, then
finish
you off with a head to head but that will crack you skull and drive you into
the
ground. And yes, he can run a few steps while on his hind legs.
As for a fox, he has no chance of a goat meal unless the goat is already dead.
Dog packs are another matter altogether.
They will detract the goat while one gets him from behind.
If you put a large wire spool or something else that the goat can climb up on,
he
will have a better chance. Put it in a corner so that it limits the directions
that he
can be attacked. They tend to get up on things like your car hood and hoove or
but anything that trys to climb up after him.
In article <37fbb4bc...@news.erols.com>, chu...@erols.com (Chuck7)
writes:
Victoria
fourth generation Pyrs that does a great job of predator control. Donkeys
and llamas are also quite effective guardians.
Goats, with or without horns, have no defense against predators. Their
defense mechanism is fright and flight and most dogs will instinctively
attack from the rear - the outcome is pretty obvious. Goats do not have a
lot of stamina or speed and can't run very far or very fast, and once down
(like deer) they just give up. Their skin is very thin (remember Cordovan
leather) and dogs can rip them to shreds in short order.
Goats do not tolerate wet and cold. They do not have heavy, water
resistant coats and they do not have body fat, they generate heat to keep
warm through the process of rumination (chewing cud) and if they can't get
food they get cold which makes them susceptible to disease.
If you expect a herd of goats to forage all year without any husbandry then
I expect you will end up with a herd of dead goats. Goats, like deer, are
browsers they reach high to eat trees and brush. This is mother natures
built in protection as they are also quite susceptible to worms which they
will ingest through grazing.
Check with goat breeders in your area, county extension agents, 4H or FFA
leaders can probably offer some good suggestions.
As Always, Victoria
Animalaura
bedding.
Otherwise, you get a goat with a massive topline skin problem
that can be akin to infections.
If you need more info on caprine care such as CAE, abcesses, etc.. Write
me.
--Animalaura
tim wrote:
> Not to butt in, but as a related issue, that also may help the original
> poster, I have about 3.5 acres in the middle of my woodlot that I would
> like to keep clear with goats as natural brushcutters.
>
> But I know nothing about the critters, before I invest much effort in
> finding out, is it feasible to keep them out in a fenced field without
> some type of shelter/barn. I'm in Oregon, we get about 40 inches of
> rain each winter, but winter lows are normally in the 30s, with an
> occassional 14-16 degree night.
>
Animalaura
becomes demonized when joined in with another stray dog because the "pack
instinct"
takes over. They go after the belly and flanks. Even a little dashed will
drain a goats
belly and udder with torn flesh.
Foxes can be a problem due to rabies. There is no known goat rabies vaccine
-and
no proof that if they were vaccinated, it would made the goats immune.
Stirred wrote:
> Chuck7 wrote in message <37fbb4bc...@news.erols.com>...
> >
> >I am thinking about acquiring a few goats for a farm in
> >Maryland. There aren't too many large predators on the
> >east coast (no mountain lions, grizzlies etc), I was wondering
> >if a male and a couple female goats could defend themselves from
> >foxes (would a fox attack a goat?), or a wandering dog. The farm
> >would be fenced in, but you never know.
> >
> >
dennis shea
dogs before i put a Great Pyreness in with them. Havent had any problems
since.
dennis shea
dennis shea
dogs.....
dennis
Jerry & Kathleen Crawford
Basically, ALL animals have a need for some type of shelter, food, and
care. Some are hardier than others and have different uses in the
landscape, but I really don't know of ANY animal that can just be dumped
onto a piece of land and ignored.
Ownership of animals brings a bit of responsibility with it.
I understand that you're probably trying to find the animal best suited
to clearing the farm of brush, and inquiring as to its general care, but I
thought that this should be said because it comes up so often.
Also, (here I go again!) just because the state says certain predators do
not exist in your area doesn't mean that they don't. 'Nuf said 'bout that.
If you put goats on the property and won't be there to watch them on a
regular basis, get a protection animal, as other posters have suggested.
But even they will need care, especially in east coast winters.
Good luck!
Kathleen
Sandy Haggard
> >
> >I am thinking about acquiring a few goats for a farm in
> >Maryland. There aren't too many large predators on the
> >east coast (no mountain lions, grizzlies etc), I was wondering
> >if a male and a couple female goats could defend themselves from
> >foxes (would a fox attack a goat?), or a wandering dog. The farm
> >would be fenced in, but you never know.
You can't just ignore them... but they are hardy animals that don't need
near as much care as a horse or a dog.
My goats were attacked by a large black dog of varying breeds. Although my
goats were injured, the dog died. The old Billy goat did not take to kindly
to the dogs advances toward his woman... didn't seem to tinder to him. My
Billy tore the dog to shreds. The females do not have the fight in them,
nor do MOST billies. But a good Billy will defend his blushing brides.
However, the very fight that makes him defend the herd will make it hard for
you as well. That Billy and I go round and round... he wants to HURT me.
Can't let the wife near him. He won't chase anyone, but get close to the
herd and he will take notice. Luckily I am faster and more dexterous than
he. Flopping him onto his back and rubbing his tummy seems to be to his
liking... but I end up smelling so musky that I have to hose down before the
wife lets me in the house.
The Haggard
Steve Spence
the milk taste funny. I'd prefer a good dog to protect my goats.
--
--
Steve Spence
Renewable Energy Pages
http://www.webconx.com
--
Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
news:zo8L3.19$dV6.65...@mick.cybertrails.com...
Richard Johnson
As a former owner of 2 fine Nubian's, I think that if you let them keep
their horns, and gave them room to get away, or as I did
keep my German Shepherd/Dobie mix with them they will be alright. (The dog
loved and protected those goats, and the goats
loved the dog.)
As to keeping the male, your choice, I had mine neutered. Full males use
their urine as a sexual attractor. The have this tendency to urinate on
their heads. Make's kinda hard to pet. (The female goats go for it
though!!)
I> Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
Steve Spence
--
--
Steve Spence
Renewable Energy Pages
http://www.webconx.com
--
Richard Johnson <ri...@remove.this.tairedd.com> wrote in message
news:37fd2...@news.pacifier.com...
Jack Nevill
mention quite easily, but they HATE rain. They will make a mad dash for the
shed at the first sign of rain. If the goats you are considering have horns,
be sure to use fencing that they can get their heads back through. (Regular
field fencing with 12" vertical stays works well.) Otherwise, you will spend
a lot of time getting them out of the fence.
This is some fact, but mostly
Just Jack Talking
tim wrote in message <7tgjlr$ie3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>Not to butt in, but as a related issue, that also may help the original
>poster, I have about 3.5 acres in the middle of my woodlot that I would
>like to keep clear with goats as natural brushcutters.
>
>But I know nothing about the critters, before I invest much effort in
>finding out, is it feasible to keep them out in a fenced field without
>some type of shelter/barn. I'm in Oregon, we get about 40 inches of
>rain each winter, but winter lows are normally in the 30s, with an
>occassional 14-16 degree night.
>
>
>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.
-----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==----------
http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!
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Homesteader
Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
news:zo8L3.19$dV6.65...@mick.cybertrails.com...
the
> wife lets me in the house.
>
> The Haggard
>
>
Speaking of which: Anyone got a good oder-killer to get the musk off your
hands? I've tried even dishwashing soap and scubbed to high heaven and can't
get the stuff off.
Ours is a pygmie BTW.
Homesteader
R Bishop
"Steve Spence" <steve....@home.com> wrote:
>if you are milking, you shouldn't let billy anywhere near the does. makes
>the milk taste funny. I'd prefer a good dog to protect my goats.
Depending on the breed (some smell worse than others) the odor can be mind-
melting. Most folks haven't encountered a billy goat in full 'bloom'.
You'll never be able to use your sinuses again, they will be burnt out.
Sue
>
>--
>--
>Steve Spence
>Renewable Energy Pages
>http://www.webconx.com
>
>--
>
>Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
>news:zo8L3.19$dV6.65...@mick.cybertrails.com...
>> > Chuck7 wrote in message <37fbb4bc...@news.erols.com>...
>> > >
>> > >I am thinking about acquiring a few goats for a farm in
>> > >Maryland. There aren't too many large predators on the
>> > >east coast (no mountain lions, grizzlies etc), I was wondering
>> > >if a male and a couple female goats could defend themselves from
>> > >foxes (would a fox attack a goat?), or a wandering dog. The farm
>> > >would be fenced in, but you never know.
>>
>> You can't just ignore them... but they are hardy animals that don't need
>> near as much care as a horse or a dog.
>>
>> My goats were attacked by a large black dog of varying breeds. Although
>my
>> goats were injured, the dog died. The old Billy goat did not take to
>kindly
>> to the dogs advances toward his woman... didn't seem to tinder to him. My
>> Billy tore the dog to shreds. The females do not have the fight in them,
>> nor do MOST billies. But a good Billy will defend his blushing brides.
>> However, the very fight that makes him defend the herd will make it hard
>for
>> you as well. That Billy and I go round and round... he wants to HURT me.
>> Can't let the wife near him. He won't chase anyone, but get close to the
>> herd and he will take notice. Luckily I am faster and more dexterous than
>> he. Flopping him onto his back and rubbing his tummy seems to be to his
>> liking... but I end up smelling so musky that I have to hose down before
>the
>> wife lets me in the house.
>>
>> The Haggard
>>
>>
>
>
Official Secretary of OSGSL
6...@prodigy.net
>Goats are great defensive animals in my experience with them. The male (buck)
>can defend himself against a dog but not more than one dog or coyote at a time
>since their tactic is to confuse and wear out their prey.
Yeah, they're really BAAAAAAD.
R Bishop
"Homesteader" <home...@ionet.net> wrote:
>
>Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
>news:zo8L3.19$dV6.65...@mick.cybertrails.com...
>> liking... but I end up smelling so musky that I have to hose down before
>the
>> wife lets me in the house.
>>
>> The Haggard
>>
>>
>
>Speaking of which: Anyone got a good oder-killer to get the musk off your
>hands? I've tried even dishwashing soap and scubbed to high heaven and can't
>get the stuff off.
> Ours is a pygmie BTW.
Try tomato juice. Sometimes an acid will cut the smell. But don't count on
it. Neuter the rascal.
>
>Homesteader
>
>
Sue
BinsMom1
>hands?
Presumably, goat milk soap is the best thing to remove buck goat odor.
Nellie
Christ--my all
Mac & Mic
sheep. They are nibblers and prefer to eat things above their head not not
the ground, although they will nibble clover etc. on the ground. They do
need shelter, and bedding and shots and vitamins and water. They need a lot
of care.
Mic
tim <tim...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:7tgjlr$ie3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Mac & Mic
etc. We keep a jug of white vinegar in the kitchen and it works very well.
Good luck.
Mic
Homesteader <home...@ionet.net> wrote in message
news:7tjn0s$psv$1...@ionews.ionet.net...
>
> Sandy Haggard <san...@cybertrails.com> wrote in message
> news:zo8L3.19$dV6.65...@mick.cybertrails.com...
> > liking... but I end up smelling so musky that I have to hose down before
> the
> > wife lets me in the house.
> >
> > The Haggard
> >
> >
>
> Speaking of which: Anyone got a good oder-killer to get the musk off your
> hands? I've tried even dishwashing soap and scubbed to high heaven and
can't
> get the stuff off.
> Ours is a pygmie BTW.
>
> Homesteader
Jerry & Kathleen Crawford
You could also try the hydrogen peroxide skunk deodorizer posted here
earlier. It works better than tomato juice or lemon juice for us.
Kathleen
Steve Spence
we put them in (it wasn't grass, it was brush, shrubs, and weeds). when the
field was stripped we fenced in another, and moved them. at night or in cold
weather, they stayed in the barn with fresh hay and Agway feed.
--
--
Steve Spence
Renewable Energy Pages
http://www.webconx.com
--
Mac & Mic <macm...@nospammail.davesworld.net> wrote in message
news:37fd9...@news5.newsfeeds.com...
> Goats are not brushcutters. You want sheep. Goats are related to deer, not
> sheep. They are nibblers and prefer to eat things above their head not not
> the ground, although they will nibble clover etc. on the ground. They do
> need shelter, and bedding and shots and vitamins and water. They need a
lot
> of care.
>
> Mic
> tim <tim...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> news:7tgjlr$ie3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > Not to butt in, but as a related issue, that also may help the original
> > poster, I have about 3.5 acres in the middle of my woodlot that I would
> > like to keep clear with goats as natural brushcutters.
> >
> > But I know nothing about the critters, before I invest much effort in
> > finding out, is it feasible to keep them out in a fenced field without
> > some type of shelter/barn. I'm in Oregon, we get about 40 inches of
> > rain each winter, but winter lows are normally in the 30s, with an
> > occassional 14-16 degree night.
> >
> >
> > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> > Before you buy.
>
>
>
>
Larry Caldwell
writes:
> Nope, not at all. Goats are easy prey for dogs. You could put a
> donkey in there with them. Or a herd guardian dog.
Unless you get an uncut buck. I had a buck once that killed two of the
neighbor dogs. He would jockey them around until they were in between
him and a hard place, then WHAM. Once they were stunned he would jump up
and down on them with his front feet until they were dead.
Of course, keeping a buck has some olfactory drawbacks.
-- Larry
R Bishop
lar...@teleport.com (Larry Caldwell) wrote:
SOME drawbacks? Yep. That's for sure.
>
>-- Larry
