Putting in gates on a hillside
Bernie Cosell
running a bunch of fencing. One thing I've never quite worked out a
satisfactory plan for is putting in gates when fence runs up a hill.
What should one do?
The most work, and probably the 'right' solution, is to dig a notch in
the hillside so that the fence can be level, but I'm nothing if not
lazy so I wonder about actually just putting the fence in along the
ground-line. It looks like you get a choice: if you put the hinge at
the downhill end, the gate will happily swing open and be a nuisance
to close. We have one such gate [it was supposed to be in level but
the hinge-post has pulled and now the thing is skewed]. The problem is
that if you slip in opening the gate it 'falls' open knocking over the
surprised sheep on the other side [not to mention giving the hinge-side
post and the hinges a REAL twist at the end of its swing].
What i was thinking of was trying one with the hinge at the _uphill_
side. It looks like it might be OK: I'll have to be a little careful to
put in some kind of stake or something to attach the gate to to hold
it open, but otherwise it seems workable. for those of you who've tried
this: *will* it work?
Are there any other tricks/tips/traps? Thanks
/Bernie\
--
Bernie Cosell cos...@world.std.com
Fantasy Farm Fibers, Pearisburg, VA (703) 921-2358
Jim Gurley
Assuming the hillside is 'smooth' (i.e. equally sloped in the gate area)
you just need to put the hinge at the top AND keep the post vertical. The
gate itself is a bit of a rhombus, and DOES need something to keep it open.
The last one I built had the hinge on the downhill side, and needed a
'stop' (short post remnant) to keep it from over-opening, but the latch was
all you needed to keep it closed. Of course, that was only a 15 degree
slope.
f_sp...@ccsvax.sfasu.edu
Is it a wire fence? Why not try the old rancher's (cheap) trick and make a
wire-and-pole panel that you just drag out of the way and lay on the ground
when you want the gate open. (I assume this is not a gate you'll want to open
several times a day.)
Cheers!
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James R. Speer Phone: 409 568 1478
Department of Psychology Fax: 409 568 2190
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malcolm roe
> satisfactory plan for is putting in gates when fence runs up a hill.
> What should one do?
What's important is to ensure that the hinges are vertical. It doesn't
matter if the gate itself slopes. A crude ASCII drawing (with an
exaggerated slope) follows:-
-------
/ -------
/ -------
/ -------
/ ------- |
/ Gate /-+|
------- ------- / |
------- ------- / | Gate post
Hill side ------- ------- / |
------- ------- /-----+|
------- ------- |
------- |
------- |
-------|
-------
+ marks the position of the hinges or, to be precise, the hinge pins.
The gate can be turned to any position and, since it neither rises nor
falls it will stay put. On a realistic slope the offset is only likely
to ba a few inches and can be achieved simply by appropriate positioning
of the hinges. If it's a steel gate you may need to weld in a spacer.
--
Malcolm Roe Phone : +44 442 230000 ext 4104
Crosfield Electronics Ltd Fax : +44 442 232301
Hemel Hempstead, Herts. HP2 7RH, UK E-mail : r...@crosfield.co.uk
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob McKay
>What's important is to ensure that the hinges are vertical. It doesn't
>matter if the gate itself slopes. A crude ASCII drawing (with an
>exaggerated slope) follows:-
[lovely piece of ASCII artwork deleted]
One point to add to this and a previous note is that the hinge post
MUST be on the downhill side - if you put it on the uphill side, the gate
won't open (I know, that's just common sense - trouble is, I've done an awful
lot of things in my time that LATER common sense told me wouldn't work)
Cheers
Bob McKay
--
Bob McKay Phone: +61 6 268 8169 fax: +61 6 268 8581
Dept. Computer Science Internet: r...@csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au
ADFA, Northcott Dve UUCP:...!uunet!munnari!csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au!rim
Campbell ACT 2600 AUSTRALIA ARPA: rim%csadfa.cs....@uunet.uu.net
Bernie Cosell
} > One thing I've never quite worked out a
} > satisfactory plan for is putting in gates when fence runs up a hill.
} > What should one do?
} What's important is to ensure that the hinges are vertical. It doesn't
} matter if the gate itself slopes. A crude ASCII drawing (with an
} exaggerated slope) follows ...
Got it... Thanks for the advice. I see clearly that if you amke
the gate a parallelogram, skewed to follow the ground, it'll all work
quite nicely. My only problem is that I wasn't planning to *make*
the gates: I was just going to go to the farm supply and pick up a
standard, metal 12' or 14' gate and hang it. Is there any similar
way to deal with the problemif you're using a store-bought gate?
On the other hand, I should dig around and check some of my
references and see just how hard it'd be to build a gate. I've
never done anything like that before [all of our other gates are
either the store-bought ones or spring gates [spring gates work
great on hillsides, but they're a *bitch* to open and close]]...
but how hard can it be? :-)
} ... If it's a steel gate you may need to weld in a spacer.
I don't understand this part. Here's my steel gate:
-------------------------
|-----------|-----------|H
|-----------|-----------|
|-----------|-----------|H
-------------------------
Where the 'H's are the two swing-eyes where the hinge pins will go.
Is the idea that you'd 'tilt' the gate by doing:
--|
--|H====H
--| ^
--|H \ welded-on 'extender'.
---
If this is the case, I have two questions:
1) would there be any lower-tech way to kludge up the extender besides
welding it? I can't weld worth squat [and I don't have any welding
equipment, although I've been thinking about getting some...]
2) Does this have to be a 'good' job? It looks to me like that
extender is going to take a LOT of stress and torque, so I bet
that however you do attach the extender, you have to do it _right_
or it'll fracture and break, no?
Thanks!
Jim Baranski
Got it... Thanks for the advice. I see clearly that if you amke
the gate a parallelogram, skewed to follow the ground, it'll all work
quite nicely. My only problem is that I wasn't planning to *make*
the gates: I was just going to go to the farm supply and pick up a
standard, metal 12' or 14' gate and hang it. Is there any similar
way to deal with the problemif you're using a store-bought gate?
The heavy duty gate hinges that I like the best are one part eye hook, and one
part right angle hook. It's easiest to get parts with long stems, and vary how
far they stick out from the gate and the post.
Jim Baranski
Dion Hollenbeck
Bernie> In article <16...@suns8.crosfield.co.uk>, malcolm roe (r...@crosfield.co.uk) wrote:
Bernie> } > One thing I've never quite worked out a
Bernie> } > satisfactory plan for is putting in gates when fence runs up a hill.
Bernie> } > What should one do?
Bernie> } What's important is to ensure that the hinges are vertical. It doesn't
Bernie> } matter if the gate itself slopes. A crude ASCII drawing (with an
Bernie> } exaggerated slope) follows ...
Bernie> Got it... Thanks for the advice. I see clearly that if you amke
Bernie> the gate a parallelogram, skewed to follow the ground, it'll all work
Bernie> quite nicely. My only problem is that I wasn't planning to *make*
Bernie> the gates: I was just going to go to the farm supply and pick up a
Bernie> standard, metal 12' or 14' gate and hang it. Is there any similar
Bernie> way to deal with the problemif you're using a store-bought gate?
Say that over the length of the gate, the slope drops 2 feet. The
gate is 4 feet high. On the downhill side, make your post with the
hinge pins in it be six feet tall with the hinge pins in the TOP four
feet. You can then just bolt on a triangular "skirt" to the bottom.
Your metal gate will be parallel to both uphill and downhill posts.
--
Dion Hollenbeck Email: hol...@megatek.com
Senior Software Engineer megatek!hol...@uunet.uu.net
Megatek Corporation, San Diego, California ucsd!megatek!hollen
Benjamin Ellsworth
Yes. I did it just last summer.
> Are there any other tricks/tips/traps?
The fence needs to be on the fall line (gradient?) of the slope, or
close to it. Don't hang a heavy gate--you're bound to get smacked by
it sometime.
I did it on a pretty gentle slope. I don't know if it is a very good
idea on a steep slope.
Good Luck!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Benjamin Ellsworth E-MAIL b...@smartstar.com
SmartStar Corp.
120 Cremona Dr. VOICE (805) 685-8000
Goleta, CA 93117 FAX (805) 562-1111
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
All possible disclaimers apply.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ronald Florence
I did it on a pretty gentle slope. I don't know if it is a very good
idea on a steep slope.
Commercial gates hung with the hinge pins vertical will work on a
slope, but I'd be cautious with sheep. A rectangular gate hung on a
hillside leaves a gap at the bottom, and it's difficult to fill the
gap on irregular land. The curiosity of lambs for places to crawl
through (any narrow space reminds them of a creep) is matched only by
their stupidity in not realizing they could crawl back. The chorus of
separated ewes and lambs will drive you nuts. Here, our guard donkey
Rosie stands guard if a lamb crawls under a gate; she brays until
someone comes.
Even if lambs don't crawl out, coyotes are wily. In late spring, when
the mother coyote has hungry kit, she will find the gap. We have
friends who fenced a seaside pasture right down into the water, only
to discover that coyotes can read the tide tables and swim.
If the gate isn't used too often, a stretch of woven wire fastened to
a pole that can be held to the next post with loops might be easier to
install and more secure than a rigid gate. To be really safe, put a
strand of barbed wire under the woven wire fencing to discourage
digging.
--
Ronald Florence
r...@mlfarm.com
malcolm roe
>Got it... Thanks for the advice. I see clearly that if you amke
>the gate a parallelogram, skewed to follow the ground, it'll all work
>quite nicely. My only problem is that I wasn't planning to *make*
>the gates: I was just going to go to the farm supply and pick up a
>standard, metal 12' or 14' gate and hang it. Is there any similar
>way to deal with the problemif you're using a store-bought gate?
No you havn't got it. The gate doesn't have to be a parallelogram.
It can be an ordinary rectangle. You will just have small triangular
gaps between the gate and the gate posts. Assume a 12' gate with a
2' fall on the slope (for example). The slope is asin(1/6). The
triangular gaps will have the same angle. What's the height of the
gate? - 4'? If so, the width of the triangular gaps is only 8".
This is unlikely to be a problem. I've never seen a horse, for example,
less than 8" wide! Also, you can make the gap at the opposite end to
the hinges disappear. Just put the post 8" closer. The bottom of
the gate will strike the post but so what? You want a stop for the
gate anyway.
>On the other hand, I should dig around and check some of my
>references and see just how hard it'd be to build a gate. I've
>never done anything like that before [all of our other gates are
>either the store-bought ones or spring gates [spring gates work
>great on hillsides, but they're a *bitch* to open and close]]...
>but how hard can it be? :-)
Yes you could make a gate, in which case make it a parallelogram
and it will be that much neater, but to do an effective job will
need some good woodworking. Gates take a lot of punishment.
>} ... If it's a steel gate you may need to weld in a spacer.
>
>I don't understand this part. Here's my steel gate:
>
> -------------------------
> |-----------|-----------|H
> |-----------|-----------|
> |-----------|-----------|H
> -------------------------
>Where the 'H's are the two swing-eyes where the hinge pins will go.
>Is the idea that you'd 'tilt' the gate by doing:
>
> --|
> --|H====H
> --| ^
> --|H \ welded-on 'extender'.
> ---
If you do it this way you'll have problems. Look at my original
drawing. The extender should be on the bottom hinge and the hinges
should be on the downhill post otherwise the gate will hit the ground
when you open it.
>If this is the case, I have two questions:
> 1) would there be any lower-tech way to kludge up the extender besides
> welding it? I can't weld worth squat [and I don't have any welding
> equipment, although I've been thinking about getting some...]
Around my way I could easily find a garage or blacksmith who would do
the job for a small amount of money. It would only take about 5 mins.
I'm sure it's possible to make a good non welded job but you would have
to be prepared to work with quite heavy pieces of steel, cutting and
drilling them. If you can't see what to do I suspect it's better not to
try.
> 2) Does this have to be a 'good' job? It looks to me like that
> extender is going to take a LOT of stress and torque, so I bet
> that however you do attach the extender, you have to do it _right_
> or it'll fracture and break, no?
Yes - it should be a strong job. Use a nice thick piece of steel bar
and make sure the welding penetrates properly.