Black Boy Lawn Statue
Mallrock
business. I chose a sixty year old stone residence which is great for
the purpose, except there is a statue about 3 feet tall or so of a
boy/male holding a lantern. I have seen these before, but never up
close. The face is black although there isn't any exaggerated ethnic
features. Even if the face is painted "white" it doesn't solve the
problem, since I know there was many of these things produced. It
registers as black even after painted white.
The welcome message I want is different than that and I expect to
place a gas light about where this now stands. With supporting
structure it probably weighs several hundred pounds since it is cast
iron.
Does anyone know the history of these kinds of lawn ornaments? A web
search as well as ebay turned up nothing close to this.
Not an effort to be politically correct here, I just see the thing as
an unnecessary piece to give the wrong impression. My decision is to,
depending on what I can learn of the history of these kinds of statues
in general, allow it to continue to exist or destroy it.
Anyone have any information?
Mallrock
Elaine Gallant
those black lawn statues.
Some people think the statues represent black serving boys or other slave
figures. The statues were originally depicted as the boys holding the reins
of a horse rather than a lantern or other items.
Furthermore, the statues are interpreted as the boys holding the reins of
their master's horse. This is not the case however.
These figures are actually jockeys. At the time of the statue's production,
horse racing in the south was sport well loved by every level of their
culture. The top tier jockeys were typically young black males.
A top jockey on a fast horse was a winning combination. In a culture with
only limited opportunities for blacks, it was considered very prestigious to
ascend the ranks and become a winning jockey.
The statues commemorate the horsemanship skills of this elite group of
riders.
"Mallrock" <mall...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:78caf9d0.01061...@posting.google.com...
JmG
>|Not an effort to be politically correct here, I just see the thing as
>|an unnecessary piece to give the wrong impression. My decision is to,
>|depending on what I can learn of the history of these kinds of statues
>|in general, allow it to continue to exist or destroy it.
Lawn Jockey.
They used to be very common back in the 50-60's and before the civil rights
thing. About ten years ago on a trip to Newfoundland I found that the further
north you went the more there were of them on people's front lawns and that
when you got off the ferry in Newfoundland they had black faces. Certainly not
an ethnic slur, more of a tradition, I'm sure.
J
wmbjk
PC or not, I'd get rid of it. What if your research leads you to believe that it
should be acceptable? Would you have a plaque made explaining your reasoning, so
that customers would be less likely to be offended? If it's too much of a chore
to remove it, how about sliding some sono tube over top (whack off the arms if
necessary), and fill that with cement. The resulting concrete pillar might make
a nice base for your gas light.
Wayne
Steve Cothran
Mallrock
>snip for brevity
> These figures are actually jockeys. At the time of the statue's production,
> horse racing in the south was sport well loved by every level of their
> culture. The top tier jockeys were typically young black males.
This makes perfect sense because the representation is of a lithe male
in riding pants/boots..jockey cap...
>
> A top jockey on a fast horse was a winning combination. In a culture with
> only limited opportunities for blacks, it was considered very prestigious to
> ascend the ranks and become a winning jockey.
>
> The statues commemorate the horsemanship skills of this elite group of
> riders.
>
Thanks for the information. Pending some additional research it is
possible this may live on in some different setting. There is nothing
in the statue's construction that is denigrating, except perhaps the
hand reaching out which could imply servitude. It is possible it
could live on in the landscaped garden part of the property, but not
at the front entry. This is the Exec/Buxiness Office and not an
ordinary retail kind of facility.
Mallrock
Tralrdr
about the impression they are going to make! Its an antique from another time
and place and I would be willing to bet there are several antique stores or
private buyers that would pay some good money for it. At least enough to
replace it with the lamp of your choice. For what its worth, I love these
things!
carrie n miller
Elaine Gallant
The statues make interesting conversation pieces. Many people got the wrong
idea about them. If it were mine, I'd keep it, being certain the colors on
the paint were correct.
If anyone said anything negative about it, they need to be educated. The
statues honor achievement.
"Mallrock" <mall...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:78caf9d0.0106...@posting.google.com...
Elaine Gallant
Ya, they could probably get a lot for it on e-bay.
"Tralrdr" <tra...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010617210734...@ng-cl1.aol.com...
LOU
Issac Murphy was considered one of the greatest jockies of all time.
There is a tribute to him at the Kentucky Horse Park in Lexington,
Kentucky.
These lawn statues are an honor, a tribute, and a loving memory to the
great Jockies of African American descent in the thoroughbred world.
That statue is nothing to be ashamed about, not to be shunned for
offending anyone, on the contrary it is acclamation to these Jockies!
My advice is to not take away their honor by hiding it or moving it to
another area, that is opposite of what the statue is intended for. We
have gone too far in this world of being "political correct",
"business correct" evidently when we worry about this.
Of course I realize you knew nothing of the background :) So I am not
condeming or chastizing you :)
But why not Educate instead of Eradicate? Why take away a great honor
to the African-American Jockies because people think it is prejudice,
when it is the opposite?
Leave it in front of your business and perhaps make a small sign based
on this honor as to what the real meaning of the Lawn Jockey is :)
If you like to see more on this, here it is at the Churchill Downs:
Website:
http://www.churchilldowns.com/kderby/history/african_americans/jockeys.html
LOU - Paintsville, Kentucky
Racing Is Fun At Queensland Racecourse
http://users.tiusa.net/kentucky/queenslandfront.htm
LOU
Lawn Jockey (Jocko) was an all- important anti-slavery symbols. Also
helpful in freeing the slaves on Underground Railway Network such as a
signal for the fleeing slaves. One such signal was if Jocko held a
lantern in his left hand, that was the code used to indicate a safe
house. There were other signals using cloth or flags with the lawn
jockey too to guide the slaves to freedom.
A little info on this is here but there is much more info available
also such as the lawn jockey started when George Washington made one
as a memorial to a beloved soldier in his troop.
http://www.blackvoices.com/feature/bhm_99/rr/alton.html
http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/2001-02-22/news2.html
http://www.kentuckyconnect.com/heraldleader/news/022298/t1free.shtml
OK, I've got excited enough for one month... hahaha I'll stop now :)
LOU - Paintsville, Kentucky
Wubba
Ya, they could probably get a lot for it on e-bay.
Maybe, but I sure wouldn't want to pay the shipping charges (it's cement!).
Wubba
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Gene
>
> On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:04:46 GMT, LOU wrote:
>
> >But why not Educate instead of Eradicate? Why take away a great honor
> >to the African-American Jockies because people think it is prejudice,
> >when it is the opposite?
>
> house, despite its long and noble history prior to 1930s Germany.
We're so worried about offending black people (and we really shouldn't
try to offend anyone), but yet it's still OK for sports teams to name
themselves after Native Americans? I don't really see the difference
here.
Main Entry: nig搽er
Pronunciation: 'ni-g&r
Function: noun
Etymology: alteration of earlier neger, from Middle French negre, from
Spanish or Portuguese negro, from negro black, from Latin niger
Date: 1700
1 usually offensive, see usage paragraph below : a black person
Main Entry: red新kin
Pronunciation: 'red-"skin
Function: noun
Date: 1699
usually offensive : AMERICAN INDIAN
Dave Hinz
: We're so worried about offending black people (and we really shouldn't
: try to offend anyone), but yet it's still OK for sports teams to name
: themselves after Native Americans? I don't really see the difference
: here.
Well, I've got a bunch of ancestors who are Norwegian, so I have chosen
to take offense at the Minnesota Vikings.
Then again, I live in Packer country, so the above is pretty much mandatory.
Dave
Gene
LOLOL. Cute :)
Then again, look at the differences in the definitions of some of the
different ethnic names used for sports teams and as insults. Can you
imagine a team called the San Antonio Spics or Galveston Greasers? how
about the Nashville Niggers? Yet most people don't understand what hte
fuss is about a team like the Washington Redskins.
I'm kind of curious what's going to happen at FSU now that Chief Billy
is no longer in charge of the Seminoles. If the new chief retracts
tribal permission for use of the name, will FSU respect their wishes and
change their mascotte?
Main Entry: nig搽er
Pronunciation: 'ni-g&r
Function: noun
Etymology: alteration of earlier neger, from Middle French negre, from
Spanish or Portuguese negro, from negro black, from Latin niger
Date: 1700
1 usually offensive, see usage paragraph below : a black person
2 usually offensive, see usage paragraph below : a member of any
dark-skinned race
Main Entry: red新kin
Pronunciation: 'red-"skin
Function: noun
Date: 1699
usually offensive : AMERICAN INDIAN
Main Entry: Vi搔ing
Pronunciation: 'vI-ki[ng]
Function: noun
Etymology: Old Norse vIkingr
Date: 1807
1 a : one of the pirate Norsemen plundering the coasts of Europe in the
8th to 10th centuries
LOU
I as a Jew would never ever want a swastika in, near or around my home
or place of business EVER!
But Blacks are seeking out and buying Lawn Jockey's because the statue
honor's them and they don't want this tribute to them to be lost.
So respectfully I disagree with the comparsion :)
LOU
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:10:23 -0500 (CDT), "B.B. Bean"
<bbb...@beancotton.com> wrote:
>On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:04:46 GMT, LOU wrote:
>
>>But why not Educate instead of Eradicate? Why take away a great honor
>>to the African-American Jockies because people think it is prejudice,
>>when it is the opposite?
>
>The same reason that you wouldn't put a swastika on the front of your
>house, despite its long and noble history prior to 1930s Germany.
>-
>B.B. Bean bbb...@beancotton.com
>Bean & Bean Cotton Co/Bean Farms http://www.beancotton.com
>Peach Orchard, MO
>
>
RSMEINER
offended a little to easy these days ?
Maybe a little thin skinned ?
Randy
>>We're so worried about offending black people (and we really shouldn't
>>try to offend anyone), but yet it's still OK for sports teams to name
>>themselves after Native Americans? I don't really see the difference
>>here.
>
>The crux of the matter is that a person with any class at all avoids
>offense wherever possible. The fact that someone else may offend
>doesn't excuse you from potentially offensive actions.
Elaine Gallant
"Wubba" <we...@SPAMFOOLERcountrytraditions.com> wrote in message
news:3b2e1bcf_3@newsfeeds...
>
> Ya, they could probably get a lot for it on e-bay.
>
> Maybe, but I sure wouldn't want to pay the shipping charges (it's
cement!).
> Wubba
Not really different from buying a car, piano, or classic 'fridge or stove.
Gene
> offended a little to easy these days ?
>
> Maybe a little thin skinned ?
Is it thin-skinned to find the word "nigger" offensive? Or the
equivalent for any other ethnic group? It's easy to stand back and say
they're thin-skinned, but perhaps it looks a little different when
you're one of the people being called whatever name it is.
RSMEINER
Those terms are generally meant as an insult.
I was just thinking of the sports teams, etc...
Take the the FSU Seminoles. Is that offensive ?
I would think more of an honor to be recognized. And I am
part Indian. I am about as mixed heritage as you can get.
And yes I have been on the receiving end of similer insults,
I used to ride a public bus. I was quite often refered to as
whitey, honky, etc.. I could have cared less. These terms
were tossed about by the teenagers on the bus. They tended
to call each other nigger, etc..
I guess I just don't get it.
Gene
> >try to offend anyone), but yet it's still OK for sports teams to name
> >themselves after Native Americans? I don't really see the difference
> >here.
>
> anyone be offended in the first place?
>
> Teams naturally want to name themselves after a
> (mean/effective/superior/whatever) mascot to say to the world that
> their team exhibits the same traits as the mascot. That's why the
> world is full of teams named Tigers, Wildcats, Colts, Patriots, etc.
>
> If some team full of big, fast, well-practiced football players wants
> to call themselves the PA Rednecks, why I'd be honored.
>
> Guess I'll never get the hang of this PC stuff, I'm just not smart
> enough to understand what the fuss is all about....
I think it has more to do with the names being used as insults in the
past. In a couple of my posts here, I showed that 'redskin" and the "N"
word had the exact same definition, only pointed at different groups.
What makes the two words so different except that it's OK to use 1 and
not the other for a sports team?
Besides, if a group of people does't take their name being used
playfully as an honor, who has the right to tell them that they're
wrong? Perhaps they don't see it the same way as you or I do, or don't
take having their name used lightly or for entertainment as such an
honor.
In case you're wondering, yes my background is Creek, and I somehow
doubt that my forefathers would have seen the white people naming their
sports teams after them and other wild animals as such an honor and
priviledge.
Mallrock
Sure...bing Appies we mostly understand the depiction of Appies and
the universal Hillbilly. About the only time I respond negatively to
a diverse matter is when the diverse person attempts to take advantage
of their diversity. As is stated in response to one of the other
thoughtful posts here, the statue will remain. It is perhaps
unfortunate that some (including me) know so little about black
accomplishment. Perhaps black history should start at a point prior
to 1960.
Mallrock
Gene
can hurt you? Would it be different if blacks were the majority and
truly did run the country and they referred to you (and me too) as
"those honkies what used to be so high and mighty....what happened Mr
Honky?...you're not in charge anymore" or named their teams after you?
My point was that it's easy for members of a majority to say that
members of a minority should be quiet and not complain about how the
majority uses their name, but does anyone ask or care about how the
people in question actually feel?
With the FSU Seminoles, they at least had the decency to get the tribe's
blessing to continue using their name, but it took a lot of pressure to
get htem to ask in the first place. Then again, Chief Billy would have
been stupid to refuse the request of a powerful state university system
regardless of how he felt. There is simply too much scholarship and job
money at stake for his people to do otherwise. As far as your Indian
heritage, do you practice any of it, or is it in name only? Do you study
the ways of your forefathers and try to understand them? Have you ever
been to a powwow as anything other than a visitor/spectator? There is a
big difference in attitudes between being of Indian descent and actually
studying and living as one, or even trying to maintian a sense of the
culture and it's past, just as there is a huge difficulty in trying to
understand the feelings of another culture or sub-culture unless you
understand that culture as a member rather than an outsider.
RSMEINER wrote:
>
> Nope, I find that and similer terms offensive as well.
> Those terms are generally meant as an insult.
> I was just thinking of the sports teams, etc...
Like the Washington Redskins?
RSMEINER
behavior.. Who is teaching them to act this way and why ?
I came from a family that believes that everyone is equal until
proven by them as otherwise. Not categories of people but
individuals. Equal until they prove themselves to be stupid.
Randy
Goedjn
> > offended a little to easy these days ?
Because there's money in it, and a chance to throw some weight around.
> > Maybe a little thin skinned ?
>
> Is it thin-skinned to find the word "nigger" offensive? Or the
> equivalent for any other ethnic group? It's easy to stand back and say
> they're thin-skinned, but perhaps it looks a little different when
> you're one of the people being called whatever name it is.
It doesn't bother me a bit. Call me "honky" any time you want.
>
Gene
>
> Actually I always wondered where they learned this type of
> behavior.. Who is teaching them to act this way and why ?
> I came from a family that believes that everyone is equal until
> proven by them as otherwise. Not categories of people but
> individuals. Equal until they prove themselves to be stupid.
>
> Randy
I too wonder the same thing, like, "Don't they have any respect for
themselves or others like them?". On the other hand, you have to ask
yourself, is it much different than a bunch of ol' redneck boys teasing
each other about who has the most cowshit between their toes, or who has
the ugliest trailer or least money or education? I can call my childhood
buddy a dumbass backwoods redneck and he'll come back with something
similar. We've swam in the same swimming holes, and worked side-by-side
in the watermelon, tobacco, and hayfields together long enough to know
that neither of us is better than the other. Do you think he'd take it
the same if the names came from a shiny-shoed lawyer or stockbroker?
It's usually OK for members of a group to poke fun at each other, even
when they're telling jokes involving the stereotypes of the group, just
don't let an outsider get caught doing it.
Gene
Of course it wouldn't bother you for me to call you a honky. I'm a honky
too :)
But it would sound a little different if someone like Louis Farrakhan
televised a speech urging all his brothers and sisters to rise up and
either kill all the honkies or ship their slave-tradin' butts back to
England.
Mallrock
> African-American jockeys won 13 out of the first 15 Kentucky Derbies.
>
> Issac Murphy was considered one of the greatest jockies of all time.
> There is a tribute to him at the Kentucky Horse Park in Lexington,
> Kentucky.
>
> These lawn statues are an honor, a tribute, and a loving memory to the
> great Jockies of African American descent in the thoroughbred world.
>
> That statue is nothing to be ashamed about, not to be shunned for
> offending anyone, on the contrary it is acclamation to these Jockies!
> My advice is to not take away their honor by hiding it or moving it to
> another area, that is opposite of what the statue is intended for. We
> have gone too far in this world of being "political correct",
> "business correct" evidently when we worry about this.
>
> Of course I realize you knew nothing of the background :) So I am not
> condeming or chastizing you :)
Thanks for your work in providing insight in this matter. The statue
will stay although in a slightly different and more prominent spot on
the grounds. I believe this is specific to one of the jockeys. I
will get a photo and compare.
Mallrock
LOU
>
>Thanks for your work in providing insight in this matter. The statue
>will stay although in a slightly different and more prominent spot on
>the grounds. I believe this is specific to one of the jockeys. I
>will get a photo and compare.
>
>Mallrock
>
Your welcome :) And I thank you for bringing up the subject.
I made a little web page on my site summing up the subject:
http://users.tiusa.net/kentucky/jocko.htm
Above is a direct link to the page so you won't have to go thru the
main Queensland Racecourse Link :)
Mallrock
> On 19 Jun 2001 14:49:08 -0700, mall...@hotmail.com (Mallrock) wrote:
>
> >
> >Thanks for your work in providing insight in this matter. The statue
> >will stay although in a slightly different and more prominent spot on
> >the grounds. I believe this is specific to one of the jockeys. I
> >will get a photo and compare.
> >
> >Mallrock
> >
>
> Your welcome :) And I thank you for bringing up the subject.
>
> I made a little web page on my site summing up the subject:
>
> http://users.tiusa.net/kentucky/jocko.htm
>
> Above is a direct link to the page so you won't have to go thru the
> main Queensland Racecourse Link :)
>
> LOU - Paintsville, Kentucky
>
>
The page is very well done.
I examined the statue yesterday and it is a virtual replica of the one
you show on your page. It has had too many coats of paint without
removing the old paint. In due course as the updating of this
property takes place, I will make some renovation to the piece. Among
that is to change the "shade" of the facial color. Presently it is
jet black and that is inappropriate. As an aside, it's illogical to
me that "blacks" refer to themselves as blacks, when most are brown.
My business is IT (hardware/software/service) related and when the
move is complete there will be web presence and "Jocko" likely will
have a some presence.
Mallrock
Raliduul Urchanii
What I heard. It's in memory of a black, who froze to death, while
holding a latern, runaway slaves could see, which pointed toward
area, where they would not be slaves.
"Mallrock" <mall...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:78caf9d0.01061...@posting.google.com...
>
> Does anyone know the history of these kinds of lawn ornaments? A web
> search as well as ebay turned up nothing close to this.
> Mallrock
Mike Marshall
>What I heard. It's in memory of a black, who froze to death, while
>holding a latern, runaway slaves could see, which pointed toward
>area, where they would not be slaves.
Where would that be?
-Mike
LOU
http://users.tiusa.net/kentucky/jocko.htm
LOU - Paintsville, Kentucky
On 27 Jun 2001 16:51:55 -0400, hub...@hubcap.clemson.edu (Mike
Trader
MH wrote:
>
> Mallrock <mall...@hotmail.com> sez:
(snip)
> : Does anyone know the history of these kinds of lawn ornaments? A web
> : search as well as ebay turned up nothing close to this.
Read the short story, "The Artificial Nigger" by Flannery O'Connor.
>
> I had always heard that the statue was a tribute
> to the Greek philosopher Diogenes. He tirelessly
> searched day and night with his lamp looking for
> an honest (wo)man.
>
> --
> MHH
Actually, he was being sarcastic, looking for an "ideal man," a
construct which if I remember right, was posited by Plato. This was some
prefect counterpart of corresponding earthly man. It was apparently
supposed to exist somewhere out in the ether. Diogenes never could find
it, and he was making fun of the whole concept. It had nothing to do
with "honesty" as we define it.
Ken
Victor P. Dura
Marshall) wrote:
Canada? If he was at the border in January, that would explain
freezing to death.
Heck, I nearly freeze to death in Tennessee.
--
Shoals Symphony Orchestra: http://www.dreamwater.org/music/sso/
News you can use: http://www.newsmax.com/
Ed Clarke
>On 27 Jun 2001 16:51:55 -0400, hub...@hubcap.clemson.edu (Mike
>Marshall) wrote:
>>"Raliduul Urchanii" <sir...@noameritech.net> writes:
>>>What I heard. It's in memory of a black, who froze to death, while
>>>holding a latern, runaway slaves could see, which pointed toward
>>>area, where they would not be slaves.
I saw one of these repainted last week. The face was white and the uniform
had been repainted to resemble a NY Yankees baseball uniform. Still had
the lantern though.
Sheesh, the things people will put in their front yards.
Gene
> >>>holding a latern, runaway slaves could see, which pointed toward
> >>>area, where they would not be slaves.
>
> I saw one of these repainted last week. The face was white and the uniform
> had been repainted to resemble a NY Yankees baseball uniform. Still had
> the lantern though.
>
> Sheesh, the things people will put in their front yards.
Not saying that my aunt's a redneck, but she has a row of toilets
planted with flowers in her front yard.
Mallrock
> On Thu, 28 Jun 2001 17:32:26 -0500, Victor P. Dura <vpd...@hiwaay.net> wrote:
>
> Sheesh, the things people will put in their front yards.
I saw a twin bed frame minus box spring and mattress with the legs
sunk into the grould...planated with flowers....the threme....."my
flower bed" That and the rest of the "garden" although somewhat
eleaborate clearly show the lady has not been taking her prozac...
Mallrock
Richard Bishop
Ed Clarke <cla...@spanker.cilia.org> wrote in message
news:slrn9jos83...@spanker.cilia.org...
I totally agree. For example: concrete geese and yard gnomes....
Sue
Steve IA
Richard Bishop wrote:
> > Sheesh, the things people will put in their front yards.
>
> I totally agree. For example: concrete geese and yard gnomes....
>
> Sue
I cain't figger it out either. With geese and nomes and gazin
balls in the yard, where'r you suppose to line up the '77
Plymouth Volares that are gonna be classics and ya can sell to
some fool from the city, and old refrigerators ya can convert
to air conditioners for the shed, and them ol tractors that yer
gonna rebuild when ya gets time?
Sum folks ain't thinkin quite right...
: ^)
Steve
Southiowa
RSMEINER
be if everyone was the same. Or all houses and yards were the
same.
Randy
CAVM
>be if everyone was the same. Or all houses and yards were the
>same.
I think the technical name for that condition is "Subdivision"
RSMEINER
it would be boring if they were all the same.
Now, what TYVM ?
>Not a flame-bait: I look at it as advertising - of their values or
>priorities. As long as I don't have to look at a mess on "my" road. Or
>my yard for them. I didn't move to the country to mow a yard TYVM.
>Then there's the people who moved near the lake and cut down every >tree on
the 10acres, levelled it out and planted sod. "Damned >flatlanders," my
realtor friend commented.
RSMEINER
>Didn't think so, just trying to ward any off, thank you very much <g>
>And I agree.
