Still receive Amber Alerts on iPhone with no WiFi or Internet?

[uno]

Does anyone know the technical reasons why Amber Alerts are still received on an iPhone 6 that has not had a working wifi antenna for 2 years, no WiFi carrier service setup, and no Internet service connected?

Do iPhones have a separate wifi receiver just for government tracking and alerts?

Note: not looking for opinions on why we have amber alerts or regulatory requirements to allow them etc. ... looking for the actual technical explanation of how they are possible without WiFi or Internet or Bluetooth

[Heron]

On 6/16/2021 7:27 PM, uno wrote:
> Does anyone know the technical reasons why Amber Alerts
> are still received on an iPhone 6 that has not had a working
> wifi antenna for 2 years, no WiFi carrier service setup,
> and no Internet service connected?

I never thought about that problem set, but, offhand, my first question to
ask is if the alert came over the old carrier's cellular frequencies, then
you still have a working cellular radio, don't you?

> Do iPhones have a separate wifi receiver just for government
> tracking and alerts?

Do you think the alert is coming over the carrier's cellular network?

> Note: not looking for opinions on why we have amber alerts
> or regulatory requirements to allow them etc. ... looking
> for the actual technical explanation of how they are
> possible without WiFi or Internet or Bluetooth

Lots of wireless emergency alerts exist nowadays with more coming.

My newest phone lists these.
Presidential alerts (on only)
Extreme threats (on/off)
Severe threats (on/off)
AMBER alerts (on/off)
Public safety messages (on/off)
State and local tests

[sms]

Your phone can connect to a cellular network without a subscription or
SIM card.

[uno]

The WiFi hardware has been broken for two years and cannot connect to either cellular or Internet, this was confirmed at the Apple store ... i.e. the phone needs the wifi hardware repaired.

So the question is ... how can a phone with broken WiFi hardware (both cellular and Internet) receive Amber Alerts? All I can think of is that Apple has installed separate hardware for emergency calls and alerts.

[nospam]

In article <6b128db5-7e36-4dde...@googlegroups.com>,

> Except the WiFi hardware has been broken for two years and cannot connect to
> either cellular or Internet, this was confirmed at the Apple .. the phone
> would need a new wifi hardware repaired.

wifi is not used for the cellular network.

> So the question is ... how can a phone with confirmed broken WiFi hardware

> receive Amber Alerts? All I can think of is that Apple has installed
> separate hardware for emergency calls and alerts.

because it's sent over the cellular network, which uses a different
radio and a different antenna.

it's also why a cellphone without a sim card or active service can call
emergency services (911/112) and also usually the carrier's customer
service number so that service can be added.

[sms]

On 6/16/2021 12:07 PM, uno wrote:
> On Wednesday, June 16, 2021 at 1:14:01 PM UTC-5, sms wrote:

> Except the WiFi hardware has been broken for two years and cannot connect to either cellular or Internet, this was confirmed at the Apple .. the phone would need a new wifi hardware repaired.

If the Wi-Fi hardware is broken that doesn't affect the cellular radio.
The Wi-Fi hardware doesn't connect to the cellular network, it's
separate hardware.

Amber alerts go to every phone in a geographic area via SMS.

You also should be able to call 911 from that phone. In the past you
could also make credit card calls via the American Roaming Network if
the phone supported CDMA, but I'm not sure it's still possible.

[uno]

Thanks, that makes sense. Does anyone know if there a way to turn off the cellular radio off?

I assume no, I can turn off cellular data, but do not see an option to turn off the entire component.

[nospam]

In article <58c5f86d-7a4f-4fa6...@googlegroups.com>,

uno <uve...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Does anyone know if there a way to turn off the
> cellular radio off?

airplane mode.

> I assume no, I can turn off cellular data, but do not see an option to turn off the entire component.

you assume incorrectly.

[uno]

[uno]

On Wednesday, June 16, 2021 at 2:53:20 PM UTC-5, nospam wrote:

Nice. Lets see know if no more Amber Alerts

[nospam]

In article <62a4435e-c7b3-4829...@googlegroups.com>,

uno <uve...@gmail.com> wrote:

> >
> > > Does anyone know if there a way to turn off the
> > > cellular radio off?
> > airplane mode.
> > > I assume no, I can turn off cellular data, but do not see an option to
> > > turn off the entire component.
> > you assume incorrectly.
>
> Nice. Lets see know if no more Amber Alerts

you could also disable amber alerts directly.

in the settings app, tap notifications, then scroll to bottom and
enable/disable amber, emergency and public safety alerts, as preferred.

[RJH]

On 16 Jun 2021 at 4:09:00 PM, nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> in the settings app, tap notifications, then scroll to bottom and
> enable/disable amber, emergency and public safety alerts, as preferred.

The phone should be able to disable everything but presidential alerts.
--
Cheers, Rob

[nospam]

In article <sadmks$1fgg$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, RJH <patch...@gmx.com>

wrote:

> > in the settings app, tap notifications, then scroll to bottom and
> > enable/disable amber, emergency and public safety alerts, as preferred.
>
> The phone should be able to disable everything but presidential alerts.

it can.

[RonTheGuy]

On Jun 16, 2021, uno wrote
(in article<news:af743f2e-f687-4dd0...@googlegroups.com>):

> So the question is ...
> how can a phone with broken WiFi hardware
> (both cellular and Internet) receive Amber
> Alerts?

Dial 911 or 611 and they both should still work in many cases.

> All I can think of is that Apple
> has installed separate hardware for
> emergency calls and alerts.

In a way they have but it also does regular calls if you pay for that.

Ron, the humblest guy in town.

[Lewis]

In message <sadefu$1n60$1...@gioia.aioe.org> Heron <McKe...@ipanywhere.com> wrote:
> On 6/16/2021 7:27 PM, uno wrote:
>> Does anyone know the technical reasons why Amber Alerts
>> are still received on an iPhone 6 that has not had a working
>> wifi antenna for 2 years, no WiFi carrier service setup,
>> and no Internet service connected?

> I never thought about that problem set, but, offhand, my first question to
> ask is if the alert came over the old carrier's cellular frequencies, then
> you still have a working cellular radio, don't you?
>
>> Do iPhones have a separate wifi receiver just for government
>> tracking and alerts?

> Do you think the alert is coming over the carrier's cellular network?

I think the OP is confused as to what Wifi is.

Amber alerts have nothing to do with WiFi.

>> Note: not looking for opinions on why we have amber alerts
>> or regulatory requirements to allow them etc. ... looking
>> for the actual technical explanation of how they are
>> possible without WiFi or Internet or Bluetooth

Because you are leaving out the way the mobile phones communicate.

--
Well, I've wrestled with reality for 35 years, Doctor, and I'm happy
to state I finally won out over it.

[Lewis]

In message <6b128db5-7e36-4dde...@googlegroups.com> uno <uve...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Except the WiFi hardware has been broken for two years and cannot
> connect to either cellular or Internet, this was confirmed at the
> Apple .. the phone would need a new wifi hardware repaired.

You are confused. WIfi and cellular are unrelated, use different
hardware, different frequencies, and different technology.

--
You start a conversation you can't even finish it You're talkin' a
lot, but you're not sayin' anything When I have nothing to say,
my lips are sealed Say something once, why say it again?

[Lewis]

In message <l9tecwob...@news.solani.org> RonTheGuy <r...@null.invalid> wrote:
> On Jun 16, 2021, uno wrote
> (in article<news:af743f2e-f687-4dd0...@googlegroups.com>):
>> So the question is ...
>> how can a phone with broken WiFi hardware
>> (both cellular and Internet) receive Amber
>> Alerts?

> Dial 911 or 611 and they both should still work in many cases.

DO NOT DIAL 911 unless you have an actual emergency.

--
'You're your own worst enemy, Rincewind,' said the sword. Rincewind
looked up at the grinning men. 'Bet?' --Colour of Magic

[sms]

Yes, for a little while longer, for certain phones.

ARN(American Roaming Network) service works from unregistered CDMA
phones. It doesn't work from GSM phones. It should still work until the
CDMA networks are all shut down. It's very expensive per minute. At one
time they sold bundles of minutes on ARN, but not any more. I suspect
that the number of daily calls handled by ARN is somewhere between 0 and 5.

[uno]

Turned on Airplane Mode, as recommend above, to see if that turns off the cellular radio and stops Amber alerts.

[RonTheGuy]

On Jun 16, 2021, uno wrote

(in article<news:d0732085-e37a-44e3...@googlegroups.com>):

> Turned on Airplane Mode, as recommend above,
> to see if that turns off the cellular radio
> and stops Amber alerts.

What happened when you dialed 611 with AirplaneMode off?
(it's probably a good test of whether 911 could work in an emergency)

[nospam]

In article <zi9ci4d3...@news.solani.org>, RonTheGuy

<r...@null.invalid> wrote:

>
> > Turned on Airplane Mode, as recommend above,
> > to see if that turns off the cellular radio
> > and stops Amber alerts.
>
> What happened when you dialed 611 with AirplaneMode off?
> (it's probably a good test of whether 911 could work in an emergency)

nothing will happen, because the cell radio is off.

in the event of an emergency, turn off airplane mode (it will prompt on
a call attempt.

[Lewis]

You can just turn off the amber alerts.


--
NON-FLAMMABLE IS NOT A CHALLENGE Bart chalkboard Ep. BABF13

[JF Mezei]

On 2021-06-16 13:27, uno wrote:
> Does anyone know the technical reasons why Amber Alerts are still received on an iPhone 6 that has not had a working wifi antenna for 2 years, no WiFi carrier service setup, and no Internet service connected?
>

Not sure if properly answered, but just in case:

Alerts ae a broadcast on all cellular frequencies by all carriers. Any
phone that is not in "airplane" mode will receive the alert, even if it
has no valid SIM card. An alert is repeated at regular intervals but
has a number. So a phone that has already received alert 99 will no
repeat it every time it reveives alert 99. But a phone that has just
entered the zone where the alert is being set out will get it the next
time it is repeasted.

These alerts do not use the internet, no wi-fi. It is purely cellular.

This is for North America.

In Australia, they chose a different method where each tower reports who
is connected to the tower and they send an individual SMS to every phone
connected to the tower. This takes considerable time.


The broadcast method is much faster as you reach everyone with a single
broadcast.

However, in Canada, alerts are only on LTE, carriers lobbied the CRTC to
not impose it on 3G. So any phone that is either old enough or
temporarily on 3G due to coverage won't get the alert until it connects
to 4G again. (remember, the broadcasts are repeated at regular intervals
during duration of alert). (The USA has the alerts on old CDMA, 3G GSM
and 4G GSM (LTE) I assume 5G as well.