Compare & contrast Apple's WebKit with Google's Android System WebView (in Android 10 and up)

[Wally J]

1. Moments ago I read an adult response on the Apple newsgroup
by "Dorper" who said this with respect to WebKit/WebView...
"Chrome is baked into Android System WebView
the same way that WebKit is baked into iOS."
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/00kPfbl3UR4/m/toGEPfyGCgAJ>

2. Hmmm... I know all about WebKit but I had never heard of WebView prior.

3. So I did some research, and a test, which I would like to flesh
out in its own thread - which is why I just opened this thread.

If you know more than I do about the differences between WebKit and
WebView - please add value to this comparative discussion (which might not
be hard given I had never heard of WebView until this very moment that
Dorper contrasted it with WebKit).

In summary - the goal of this thread is to compare and contrast
Apple's pervasive WebKit with Google's pervasive WebView.

=====< below is the post I just wrote testing WebView >=====

On 6 Oct 2023, Dorper <use...@dorper.me>
Message-ID: <E145C170.1DB9%use...@dorper.me>
wrote in
misc.phone.mobile.iphone,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system:

> Chrome is baked into Android System WebView the same way that WebKit is
> baked into iOS.

WebView? I had never heard of Android System WebView before.

It was here.
<https://i.postimg.cc/8kfsyKdV/webview01.jpg> WebView is here
Now it's gone.
<https://i.postimg.cc/dtLBhFqh/webview02.jpg> WebView is gone

*Let's see what happens!*

I am not ashamed to say I've never heard of Android System WebView
(although I'm all too familiar with Apple's walled-garden WebKit).
a. Ignorance can be cured (rather easily);
b. It's stupidity that can't be cured.

Thank you for bringing up Android System WebView so we can learn from you.
And thank you for making the (presumed) "equivalence" with Apple's WebKit.

This presumed equivalence may be true. Or it may not be true.
I'd have to know more since I never looked up Android System WebView.
<https://duckduckgo.com/?&q=Android+System+WebView>

First hit:
*Android System WebView* by Google LLC,3.7star,8.52M reviews.5B+Downloads*
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.webview>
Android WebView is a pre-installed system component from Google
that allows Android apps to display web content.

Hmmmm... let's see what it's doing on my free Samsung Galaxy, shall we?
<https://i.postimg.cc/8kfsyKdV/webview01.jpg>
Android System WebView <com.google.android.webview>
Version 116.0.5845.163 (584516331)
System App, Updated, 2 splits, Play App Signing
Data transmitted 64kB
Data received 5.84MB
Date Installed Wed, Dec 31, 2008 7:00 AM
Date Updated Wed, Sep 6, 2023 7:53 AM
Installer App com.android.vending

Hmmm... so (a) I have it, and (b) it came with the phone, and (c) it was
recently seamlessly updated, and (d) it received 6GB (since when?) and it
transmitted 64kB (since when?). Hm... What is this Android System WebView?

I can disable and remove it, but first I need to know what it's doing.

*What is Android System WebView? Is it Safe to Disable it?*
<https://appuals.com/android-system-webview/>
"Android System WebView is a pre-installed app that is responsible for
displaying web content without opening the respective web browser."

They cover the history, where it's apparently part of the Project Mainline
(aka Google Play System update) seamless update for Android 10+ devices.

That explains why it's updated only a month ago (as all Android 10+ phones
are seamlessly updated ~every month over the Internet nowadays).

This article says "there are two ways to open web content on an Android
device: You can use a traditional web browser or an Android application
that includes WebView in the layout."
<https://www.techtarget.com/searchsecurity/definition/Android-Webview>

That article further explains that "A developer who wants to add browser
functionality to an application can include the WebView library and create
an instance of a WebView class", but that a more privacy-tuned developer
"can use third-party code instead of WebView or alternative Android
browsers to perform the same task."

Furthermore "Rather than having every app use its own built-in web browser
that can render the same way Google Chrome's blink engine does, Google has
provided a built-in system component that just works", so it's the Chrome
engine that they're including (as Dorper had indicated).
<https://www.androidcentral.com/what-android-system-webview-and-why-do-so-many-apps-depend-it>

So it's up to the app whether or not it includes WebView inside the app.

That's pretty much enough to know I probably want to delete it, but the
cite above says one Monday afternoon (March 22, 2021 in fact) a WebView
update caused a bunch of apps to go haywire (i.e., Gmail, Google Maps, and
Instagram).

Now back to your comment, which is really a fact plus an assessment:
FACT: "Chrome is baked into Android System WebView..."
ASSESSMENT: "...the same way that WebKit is baked into iOS".

From the little I gleaned by the above quick search, I would agree with the
first statement of fact; but I might not fully agree with the assessment.

In "some" ways, the two are similar - in that both are components
incorporated into other apps to allow those other apps to render content.

But we know (from many discussions) that WebKit is a walled-garden
requirement; it must be built into _all_ Apple browsers (which is why IOS
can't have the kind of anonymous web browsing security and privacy that is
available on all other common consumer operating systems except for iOS).]

By way of contrast, we don't see any _requirement_ that WebView be used.
Nor do we see any mention that WebView is used primarily for web browsers.

Let's run an experiment to see how pernicious this Android WebView is...
C:\> adb connect 192.168.1.4:44285
C:\> adb shell pm dump com.google.android.webview
C:\> adb shell am force-stop com.google.android.webview
C:\> adb shell pm disable-user --user 0 com.google.android.webview
C:\> adb shell pm uninstall --user 0 com.google.android.webview

Anyway, I deleted it so now let's see what happens to my Android device
without Android System WebView... shall we?

In summary, I do agree with Dorper's factual statement that Android System
WebView is baked into "some things" - where I'd modify that factual
statement a bit to say that it's baked into 'some apps' only (we don't know
which yet of course - but we're about to find out which apps break!).

I'm not yet ready to agree with Dorper's assessment that Android System
WebView is baked into Android the same way that WebKit is baked into every
web browser on iOS by decree from Apple - especially when we know WebKit is
why only iOS can't the privacy & anonymity that all other operating systems
have that don't have the requirement of baking WebKit into the browser.

Time will tell... as I need to see what breaks on my Android 13 Galaxy now.

Many thanks to Dorper for bringing up the analogy between the two systems.
--
I prefer to discuss topics on the Apple Usenet newsgroups at the level
an adult would appreciate and not at the level of the child-like iKooks.

[Alan]

That's a claim it's gone.

Not proof.

Not even evidence.

[Wolf Greenblatt]

On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 20:18:18 -0700, Alan wrote:

>> Now it's gone.
>> <https://i.postimg.cc/dtLBhFqh/webview02.jpg> WebView is gone
>
> That's a claim it's gone.
>
> Not proof.
>
> Not even evidence.

Where did this fuckin' ignoramus come from that claims adb can't uninstall
system apps from the user space when everyone on Android who knows anything
about Android has been doing just that since the very beginning of time?

Is he an Apple wanna-be wonka who doesn't know his shit from his asshole?

Read this you stupid fuck before you go on with your Apple excrement again.
[https://www.makeuseof.com/uninstall-android-app-adb-system-apps-bloatware/]

[Jeff Layman]

On 07/10/2023 03:52, Wally J wrote:

> First hit:
> *Android System WebView* by Google LLC,3.7star,8.52M reviews.5B+Downloads*
> <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.google.android.webview>
> Android WebView is a pre-installed system component from Google
> that allows Android apps to display web content.

I first came across WebView when I tried the BBC iPlayer app for the
first time a year or so ago on my Xiaomi Redmi Note 10 (which is locked
down far more than most of the phones mentioned here), but in a somewhat
different way than you've found.

When I tried to run iPlayer, Chrome popped up - or at least a "Welcome
to Chrome" screen with the Chrome icon. I couldn't uninstall Chrome, but
I had earlier disallowed permissions to it, so it asked for access (now
whether this is Chrome itself or part of Chrome I don't know, but it did
note that it would send data home, so it sure sounds like Chrome!).

I complained to the BBC that if, as they claimed, privacy mattered to
them, they should allow iPlayer to access a different browser. I asked
"Why does the iPlayer app insist on Chrome, and can this be changed to
my default browser?"

They replied "Chrome is used because of its support for Custom Tabs
(allowing users to sign into their browser, and easily sign in to apps
too without entering their password). However, if Chrome is disabled or
uninstalled we fall back to the built in WebView. This won’t differ even
if a user has selected a different default browser. If you really don't
want to use Chrome, you can disable it in the Android settings and
iPlayer will use a built in WebView as a fall back."

I replied "your point about Chrome being used because of its Custom Tabs
is at least a year out-of-date. Even the developers of Chrome itself
state that "Custom Tabs is a browser feature, introduced by Chrome, that
is now supported by most major browsers on Android."

Secondly, Chrome is a system app in later versions of Android and cannot
be uninstalled without rooting or use of a fairly complicated procedure
using adb. With my Android 11 phone, I cannot even disable it. I can
force it to stop, but as soon as I tap on the iPlayer app sign-in it
causes Chrome to restart."

They said they'd look into using other browsers, but more than a year on
iPlayer /still/ defaults to Chrome! I fortunately found a way round it
because iPlayer has a link to their Privacy Statement webpage which -
perhaps strangely - opens in my default browser Firefox. From that
webpage I can access any of the iPlayer pages.

> *What is Android System WebView? Is it Safe to Disable it?*
> <https://appuals.com/android-system-webview/>
> "Android System WebView is a pre-installed app that is responsible for
> displaying web content without opening the respective web browser."

As noted above, BBC iPlayer might be doing that - I'm not sure.

> This article says "there are two ways to open web content on an Android
> device: You can use a traditional web browser or an Android application
> that includes WebView in the layout."
> <https://www.techtarget.com/searchsecurity/definition/Android-Webview>
>
> That article further explains that "A developer who wants to add browser
> functionality to an application can include the WebView library and create
> an instance of a WebView class", but that a more privacy-tuned developer
> "can use third-party code instead of WebView or alternative Android
> browsers to perform the same task."
>
> Furthermore "Rather than having every app use its own built-in web browser
> that can render the same way Google Chrome's blink engine does, Google has
> provided a built-in system component that just works", so it's the Chrome
> engine that they're including (as Dorper had indicated).
> <https://www.androidcentral.com/what-android-system-webview-and-why-do-so-many-apps-depend-it>
>
> So it's up to the app whether or not it includes WebView inside the app.

Well, according to the BBC, the iPlayer app uses Chrome, but if that's
unavailable (uninstalled, perhaps?), it uses WebView to access another
browser. That's a little different from the explanation in the links
above, but I'll leave those with technical knowledge to explain it.

(BTW, I've yet to get round to using adb to remove the unwanted dross
from my phone.)

--

Jeff

[Wally J]

Wolf Greenblatt <wo...@greenblatt.net> wrote

> Where did this fuckin' ignoramus come from that claims adb can't uninstall
> system apps from the user space when everyone on Android who knows anything
> about Android has been doing just that since the very beginning of time?
>
> Is he an Apple wanna-be wonka who doesn't know his shit from his asshole?
>
> Read this you stupid fuck before you go on with your Apple excrement again.
> [https://www.makeuseof.com/uninstall-android-app-adb-system-apps-bloatware/]

Please ignore the iKook Alan Baker as he just wants to whine that he can't
do anything on his Apple devices that everyone else can always easily do.

*Any unrooted Android use can uninstall anything in the user partition*
*Even pre-installed system apps*
*Like Android System WebView is*
<https://i.postimg.cc/8kfsyKdV/webview01.jpg> Android System WebView here
<https://i.postimg.cc/dtLBhFqh/webview02.jpg> Android System WebView gone
<https://i.postimg.cc/yN3BzM4k/webview03.jpg> Dev Options shows it's gone

Once you uninstall Android System Webview, there's confirmation here.
Settings > Developer options > WebView implementation = None
Developer Options > Android System WebView = (uninstalled for user Owner)

You don't even need the PC to do it since there is a FOSS local adb that
runs directly on Android w/o the PC (but the PC is easily enough used).
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.draco.ladb>
(Source code is available on GitHub for those who can compile it.)]

Moving forward to share with other intelligent people and learn from them,
I did s'more research, and unlike Apple's WebKit, Android users have long
been swapping out Google WebView for Ungoogled Chromium Bromite WebView.
<https://github.com/bromite/bromite/releases>
Apparently they simply swap out the original WebView with the Bromite one.
<https://www.bromite.org/system_web_view>
Once installed, they just choose the new WebView in Developer options.
Developer options > WebView implementation > Bromite SystemWebView
<https://xdaforums.com/t/guide-how-to-install-bromite-systemwebview-without-magisk-android-12-included.4486569/>

Some are rooted using the Magisk Module WebView manager, but many are not.
<https://github.com/Androidacy/WebviewManager-Module>
<https://xdaforums.com/t/magisk-mod-oos-9-5-11-13-allow-choosing-bromite-as-webview-implementation.3954582/>

The reason I don't think you need to be rooted to swap out the Android
System WebView for the Bromite WebView is that others have done it.

The fact everyone swaps out the Android System Webview with the Bromite
WebView is good to know, where I found the instructions just now here.
<https://github.com/bromite/bromite/wiki/Installing-SystemWebView>
(Lots of detail there that I'm skipping at the moment - later on that.)

I'm not sure yet if you need to change the package name though - as I'm
still bouncing between all the references for how other people do this.
<https://xdaforums.com/t/how-to-guide-mod-change-package-names-of-apks.2760965/>]
You can also edit the APKs if you know exactly what to edit in the package.
*Apk Editor Pro* by Ben techs
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.apkeditor.new.explorer3>
You can even clone the package with a new name (with apktool or clonemyapp)
<https://apktool.org/> or <https://clonemy.app/>
<https://xdaforums.com/t/tool-clonemyapp-android-apk-cloner.4513777/>
While it's nice to know you can change package names, I think the
Android Developer options allow you to swap out one WebView for another.
Settings > Developer options > WebView implementation = (pick one)

Nor am I sure (yet) if you need to edit the original APKs (where this cross
platform mac, Windows & Linux APK editor will edit the APK if you need it.
APK Editor Studio <https://qwertycube.com/apk-editor-studio/>
This free app will also edit an APK (if you need to edit it, that is).
<https://f-droid.org/packages/com.apk.editor/>

In summary, I'm testing what happens first with Android System Webview
removed from the user partition - and - after that - I'll see if I can swap
out the Bromite WebView on an unrooted device (that might require root).

If anyone reading this knows more than I do (which shouldn't be too hard
given I never heard of this WebView until a couple of hours ago), please
let me know if you can swap out the default WebView with the Bromite
WebView without being rooted. Thanks!
--
I learn from others and others learn from me - if we keep an open mind
and if we help each other on both the small and large questions & answers.

[Alan]

On 2023-10-06 21:24, Wolf Greenblatt wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Oct 2023 20:18:18 -0700, Alan wrote:
>
>>> Now it's gone.
>>> <https://i.postimg.cc/dtLBhFqh/webview02.jpg> WebView is gone
>>
>> That's a claim it's gone.
>>
>> Not proof.
>>
>> Not even evidence.
>
> Where did this fuckin' ignoramus come from that claims adb can't uninstall
> system apps from the user space when everyone on Android who knows anything
> about Android has been doing just that since the very beginning of time?

I made no such claim, asshole.

What I ASSERT is that an IMAGE that merely SAYS something is gone
doesn't actually prove it's gone.

Watch, I SAY your brain is gone.

Is it? I mean, it's not very much of a brain, but it's probably still in
there somewhere.

>
> Is he an Apple wanna-be wonka who doesn't know his shit from his asshole?
>
> Read this you stupid fuck before you go on with your Apple excrement again.
> [https://www.makeuseof.com/uninstall-android-app-adb-system-apps-bloatware/]

Is "Android System WebView" an Android APP?

'Is it safe to uninstall Android System WebView?

WebView is impossible to uninstall because it is system software and
comes pre-installed on Android devices.'

<https://www.techtarget.com/searchsecurity/definition/Android-Webview>

And before you rant on:

'It's possible to disable Android System WebView on older devices
running Android 7.0, 8.0, or 9.0.'

<https://www.businessinsider.com/guides/tech/android-system-webview>

[Wally J]

Wally J <walte...@invalid.nospam> wrote

> In summary, I'm testing what happens first with Android System Webview
> removed from the user partition - and - after that - I'll see if I can swap
> out the Bromite WebView on an unrooted device (that might require root).

I think a lot of people are afraid for no good reason about deleting some
of these Google packages - the Android System WebView being one of them.

Just a quick update... I've used the phone all day today for normal stuff
(which doesn't really stress it all that much) and there have been only
very minor repercussions from having wiped out Android System WebView.

Mainly a couple of web browsers crash without it - but that's about it.
Most web browsers are working fine without Android System WebView.

Partly this may be because I shun apps with GSF installed (although I don't
know for sure that GSF includes the calls to the Android System WebView).

My plan is the following:
a. Test the phone without Android System WebView for a while, and, then,
b. If it's possible to swap in the Bromite WebView unrooted, I'll do that.

Note: You can't wipe out Apple's WebView so there's really no comparison.
But still, I thank Dorper for bringing up the concept that WebView existed.
--
My role on the operating system newsgroups is to learn and to teach.
That's why I thoroughly test every solution that I write about on the ng.

[candycanearter07]

On 10/8/23 00:15, Wally J wrote:
> I think a lot of people are afraid for no good reason about deleting some
> of these Google packages - the Android System WebView being one of them.

Probably scared of messing with anything pre-installed, in case it
breaks something. Most don't really see the point of it.
--
user <candycane> is generated from /dev/urandom

[Alan]

On 2023-10-07 22:42, candycanearter07 wrote:
> On 10/8/23 00:15, Wally J wrote:
>> I think a lot of people are afraid for no good reason about deleting some
>> of these Google packages - the Android System WebView being one of them.
>
> Probably scared of messing with anything pre-installed, in case it
> breaks something. Most don't really see the point of it.

Amazingly, ordinary users don't WANT to fool with things.

They just want a device that works.

[Your Name]

On 2023-10-08 05:42:37 +0000, candycanearter07 said:
> On 10/8/23 00:15, Wally J wrote:
>>
>> I think a lot of people are afraid for no good reason about deleting some
>> of these Google packages - the Android System WebView being one of them.
>
> Probably scared of messing with anything pre-installed, in case it
> breaks something. Most don't really see the point of it.

Most people simply use their devices. They don't even know 90% of what
is on there and couldn't care less. As long as the device works for
what they need (which is basically a gloried pager to receive text
messages), they're happy.

It's only the nerds who even think about continually mucking about with
their devices.

[candycanearter07]

Which is fair, but unfortunately companies take advantage of it by
including spyware programs that aren't needed.

[Wally J]

candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote

>> I think a lot of people are afraid for no good reason about deleting some
>> of these Google packages - the Android System WebView being one of them.
>
> Probably scared of messing with anything pre-installed, in case it
> breaks something. Most don't really see the point of it.

It's just a phone.
What's the worst thing than can happen?

I got four of them (well, six - as I bricked two of them) for free from
T-Mobile - where all I had to pay on the first was the sales tax on MSRP.

The rest were free (T-Mobile refunded the $20 & subsequently $25 in-store
processing fees on my monthly bill) so that's six powerful phones for free.
(They're far more powerful than any iPhone ever sold - for example.)

Besides. A phone is a mere commodity.
If it costs more than free than you're probably paying too much for it.

Anyway, I'm progressing on my thread on the topic at the XDA forum.
<https://xdaforums.com/t/what-happens-when-you-use-adb-to-delete-android-system-webview-on-android-10-devices-where-its-maintained-by-project-mainline-what-breaks-on-you.4634716/#post-89089173>

The first thing I doublechecked is I ran TrebleInfo on the hardware.
<https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=tk.hack5.treblecheck>
Project Treble = Supported
VNDK version = 31.0
Linker namespace isolation = VNDK is not in lite mode
Manifest location = Modern
System as Root = Enabled
Seamless Upgrades = Unsupported
Dynamic Upgrades = Unsupported
Dynamic Partitions = Enabled
CPU architecture = ARM64
Binder architecture = 64 bit

If it matters for others to compare their results, here's the output
from "adb shell dumpsys webviewupdate" which shows Bromite not there yet.

C:\app\editor\android\scrcpy> adb shell dumpsys webviewupdate
Current WebView Update Service state
Multiprocess enabled: true
Current WebView package is null
Minimum targetSdkVersion: 33
Minimum WebView version code: 524912633
Number of relros started: 0
Number of relros finished: 0
WebView package dirty: false
Any WebView package installed: false
Preferred WebView package: none
WebView packages:
Valid package com.google.android.webview (versionName: 116.0.5845.163,
versionCode: 584516331, targetSdkVersion: 34) is NOT installed/enabled for
all users
com.google.android.webview.beta is NOT installed.
com.google.android.webview.dev is NOT installed.
com.google.android.webview.canary is NOT installed.
com.google.android.webview.debug is NOT installed.
com.android.webview is NOT installed.

BTW, if it matters, here's my results from "adb shell cmd overlay list".
(I wonder if "webview" would have shown up had it not been wiped out?)

C:\app\editor\android\scrcpy> adb shell cmd overlay list

com.google.android.networkstack.tethering
[x] com.mtk.google.android.networkstack.tethering.overlay
[x] com.google.android.networkstack.tethering.overlay

com.samsung.android.app.cocktailbarservice
[x] com.samsung.android.app.cocktailbarservice.en

com.google.android.cellbroadcastservice
[x] com.google.android.overlay.modules.cellbroadcastservice

com.samsung.android.aremoji
[x] com.samsung.android.aremoji.en

com.samsung.android.smartmirroring
[x] com.samsung.android.smartmirroring.en

com.sec.android.app.safetyassurance
[x] com.sec.android.app.safetyassurance.en

com.samsung.android.incallui
[x] com.samsung.android.incallui.en

com.samsung.android.aware.service
[x] com.samsung.android.aware.service.en

com.samsung.android.rubin.app
[x] com.samsung.android.rubin.app.en

com.sec.android.easyMover.Agent
[x] com.sec.android.easyMover.Agent.en

com.samsung.android.mdx.quickboard
[x] com.samsung.android.mdx.quickboard.en

com.samsung.android.secsoundpicker
[x] com.samsung.android.secsoundpicker.en

com.sec.android.app.soundalive
[x] com.sec.android.app.soundalive.en

android
[ ] com.android.internal.display.cutout.emulation.corner
[ ] com.android.internal.display.cutout.emulation.double
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.navbar.gestural_wide_back
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.onehanded.gestural
[ ] com.samsung.internal.systemui.navbar.sec_gestural
[ ] com.android.internal.display.cutout.emulation.hole
[ ] com.android.internal.display.cutout.emulation.tall
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.navbar.threebutton
[ ] com.samsung.internal.systemui.navbar.sec_gestural_no_hint
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.navbar.gestural_extra_wide_back
[ ] com.android.theme.font.notoserifsource
[ ] com.android.internal.display.cutout.emulation.waterfall
[ ] com.samsung.internal.systemui.navbar.gestural_no_hint
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.navbar.gestural
[ ] com.android.internal.systemui.navbar.gestural_narrow_back

com.samsung.android.messaging
[x] com.samsung.android.messaging.en

com.samsung.android.app.telephonyui
[x] com.samsung.android.app.telephonyui.en

com.google.android.permissioncontroller
[x] com.google.android.overlay.modules.permissioncontroller

com.android.providers.settings
--- com.mediatek.SettingsProviderResOverlay

com.samsung.knox.securefolder
[x] com.samsung.knox.securefolder.en

com.samsung.android.app.smartcapture
[x] com.samsung.android.app.smartcapture.en

com.samsung.android.mdecservice
[x] com.samsung.android.mdecservice.en

com.google.android.networkstack
[x] com.samsung.android.networkstack
[ ] com.samsung.android.wcmurlsnetworkstack

com.samsung.android.ardrawing
[x] com.samsung.android.ardrawing.en

com.android.wifi.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.wifi.p2paware.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.wifi.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.wifi.h2e.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.wifi.softap.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.wifi.softapwpathree.resources

com.samsung.android.allshare.service.fileshare
[x] com.samsung.android.allshare.service.fileshare.en

com.google.android.connectivity.resources
[x] com.samsung.android.ConnectivityUxOverlay
[x] com.samsung.android.ConnectivityOverlay

com.samsung.android.setting.multisound
[x] com.samsung.android.setting.multisound.en

com.android.networkstack.tethering
--- com.mtk.android.networkstack.tethering.overlay
--- com.samsung.android.networkstack.tethering.overlay

com.samsung.android.arzone
[x] com.samsung.android.arzone.en

com.google.android.documentsui
[x] com.google.android.overlay.modules.documentsui

com.android.cellbroadcastreceiver.module
--- com.mediatek.cellbroadcastuiresoverlay

com.samsung.android.appseparation
[x] com.samsung.android.appseparation.en

com.samsung.android.honeyboard
[x] com.samsung.android.honeyboard.en

com.android.settings
--- com.mediatek.MtkSettingsResOverlay

com.samsung.app.newtrim
[x] com.samsung.app.newtrim.en

com.android.networkstack.tethering.inprocess
--- com.mtk.android.networkstack.tethering.inprocess.overlay

com.sec.android.emergencylauncher
[x] com.sec.android.emergencylauncher.en

com.sec.hearingadjust
[x] com.sec.hearingadjust.en

com.samsung.android.app.appsedge
[x] com.samsung.android.app.appsedge.en

com.android.systemui
[x] com.mediatek.systemuiresoverlay

com.google.android.cellbroadcastreceiver
[x] com.google.android.overlay.modules.cellbroadcastreceiver

com.sec.android.app.camera
[x] com.sec.android.app.camera.en

com.samsung.android.video
[x] com.samsung.android.video.en

Drat... I didnt' realize it was such a long listing.
I should have grep'd for "webview", e.g.,
C:\> adb shell cmd overlay list | findstr -i "webview"

It's not so easy to follow the instructions over here though...
<https://github.com/bromite/bromite/wiki/Installing-SystemWebView>

They look nice.
But they're missing steps.

I'm working with the authors on that as we speak as I would like to write
up a tutorial so that even those low-IQ iKooks could do what I'm doing.

[Wally J]

candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote

> Which is fair, but unfortunately companies take advantage of it by
> including spyware programs that aren't needed.

If people think consumer operating systems are complicated, then they've
never worked with truly complex software as I have in the Silicon Valley.

Android has a lot of packages - but I've already deleted scores of them.
And my phone is working just fine (probably better) as a direct result.

But what gets me about this stuff is how much of it is a boldfaced lie.

It seems that Google extols the virtues of these three packages which
mostly Jeff Layton and I have debunked, as the Google shills say they not
only do your dishes, but they wash your socks & scratch your back for you.

*Google Partner Setup*
C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.partnetsetup
<https://yoodley.com/google-partner-setup/>

*Android System Intelligence*
C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.as
<https://www.androidpolice.com/what-is-android-system-intelligence/>

*Android System WebView*
C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.webview
<https://appuals.com/android-system-webview/>

Turns out the phone works just fine without these (and scores more)...

Which is kind'a funny when you read the marketing on what they claim they
do (which I know you've done - but the ignorant iKooks will never read
anything - they can barely handle the pretty glossy Apple marketing).

But back to the original assessment by Dorper, in a way the Android System
WebView is a tiny bit like the Apple WebKit - but in many ways it's not.

The biggest difference is you can easily ditch it - and - as I'm learning,
you can replace it with a different WebView - which is what I'm working on.

With the Apple WebKit - you're stuck with it. And it's the reason for most
of the Apple exploited zero-day bugs too. Sigh. It's the reason there is no
privacy or security on iOS and the iKooks don't even know why that's true.
--
The whole point of a computing device is to mess with it how you like.

[Alan]

On 2023-10-08 01:47, Wally J wrote:
> candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote
>
>> Which is fair, but unfortunately companies take advantage of it by
>> including spyware programs that aren't needed.
>
> If people think consumer operating systems are complicated, then they've
> never worked with truly complex software as I have in the Silicon Valley.
>
> Android has a lot of packages - but I've already deleted scores of them.
> And my phone is working just fine (probably better) as a direct result.
>
> But what gets me about this stuff is how much of it is a boldfaced lie.
>
> It seems that Google extols the virtues of these three packages which
> mostly Jeff Layton and I have debunked, as the Google shills say they not
> only do your dishes, but they wash your socks & scratch your back for you.
>
> *Google Partner Setup*
> C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.partnetsetup
> <https://yoodley.com/google-partner-setup/>
>
> *Android System Intelligence*
> C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.as
> <https://www.androidpolice.com/what-is-android-system-intelligence/>
>
> *Android System WebView*
> C:\> adb shell pm uninstall -k --user 0 com.google.android.webview
> <https://appuals.com/android-system-webview/>
>
> Turns out the phone works just fine without these (and scores more)...

From your source, Arlen:

'Is it safe to disable Android System WebView?

Yes, it is safe to disable Android System WebView only for Android 7.0,
8.0, and 9.0 as they use Google Chrome to handle WebView-related tasks.
However, it’s not recommended to disable it on any other Android version.

Other versions need System WebView to function properly and add browser
functionality to your apps. Disabling System WebView also disables the
security configuration to display the web pages directly inside apps.
Consequently, your apps are at great risk. Moreover, Google suggests
keeping it activated as it does not harm your device.'

But you only write facts...

...right?

[Alan Browne]

On 2023-10-08 03:07, Your Name wrote:

> Most people simply use their devices. They don't even know 90% of what
> is on there and couldn't care less. As long as the device works for what
> they need (which is basically a gloried pager to receive text messages),
> they're happy.
>
> It's only the nerds who even think about continually mucking about with
> their devices.

As a nerd I don't muck about much with my iPhone. Beyond a pager,
however it's important to me for a range of things/apps.

I've also installed dozens of apps that I've never used. Should clean
them out - but doesn't cost anything to leave them...

--
“Markets can remain irrational longer than your can remain solvent.”
- John Maynard Keynes.

[candycanearter07]

On 10/8/23 03:47, Wally J wrote:
> The biggest difference is you can easily ditch it - and - as I'm learning,
> you can replace it with a different WebView - which is what I'm working on.
>
> With the Apple WebKit - you're stuck with it. And it's the reason for most
> of the Apple exploited zero-day bugs too. Sigh. It's the reason there is no
> privacy or security on iOS and the iKooks don't even know why that's true.

Modularity FTW

[candycanearter07]

On 10/8/23 03:28, Wally J wrote:
> candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote

>> Probably scared of messing with anything pre-installed, in case it
>> breaks something. Most don't really see the point of it.
>
> It's just a phone.
> What's the worst thing than can happen?

Most phones are pretty expensive, people only have one, and it could
take a while to fix if they don't know what they're doing.

[Wally J]

candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote

>> It's just a phone.
>> What's the worst thing than can happen?
>
> Most phones are pretty expensive, people only have one, and it could
> take a while to fix if they don't know what they're doing.

As I said, phones are almost free nowadays, and, even if they weren't,
what's the worst thing that you will do to it if you make a mistake?

Factory reset.
Big deal.

Especially with Google/Apple both making it trivial to backup & restore.

With that in mind, if someone's afraid to "touch" the settings, then, well,
then they don't belong on this newsgroup - and - I feel sorry for them.

It's like you're rowing on the Charles & you're afraid of catching a crab.
They don't go together.

[Alan]

On 2023-10-08 19:54, Wally J wrote:
> candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote
>
>>> It's just a phone.
>>> What's the worst thing than can happen?
>>
>> Most phones are pretty expensive, people only have one, and it could
>> take a while to fix if they don't know what they're doing.
>
> As I said, phones are almost free nowadays, and, even if they weren't,

You're just an idiot.

> what's the worst thing that you will do to it if you make a mistake?
>
> Factory reset.
> Big deal.
>
> Especially with Google/Apple both making it trivial to backup & restore.
>

Except you've told us you can't trust either of them to keep your data
safe...

[Wally J]

candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote

>> The biggest difference is you can easily ditch it - and - as I'm learning,
>> you can replace it with a different WebView - which is what I'm working on.
>>
>> With the Apple WebKit - you're stuck with it. And it's the reason for most
>> of the Apple exploited zero-day bugs too. Sigh. It's the reason there is no
>> privacy or security on iOS and the iKooks don't even know why that's true.
>
> Modularity FTW

What is hugely different between Apple & every other operating system, is
that the walled garden prevents the users from being able to do things.

Like wiping out the default system WebView, as just one proximal example.

To that end, I figured out why removing Android System WebView had almost
no impact for me, where one of the main reasons is I choose good apps.

I can't stress enough everyone wants to deceive you, and most people are
stupid so they're deceived - but if you're intelligent - your apps are too.

The only apps that acted up over the weekend was DuckDuckGo browser and
Bromite browser (surprisingly) where DDG was my default browser for links.

While DuckDuckGo & Bromite browsers crashed, Ungoogled Chromium did fine.
So I simply set the default web browser to Ungoogled Chromium to fix it.
<https://i.postimg.cc/jd4dKn60/webview07.jpg> Default UnGoogled Chromium
Settings > Apps > Choose default apps > Browser app > Default browser app = Ungoogled Chromium

Likewise, while stupid people have stupid settings, I have never had links
open up inside of apps - so Android System WebView doesn't affect me there.
<https://i.postimg.cc/bNcsqjKb/webview08.jpg> Open links in apps = off
Settings > Apps > Choose default apps > Opening links > Open links in apps = off

So far what I'm concluding is that anyone who "loses stuff" when they wipe
out the Android System WebView, is probably choosing bad apps & settings.

Even so, it's still worth it to swap in the Bromite System WebView,
although I've learned since Dorner told me about WebView that there are
actually _many_ de-googled WebViews that I can swap out for WebView.

But for now I'll stick with the Bromite System WebView which seems to be
the most used and supported over the various Android versions.

Here's a tutorial for doing what I'm planning on doing when the testing of
what happens when I removed the Android System WebView is completed.

*Ditch Google's WebView & Switch Android's System Browser to Bromite*
<https://android.gadgethacks.com/how-to/ditch-googles-webview-switch-androids-system-browser-bromite-0384227/>

But that process requires Magisk, which (AFAIK) requires rooting, where
unfortunately my phone is unrootable (AFAIK) so I need to use a non-Magisk
method (which exists - it's just more convoluted, that's all. AFAIK
*[GUIDE]How to install Bromite SystemWebView without Magisk (Android 12+ included)*
<https://xdaforums.com/t/guide-how-to-install-bromite-systemwebview-without-magisk-android-12-included.4486569/>
--
The whole point of Usenet is to find people who know more than you do.

[Alan]

On 2023-10-08 22:14, Wally J wrote:
> candycanearter07 <n...@thanks.net> wrote
>
>>> The biggest difference is you can easily ditch it - and - as I'm learning,
>>> you can replace it with a different WebView - which is what I'm working on.
>>>
>>> With the Apple WebKit - you're stuck with it. And it's the reason for most
>>> of the Apple exploited zero-day bugs too. Sigh. It's the reason there is no
>>> privacy or security on iOS and the iKooks don't even know why that's true.
>>
>> Modularity FTW
>
> What is hugely different between Apple & every other operating system, is
> that the walled garden prevents the users from being able to do things.
>
> Like wiping out the default system WebView, as just one proximal example.

Which you can't do since Android 9.

>
> To that end, I figured out why removing Android System WebView had almost
> no impact for me, where one of the main reasons is I choose good apps.

So you're on Android 9 or before, then?

>
> I can't stress enough everyone wants to deceive you, and most people are
> stupid so they're deceived - but if you're intelligent - your apps are too.
>
> The only apps that acted up over the weekend was DuckDuckGo browser and
> Bromite browser (surprisingly) where DDG was my default browser for links.

So you lied when you said it had "no impact".

[candycanearter07]

I presume they meant "impact on how they used their device".