Road signs question
Michael
Which law(s) describe(s) where a road sign is effective?
Until recently I assumed that the sign is valid from where the sign is
placed until next intersection.
Today I was told by a cop who ticketed me that the "No parking" sign
is valid as long as it may be seen (I'e I cannot park if I see the
sign ahead of me, even if there are none behind me). Is it bunch of
baloney?
Thanks!
Mike Jacobs
Doesn't make sense to me, the way you stated it, so I assume something
is missing from your story. What if you had eagle vision? You
couldn't park anywhere in town that was within a straight line view of
the sign. Or if you had poor, nearsighted vision, you could park
right up to a couple of feet away from the sign. And a sign without
arrows, facing in the direction of oncoming traffic so it can be seen,
generally applies to traffic moving in that direction from the point
where the sign is planted, onwards; it doesn't apply _before_ you
reach the sign.
That is true of speed limits, stop signs, etc. as well as "no parking"
signs. Of course, to comply with a speed limit sign that reduces the
limit from the previous section of road, you will have to begin
slowing down to the new limit _before_ you reach the sign, otherwise
you WILL be going over the limit _after_ you reach the sign. Many,
but not all, jurisdictions require a helpful "reduced speed ahead"
sign to warn you of an upcoming lower limit so you can begin slowing
down in advance.
I dunno about your neighborhood, but everywhere I have lived, the "no
parking" signs either (1) face oncoming traffic, so that they apply to
an entire lot or street _ahead_ of the sign (e.g. a "no parking
without permit" sign at the entrance to a parking lot reserved for
those with the proper stickers, or a cul-de-sac reserved for
residents) or, (2) for streetside parallel parking, the signs face 90
degrees to the direction of traffic and have ARROWS on them,
indicating their effective direction, whether forward in your
direction of travel, back the way you came from, or both ways (with a
double-headed arrow). If it's one of those kind, maybe that's what
the cop meant, i.e. if the sign says "no parking" anywhere to the east
of that sign (indicated by an arrow on the sign, not in words), then
you can't park anywhere east of that sign, on that side of the road,
until you get to the sign that says "no parking west of this sign"
which indicates the end of the no-parking zone, even if you can't see
the sign at the far east end when you enter from the west. Or if the
sign said "no parking" with a double-headed arrow, that means "no
parking" as far as you can see in each direction, at least until you
come to a single-arrow sign that marks one end or another of the no-
parking zone, thus:
NO PARKING NO PARKING NO PARKING
--------> <---------> <--------
If you were parked anywhere near the middle sign, that is in fact one
correct interpretation of what you quote the cop as saying. Maybe
you could clarify what you meant, what the cop actually said, and what
the signs actually show.. By all means, if you do decide to contest
this ticket in court, you will want to bring photos of the actual
signs to show the judge, if they don't do what you think the cop meant
they do and if they reasonably led you to think that it was OK to park
where you parked.
--
This posting is for discussion purposes, not professional advice.
Anything you post on this Newsgroup is public information.
I am not your lawyer, and you are not my client in any specific legal
matter.
For confidential professional advice, consult your own lawyer in a
private communication.
Mike Jacobs
LAW OFFICE OF W. MICHAEL JACOBS
10440 Little Patuxent Pkwy #300
Columbia, MD 21044
(tel) 410-740-5685 (fax) 410-740-4300
Mike
As in a lot of cases, "it depends."
If the sign says "no parking" then it's probably anywhere that you can
see the sign from and that's along the same curb line (i.e. it's not
going to apply around the corner from the sign) that's not allowed for
parking.
If it says "no parking from here to corner" or "no parking between
signs" or "no parking this side of sign" THEN it'd only apply to that
specific area.
Michael
this group is appropriate as I am looking for a certain law.
I live in USA, Massachusetts.
Which law(s) describe(s) where a road sign is effective?
Until recently I assumed that the sign is valid from where the sign is
placed until next intersection. Today I was told by a cop who ticketed
me that the "No parking" sign is valid as long as it may be seen (I'e
I cannot park if I see the sign ahead of me, even if there are none
behind me). Is it bunch of baloney?
Thanks!
P.S.: I asked this question earlier and forgot where I posted it.
Could not find my posting and answers (if any).
I would appreciate if you replied to mkog...@rcn.com (remove 32).
:o)
John F. Carr
Massachusetts police are generally ignorant of traffic law.
That doesn't mean they are wrong in all cases. Anybody can
guess right sometimes.
In Massachusetts parking restrictions are set by local
ordinance or by regulation in the case of state highways.
There should be a written rule saying where parking is
prohibited. That rule controls, subject to the requirement
that proper signs are posted in the case of a rule that is
not generally applicable.
My city had to stop writing parking tickets on one street
after a car owner showed that there was no ordinance
prohibiting parking. The no parking signs were just
decorative bits of metal.
The legal requirements for placement of parking signs can be
found here:
http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/HTM/2003r1/part2/part2b3.htm#section2B39
This is a federal standard which has been adopted as the state
standard by the Massachusetts Highway Department pursuant to General
Laws chapter 85 section 2. You will find that many standards are
not absolute rules but merely best practices.
There are some parking restrictions that are in effect without
being posted, much like there are speed limits in effect on
roads without speed limit signs. For example, one may not
park on a state highway or on the roadway in a rural district
except where signs permit parking. One may not park so as to
leave less than 10 feet for passing traffic (12 feet on a
state highway). One may not park near driveways, fire
hydrants, and intersections. Etc.
Whether the parking restriction in your particular case was
adequately posted, I'm not going to guess.
--
John Carr (j...@mit.edu)