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Frivolous lawsuits
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Bernie Cosell
Nov 2, 2022, 3:44:03 PM11/2/22
to
What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it *was*.
Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
/Bernie\
--
Bernie Cosell Fantasy Farm Fibers
ber...@fantasyfarm.com Pearisburg, VA
--> Too many people, too few sheep <--
meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it *was*.
Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
/Bernie\
--
Bernie Cosell Fantasy Farm Fibers
ber...@fantasyfarm.com Pearisburg, VA
--> Too many people, too few sheep <--
Barry Gold
Nov 2, 2022, 5:59:41 PM11/2/22
to
On 11/2/2022 12:44 PM, Bernie Cosell wrote:
> What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
> meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
> filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
> remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
> and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
> response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*.
>
> Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
> to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
The Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, rule 11, provides for sanctions
> What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
> meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
> filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
> remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
> and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
> response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*.
>
> Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
> to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
against anyone who files any frivolous argument or fails to do "due
diligence" with respect to the "facts" that they allege in their papers.
Sanctions can include fines, dismissal of some of the claims, or
dismissal of the entire case. Sometimes "costs" (the amount the
defendant/respondent had to spend to refute the frivolous claims) can be
assessed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Rules_of_Civil_Procedure
And rule 3.1 of the Model Rules of Professional Conduct (aka lawyer's
ethics) says:
A lawyer shall not bring or defend a proceeding, or assert or controvert
an issue therein, unless there is a basis in law and fact for doing so
that is not frivolous, which includes a good faith argument for an
extension, modification or reversal of existing law.
Presumably the lawyers could be subject to discipline: public or private
reprimands, fines, suspension of their license to practice law, even
complete disbarment.
--
I do so have a memory. It's backed up on DVD... somewhere...
Roy
Nov 2, 2022, 7:22:49 PM11/2/22
to
Rick
Nov 2, 2022, 8:27:15 PM11/2/22
to
"Bernie Cosell" wrote in message
news:a9r4mhd8ol1cc018p...@4ax.com...
failing to follow procedures or something similar
--
news:a9r4mhd8ol1cc018p...@4ax.com...
>
>What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
>meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
>filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
>remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
>and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
>response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it *was*.
>
Well if not fraud, then I suppose they could be alleging incompetence or
>What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
>meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
>filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
>remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
>and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
>response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it *was*.
>
failing to follow procedures or something similar
--
Stuart O. Bronstein
Nov 4, 2022, 6:10:22 PM11/4/22
to
Bernie Cosell <ber...@fantasyfarm.com> wrote:
> What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous
> lawsuits. I'd meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess:
> lawyers for Trump were filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just
> thrown out entirely. I remember one that amused me: Rudy
> Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania and the judge asked him "Is
> this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his response "no, your honor",
> which left me wondering just what it *was*.
>
> Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what
> seemed to me to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some
> punishment/penalty?
In my experience there is generally little or no punishment for
> What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous
> lawsuits. I'd meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess:
> lawyers for Trump were filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just
> thrown out entirely. I remember one that amused me: Rudy
> Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania and the judge asked him "Is
> this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his response "no, your honor",
> which left me wondering just what it *was*.
>
> Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what
> seemed to me to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some
> punishment/penalty?
frivolous lawsuits. In extreme cases the plaintiff might be required
to pay the defendant's attorney's fees and court costs. But in general
that's pretty much the extent of it.
--
Stu
http://DownToEarthLawyer.com
Stuart O. Bronstein
Nov 5, 2022, 12:11:21 PM11/5/22
to
Jethro_uk <jeth...@hotmailbin.com> wrote in
news:tk59ma$2c0gt$2...@dont-email.me:
> Occasionally in the UK there will be a story where (usually
> neighbours) escalate a dispute to the courts and the judge will
> make each side pay their own costs to make a point. Hedges, fences
> and trees are the main cause ...
Each side paying their own costs is the rule in the US, so that
wouldn't be punishment here.
--
Stu
http://DownToEarthLawyer.com
news:tk59ma$2c0gt$2...@dont-email.me:
> neighbours) escalate a dispute to the courts and the judge will
> make each side pay their own costs to make a point. Hedges, fences
> and trees are the main cause ...
Each side paying their own costs is the rule in the US, so that
wouldn't be punishment here.
--
Stu
http://DownToEarthLawyer.com
Bernie Cosell
Nov 6, 2022, 10:27:00 AM11/6/22
to
Barry Gold <bg...@labcats.org> wrote:
} On 11/2/2022 12:44 PM, Bernie Cosell wrote:
} > What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
} > meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
} > filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
} > remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
} > and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
} > response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*.
} >
} > Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
} > to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
}
} The Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, rule 11, provides for sanctions
} against anyone who files any frivolous argument or fails to do "due
} diligence" with respect to the "facts" that they allege in their papers.
Is what you're telling me that *not*one* of the scores of ridiculous,
} On 11/2/2022 12:44 PM, Bernie Cosell wrote:
} > What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous lawsuits. I'd
} > meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess: lawyers for Trump were
} > filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were just thrown out entirely. I
} > remember one that amused me: Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania
} > and the judge asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his
} > response "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*.
} >
} > Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what seemed to me
} > to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some punishment/penalty?
}
} The Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, rule 11, provides for sanctions
} against anyone who files any frivolous argument or fails to do "due
} diligence" with respect to the "facts" that they allege in their papers.
untethered from reality, lawsuits that were filed in the wake of the 2020
elections rose to the level of incurring sanctions? If so, there's not
much in the way of teeth of those rules.
Stuart O. Bronstein
Nov 6, 2022, 12:17:10 PM11/6/22
to
Bernie Cosell <ber...@fantasyfarm.com> wrote:
some reason most judges are reluctant to impose sanctions unless the
suit or actions of the parties, are just so ridiculous that no
reasonable person would be able to help but laugh out loud.
--
Stu
http://DownToEarthLawyer.com
> Barry Gold <bg...@labcats.org> wrote:
> Bernie Cosell wrote:
> } > What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous
> lawsuits. I'd } > meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess:
> lawyers for Trump were } > filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were
> just thrown out entirely. I } > remember one that amused me:
> Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania } > and the judge
> asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his } > response
> "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*. } >
> } > Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what
> seemed to me } > to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some
> punishment/penalty? }
> } The Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, rule 11, provides for
> sanctions } against anyone who files any frivolous argument or
> fails to do "due } diligence" with respect to the "facts" that
> they allege in their papers.
>
> Is what you're telling me that *not*one* of the scores of
> ridiculous, untethered from reality, lawsuits that were filed in
> the wake of the 2020 elections rose to the level of incurring
> sanctions? If so, there's not much in the way of teeth of those
> rules.
It's not that no lawsuits rise to the level of sanctions. But for
> Bernie Cosell wrote:
> } > What is the standard, and punishment, for filing frivolous
> lawsuits. I'd } > meant to ask this in the wake of the 2020 mess:
> lawyers for Trump were } > filing lawsuit after lawsuit that were
> just thrown out entirely. I } > remember one that amused me:
> Rudy Guiliani had filed one in Pennsylvania } > and the judge
> asked him "Is this a lawsuit alleging fraud?" and his } > response
> "no, your honor", which left me wondering just what it*was*. } >
> } > Could/should some [many?] of the lawyers that had filed what
> seemed to me } > to be frivolous lawsuits have incurred some
> punishment/penalty? }
> } The Federal Rules of Civil Procedure, rule 11, provides for
> sanctions } against anyone who files any frivolous argument or
> fails to do "due } diligence" with respect to the "facts" that
> they allege in their papers.
>
> Is what you're telling me that *not*one* of the scores of
> ridiculous, untethered from reality, lawsuits that were filed in
> the wake of the 2020 elections rose to the level of incurring
> sanctions? If so, there's not much in the way of teeth of those
> rules.
some reason most judges are reluctant to impose sanctions unless the
suit or actions of the parties, are just so ridiculous that no
reasonable person would be able to help but laugh out loud.
--
Stu
http://DownToEarthLawyer.com
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