Can my employer "Eliminate" my position while advertising for it elsewhere?
R
10 years. Two weeks ago my position was "Eliminated" and I was let go.
I come to find out they are advertising for my "Eliminated" position
in a different area of the country. Can I make trouble for them?
grendal
Probably not.
You don't really give enough information to make any sort of informed
opinion.
There are legitimate reasons that would allow a company to relocate a
job.
There are illegal reasons like age discrimination that would be
actionable.
But without knowing more specifics, the short answer is going to be
no.
You don't mention where you live, or what type of work you did. It
could be that they wanted to consolidate the work to a less expensive
location. This would be legit.
You don't mention if others of similar age were also let go. If so,
there may be some grounds for age discrimination.
Did they mention that they were moving the work to another location,
offer you the job, but balked at paying your relocation expenses?
If your team is geographically dispersed, what's happening to the rest
of them?
While you may be angry, I suggest you get more facts, not only about
your situation, hearing what is happening to others in the company
(ies) and see if there is a connection.
Once you get your facts together, then talk to a lawyer who
specializes in employment law.
Stan K
(Disclaimer: IANAL) My understanding of applicable laws is that
unless you can prove that your dismissal was for a reason covered by
any applicable Federal or State Civil Rights law, there's really
nothing you can do. Also, as I understand a recent court decision, if
you allege age discrimination, you have to prove that it was ONLY
because of your age (i.e., if the company can show that something
else, like job performance, was "also" a factor, you'll lose).
In addition, if you've been offered a severance package (on the
condition, of course, that you agree, among other things, that your
dismissal wasn't due to any reason covered by any Civil Rights laws),
if you "make trouble", the company will withdraw the offer of the
package, probably on the grounds that you cost them money by making
them investigate your assertions (this actually happened to someone I
once worked with).
Mike Jacobs
Talk to a local anti-discrimination lawyer. This is a common ploy of
companies trying to get rid of older workers without arousing the
suspicions of the laid-off employee that a younger person will be
taking his place. If that's truly what they are doing, you may have a
good age discrimination claim.
Talk to friends and family who have hired lawyers in the past whom
they trust and whose opinions they respect, even if it was in a
different area of law. Call those lawyers, and ask them who they
would go to for your type of case. Once you start getting the same
few names referred to you, you will know who the "go to" lawyers in
your area are for this case.\
Call and make an appointment. Ask in advance what it will cost -
most discrimination lawyers _do_ ask for some fees up front, to cover
their initial investigation costs, although some will offer at least a
free first consultation to see if they want to take the case. Have a
realistic goal of what you want to accomplish by suing - get your job
back? Get an award of back pay or front pay to cover the income
you've lost? If you have a new job already, does it pay you more, or
less, than the old one? Were your job evaluations consistently
positive, or did the employer have some criticisms that they might use
to try to justify your firing? Be ready to discuss all these things
with your lawyer. Good luck,
--
This posting is for discussion purposes, not professional advice.
Anything you post on this Newsgroup is public information.
I am not your lawyer, and you are not my client in any specific legal
matter.
For confidential professional advice, consult your own lawyer in a
private communication.
Mike Jacobs
LAW OFFICE OF W. MICHAEL JACOBS
10440 Little Patuxent Pkwy #300
Columbia, MD 21044
(tel) 410-740-5685 (fax) 410-740-4300
Robert Bonomi
Were you an "at will' employee? Could _you_ quit the position at any time,
without repercussions?
If the answer to those questions is 'yes', the employer _is_ free to
terminate your employment at any time, for any reason (or even 'no'
reason). At _most_, depending on the reason, you are entitled to
'unemployment' compensation from the state, but you must file for ti,
it is -not- automatic.
Were you covered by a collective bargaining contract, or a personal employment
contract?
If the answer to either of those questions is 'yes', you need to read
the relevant contract _carefully_. Probably you will need to consult
a legal professional.
Are you willing to relocate -- at your own expense -- to where the job
is currently being offered?
If the answer to that question is 'no', you may simply be SOL.
If 'yes', apply for the opening -- you have years of experience _within_
the company that should be worth a premium.
Now, *IF* -- and it is a =big= if -- you can show that your termination was
based _solely_ on 'age' (or a directly age-related issue), you have possible
grounds for action. Caveat: proving age discrimination is _VERY_ difficult,
without assistance from 'inside' the company.
o
Deadrat
@a21g2000yqc.googlegroups.com:
I assme that they aren't just advertaising in a different area of the
country, but that they are advertising for a position in a different area
of the country. In that case, they really did eliminate your position. At
least where you live now.
Unless you have a contract that specifies otherwise, the company may do
that. Unless, of course, they have eliminated your position because of
your membership in a protected class. Age, possibly. If you can show that
they eliminated your position as a ruse to get rid of an older worker, then
you may sue the company for age discrimination. This is hard to do unless
you can show a pattern of "eliminating" positions occupied by older workers
and hiring younger ones to replace them.
Old means 40 or older.
Good luck.
Gordon Burditt
Have you tried applying for the job in the different area of the
country? Did they refuse your application? Has someone other than
you been hired for that position already? If your application is
still pending, you may be complaining too early.
In many states, you can be laid off for no reason or any reason
besides a specific prohibited reason (race, age, religious preference,
etc.), assuming you don't have a written employment contract (think
professional baseball players or CEOs) or a union contract. This
is called "employment at will". It also means you can quit without
notice. Some legitimate reasons for what they did might be:
- Not wanting to pay for your relocation according to their relocation policy.
- You showed up for work on time all the time.
- Your name (or position) got hit with the dart on the Dart Board of Layoffs.
- Your taste in ties sucks (or doesn't suck).
- The boss decided to fire the next person who walked into his office,
and you did.
If you can prove a pattern of elimination of positions held by older
workers, you might have a case for age discrimination. It may be
illegal to lay someone off to prevent them from vesting in pension
rights. Did this apply to you? (something would have vested at
10 years?) It will be difficult to prove this unless it happened
to several other people also.
Mark A
news:75aafffa-b34b-452d...@a21g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
Unless you had an employment contract that does not allow them to do so,
they are within their legal rights to fire you at will. Some states require
proper notice be given prior to a layoff of a certain number of persons, but
that does not sound like the case here. So it is extremely unlikely that you
can make "legal" trouble for them.
Mike Jacobs
> R <raburd...@gmail.com> wrote in news:75aafffa-b34b-452d-ac7f-9932ddaaa244
> @a21g2000yqc.googlegroups.com:
>
> > I come to find out they are advertising for my "Eliminated" position
> > in a different area of the country. Can I make trouble for them?
>
> I assme that they aren't just advertaising in a different area of the
> country, but that they are advertising for a position in a different area
> of the country.
Okay, I hadn't thought of that angle in my previous post on this
thread. I perceived OP as saying that the position and location
still existed and remained the same, but that the company had fired
him and was advertising for the exact same position (his exact same
desk and chair, maybe), deviously placing those ads in media markets
where they thought OP was unlikely to see the ads and become aware
that he was being undermined. But, as you note, his post was
ambiguous - did he mean the company was just "advertising ... in a
different area of the country" for "my" same position, or were they
advertising for a "position in a different area of the country?" I
assumed the former, based in large part on OP's choice of words, his
calling it "_my_ position" that they were advertising for. But,
perhaps I gave OP too much credit for actually thinking about the full
import of the words he used. Unconscious ambiguities abound, and
Deadrat just uncovered one that I had missed.
> �In that case, they really did eliminate your position. �At
> least where you live now.
Agreed, _if_ the company in fact moved the job to a different
geographic locale. They eliminated the position of "junior assistant
manager of product placement" in Podunk, East Dakota and created a
_new_ position of "junior assistant manager of product placement" in
Bumpkin, West Carolina.