The Right Wing Myth
K C
fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
about all the religions.
It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
by force? In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
to impose Christianity on the masses? I'd dispute that it was ever
true (even in the Crusades) but it definitely hasn't happened in
hundreds of years, to my knowledge.
What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
said we should have all kids pray to Jesus? What about calling for
flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
be baptized....right?
No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
not ever the case. In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
in spite of it.
However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders. Where
are the calls for this to change on this group?
I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
real and harsh? Any answers?
Gray Shockley
(in message <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com>):
> This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this.
Oh, golly; you don't realize what you just asked for!
Would you ask the people responding to this if they'll please stop at one
thousand quotes so that this ng doesn't totally bog down with the quotations?
Gray Shockley
--------------------------
"Swinehood hath no remedy." - Sidney Lanier
In The Darkness
> This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> about all the religions.
Most of them know it from first hand experience.
And links like:
http://www.americanchristianhistory.com/constitution01.html
Desperately trying to prove that Xianism was somehow
the basis or our nation.
Oh, that and things like the Abortion laws, whose primary
argument against, is really hidden Xianism.
Not to mention, the anti-marriage actions around the US
lead by.... you guessed it. Xians.
> It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
> Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
> by force? In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
> to impose Christianity on the masses? I'd dispute that it was ever
> true (even in the Crusades) but it definitely hasn't happened in
> hundreds of years, to my knowledge.
How many countries _Formed_ in the past several
hundred years.... at least countries of any size ?
Fallacy resides as a basis of your argument.
> What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
> was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
> said we should have all kids pray to Jesus? What about calling for
> flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
> be baptized....right?
No, just have kids indoctrinated with their erroneous beliefs.
> No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
> not ever the case. In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
> religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
> in spite of it.
Patrick convinced himself of that because of his -own- beliefs,
not because he was accurate.
> However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
> being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
> taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
> they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders. Where
> are the calls for this to change on this group?
In the form of cruise missiles, flying up their rearends ?
> I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
> members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
> exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
Islam isn't forcing it's religion down the US throats, hence
the lack of complaints.
This is about America, not her neighbors.
> What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
> Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
> two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
> real and harsh? Any answers?
First off, "non-present" is in error, secondly, Islamic oppression
isn't oCCURING this continent.
But, we will fight it, as well, when it arrives.
Cary Kittrell
<This group is rich with people that think the Christian
<fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
<other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
<produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
<are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
<about all the religions.
Actually, every time this is brought up, several on the liberal
side chimes in to say that teaching /about/ religion, as
an academic subject, is a fine idea.
Three posts so far, this time around.
And you never acknowledge these responses. One wonders why. Would it
rob you of the mantle of victimhood? That's a stereotypical
leftist thing to do, you know: assuming the victim's role
without adequate cause.
One wonders if you will even acknowledge this very post.
<
<It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
<Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
<by force? In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
<to impose Christianity on the masses? I'd dispute that it was ever
<true (even in the Crusades) but it definitely hasn't happened in
<hundreds of years, to my knowledge.
<
<What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
<was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
<said we should have all kids pray to Jesus?
The last time anyone said we should put prayers back in school.
The people who call for this are not assuming the the kids
will be then praying to Lord Ganesha.
<What about calling for
<flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
<be baptized....right?
<
<No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
<not ever the case. In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
<religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
<in spite of it.
Not ever the case? The history of Europe can be read as a
set of ongoing wars fought by Christians against other
Christians because one perceived that the other had
the wrong flavor of Christianity.
And then there were the massacres.
And the Inquisition.
<
<However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
<being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
<taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
<they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders. Where
<are the calls for this to change on this group?
<
<I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
<members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
<exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
<What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
<Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
<two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
<real and harsh? Any answers?
Sure. We in this group respond to topics brought up by posters
in this group. When's the last time you saw a post here urging
government support for midrashes? When's the last time anyone
said the Constitution implied that the kids could get down
and bow to Mecca several times a day? When's the last time
that someone posted here suggesting that monuments to the
Qran and the Haddith belonged in courthouses?
If such were suggested, you can be sure that you would see
denunciations of the idea.
Incidentally, lest you think that secular humanists are indifferent
to secular power instituting religions other than Christianity,
you might subscribe to the email edition of the American Atheist
Newsletter, which regularly carries article on Islamic persecution
of such people as Taslima Nasrin (do you, with your concern about
Islamin persecution, even know who she is)?
Additionally, you might look into such secular humanist publications
as Free Inquiry, which recently carried a series of aritcles
on Islam and democracy.
Which I suggested to you before, in response to your request for
information on Islam.
Which (I thought helpful) suggestion you also never acknowledged.
Why is that?
One final suggestion to disabuse you of the idea that humanists
are indifferent to the problems with Islam: take a little
jaunt over to
www.prometheusboks.com
the most noted bookseller for books of interest to skeptics, humanists,
atheists, and other freethinkers. Click on "Islamic Studies". Most
or all of the titles you will find are quite critical of Islam.
Hope this helps.
-- cary
Bu...@awol.com
>This group is rich with people that think the Christian
>fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
>other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
>produce any quotes of Christians seeking this
Then you haven't read any Jerry Falwell, Dr David Dobson, Orel
Roberts, Pat Robertson's shit lately.
After Robertsons failed presidential bid, he gave lectures to his
intact campaign structure in how to go out and win elections to school
boards, county commissioners, mayor seats, aldermen, state and local
representatives of all sorts, SPECIFICALLY to fulfill an agenda of
enacting laws and regulations to "put god into government".
>
>It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
>Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
>by force? In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
>to impose Christianity on the masses?
The entire history of the Holy Roman Empire (after Rome became
"christian" was a series of FORCED religious indoctination. During
the "Dark Ages", the HRE was the ONLY government until the rise of
Nation States began to emerge. Western Civilization was a FORCED
religious government.
>
>What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
>was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
>said we should have all kids pray to Jesus?
The last time Dr Dobson, Jerry Falwell and/or Pat Robertson spoke.
>I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
>members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
>exist,
Noone gives a rat's ass about whether or not you worship as you do
But we do care that your sham religious nuttery isn't part of a
government sponsored activity.
========================================================================================================
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Carol Lee Smith
> In article <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com> writi...@yahoo.com (K C) writes:
> <This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> <fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> <other people's kids with Christianity.
Crusading to bring about Biblical law is objectionable, IMHO. I don't
suppose you consider what ex-judge Roy Moore did is any kind of a problem.
I think such government-endorsed action is proselytizing and an attempt to
indoctrinate.
> <The problem is, they cannot <produce any quotes of
> <Christians seeking this.
Much is on the web to substantiate what I have suggested. Someone else
will have to dig it up if you are google-challenged, because I leave
shortly to frolic with my infidel friends at our annual atheist orgy in
Colorado.
> <No, they just say we
> <are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> <about all the religions.
I am very interested for you to provide a referent for fundamentalists
advocating teaching aabout ALL THE RELIGIONS. Evidence is out there which
suggests they are extremely threatened and easily bent out of shape
(panties in a wad, etc., etc.) when schools present information of
religions which are not the majority persuasion.
> Actually, every time this is brought up, several on the liberal
> side chimes in to say that teaching /about/ religion, as
> an academic subject, is a fine idea.
Every chance I get, I suggest folks should check out the curriculum
materials at OABITAR.
> Three posts so far, this time around.
> And you never acknowledge these responses. One wonders why. Would it
> rob you of the mantle of victimhood? That's a stereotypical
> leftist thing to do, you know: assuming the victim's role
> without adequate cause.
> One wonders if you will even acknowledge this very post.
Or this.
<snip>
> The last time anyone said we should put prayers back in school.
> The people who call for this are not assuming the the kids
> will be then praying to Lord Ganesha.
Heavens to murgatroid. Or the invisible pink unicorn and the purple
seven-boobed cyclops.
> <What about calling for
> <flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
> <be baptized....right?
Huh?
> <No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
> <not ever the case. In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
> <religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
> <in spite of it.
Is that why some religious pols have stated publically that having freedom
of religion doesn't guarantee freedom from religion?
> Not ever the case? The history of Europe can be read as a
> set of ongoing wars fought by Christians against other
> Christians because one perceived that the other had
> the wrong flavor of Christianity.
> And then there were the massacres.
> And the Inquisition.
> <However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
> <being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
> <taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
> <they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders. Where
> <are the calls for this to change on this group?
It is frequently pointed out that religion is responsible for many
horrors. What are you doing to promote rationality and critical thinking?
> <I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
> <members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
> <exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
> <What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
> <Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
> <two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
> <real and harsh? Any answers?
Isn't it pecular to you that you hear Bush wax prophetic about the
importance of separation of religion and government in Iraq, but he
promotes just the opposite here?
Why is that?
Have you written him any letters to tell him you think separation is
better for government and better for religion?
<snip>
> If such were suggested, you can be sure that you would see
> denunciations of the idea.
> Incidentally, lest you think that secular humanists are indifferent
> to secular power instituting religions other than Christianity,
> you might subscribe to the email edition of the American Atheist
> Newsletter,
Or the Atheist Daily Briefing from the Atheist Law Center.
> which regularly carries article on Islamic persecution
> of such people as Taslima Nasrin (do you, with your concern about
> Islamin persecution, even know who she is)?
She is speaking (again) over the weekend in Colorado at the convention of
the Atheist Alliance. I recommend her book.
What did our government about Younus Shaikh who was imprisoned for about
three years in Pakistan under false charges of blasphemy?
> Additionally, you might look into such secular humanist publications
> as Free Inquiry, which recently carried a series of aritcles
> on Islam and democracy.
> Which I suggested to you before, in response to your request for
> information on Islam.
> Which (I thought helpful) suggestion you also never acknowledged.
> Why is that?
> One final suggestion to disabuse you of the idea that humanists
> are indifferent to the problems with Islam: take a little
> jaunt over to
> www.prometheusboks.com
I think you left out an <o>
> the most noted bookseller for books of interest to skeptics, humanists,
> atheists, and other freethinkers. Click on "Islamic Studies". Most
> or all of the titles you will find are quite critical of Islam.
I recommend the books of Kanan Makiya.
> Hope this helps.
One would think it would make a world of differenct if people would
investigate rather than believe what comes out of the mouths of Falwell,
Robertson, and others of their ilk.
But that would require a miracle.
"Without faith we might relapse into scientific or rational thinking,
which leads by a slippery slope toward constitutional democracy."
-- Robert Anton Wilson
Cary Kittrell
<On Tue, 6 Apr 2004, Cary Kittrell wrote:
<
<
<> One final suggestion to disabuse you of the idea that humanists
<> are indifferent to the problems with Islam: take a little
<> jaunt over to
<> www.prometheusboks.com
<
<I think you left out an <o>
What? You think they're O'Prometheus Books, like O'Reilly Books?
Actually of course, you're correct:
www.prometheusbooks.com
Have a trippy trip. And tell us all about it.
-- cary
Magi D. Shepley
K C wrote:
> This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> about all the religions.
I can produce PLENTY of quotes from Jerry Fallwell and others of his ilk
saying that if you're not Christian that you're going to hell. I do
believe that it was a right-wing Christian who said that 9/11 was the
fault of the Jews. Is that enough for you, or should I dig deeper? I
grew up in the "northern Bible Belt", and was told many times by many
"good Christians" that I was going to hell. Once I got older, I always
smiled and told them that since I didn't believe in Hell, I must not be
going there, and they'd need to find somewhere else for me to be. Most
of them never understood that.
>
> It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
> Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
> by force?
Let's see... most African nations, Hawaii (though not a nation), Japan
and parts of China. All invaded by Christian missionaries.
In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
> to impose Christianity on the masses? I'd dispute that it was ever
> true (even in the Crusades) but it definitely hasn't happened in
> hundreds of years, to my knowledge.
Your knowledge is VERY dated, obviously. The Boxer Rebellion in China?
Ever heard of it? Weren't Christian missionaries involved? How about
all the missionaries who "minister" to the poor tribes in Central and
South America?
>
> What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
> was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
> said we should have all kids pray to Jesus?
Newt Gingrich. Jerry Fallwell. The Christian Coalition.
What about calling for
> flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
> be baptized....right?
I've never seen any Christian flag in any church that I've been in or
passed.
>
> No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
> not ever the case. In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
> religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
> in spite of it.
>
Of course it fits the Christian religion, and the Arab religion, and the
Jewish religion. It fits ALL right-wing versions of EVERY religion.
Including atheism.
> However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
> being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
> taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
> they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders.
Where in the US is Islam being forced on students? Surely, you're not
going to point to the district in California using that role-playing
text about Islam? Where parents had the option to opt out?
Where
> are the calls for this to change on this group?
>
EVerywhere. Bob and others have consistantly said that teaching ABOUT
religion is fine, teaching OF a religion is wrong. Comparative religion
classes are fine; you want prayer in your school, go to a religious school.
> I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
> members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
> exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
> What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
> Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
> two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
> real and harsh? Any answers?
The same President who declared a national day of CHRISTIAN prayer.
Yea, I trust his motives. Not.
MAgi
Byron Canfield
news:e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com...
> This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> about all the religions.
Except you don't want ones that conflict with christianity, right?
>
> It is humorous (truely..makes me laugh) that they attach this to
> Christians. Look around the world. How many countries are Christian
> by force? In fact, when was the last time that any nation used force
> to impose Christianity on the masses?
So far, in every military conflict in which the United States has engaged
for the last 100 years, it has been claimed that "God is on our side",
spoken so eloquently by self-righteous professed christians. What would you
call that?
> I'd dispute that it was ever
> true (even in the Crusades) but it definitely hasn't happened in
> hundreds of years, to my knowledge.
You knowledge of history is severly lacking. Maybe you should read something
OTHER than the bible, eh?
>
> What about just Christian imposition of beliefs (without force)? When
> was the last time that any political group, anywhere in the country,
> said we should have all kids pray to Jesus?
I would venture sometime within that past hour, given the proclivities of
such as Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson.
> What about calling for
> flying the Christian flag? Surely, they are demanding that children
> be baptized....right?
I'm sure you would demand that if you thought you could get away with it.
>
> No, this kind of oppression does not fit the Christian religion and is
> not ever the case.
Pure bunk.
> In fact, Patick Henry said that we have freedom of
> religion for other faiths in the country BECAUSE of Christianity, not
> in spite of it.
We've already been through that and debunked it. Are you going to argue in
circles now?
>
> However, if we want to talk about religious oppression. Islam is
> being enforce on kids all over the world right now. Kids are being
> taught (with government funds) only one faith (Islam) and in Palestine
> they are being taught to make bombs by those religious leaders. Where
> are the calls for this to change on this group?
In which country is that? Or are you in need of some schooling in geography,
as well?
>
> I mean, really, Christianity has been attacked over and over by
> members of this group afraid of a Christian intolerance that doesn't
> exist, while they CHOOSE to ignore religious intolerance by Islam.
No, christians attempts to impose THEIR religion have been repelled. That
does not constitute attack (except in the minds, such as they are, of
fundamentalist christians).
> What's the deal? Why to the fight to harshly against a non-present
> Christian oppression in the USA but object when our President frees
> two countries, Afganistan and Iraq, from Islamic oppression that is
> real and harsh? Any answers?
Our country is not authorized to invade other countries, for religious
reasons or otherwise. You say our preseident has eliminated Islamic
oppression, but isn't that exactly what you said hasn't happened in hundreds
of years? Our nation, lead by a professed christian, entered into an illegal
war based on lies, and now the only justification you can offer up is that
they are not christian? What's the deal? Any answers?
Out of one side of you mouth, you say one thing. But out of the other side,
you say another. I believe there's a word for that -- could it be
"hypocrisy"?
This country has no position mandating what Islamic children are taught.
However, we can make DAMN sure that kind of mandated religious
indoctrination does NOT happen here.
You're right -- the imposition of christianity is not SUPPOSED to be part of
the agenda of christians, but it is obvious from many posts, including many
of yours that your agenda IS to mandate YOUR religion, which means one of
two things -- either you are not really a christian, or that is in fact, the
agenda of your particular denomination of christianity. Which is it?
--
Byron "Barn" Canfield
-----------------------------
"Politics is a strife of interests masquerading as a contest of principles."
-- Ambrose Bierce
Roger
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> about all the religions.
Doesn't matter.
Keep your beliefs to yourself. Don't use OUR government to force your
beliefs on others.
Gray Shockley
(in message <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com>):
> This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> produce any quotes of Christians seeking this.
"There can be no separation of Church and State."
--Rouas J. Rushdooney
"Christians are called upon by God to exercise dominion".
--pamphlet of the Christian
Reconstruction movement
"We must remove all humanists from public office and replace them
with pro-moral political leaders. The Bible says, 'When the Righteous
are in authority, the people rejoice.' "
--Tim LaHaye
"It is time to reject the godless Communistic definition of separation
of Church and State that says there is no place for Biblical moral law
in public policy."
--"Moral Majority Report"
"We are talking about Christianizing America."
--Paul Weyrich
"I have a Divine Mandate to go into the halls of Congress and fight
for laws that will save America."
--Jerry Falwell
"The Constitution was designed to perpetuate a Christian order."
--Christian Roundtable
"Christians, like slaves and soldiers, ask no questions."
--Jerry Falwell
"Freedom of speech has never been right. We've never had freedom of
speech in this country and we never should have."
--Rich Anguin
Minnesota Moral Majority
"We do not want a democracy in this country because if we have a
democracy a majority rules."
--Charles Stanly
Moral Majority Inc.
"Our Founding Fathers would not accept the tyranny of a democracy
because they recognized that the only sovereign over men and nations
was God."
--Jerry Falwell
"Let me tell you something else about the character of God. If
necessary, God would raise up a tyrant--a man who might not have the
best ethics--to protect the freedom and the interests of the ethical
and the godly."
--James Robison
"We are no longer working to preserve the status quo. We are
radicals, working to overturn the present power structures of this
country."
--Paul Weyrich
""The elitist-evolutionist-humanist is not going to be able to control
education in America forever."
--Tim LaHaye
Financier of the ICR
"The Bible says we are to rule. If you don't rule and I don't rule,
the atheists and the humanists and the agnostics are going to rule.
We should be the head of our school board. We should be the head of
our nation. We should be the Senators and the Congressmen. We should
be the editors of our newspapers. We should be taking over every area
of life."
--Bob Werner
Roger
news:0001HW.BC97B914...@news.giganews.com...
> On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 18:33:16 -0500, K C wrote
> (in message <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com>):
>
> > This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> > fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> > other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> > produce any quotes of Christians seeking this.
From http://www.religioustolerance.org/rel_plur.htm
"I want you to just let a wave of intolerance wash over you. I want you to
let a wave of hatred wash over you. Yes, hate is good...Our goal is a
Christian nation. We have a Biblical duty, we are called by God, to conquer
this country. We don't want equal time. We don't want pluralism." Randall
Terry, Founder of Operation Rescue. Reported by the News-Sentinel, Fort
Wayne, IN, 1993-AUG-16:
W. Stephen Lush
news:TUrcc.46974$Fl7....@newssvr25.news.prodigy.com...
> "K C" <writi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com...
> > This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> > fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> > other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> > produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> > are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> > about all the religions.
>
> Doesn't matter.
>
> Keep your beliefs to yourself. Don't use OUR government to force your
> beliefs on others.
Why not? It already teaches us to not be independent (welfare, medicaid),
not save for the future (soc. security), that how good you are at something
doesn't matter (affirmative action), and lying is ok (Bill Clinton) unless
you're some rich bitch no one will feel bad about (Martha Stewart).
But that's not a belief system... no...
Roger
news:c4tv7k$9ff$1...@usenet.cso.niu.edu...
No, it's being human. Even leaders are human.
Also, the Constitution prohibits government involvement in religion. It has
nothing to say about this other stuff.
Steve Hayes
>This group is rich with people that think the Christian
>fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
>other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
>produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
>are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
>about all the religions.
Which group?
You posted to four.
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/7734/stevesig.htm
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
bucke...@nopam.net
>:|This group is rich with people that think the Christian
>:|fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
>:|other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
>:|produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
>:|are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
>:|about all the religions.
How many quotes world you like from the dominions?
Do you even know who or what the dominions are?
Would 10, 25, 50, 100 more do?
I doubt it. They rely on people like you, blind to events so that they can
advance their causes.
However, speak up. Even though I am spending most my time recently getting
caught up finishing articles for the our web site, I can take the time off
to produce more evidence than you could ever hope to see or have to deal
with that there is a real threat out there. Even if you are blind to it or
even hope it is successful.
Thers is nothing mythical about the Christian Reconstructionists
(Dominions) The only question is, how far will they get before they are
stopped? How much will they alter or change America into their image of
waht it should be?
K C
1. People wanting general religion in government
and
2. Christians wanting a Christian nation but not mentioning
government.
My point holds. Christians want a Christian nation, not a Christian
government. Don't you understand the difference, oh wise ones?
http://beingone.20m.com/providence.html
"Roger" <rog...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<Puscc.47064$EO7....@newssvr25.news.prodigy.com>...
Roger
> 1. People wanting general religion in government
> and
> 2. Christians wanting a Christian nation but not mentioning
> government.
>
> My point holds. Christians want a Christian nation, not a Christian
> government. Don't you understand the difference, oh wise ones?
From http://www.religioustolerance.org/rel_plur.htm
Roger
news:40725d27....@news.saix.net...
> On 5 Apr 2004 16:33:16 -0700, writi...@yahoo.com (K C) wrote:
>
> >This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> >fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> >other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> >produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> >are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> >about all the religions.
>
> Which group?
>
> You posted to four.
You're talking about specifics. He talks in generalities.
Generally, he hates America the way it is. He wants the Christian Taliban to
run the country. He's looking for a legal excuse to make this happen.
Byron Canfield
> 1. People wanting general religion in government
> and
> 2. Christians wanting a Christian nation but not mentioning
> government.
>
> My point holds. Christians want a Christian nation, not a Christian
> government. Don't you understand the difference, oh wise ones?
We do, and we see the implications -- you quite apparently do not, or
pretend you do not.
Roger
news:Y9Acc.78511$gA5.965607@attbi_s03...
> "K C" <writi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com...
> > I see two things in the quotes below.
> > 1. People wanting general religion in government
> > and
> > 2. Christians wanting a Christian nation but not mentioning
> > government.
> >
> > My point holds. Christians want a Christian nation, not a Christian
> > government. Don't you understand the difference, oh wise ones?
>
> We do, and we see the implications -- you quite apparently do not, or
> pretend you do not.
I have no problem with a nation of Christians.
I do have a problem with a Christian nation.
I have a big problem with a nation of Christians wanting a Christian nation.
They don't understand what America is all about.
Cary Kittrell
Whoa! Good job. I'm pinning this one up on my net.refrigerator
for future reference.
-- cary
Magi D. Shepley
ideal, there.
Magi
K C
> K C wrote:
> > This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> > fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> > other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> > produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> > are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> > about all the religions.
>
> Most of them know it from first hand experience.
>
> And links like:
>
> http://www.americanchristianhistory.com/constitution01.html
>
> Desperately trying to prove that Xianism was somehow
> the basis or our nation.
>
> Oh, that and things like the Abortion laws, whose primary
> argument against, is really hidden Xianism.
>
> Not to mention, the anti-marriage actions around the US
> lead by.... you guessed it. Xians.
>
No quotes...and religious heritage is not the same as Christian only now...right?
K C
> In article <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com> writi...@yahoo.com (K C) writes:
> <This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> <fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> <other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> <produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> <are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> <about all the religions.
>
> Actually, every time this is brought up, several on the liberal
> side chimes in to say that teaching /about/ religion, as
> an academic subject, is a fine idea.
>
> Three posts so far, this time around.
>
> And you never acknowledge these responses. One wonders why. Would it
> rob you of the mantle of victimhood? That's a stereotypical
> leftist thing to do, you know: assuming the victim's role
> without adequate cause.
>
> One wonders if you will even acknowledge this very post.
>
>
My post didn't apply to you, but you keep making yourself the victim.
One wonders why.
K C
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2004, Cary Kittrell wrote:
>
> > In article <e88a6c8b.04040...@posting.google.com> writi...@yahoo.com (K C) writes:
> > <This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> > <fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> > <other people's kids with Christianity.
>
> Crusading to bring about Biblical law is objectionable, IMHO. I don't
> suppose you consider what ex-judge Roy Moore did is any kind of a problem.
> I think such government-endorsed action is proselytizing and an attempt to
> indoctrinate.
>
> > <The problem is, they cannot <produce any quotes of
> > <Christians seeking this.
>
> Much is on the web to substantiate what I have suggested. Someone else
> will have to dig it up if you are google-challenged, because I leave
> shortly to frolic with my infidel friends at our annual atheist orgy in
> Colorado.
So, you can produce no quotes yourself?
K C
> On 5 Apr 2004 16:33:16 -0700, writi...@yahoo.com (K C) wrote:
>
> >This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> >fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> >other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> >produce any quotes of Christians seeking this
>
> Then you haven't read any Jerry Falwell, Dr David Dobson, Orel
> Roberts, Pat Robertson's shit lately.
>
> After Robertsons failed presidential bid, he gave lectures to his
> intact campaign structure in how to go out and win elections to school
> boards, county commissioners, mayor seats, aldermen, state and local
> representatives of all sorts, SPECIFICALLY to fulfill an agenda of
> enacting laws and regulations to "put god into government".
No quotes given and God in Gov is not the same as Christ only.
K C
> K C wrote:
> > This group is rich with people that think the Christian
> > fundamentalists are seeking to oppress the masses and indoctrinate
> > other people's kids with Christianity. The problem is, they cannot
> > produce any quotes of Christians seeking this. No, they just say we
> > are trying to hide our intentions, when we call for religious teaching
> > about all the religions.
> I can produce PLENTY of quotes from Jerry Fallwell and others of his ilk
> saying that if you're not Christian that you're going to hell. I do
> believe that it was a right-wing Christian who said that 9/11 was the
> fault of the Jews. Is that enough for you, or should I dig deeper? I
> grew up in the "northern Bible Belt", and was told many times by many
> "good Christians" that I was going to hell. Once I got older, I always
> smiled and told them that since I didn't believe in Hell, I must not be
> going there, and they'd need to find somewhere else for me to be. Most
> of them never understood that.
You produce not one quote that a Christian is seeking Christian only
favors from the government. All you show is that Christians believe
in Christianity...duh. And that They want God in Gov, but not
"Christ" specifially.
Also, it wasn't a Christian that said it was the jews in 911. It was
muslims, which you still lack condemnation for their indoctrination of
children. I wonder why?
Gray Shockley
(in message <c4ul09$h12$1...@oasis.ccit.arizona.edu>):
A collection that was on FidoNet some years ago. /gray//
A fuller quotation: "We are talking about Christianizing America. We are
talking about the Gospel in a political context."
-- Paul Weyrich
We have enough votes to run the country. And when the people say, "We've had
enough," we are going to take over.
- Pat Robertson
If Christian people work together, they can succeed during this decade in
winning back control of the institutions that have been taken from them over
the past 70 years. Expect confrontations that will be not only unpleasant but
at times physically bloody.... This decade will not be for the faint of
heart, but the resolute. Institutions will be plunged into wrenching change.
We will be living through one of the most tumultuous periods of human
history. When it is over, I am convinced God's people will emerge victorious.
- Pat Robertson
We at the Christian Coalition are raising an army who cares. We
are training people to be effective -- to be elected to school boards,
to city councils, to state legislatures, and to key positions in
political parties.... By the end of this decade, if we work and
give and organize and train, THE CHRISTIAN COALITION
WILL BE THE MOST POWERFUL POLITICAL
ORGANIZATION IN AMERICA.
- Pat Robertson
A Supreme Court ruling is not the Law of the United States. The law of the
United Sates is the Constitution, treaties made in accordance with the
Constitution, and laws duly enacted by the Congress and signed by the
president. And any of those things I would uphold totally with all of my
strength, whether I agreed with them or not.... I am bound by the laws of the
United States and all 50 states ... [but] I am not bound by any case or any
court to which I myself am not a party.... I don't think the Congress of the
United States is subservient to the courts.... They can ignore a Supreme
Court ruling if they so choose.
- Pat Robertson
TERM LIMITS FOR BROADCASTERS NEEDED
"The President whom we select should also publicly promise us that he will
name members of the Federal Communications Commission who will give us the
most important kind of term limits we could desire: term limits for broadcast
licenses, so that, at last, we can end the corrupt power of the left-wing
media, and turn the airwaves over to men and women like Paul Weyrich, Reed
Irvine, Don Wildmon, James Dobson, Brent Bozell, and Bev LaHaye.
- Stormfront White Nationalist Community