Fine article to email.
ted
> Id like to add that the entire labor market becomes depressed due to illegal workers.
Nope, just the dregs of the labor market.
> They work cheap not because they are mexican or because they are poor, but primarily because they are illegal. It
> significantly reduces their ability to ask higher wages. This first reduces the going wage in that specific labor
> market, and secondarily reduces the going wages in the labor market in general for that geographic area.
Nope, doesnt depress the wages of doctors, engineers or lawyers etc etc etc.
> Legal workers cant ask for more pay for farming (as example) when the employer can just go out and get illegals
> cheaper.
Yes, but it doesnt affect the wages of professionals.
> And people in other industries in the area also have reduced ability
> to tell their employer "Ill just go work for someone else if I cant
> get more pay here", since there are less choices of other places to
> go since some jobs choices are monopolized by cheap illegal labor.
There's plenty of jobs illegals dont get to do.
> Everyone that works for a living loses wages to a degree depending on how distant they are from the illegal jobs
> market.
Nope, professionals most obviously arent affected at all
and get to employ the illegals to do the menial work like
the lawns, wiping kids arses, cleaning the house, etc etc etc.
Its nothing like as black and white as you claim.
Which is still several steps up from a career welfare leech.
>
>> They work cheap not because they are mexican or because they are poor, but primarily because they are illegal. It
>> significantly reduces their ability to ask higher wages. This first reduces the going wage in that specific labor
>> market, and secondarily reduces the going wages in the labor market in general for that geographic area.
>
> Nope, doesnt depress the wages of doctors, engineers or lawyers etc etc etc.
>
>> Legal workers cant ask for more pay for farming (as example) when the employer can just go out and get illegals
>> cheaper.
>
> Yes, but it doesnt affect the wages of professionals.
>
>> And people in other industries in the area also have reduced ability
>> to tell their employer "Ill just go work for someone else if I cant
>> get more pay here", since there are less choices of other places to
>> go since some jobs choices are monopolized by cheap illegal labor.
>
> There's plenty of jobs illegals dont get to do.
>
>> Everyone that works for a living loses wages to a degree depending on how distant they are from the illegal jobs
>> market.
>
> Nope, professionals most obviously arent affected at all
> and get to employ the illegals to do the menial work like
> the lawns, wiping kids arses, cleaning the house, etc etc etc.
Still more work than you ever did, welfare boy.
Actually, it does. Since uninsured illegals use public hospitals, public
defenders, etc., doctors and lawyers and other professionals have to do a lot of
pro bono and/or low-compensation work that uses up time they could otherwise
devote to higher-paid work.
Perhaps in the area of unskilled labor, but that's about all. A
significant pool to be sure, but not as critical to the overall
economic picture as some would have us believe. Every job in this
country has a market clearing price, which can vary considerably
depending on where it is. Employers who want to stay in business
can't pay more than that, and employees who want to keep their jobs
better not expect more than that. Unless you have some sort of hard
to find technical or professional skill set, that these illegals
simply don't possess, telling your boss you're going somewhere else if
you don't get a raise will result in unemployment. Doesn't have
anything to do, in my opinion, with their status.
Regards,
Sarge
I never said it was black and white, I said everyone is affected to a
*degree* depending on how close they are to the job market that the illegals
work. Lawyers are so distant that the effect is not noticable, obviously.
Farmworkers are affected more than anyone else because they are right in the
labor market affected. Those are the two ends of the spectrum. Everyone in
between is affected more or less depending on where they are in the market.
You cant take a section of the labor market away without affecting the rest
of the labor market.
>>> Id like to add that the entire labor market becomes depressed due to illegal workers.
>> Nope, just the dregs of the labor market.
>> Nope, doesnt depress the wages of doctors, engineers or lawyers etc etc etc.
> Actually, it does.
Actually, it doesnt.
> Since uninsured illegals use public hospitals, public defenders, etc., doctors and lawyers and other professionals
> have to do a lot of pro bono and/or low-compensation work that uses
> up time they could otherwise devote to higher-paid work.
Pity about the teachers that have to teach their brats etc.
And the cops who get to deal with their crime, etc etc etc.
And the border guards, immigration paper shufflers etc etc etc.
>>> Everyone that works for a living loses wages to a degree depending on how distant they are from the illegal jobs
>>> market.
>> Nope, professionals most obviously arent affected at all
>> and get to employ the illegals to do the menial work like
>> the lawns, wiping kids arses, cleaning the house, etc etc etc.
>> Its nothing like as black and white as you claim.
> I never said it was black and white,
That para of yours now at the top is just that.
> I said everyone is affected to a *degree* depending on how close they are to the job market that the illegals work.
And that is just plain wrong, as I rubbed your nose in.
> Lawyers are so distant that the effect is not noticable, obviously.
Pity about cops, teachers, govt employees that deal with immigrants,
most obviously with those dealing with foreigners at airports, etc etc etc.
> Farmworkers are affected more than anyone else
> because they are right in the labor market affected.
Yes, SOME are affected, most obviously with the dregs of the labor market, as I said.
The problem is your silly claim that EVERYONE THAT WORKS FOR A LIVING is affected.
That is just plain wrong, hordes of them arent affected at all in the wages they get most
obviously with the bulk of the professions and even those like teachers and cops.
> Those are the two ends of the spectrum. Everyone in between is affected more or less depending on where they are in
> the market.
Wrong, hordes dont have their wages affected at all, most obviously with teachers and cops.
> You cant take a section of the labor market away without affecting the rest of the labor market.
Wrong again. And no section of the labor market is taken away either.
What would you know about working for a living,welfare boy?
> Wrong, hordes dont have their wages affected at all, most obviously with
> teachers and cops.
We disagree here. I claim that teachers and cops are somewhat affected and
you claim they are not affected at all. The basis for my claim is in the
logic I presented and the basis of your claim is simply your say-so.
>>>>> Everyone that works for a living loses wages to a degree depending on how distant they are from the illegal jobs
>>>>> market.
>>>> Nope, professionals most obviously arent affected at all
>>>> and get to employ the illegals to do the menial work like
>>>> the lawns, wiping kids arses, cleaning the house, etc etc etc.
>>>> Its nothing like as black and white as you claim.
>>> I never said it was black and white,
>> That para of yours now at the top is just that.
>>> I said everyone is affected to a degree depending on how close they are to the job market that the illegals work.
>> And that is just plain wrong, as I rubbed your nose in.
>>> Lawyers are so distant that the effect is not noticable, obviously.
>> Pity about cops, teachers, govt employees that deal with immigrants,
>> most obviously with those dealing with foreigners at airports, etc etc etc.
>>> Farmworkers are affected more than anyone else
>>> because they are right in the labor market affected.
>> Yes, SOME are affected, most obviously with the dregs of the labor market, as I said.
>> The problem is your silly claim that EVERYONE THAT WORKS FOR A LIVING is affected.
>> That is just plain wrong, hordes of them arent affected at all in the wages they get most
>> obviously with the bulk of the professions and even those like teachers and cops.
>>> Those are the two ends of the spectrum. Everyone in between is affected more or less depending on where they are in
>>> the market.
>> Wrong, hordes dont have their wages affected at all, most obviously with teachers and cops.
> We disagree here.
Your problem.
> I claim that teachers and cops are somewhat affected
They actually end up with better wages.
In the case of the teachers, because there are more brats to teach.
In the case of the cops, more criminals to deal with, quite a bit of the time on overtime etc.
> and you claim they are not affected at all.
> The basis for my claim is in the logic I presented
You didnt present a shred of 'logic' with those two groups and their wages.
> and the basis of your claim is simply your say-so.
You're lying, as always.
> Nope, doesnt depress the wages of doctors, engineers or lawyers etc etc
> etc.
Most of those guys are protected from int'l competition by guvmint or by
their own racket.
>> Nope, doesnt depress the wages of doctors, engineers or lawyers etc etc etc.
> Most of those guys are protected from int'l competition by guvmint or by their own racket.
Plenty of others arent and dont have their wages depressed by illegals either.