Grantha Lipi Display - Test Mail

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வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:25:17 AM1/10/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Hi Guys,

I had initially thought of sending HTML mails with images embedded,
but I suppose it would be disastrous for those who read the mails in
the webpage (that includes me). So, I am experimenting the usage of
Grantha in Plain Text.

This is a Test Mail regarding the display of Grantha Lipi. So, please
provide your feedback whether you are getting the display properly,
along with the browser that you are using, and where you are reading
the mail (Webpage/Inbox).

If possible, please attach a screenshot of your display.

So, I have to check whether Grantha gets displayed properly in the
browsers.

Please download Code 2000 Font: http://code2000.net/CODE2000.ZIP and
install it in your PC before proceeding to read this mail.

(You may have to increase the font size to read the characters
properly - Use Ctrl + + to increase the font size )

Test Text 1:

 
விநோத்³ ராஜந்

:-)

Test Text 2:

  
    
   
   

யே த⁴ர்மா ஹேதுப்ரப⁴வா
ஹேதுந் தேஷாம்² ததா²க³தோ ஹ்யவத³த் |
தேஷாம்² ச யோ நிரோத⁴
ஏவம்² வாதீ³ மஹாஸ்²ரமண‍: ||

V

N. Kannan

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:28:46 AM1/10/10
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No I can't read any Granta only squares!

K.>

2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh...@gmail.com>:

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:34:49 AM1/10/10
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Hmm..

You are using IE ?

This is the desired display (Google Chrome, with bigger font size )

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll301/vinodhrajan/Chrome_Bigger_font_size_grantha-1.jpg

V

On Jan 10, 5:28 pm, "N. Kannan" <navannak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> No I can't read any Granta only squares!
>
> K.>
>

> 2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com>:

N. Kannan

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:43:11 AM1/10/10
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No.
I use Avant
I do not use Google Chrome. I'm comfortable with Avant.

K.>

2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh...@gmail.com>:

N. Kannan

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:44:31 AM1/10/10
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BTW, if it is in unicode, should Gmail automatically display it? as it
is fully Unicode combatible (independent of browser?)

K.>

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:47:24 AM1/10/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Code2000 has Grantha in the PUA. of Unicode. Many browsers have
trouble displaying the PUA text. (including FF & IE )

I suppose, if we decide to write Grantha in Plain Text, people have to
switch to Google Chrome to view our mails :-)

V

On Jan 10, 5:44 pm, "N. Kannan" <navannak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> BTW, if it is in unicode, should Gmail automatically display it? as it
> is fully Unicode combatible (independent of browser?)
>
> K.>
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 9:43 PM, N. Kannan <navannak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > No.
> > I use Avant
> > I do not use Google Chrome. I'm comfortable with Avant.
>
> > K.>
>

> > 2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com>:

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:49:15 AM1/10/10
to மின்தமிழ்
> I suppose, if we decide to write Grantha in Plain Text, people have to
> switch to Google Chrome to view our mails :-)

I am not sure, how many people will be comfortable with this Idea

:-/

:-\

:-|

V

On Jan 10, 5:47 pm, வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Code2000 has Grantha in the PUA. of Unicode. Many browsers have
> trouble displaying the PUA text. (including FF & IE )
>

>

N. Kannan

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Jan 10, 2010, 7:52:46 AM1/10/10
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Not me!

K.>

ps. will it be a problem in Wiki as well?

2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh...@gmail.com>:

Tirumurti Vasudevan

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Jan 10, 2010, 11:12:51 AM1/10/10
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உபுண்டு லீனக்ஸ் பயர்பாக்ஸ் 3.5.7
அழகாகத்தெரிகிறது
:-))
திவாஜி

2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh...@gmail.com>
Hi Guys,
--
My blogs: [all in Tamil]
http://anmikam4dumbme.blogspot.com/
http://chitirampesuthati.blogspot.com/ photo blog now with english text too!
http://kathaikathaiyaam.blogspot.com/

BE HAPPY! LIFE IS TOO SHORT TO BE UNHAPPY!

Jean-Luc Chevillard

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Jan 10, 2010, 11:50:36 AM1/10/10
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Dear Vinodh,

my experience here in Paris is the following.

*1.*
when I first tried to read your message in Thunderbird 3.0,
my mail client,
I could only see rectangles giving the Hexadecimal codes.

*2.*
I then went to the MinTamil web site,
using Firefox 3.5.7, but there also I could only see rectangles
(I am a Windows XP [SP3] user)

*3.*
I decided to download Google Chrome in order to make a test
and it works fine: I can see the grantha letters.
My 16 year old son has been using Google Chrome for several months and
thinks it is great
and this shows that he is right :-)
we have a lot to learn from younger people!

Therefore,
I am now ready to follow your Sanskrit lessons

-- Jean-Luc

Hari Krishnan

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Jan 10, 2010, 8:54:24 PM1/10/10
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2010/1/10 Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.c...@gmail.com>

Dear Vinodh,

my experience here in Paris is the following.

*1.*
when I first tried to read your message in Thunderbird 3.0,
my mail client,
I could only see rectangles giving the Hexadecimal codes.

*2.*
I then went to the MinTamil web site,
using Firefox 3.5.7, but there also I could only see rectangles
(I am a Windows XP [SP3] user)

*3.*
I decided to download Google Chrome in order to make a test
and it works fine: I can see the grantha letters.
My 16 year old son has been using Google Chrome for several months and thinks it is great
and this shows that he is right :-)
we have a lot to learn from younger people!

Therefore,
I am now ready to follow your Sanskrit lessons

-- Jean-Luc


OTOH

I am using Google Chrome, which is my default browser.
I have installed Code 2000 as well as Code 2002.  I have been using these fonts for several years now.  Code 2002 is my Sans Serif Font for Google Chrome.

Despite these, I am not able to read the Grantha Lipi.  All that I can see is a row of rectangles.  

What fine tunings are required so that I may at least participate as a silent student?


--
அன்புடன்,
ஹரிகி.

N. Kannan

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:02:42 AM1/11/10
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On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Hari Krishnan
<hari.har...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am using Google Chrome, which is my default browser.
> I have installed Code 2000 as well as Code 2002.  I have been using these
> fonts for several years now.  Code 2002 is my Sans Serif Font for Google
> Chrome.
> Despite these, I am not able to read the Grantha Lipi.  All that I can see
> is a row of rectangles.
> What fine tunings are required so that I may at least participate as a
> silent student?
>

>>>>>

Vinoth:

I presume Google Chrome is not a browser but an add-on module that
functions with any browser, right? I should try it this evening.

However, when I tried Google Chrome on my daughters Laptop, no Tamil
was visible, in spite of having several Tamil Unicode fonts. Now
HariKi introduces other installations.

How exactly your Google Chrome should be set? to see Grantha? BTW, is
your grantha font is a unicode font?

Kannan

Geetha Sambasivam

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:05:13 AM1/11/10
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லீனக்ஸ்னா தெரியுமோ?? நானும் நெருப்பு நரிதான் பயன்படுத்தறேன்.
//Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-GB; rv:1.9.1.7) Gecko/20091221 Firefox/3.5.7//

ஒண்ணும் தெரியலை, கட்டம், கட்டமா இருக்கு. :(


2010/1/10 Tirumurti Vasudevan <agni...@gmail.com>
--
"Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage Foundation. Visit our website: http://www.tamilheritage.org; you may like to visit our Muthusom Blogs at: http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.html To post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to minTamil-u...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minTamil

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:11:45 AM1/11/10
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AFAIK

//I presume Google Chrome is not a browser but an add-on module that
functions with any browser, right? I should try it this evening. //

Google Chrome is a Complete Web Browser :-)

//However, when I tried Google Chrome on my daughters Laptop, no


Tamil
was visible, in spite of having several Tamil Unicode fonts. Now
HariKi introduces other installations.


How exactly your Google Chrome should be set? to see Grantha? BTW, is
your grantha font is a unicode font?

//

Code2002 is not needed.

Actually, No configuration is needed. Just install the Code2000 (may
be restart the system) ;

You must be able to see the Text in Chrome...

The Grantha Font is Unicode - but its in PUA. Thats the who issue
here :-(

Try this:

Copy tht text in Notepad/wordpad/Msword/ or any other wordprocessor
and set the font to Code2000.

else..

I can attach the PDF version with every message... & may be the .txt
version too..

V

On Jan 11, 1:02 pm, "N. Kannan" <navannak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Hari Krishnan
>

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:13:39 AM1/11/10
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Geetha,

It wont display in Firefox.

You have to switch to Chome ( I presume you guys have the font
installed )

http://www.google.com/chrome

V

On Jan 11, 1:05 pm, Geetha Sambasivam <geethasmbs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> லீனக்ஸ்னா தெரியுமோ?? நானும் நெருப்பு நரிதான் பயன்படுத்தறேன்.
> //Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-GB; rv:1.9.1.7) Gecko/20091221
> Firefox/3.5.7//
>
> ஒண்ணும் தெரியலை, கட்டம், கட்டமா இருக்கு. :(
>

> 2010/1/10 Tirumurti Vasudevan <agnih...@gmail.com>


>
>
>
> > உபுண்டு லீனக்ஸ் பயர்பாக்ஸ் 3.5.7
> > அழகாகத்தெரிகிறது
> > :-))
> > திவாஜி
>

> > 2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com>


>
> >> Hi Guys,
>
> > --
> > My blogs: [all in Tamil]
> >http://anmikam4dumbme.blogspot.com/

> >http://chitirampesuthati.blogspot.com/photo blog now with english text


> > too!
> >http://kathaikathaiyaam.blogspot.com/
>
> > BE HAPPY! LIFE IS TOO SHORT TO BE UNHAPPY!
>
> > --
> > "Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage Foundation.
> > Visit our website:http://www.tamilheritage.org;you may like to visit our
> > Muthusom Blogs at:http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.htmlTo
> > post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > minTamil-u...@googlegroups.com
> > For more options, visit this group at

> >http://groups.google.com/group/minTamil- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

O தோழன்:-}

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:23:04 AM1/11/10
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கிரந்த எழுத்துருவை பழக எளிமையான மாற்று வழி

http://noolaham.org/wiki/index.php/%E0%AE%B5%E0%AE%B2%E0%AF%88%E0%AE%B5%E0%AE%BE%E0%AE%9A%E0%AE%B2%E0%AF%8D:%E0%AE%95%E0%AE%BF%E0%AE%B0%E0%AE%A8%E0%AF%8D%E0%AE%A4%E0%AE%AE%E0%AF%8D

Grantham word pad
http://sourceforge.net/projects/hayagreevaindic/



2010/1/11 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh...@gmail.com>
"Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage Foundation. Visit our website: http://www.tamilheritage.org; you may like to visit our Muthusom Blogs at: http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.html To post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to minTamil-u...@googlegroups.com
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minTamil



--
அன்புடன்.....
கல்யாண்ஜி

"மண் பயனுற வேண்டும்"
http://hariom.acnrep.com/

http://velmurugantemple.org.uk/

Sri Sritharan

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:36:42 AM1/11/10
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நூலகத்தினுள்ளும் நுழைந்தாயிற்று. மின்தமிழ் ஒன்று தான் பாக்கி.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jean-Luc Chevillard

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:37:05 AM1/11/10
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Dear all,

The Code 2000 font has been available for several years.

Therefore, there are several versions
and not all of them can contain the Grantha font in the PUA (private
user area)

When I made the test,
I first removed the existing Code2000 that was in my font directory,
installed the new version of Code2000,
and restarted the computer in order to have a fresh Code2000 font running.

that might be the solution for our friend Hari Krishnan

Cheers

-- Jean-Luc


Le 1/11/2010 9:02 AM, N. Kannan a �crit :

வினோத் ராஜன்

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:38:57 AM1/11/10
to மின்தமிழ்
>
> http://noolaham.org/wiki/index.php/%E0%AE%B5%E0%AE%B2%E0%AF%88%E0%AE%...
>


It was me who create that Portal for Noolaham digital library :-)

> Grantham word padhttp://sourceforge.net/projects/hayagreevaindic/

e-Grantamil has serious issues with glyph rendering due to problem
with Uniscribe Engine.

So, its highly probable that e-Grantamil font doesn't display the
ligatures and other stuff correctly in most of the PC's.

Code2000 is the only way to display proper Grantha

V

On Jan 11, 1:23 pm, O தோழன்:-} <gurukk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> கிரந்த எழுத்துருவை பழக எளிமையான மாற்று வழி

>
> 2010/1/11 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com>


>
>
>
>
>
> > Geetha,
>
> > It wont display in Firefox.
>
> > You have to switch to Chome ( I presume you guys have the font
> > installed )
>
> >http://www.google.com/chrome
>
> > V
>
> > On Jan 11, 1:05 pm, Geetha Sambasivam <geethasmbs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > லீனக்ஸ்னா தெரியுமோ?? நானும் நெருப்பு நரிதான் பயன்படுத்தறேன்.
> > > //Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-GB; rv:1.9.1.7)
> > Gecko/20091221
> > > Firefox/3.5.7//
>
> > > ஒண்ணும் தெரியலை, கட்டம், கட்டமா இருக்கு. :(
>
> > > 2010/1/10 Tirumurti Vasudevan <agnih...@gmail.com>
>
> > > > உபுண்டு லீனக்ஸ் பயர்பாக்ஸ் 3.5.7
> > > > அழகாகத்தெரிகிறது
> > > > :-))
> > > > திவாஜி
>
> > > > 2010/1/10 வினோத் ராஜன் <vinodh.vin...@gmail.com>
>
> > > >> Hi Guys,
>
> > > > --
> > > > My blogs: [all in Tamil]
> > > >http://anmikam4dumbme.blogspot.com/

> > > >http://chitirampesuthati.blogspot.com/photoblog now with english text


> > > > too!
> > > >http://kathaikathaiyaam.blogspot.com/
>
> > > > BE HAPPY! LIFE IS TOO SHORT TO BE UNHAPPY!
>
> > > > --
> > > > "Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage
> > Foundation.

> > > > Visit our website:http://www.tamilheritage.org;youmay like to visit


> > our
> > > > Muthusom Blogs at:http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.htmlTo
> > > > post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > > > minTamil-u...@googlegroups.com
> > > > For more options, visit this group at

> > > >http://groups.google.com/group/minTamil-Hide quoted text -


>
> > > - Show quoted text -
> > --
> > "Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage Foundation.
> > Visit our website:http://www.tamilheritage.org;you may like to visit our

> > Muthusom Blogs at:http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.htmlTo
> > post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> > minTamil-u...@googlegroups.com
> > For more options, visit this group at

> >http://groups.google.com/group/minTamil
>
> --
> அன்புடன்.....
> கல்யாண்ஜி
>
> "மண் பயனுற வேண்டும்"http://hariom.acnrep.com/
>

> http://velmurugantemple.org.uk/- Hide quoted text -

Tirumurti Vasudevan

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Jan 11, 2010, 3:54:02 AM1/11/10
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ஹிஹிஹி!
எல்லாரும் உஜாலாவுக்கு மாறுங்க!
திவாஜி

2010/1/11 Geetha Sambasivam <geetha...@gmail.com>

லீனக்ஸ்னா தெரியுமோ?? நானும் நெருப்பு நரிதான் பயன்படுத்தறேன்.

Jean-Luc Chevillard

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Jan 13, 2010, 6:08:02 AM1/13/10
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Dear Vinodh,

I have made a few experiments
but there are a few things which puzzle me.
and I would be happy to have your guidance.

Since the same questions certainly interest others on this list,
let me ask them here.

A possible result of these experiments
would be to have
the நாலாயிர திவ்வியப் பிரபந்தம்
with their manipravalam commentaries
[using a combination of grantha and tamil scripts]
as digital texts (in PDF format)

My experience was the following.

*(1)*
I downloaded from the GRETIL website
(<http://www.sub.uni-goettingen.de/ebene_1/fiindolo/gretil.htm>)
the digital text of the Vakyapadiya
(<http://www.sub.uni-goettingen.de/ebene_1/fiindolo/gretil.htm#Gram>)

I copied the text of the first verse to your தூரிகை Indic script converter:
<http://tamilcc.org/thoorihai/thoorihai.php>
to which I was accessing through Google Chrome.

I selected IAST as encoding for the மூலம்
and கிரந்தம் as encoding for the இலக்கு

I pressed மாற்றுக

It worked fine:

I could see in the upper window the following
anādinidhanam brahma śabdatattvaṁ yad akṣaram /
vivartate \'rthabhāvena prakriyā jagato yataḥ // 1.1 //


And I could see the same text in Grantha script inside the lower window.

SEE THE ATTACHED FILES:

-- "Thoorihai print screen.JPG"

-- "Thoorihai as PDF.pdf"

*(2)*
After that,
I made a second experiment:
I had opened the current thread
<http://groups.google.com/group/mintamil/browse_thread/thread/77899dfea9b25eb6#>
in a Browser
and used the command "View page source"
so as to be able to see the code
using NOTEPAD (with Code2000 as the main font).

I had located the place inside the HTML code
where the text you have used for the experiment
("யே த⁴ர்மா ஹேதுப்ரப⁴வா ....) appears.


*(3)*
I went to the தூரிகை Indic script converter window
and selected the text in Grantha

I pasted into the NOTEPAD window
the selected text.

But it appeared as Bengali

SEE THE ATTACHED FILE:

-- "Notepad Print screen.JPG"

*************************

Is there a way to overcome the difficulty?

I suspect a bit has been turned off in the selected string
because using the PUA is a non-standard action

Thanks for your help

It would be nice to be able to create a library of classical texts in Grantha
and it would also be nice to have
the நாலாயிர திவ்வியப் பிரபந்தம்
with their manipravalam commentaries
as digital texts (in PDF format)

We do not seem to be very far from that goal, now,
thanks to you.

Best wishes

-- Jean-Luc Chevillard (Paris)

<http://www.linguist.univ-paris-diderot.fr/~chevilla/>


Le 1/11/2010 9:38 AM, வினோத் ராஜன் a écrit :
[......]
Code2000 is the only way to display proper Grantha

V

[.....]
Thoorihai print screen.JPG
Notepad Print screen.JPG
Thoorihai as PDF.pdf

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 13, 2010, 11:21:45 AM1/13/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Hi Jean,

All this confusion is due to the lack of Unicode Standard for Grantha.

e-Grantamil hack-encoded Grantha in the Bengali Code Point Range.

Code2000 has Grantha in PUA.

Both of the implementation are font specific.

In the notepad screen, you have selected the font as Code2000, since e-
grantamil Grantha is technically Bengali, you can get it as Bengali
Text .

(OTOH if you have selected e-Grantamil as the font, the Code2000
characters wouldn't display properly. )

BTW I am rechristening the Tool, once I publish the updated version
with all Indic Scripts with Burmese/Khmer :-). As of now, I have added
all the important Indic Scripts (including Saurashtra) (Guess what, I
have even added Asokan Brahmi !! Courtesy: Xenotypetech. It is so
beautiful to see Prakrit in Brahmi !! ).

Once, I add Burmese/Khmer it will be released. The Documentation about
the scripts, is taking some time. :-(

V

On Jan 13, 4:08 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> <http://groups.google.com/group/mintamil/browse_thread/thread/77899dfe...>

>  Thoorihai print screen.JPG
> 272KViewDownload
>
>  Notepad Print screen.JPG
> 364KViewDownload
>
>  Thoorihai as PDF.pdf
> 266KViewDownload

Chandra sekaran

unread,
Jan 13, 2010, 1:59:35 PM1/13/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
அன்பு மருத்துவர் தி.வா வின் தவப்புதல்வர் ரமணா எனக்கு  சொன்ன Sanskrit 2003 free download (Omkarananda Ashram, Rishikesh) அருமையாக வேலை செய்கிறது. NHM writer Tamil போலவே, நாம் maataa என்று அடித்தால், माता என்று அழகாக யுனிகோடில் தெரிகிறது. பிறகென்ன சமஸ்க்ருதம் கற்றுக் கொள்ள வேண்டியதுதானே? கலாக்‌ஷேத்ரத்துக்கு நான் அவர்களது நூலக பழைய பிரதிகளை சமஸ்க்ருதம், தமிழ் ஆங்கிலம் மற்றும் அதன் transliteration in English,  அர்த்தங்கள் தமிழ் மற்றும் ஆங்கிலத்தில் செய்து வருகிறேன். தேவ் சார், வினோதுக்கு இது தெரியும்.

வாருங்கள் படிப்போம் சமஸ்கிருதம். 
சந்திரா

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 13, 2010, 2:10:24 PM1/13/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Nope !

தேவநாகரி லிபிக்கு பதில் கிரந்த லிபியை பயன்படுத்துவதான் உச்சிதம் !

நம் பாரம்பிய லிபியை நாம் கற்காமல் வேறு யார் கற்கப்போகிறார்.

V

On Jan 13, 11:59 pm, Chandra sekaran <plasticschan...@gmail.com>
wrote:

விஜயராகவன்

unread,
Jan 13, 2010, 6:33:05 PM1/13/10
to மின்தமிழ்
இதை 100% ஆதரிக்கிறேன். சமஸ்கிருதத்தை கிரந்தத்தில் கற்பது ஒரு கல்லில்
இரு மாங்காய் அடிப்பதாகும்

விஜயராகவன்

N. Kannan

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 12:11:44 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
நானும் இதையே ஆதரிக்கிறேன். கிரந்தம் தமிழர் லிபி.

க.>

2010/1/14 விஜயராகவன் <vij...@gmail.com>:

Tirumurti Vasudevan

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 12:31:32 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
vinod ask kniprath for fonts.
tv

Chandra sekaran

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Jan 14, 2010, 12:40:30 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
மாங்காயோ, கல்லோ ரெண்டுமே கண்ல படலை.

for new entrants understanding the language is more essential than searching for unavailable grantha libi. We'll start off with well available Devanagiri Unicode fonts and then promote to Grantha when it is available. Most books are today typed with Devanagiri scripts including those of RK mutt and Vivekananda Kendra. Why wait?

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 12:43:35 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Yeah.

I have his fonts.

In Code2000, I can control the display of Samyuktaksharas.

Atleast in my system, e-Grantamil doesn't work properly in my system.
There are problebs with samyuktasharas As said earlier, it has issues
with Uniscribe..

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll301/vinodhrajan/e-Gratha_fault_display.jpg

V

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 1:32:22 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Dear வினோத்,

if I understand you correctly,

*****************************
*(1)*
 in your initial message, which is a the beginning of this thread,
when I see ""

I am seeing a collection of 6 glyphs contained in the PUA, namely

   U+ED35:   No name (Private Use Area)
   U+ED3F:   No name (Private Use Area)
   U+ED47:   No name (Private Use Area)
   U+ED28:   No name (Private Use Area)
   U+ED3E:   No name (Private Use Area)
   U+EF23:   No name (Private Use Area)

******************************
*(2)*
when I use the Thoorihai converter,
start from விநோத்³
and convert it to "கிரந்தம் (இந்தோலிபி)"

I am under the illusion that what I obtain is the same as what is shown in (1)
because e-Grantamil is already installed on my computer.

What I have in the Thoorikai lower window is
ৱিনোদ্,
which for me appears as Sanskrit written in Grantha
but which for others will normally appear as Bengali,
because the succession of Unicode charcters is:
ৱ   U+09F1:   BENGALI LETTER RA WITH LOWER DIAGONAL   (Bengali)
ি   U+09BF:   BENGALI VOWEL SIGN I   (Bengali)
ন   U+09A8:   BENGALI LETTER NA   (Bengali)
ো   U+09CB:   BENGALI VOWEL SIGN O   (Bengali)
দ   U+09A6:   BENGALI LETTER DA   (Bengali)
্   U+09CD:   BENGALI SIGN VIRAMA   (Bengali)
*****************************************
*(3)*
If I do a copy-and-paste
of the "ৱিনোদ্," sequence from the Thoorikai window
to the Notepad window,
it suddenly appears as Bengali
and no longer as Grantha
[the illusion is dissolved]
simply because I have told Notepad to use Code2000
and because Code2000 takes precedence over e-Grantamil
****************************************************

Is that it?

Happy Pongal


-- Jean-Luc (Paris)

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 2:35:01 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Bingo !

Vinodh Rajan

On Jan 14, 11:32 am, Jean-Luc Chevillard

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 6:41:32 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Dear Vinodh,

thanks to your explanations, I have now been able to make a longer sample.

I include it here in order to show what is now possible
thanks to your dedicated work.

The longer sample may also be useful for detecting bugs in the font.

Thanks a lot

-- Jean-Luc (Paris)

P.S. The next challenge is now to make some specimens, showing the nice
coexistence of Tamil script and Grantha script,
inside some Vaishnava commentaries, for instance on ஆண்டாள் 's poems.
Do you know whether there are some already available as digital texts
using Devanagari along with Tamil.


Le 1/14/2010 8:35 AM, வினோத் ராஜன் a écrit :
> Bingo !
>
> Vinodh Rajan
>
> On Jan 14, 11:32 am, Jean-Luc Chevillard
> <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dear வினோத்,
>>
>> if I understand you correctly,
>>
>>

[...]

Vakyapadiya in Grantha (1-14).pdf

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:03:31 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Yeah. The Grantha Display is OK in your PC.

The Problem is I have updated my uniscribe engine to enable Tibetan/
Sinhala/Burmese and other scripts. The e-Grantamil font seems to be
incompatible with the updated uniscribe engine.

e-Grantamil font seems to work only on Windows XP SP2 with the default
rendering engine.

--

There seems to be a error in the Text, one word in the Text reads:

ānjasasḥ
आन्जसस्ः

BTW Hold on your references to my tool for a week :-)

//P.S. The next challenge is now to make some specimens, showing the


nice
coexistence of Tamil script and Grantha script,
inside some Vaishnava commentaries, for instance on ஆண்டாள் 's

poems. //

There are some nice collection of Manipravala Texts from the Internet
Archive, which I have collected here:

http://www.noolaham.org/wiki/index.php/%E0%AE%AA%E0%AE%95%E0%AF%81%E0%AE%AA%E0%AF%8D%E0%AE%AA%E0%AF%81:%E0%AE%AE%E0%AE%A3%E0%AE%BF%E0%AE%AA%E0%AF%8D%E0%AE%AA%E0%AE%BF%E0%AE%B0%E0%AE%B5%E0%AE%BE%E0%AE%B3_%E0%AE%A8%E0%AF%82%E0%AE%B2%E0%AF%8D%E0%AE%95%E0%AE%B3%E0%AF%8D

//Do you know whether there are some already available as digital
texts
using Devanagari along with Tamil. //

Yeah. Actually there are many.. but I don't remember any immediate
reference now. Will post some.. once I trace them

V

On Jan 14, 4:41 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>


wrote:
> Dear Vinodh,
>
> thanks to your explanations, I have now been able to make a longer sample.
>
> I include it here in order to show what is now possible
> thanks to your dedicated work.
>
> The longer sample may also be useful for detecting bugs in the font.
>
> Thanks a lot
>
> -- Jean-Luc (Paris)
>
> P.S. The next challenge is now to make some specimens, showing the nice
> coexistence of Tamil script and Grantha script,
> inside some Vaishnava commentaries, for instance on ஆண்டாள் 's poems.
> Do you know whether there are some already available as digital texts
> using Devanagari along with Tamil.
>
> Le 1/14/2010 8:35 AM, வினோத் ராஜன் a écrit :> Bingo !
>
> > Vinodh Rajan
>
> > On Jan 14, 11:32 am, Jean-Luc Chevillard
> > <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>  wrote:
>
> >> Dear வினோத்,
>
> >> if I understand you correctly,
>
> [...]
>

>  Vakyapadiya in Grantha (1-14).pdf
> 231KViewDownload

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:25:46 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Dear Vinodh,

for the record,
my setting is Windows XP SP3
and I made the PDF file
using Google Chrome
and Adobe PDF Printer

Cheers!

-- Jean-Luc

P.S. thanks for signaling the error in the VP text used


Le 1/14/2010 1:03 PM, வினோத் ராஜன் a écrit :
> [....]


> e-Grantamil font seems to work only on Windows XP SP2 with the default
> rendering engine.
>
>

[....]

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:27:21 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Hmm..

What is the version of your Uniscribe Engine ?

V

On Jan 14, 5:25 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:32:13 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Where does one find that information?

It is somewhere in the Control panel?

-- jl

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:39:48 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
Search for the file USP10.dll in the Windows folder.

In the file properties, you can find the Version

V

On Jan 14, 5:32 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:52:15 AM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Dear Vinodh,

the file "usp10.dll"
in contained inside
the "C:\WINDOWS\system32" folder.

On the properties window,
I can read:
*********************************
File version: 1.420.2600.5512
Description: Uniscribe Unicode script processor
****************************************
In "Other version information", I can read:
*************************************
File version: 1.0420.2600.5512 (xpsp.080413-2105)

Internal name: Uniscribe

Language: English (United States)

Original file name: Uniscribe

Product name: Microsoft(R) Uniscribe Unicode script processor

Product version: 1.0420.2600.5512
********************************

Cheers

-- Jean-Luc

Le 1/14/2010 1:39 PM, வினோத் ராஜன் a écrit :
> Search for the file USP10.dll in the Windows folder.
>
> In the file properties, you can find the Version
>
> V
>
> On Jan 14, 5:32 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard<jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Where does one find that information?
>>

>> Is it somewhere in the Control panel?

வினோத் ராஜன்

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 7:54:08 AM1/14/10
to மின்தமிழ்
> File version: 1.420.2600.5512

My Version is : 1.601.5022.8

e-Grantamil seems to work only with the Old version of Uniscribe

V

On Jan 14, 5:52 pm, Jean-Luc Chevillard <jeanluc.chevill...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Dear Vinodh,
>


> the file "usp10.dll"
> in contained inside
> the "C:\WINDOWS\system32" folder.
>
> On the properties window,
> I can read:
> *********************************

> Description: Uniscribe Unicode script processor

Chandra sekaran

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 12:29:03 PM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
The least leaned man in this group has a small doubt. If this string has only a dialogue between Jean and Vinodh, Itis better they finish that and then start teaching Sanskrit for lay man like me.
Till then, we anxiously open this link and then learn nothing. If this has to do with the programming and othr coding issues, none would have the expertise and patience to all these things for the sake of learning Sanskrit afresh. Unless it is easy to just type in english and get the translitertion in grantha without much of setting ups, I think this can be more an individual mail betten Jean and Vinidh. If I am wrong please correct me.

Jean-Luc Chevillard

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 2:42:01 PM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
ஐயா, நீங்கள் மன்னித்து விடுங்கள்!


உங்களுக்கு தொந்தரவு கொடுக்கிறது
எனக்கு உத்தேசமேயில்லை!

நல்லதுக்குதான் செய்து வைக்கின்றோம்.

The reason this exchange was made publicly
is that it is a "TEST" message.
Messages labelled as "TEST" in the Subject line
are intended as good for the future of the community
but should be ignored by members who are not technically minded.
If they are public, they can be inspected on the spot
by external technical gurus,
who can make useful suggestions
[இது தமிழில் எப்படி சொல்கிறது எனக்கு தெரியவில்லையே!]
[நீங்கள் இதனை தமிழில் மொழிப்பெயர்த்துக் கொடுத்தால், எனக்கு உதவும்!]

இல்லாவிட்டால் இப்படி எழுதியிருக்க மாட்டேன்.

தயவு செய்து பொறுத்தருளுங்கள்

-- ழா(ன்) லூய்க் செவ்வியார்
[தமிழ் மாணாக்கன், பாரீசு]

<http://www.linguist.univ-paris-diderot.fr/~chevilla/>


Le 1/14/2010 6:29 PM, Chandra sekaran a écrit :
> The least leaned man in this group has a small doubt. If this string has
> only a dialogue between Jean and Vinodh, Itis better they finish that and
> then start teaching Sanskrit for lay man like me.
> Till then, we anxiously open this link and then learn nothing. If this has
> to do with the programming and othr coding issues, none would have the
> expertise and patience to all these things for the sake of learning Sanskrit
> afresh. Unless it is easy to just type in english and get the translitertion
> in grantha without much of setting ups, I think this can be more an
> individual mail betten Jean and Vinidh. If I am wrong please correct me.
>
> Chandra
>

> To save culture& heritage visit:

Subashini Tremmel

unread,
Jan 14, 2010, 3:03:47 PM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
அன்புள்ள சந்திரா,
 
இன்னமும் பாடம் ஆரம்பிக்கவில்லை.  எழுத்துருக்கள் தெளிவாக வர வேண்டுமென்பதற்காக சோதனை செய்து கொண்டிருக்கின்றனர். அதிலும் தலைப்பிலும் Test Mail என்று குறிப்பிட்டுள்ளது. உங்களுக்கு இந்த உரையாடலில் கலந்து கொள்ள விருப்பம் இல்லையென்றால் நீங்கள் வாசிக்க வேண்டியதில்லையே. எத்தனையோ கடிதங்கள் பல வந்து கொண்டிருக்கின்றன. அனைத்தையுமா வாசிக்கின்றோம். நமக்குத் தேவையான ஆர்வம் உள்ள விஷயத்தை மட்டும் தானே வாசிக்கின்றோம். அது போலத்தான்.  விரைவில் சமஸ்கிருத பாடம் தொடங்கும் தலைப்பிலேயே பாடம் என்றும் குறிப்பிடப்பட்டு பாடம் தொடங்கும்.  அதிலும் ஷோன் எதிர்நோக்கும் பிரச்சனைகள் வேறு பலருக்கும் இருக்கும் நிலையில் இவ்வகை கலந்துரையாடல்கள் இருப்பதை தவிர்க்க முடியாது. பிறர் பதிலளிக்கவில்லையென்பதால் வேறு யாரும் பலன் பெறவில்லை என்று சொல்லிவிடவும் முடியாது.
 
பொங்கல் வாழ்த்துக்கள்!
 
அன்புடன்
சுபா

--
"Tamil in Digital Media" group is an activity of Tamil Heritage Foundation. Visit our website: http://www.tamilheritage.org; you may like to visit our Muthusom Blogs at: http://www.tamilheritage.org/how2contribute.html To post to this group, send email to minT...@googlegroups.com

N. Kannan

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Jan 14, 2010, 8:10:30 PM1/14/10
to mint...@googlegroups.com
Dear Chandra:
 
You need to take a soft look at this situation.
 
MinTamil is for technical discussions. It is not an ordinary forum where gossip and opinions are exchanged.
If we've nothing to contribute it is better to be silent.
 
Hope you understand the purpose of thi forum.
 
Kannan

Tirumurti Vasudevan

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Jan 14, 2010, 10:18:55 PM1/14/10
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தொழில் நுட்ப உரையாடல் நல்ல தீர்வுக்கு இப்போதைக்கு கொண்டு செல்லும் என்று தோன்றவில்லை.
க்ரந்த எழுத்துக்களை பிடிஎf அல்லது பட வடிவில் இட்டு பாடங்களை துவங்கிவிடலாம்.
அது கடினமாக இருப்பின் நாகரியிலேயே தொடங்கிவிடலாம்.
துவங்குவது முக்கியம்.
திவாஜி


On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 10:59 PM, Chandra sekaran <plastic...@gmail.com> wrote:
Itis better they finish that and then start teaching Sanskrit for lay man like me.



Geetha Sambasivam

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Jan 14, 2010, 10:24:33 PM1/14/10
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நாகரி என்றால் என்னைப் போன்றவர்களுக்கு எளிது என்றாலும் கிரந்தமும் கத்துக்கணும்னு ஆசையாவும் இருக்கு. ஆசான் எப்படிச் சொல்லித் தரப்போறாரோ???

2010/1/15 Tirumurti Vasudevan <agni...@gmail.com>

ram

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Jan 15, 2010, 10:32:30 AM1/15/10
to மின்தமிழ்
கிரந்த லிபி பற்றி மேலும் விக்கியில் அறியலாம் http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grantha_script
, இதிலே எழுத்துகளின் ஒலிகள் விபரமாக கொடுக்கப்பட்டுள்ளன , அதை தவிர
கிரந்தத்தின் பல எழுத்துகள் மலையாள எழுத்துகளை ஒட்டிள்ளன . ஆனால் நாகரி
கற்று அதன் மூலம் படிப்பதே உசிதம் ஏனெனில் பல சமஸ்க்ருத படைப்புகள்
நாகரி வடிவிலேயே உள்ளன அதனால் நாம் அவற்றையும் படிக்க வாய்ப்பு
கிடைக்கும் , கிரந்தத்தை அவ்வடிவில் உள்ள படைப்புகளை படிக்க நாம்
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