Control with WinVNC and XP License issue
Sonam
I have to use both WinXP and Linux at work (two seperate
computers). I run a VNC server (tightvnc.org) on XP, and
use x2vnc on Linux to control the XP box
(http://www.hubbe.net/~hubbe/x2vnc.html). This is a very
convenient arrangement since I use a single mouse and
keyboard to control both computers. I can cut and paste
between Linux and Windows too -- it functions like a
single dual head computer.
However, this Infoworld article (below) that I came across
says this is illegal. Is that correct? - can I not control
my XP box from my Linux box?
Regards,
Sonam Chauhan
--
Corporate Express Australia Ltd.
Phone: +61-2-9335-0725, Fax: 9335-0753, Email:
son...@ce.com.au
-------------------------------------------
From:
http://www.infoworld.com/articles/op/xml/02/03/18/020318opl
ivingston.xml
Microsoft's XP license agreement says, "Except as
otherwise permitted by the NetMeeting, Remote Assistance,
and Remote Desktop features described below, you may not
use the Product to permit any Device to use, access,
display, or run other executable software residing on the
Workstation Computer, nor may you permit any Device to
use, access, display, or run the Product or Product's user
interface, unless the Device has a separate license for
the Product."
That means using any software other than Microsoft's to
view an XP desktop from Windows 2000 or any other
operating system would violate the company's license
agreement, in case you care.
-------------------------------------------
PS: I have an unused Win 98 license on my Linux box. Does
this have any impact on this issue?
Bill Sanderson
doesn't prevent you from using their PCAnywhere product to likewise access
XP.
I don't understand this stuff either, but I'm willing to trust Symantec's
lawyers.
Seems to me you should be able to find an RDP client for your linux
box--perhaps a Java based one, which would allow you to use Remote Desktop
instead of VNC.
"Sonam" <sonam....@ce.com.au> wrote in message
news:232201c27401$7e297270$37ef2ecf@TKMSFTNGXA13...
Alex K. Angelopoulos (MVP)
First, I'm not a lawyer; insert other boilerplate that holds me forever
blameless, etcetera. ;-)
Here's what I've come up with as opinions on that EULA
The primary intent of that is apparently to make it explicitly clear that
tweaking or hacking XP so that the internal Terminal Services supports 2 or more
simultaneous users without benefit of multiple licenses is a violation of
licensing. Usage of products such as VNC is not covered. Here are some things
to note:
(1) First, the actual phrasing of the agreement: VNC, pcAnywhere, RAdmin,
NetOps, CarbonCopy, and other applications of their sort provide services which
are similar in kind to NetMeeting, Remote Assistance and Remote Desktop.
(2) There is no actual harm to Microsoft, a key point in legal issues such as
this. It is quite legal to write your own client application that interacts
with Netmeeting or Terminal Services/Remote Desktop and use it; using an
alternate mechanism for getting the same end result is not an issue. For
example, you could compile the RDesktop Linux client and access the XP system
using the built-in Remote Desktop interface to achieve the same end. Net
economic effect on Microsoft is 0.
(3) There is no enforcement of an aggressive interpretation of the EULA. If
InfoWorld (not always a hotbed of accurate information) were correct, that would
mean that Symantec and abut half-a-dozen other companies have been condoning,
encouraging, and profiting from EULA violations on XP for over a year - and
Microsoft has taken no measures against them. This alone would make enforcement
of such a strict interpretation close to impossible now.
(4) Absolutely zero technical countermeasures have been taken against using such
applications with XP. Every now and then in the VNC mailing list someone will
ask if Microsoft is doing something to VNC since they get disconnects, and it
usually turns out to be issues with Fast User Switching being turned on - the
only measures taken there are security ones.
(5) Finally, for over a year I have been using and testing combinations of all
of the products mentioned above as well as a few others with my XP host, and
freely posting about them in the TS and Remote Desktop forums here; I can count
over 100 posts about VNC alone which I have made, most tested against or from
XP and .NET Beta/RC1. In spite of that, and in spite of the fact that
Microsoft's TS Program Managers will quickly point out any potential licensing
issues for TS/RD deployment, there has not been one thing said to even imply an
issue.
Admittedly, I'm not privy to inside info, I'm not a lawyer, and I would say that
the EULA can be confusing to end users who are not expert contract lawyers with
excellent remote computing savvy...
However, bottom line is that if there WERE a licensing violation, people
developing or using such products would be able to argue that they have been
acting in good faith under reasonable interpretation of the EULA. Besides that,
Symantec is ahead of us in the line to get sued. ;-)
In news:232201c27401$7e297270$37ef2ecf@TKMSFTNGXA13,
Sonam typed:
> Hello -
> I have to use both WinXP and Linux at work (two seperate
> computers). I run a VNC server (tightvnc.org) on XP, and
> use x2vnc on Linux to control the XP box
> (http://www.hubbe.net/~hubbe/x2vnc.html). This is a very
> convenient arrangement since I use a single mouse and
> keyboard to control both computers. I can cut and paste
> between Linux and Windows too -- it functions like a
> single dual head computer.
>
> However, this Infoworld article (below) that I came across
> says this is illegal. Is that correct? - can I not control
> my XP box from my Linux box?
>
> Regards,
> Sonam Chauhan
Microsoft's XP license agreement says, "Except as
otherwise permitted by the NetMeeting, Remote Assistance,
and Remote Desktop features described below, you may not
use the Product to permit any Device to use, access,
display, or run other executable software residing on the
Workstation Computer, nor may you permit any Device to
use, access, display, or run the Product or Product's user
interface, unless the Device has a separate license for
the Product."
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----------
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Sonam Chauhan
they were very helpful. A big relief: I took a look at the
actual EULA accompanying my copy of Win XP Pro
(c:\windows\System32\eula.txt) -- it does *not* contain
the paragraphs in the Computerworld article. Instead it
contains the sections below. MS may have removed the
offending paragraphs from later EULAs, or maybe the EULA
listed there is for Win XP Home.
I think the original EULA restrictions are wrong - they
would stop any "device" - even a game controller - from
gaining "access" to the WinXP "user interface", "unless
the Device has a separate license for the Product"
(quoting from the EULA). Maybe it was written the way it
was because of 'Mira'.
------------------------------------------
1. GRANT OF LICENSE.
...
You may permit a maximum of ten (10)
("Connection Maximum") computers or other electronic
devices (each a "Device") to connect
to the COMPUTER to utilize the services of the SOFTWARE
solely for File and Print services, Internet Information
services, and remote access (including connection sharing
and telephony services).
...
2. DESCRIPTION OF OTHER RIGHTS AND LIMITATIONS.
* NetMeeting/Remote Assistance/Remote Desktop Features.
SOFTWARE may contain NetMeeting, Remote Assistance, and
Remote Desktop technologies that enable the SOFTWARE
or other applications installed on the COMPUTER to be
used remotely between two or more computers, even if
the SOFTWARE or application is installed on only one
COMPUTER. You may use NetMeeting, Remote Assistance,
and Remote Desktop with all Microsoft products; provided
however, use of these technologies with certain Microsoft
products may require an additional license. For
Microsoft and non-Microsoft products, you should consult
the license agreement accompanying the applicable product
or contact the applicable licensor to determine whether
use of NetMeeting, Remote Assistance, or Remote Desktop
is permitted without an additional license.
------------------------------------------
Regards,
Sonam
>-----Original Message-----
>Symantec says that their lawyers back them up in stating
that this license
>doesn't prevent you from using their PCAnywhere product
to likewise access
>XP.
>
>I don't understand this stuff either, but I'm willing to
trust Symantec's
>lawyers.
>
>Seems to me you should be able to find an RDP client for
your linux
>box--perhaps a Java based one, which would allow you to
use Remote Desktop
>instead of VNC.
>
Naw. It won't be any different from using Linux to access
>.
>
Sooner Al
Al
"Bill Sanderson" <bill_NoSpa...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:#p0sUkAdCHA.504@tkmsftngp11...
>
<--- SNIP --->
>
> Seems to me you should be able to find an RDP client for your linux
> box--perhaps a Java based one, which would allow you to use Remote Desktop
> instead of VNC.
>
---
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Bill Sanderson
Do take a look at Sooner Al's Remote Desktop client thought--VNC is quite
nice on a lan (have you looked at www.realvnc.org?), but RDP is better, at
least with Microsoft clents.
"Sonam Chauhan" <sonam....@ce.com.au> wrote in message
news:2d6201c2742a$1a86b740$3aef2ecf@TKMSFTNGXA09...
Jeffrey Randow (MVP)
provide that functionality...
Jeffrey Randow
Windows Client MVP - Remote Networking & Security
Windows XP Expert Zone - http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone
.NET Server Community -
http://www.microsoft.com/windows.netserver/community
wi...@longhornconsulting.com
Visit the Remote Networking Technology Wiki
http://www.remotenetworktechnology.com
Please post all responses to the newsgroups for the benefit
of all USENET users. Messages sent via email may or may not
be answered depending on time availability....
Sonam
couple of more things:
1. Does any RDP client support the following: The VNC
client I use - x2vnc - does not open a VNC client window.
Instead, it creates a one-pixel invisible at one edge of
the screen, that "grabs" and sends across mouse and
Keyboard events when the user wants to use the other
computer. i.e. like a software based console switch.
2. I was surprised to see my EULA differed from the
article. My machines is an OEM (HP) WinXP Pro machine. Can
anyone confirm if their XP Home or XP Pro EULA contains
the "cannot use other device to control XP" restriction
reported in the article. The EULA is typically at
c:\windows\System32\eula.txt
Sonam
Rdesktop
>.
>
Bill Sanderson
I think it is the same as yours.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
* Installation and use. You may install, use, access,
display and run one copy of the Product on a single
computer, such as a workstation, terminal or other device
("Workstation Computer"). The Product may not be used
by more than two (2) processors at any one time on any
single Workstation Computer. You may permit a maximum
of ten (10) computers or other electronic devices (each
a "Device") to connect to the Workstation Computer to
utilize the services of the Product solely for File and
Print services, Internet Information Services, and remote
access (including connection sharing and telephony
indirect connections made through "multiplexing" or other
software or hardware which pools or aggregates
connections. Except as otherwise permitted by the
NetMeeting, Remote Assistance, and Remote Desktop
features described below, you may not use the Product
executable software residing on the Workstation Computer,
nor may you permit any Device to use, access, display,
or run the Product or Product's user interface, unless
the Device has a separate license for the Product.
------
* NetMeeting/Remote Assistance/Remote Desktop Features. The
Product contains NetMeeting, Remote Assistance, and
Remote Desktop technologies that enable the Product or
other applications installed on the Workstation Computer
to be used remotely between two or more computers, even
Workstation Computer. You may use NetMeeting, Remote
Assistance, and Remote Desktop with all Microsoft products;
provided however, use of these technologies with
certain Microsoft products may require an additional
license. For Microsoft and non-Microsoft products, you
should consult the license agreement accompanying the
applicable product or contact the applicable licensor
to determine whether use of NetMeeting, Remote
Assistance, or Remote Desktop is permitted without an
additional license.
---
"Sonam Chauhan" <sonam....@ce.com.au> wrote in message
news:2d6201c2742a$1a86b740$3aef2ecf@TKMSFTNGXA09...