dns administration delegation
doh
2 domain controllers are in site A
2 domain controllers are in site B
I want admins from site A to be able to manage only the DNS servers at site
A.
I want admins from site B to be able to manage only the DNS servers at site
B.
I create a group named siteA_dns and add this group to the two servers
security tab in site A to read/write access.
Replication takes effect and I check the two dns server in site B. They both
now have the same security read/write access for the siteA_dns group.
Anyone know of a way to work around this to be able to prevent admins from
one site making mods at another site (besides blocking rpc via registry)?
Herb Martin
"doh" <d...@simpson.org> wrote in message news:f4nglt$hnl$1...@aioe.org...
>4 total DNS servers runnin on domain controllers
>
> 2 domain controllers are in site A
> 2 domain controllers are in site B
> I want admins from site A to be able to manage only the DNS servers at
> site A.
> I want admins from site B to be able to manage only the DNS servers at
> site B.
> I create a group named siteA_dns and add this group to the two servers
> security tab in site A to read/write access.
Are you doing this in the DNS MMC properties on the Security tab?
Does this work?
I will look forward to other answers but I don't think this is the way to do
this, and have always done it with a GPO to delegate control of the service.
(There is a problem with this method in your case however which may be
as bad as what you are seeing even though it is different.)
I am not even sure that permissions you are actually delegating there --
if you look at the Standard Permissions permissions you see there is
nothing in there for stopping and starting the service. If you further look
in the Special Permission for any ACE you will also see this is missing
but worse there seems to be all sorts of additional permissions that seem
to be concerned with all sorts of unrelated (and in your case undesirable)
areas.
> Replication takes effect and I check the two dns server in site B. They
> both now have the same security read/write access for the siteA_dns group.
> Anyone know of a way to work around this to be able to prevent admins from
> one site making mods at another site (besides blocking rpc via registry)?
The problem with doing it through a GPO is that you would normally want to
do this by putting the servers in different OUs -- you must however NOT
move your DCs outside of the Domain Controller OU.
Some claim you can put them in child OUs but my experience was NOT
good when I tried that and I have never tested it again.
You could however (with no problem I can conceive) link to the existing
DC OU but use permissions (on the DC computer accounts) to filter
the GPO to only apply to one set of DC and then the other set of DCs
for the other users.
Or you could link the GPOs to the respective SITES instead of using
permission filtering.
Since these are all one DCs do you really have trouble with admins messing
where they shouldn't?
Can't you just (reliably) make business/security rules where one set of
Admins
doesn't mess with the other set of DNS servers?
Presumably these are NOT "domain admins" either -- but just something you
are calling Site admins?
--
Herb Martin, MCSE, MVP
http://www.LearnQuick.Com
(phone on web site)
doh
security tab in dnsmgmt.msc. You are correct about the additional
permissions that grant unnecessary rights. I wasn't aware of the GPO method
where one can delegate rights to a specific dns server.
You are also correct in that the "site admins" are not domain admins
otherwise they would have full control anyway.
What is the setting(s) via GP that you're referring to that could grant
these admins full access to their local dns servers (which are also domain
controllers), but not access any other dns servers within the domain?
I am aware of filtering out GPs based on groups, which would be my preferred
method rather than adding child OUs.
At any rate, if this causes more trouble than its worth, then I might just
opt to drop all the admins into the DNS Administrators group and state that
they should not manage any other servers. Auditing would have to be put in
place here just in case an admin from an alternate site does make a
modification on a dns server not within their administrative boundary.
"Herb Martin" <ne...@learnquick.com> wrote in message
news:OVB9%238WrH...@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...
Herb Martin
"doh" <d...@simpson.org> wrote in message news:f4pan0$db2$1...@aioe.org...
> The method I initially described was in fact setting the permissions via
> the security tab in dnsmgmt.msc. You are correct about the additional
> permissions that grant unnecessary rights. I wasn't aware of the GPO
> method where one can delegate rights to a specific dns server.
The usual way is to do this through a GPO -- to make someone a service
admin for all servers of that type -- but you can still use a GPO for one
or a few servers if you find a way to distinguish them by filter
(permissions
or WMI) or by Site as in your specific case.
> You are also correct in that the "site admins" are not domain admins
> otherwise they would have full control anyway.
I presumed that, but people ask all sorts of strange things based on waht
they have tried without thinking it through, so it was important for you to
confirm.
> What is the setting(s) via GP that you're referring to that could grant
> these admins full access to their local dns servers (which are also domain
> controllers), but not access any other dns servers within the domain?
Computer->Windows Settings->Security->Services
> I am aware of filtering out GPs based on groups, which would be my
> preferred method rather than adding child OUs.
Good, as I am really nervous about even child OUs for DCs. Although
in your case I might well suggest Sites for this, then you would not need
to modify it if you add another DC in either location -- it would just work.
You could even move a DC from one site and the control would switch
with the location.
> At any rate, if this causes more trouble than its worth, then I might just
> opt to drop all the admins into the DNS Administrators group and state
> that they should not manage any other servers.
Curious: What is different about the two sets of services? Do they have
different zones, or what else is different? We must presume you have at
least some of the zones replicated for the Domain since they are all DCs.
> Auditing would have to be put in place here just in case an admin from an
> alternate site does make a modification on a dns server not within their
> administrative boundary.
You can also use the GPO (Advanced) settings for the service to add
not just permission but also Auditing, and also make certain services
required or forbidden (this last is not what you were asking of course.)
doh
know there is a GPO key to allow specific users to start/stop a service,
this is only half of the job. Does the same GP setting allow these users to
fully manage DNS? Meaning add/delete/modify zones?
Aside from the fact that the main ADI replicated zone for the domain will be
under their control, I'm more concerned about these admins to have the
ability to add zones for their specific site.
Hope this is a bit more clear now.
"Herb Martin" <ne...@learnquick.com> wrote in message
news:umCsOJfr...@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
Herb Martin
"doh" <d...@simpson.org> wrote in message news:f4ppt3$74c$1...@aioe.org...
> I'm not sure if I got my point across with what my ultimate goal is. As I
> do know there is a GPO key to allow specific users to start/stop a
> service, this is only half of the job. Does the same GP setting allow
> these users to fully manage DNS? Meaning add/delete/modify zones?
Yes, full control of the SERVICE will allow you read and write its data,
or you can give limited permisions such as "read" to the Help Desk to
allow those folks to VIEW but not change settings.
> Aside from the fact that the main ADI replicated zone for the domain will
> be under their control, I'm more concerned about these admins to have the
> ability to add zones for their specific site.
How often do zones get added? This is usually a (nearly) static thing --
set
once, early in the deployment of DNS servers and then seldom if every
modified
(the actual zones.)
doh
Created a group named site_DNSadmin.
Created a GP object.
Allow site_DNSadmin group to FULL control Computer Configuration\Windows
Settings\Security Settings\System Services\DNS Server via the GP.
Apply the GP to the domain controllers in question.
Force replication.
Force GP update.
Verified with RSOP that the GP is in fact applied to the domain controllers.
Logged on to a workstation in the domain with an admin account which is a
member of the site_DNSadmin group.
Executed dnsmgmt.msc and added one of the dns servers.
The console of course results with an Access Denied.
Did I miss a step in this process? Would I need to grant these admins the
right to logon to the domain controller directly and then have them run
dnsmgmt.msc from the server itself?
Also, to answer your question about zones... some of the dns servers hosts
services for different development groups. They have needs to add local
zones to their servers that dont apply to other sites.
"Herb Martin" <ne...@learnquick.com> wrote in message
news:OIVq5chr...@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
Herb Martin
"doh" <d...@simpson.org> wrote in message news:f4ugp3$hh9$1...@aioe.org...
>I just executed the following:
>
> Created a group named site_DNSadmin.
> Created a GP object.
> Allow site_DNSadmin group to FULL control Computer Configuration\Windows
> Settings\Security Settings\System Services\DNS Server via the GP.
> Apply the GP to the domain controllers in question.
> Force replication.
> Force GP update.
> Verified with RSOP that the GP is in fact applied to the domain
> controllers.
> Logged on to a workstation in the domain with an admin account which is a
> member of the site_DNSadmin group.
>
> Executed dnsmgmt.msc and added one of the dns servers.
> The console of course results with an Access Denied.
> Did I miss a step in this process? Would I need to grant these admins the
> right to logon to the domain controller directly and then have them run
> dnsmgmt.msc from the server itself?
No, logon locally to the DC should NOT be needed.
> Also, to answer your question about zones... some of the dns servers hosts
> services for different development groups. They have needs to add local
> zones to their servers that dont apply to other sites.
And do these zones get added and modified frequently? Even in such
as case the zones shouldn't be changing that often.
You could just get a (real) admin to conditionally forward to a server used
by the "development" groups -- it is not obvious why developers would
be creating DNS zones in a production system.
doh
it's necessary. ;)
On the other issue, I still can't access the dnsmgmt.msc because of an
Access Denied. Any ideas?
"Herb Martin" <ne...@learnquick.com> wrote in message
news:%23uUS3C4...@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
Kevin D. Goodknecht Sr. [MVP]
In news:f4pan0$db2$1...@aioe.org,
doh <d...@simpson.org> typed:
> What is the setting(s) via GP that you're referring to that could
> grant these admins full access to their local dns servers (which are
> also domain controllers), but not access any other dns servers within
> the domain?
To get to the nitty gritty of this question is if all DCs are in the same
domain you cannot do what you ask. Nor, can you do this with the zone. If
the sites were split into child domains, you could, but not in a single
domain.
--
Best regards,
Kevin D. Goodknecht Sr. [MVP]
Hope This Helps
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