Live TV suttering
Nathan
looking for some suggestions. The new pc is an AMD X2 4200+, Asus A8N-SLI
deluxe motherboard, 2gb of ram(two 1gb sticks) , Leadtek 6600gt pci
express, 80 sata drive for the OS and 2 250gb ata drives for recorded
TV/movies, two 150mce, and a zoom 3025 pci modem. The PC is connected via
DVI to a LCD TV running at 1280 x 720 at 60 hertz.
When watching live TV after about a half hour the video starts to stutter,
freeze, or play in slow motion. I can stop and restart the video and it
works for a short time but it still continues to do the same things. Shows
recorded on my former MC pc play fine on the new one. Shows recoded on the
new MC pc sometimes skip during playback on the MC PC but are fine on any of
the extenders. Live TV is fine on the extenders.
I have tried the NVIDIA DVD decoder version 1.02-150 and the 1.0.67
version; I have also tried the powerdvd 6 decoder. I have used the 77.72
forceware drivers and the 72.14 for media center drivers and the 66.93
drivers.
I am assuming that it is a decoder/video driver error because live TV works
fine on extenders. I have updated the bios on the motherboard to the latest
non beta version and have updated all the other drivers. I have watched CPU
utilization and it never goes over 50% and is as low as 5%-10% when it
happens. Any suggestions?
Thanks,
Nathaniel
JW
of stuttering.
What is very strange is the different behavior of playing of a program on
your new MCE system that was recorded on your previous MCE system and one
recorded on your new MCE system.
Since you have a new system I assume that you are using 24 IRQs, However you
may still want to check and be sure that none of the devices in use when
watching TV using the MCE system share an IRQ with another one of the
devices in use.
Also do you have any problem in playing DVDs on the MCE system using MCE?
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
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Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:%233MOHzq...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
JW
can you please explain your comment about HD shows working fine.
Does the audio also stutter along with the video?
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:ucTJoXrl...@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Nathan
For recording HD I am using a application that Tim Moore wrote at The Green
Button forums for changing channels and recording over firewire. I used it
on my last MC pc and I was having live tv issues before I installed it but
watned to record Wanted on TNT last night in HD.
Nathaniel
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:u70X3frl...@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
BorisDM
or watching live TV with my D drive selected as the recording location. My C
drive is an 80g SATA, but my D drive is a 200mb ATA. I can copy files from
the C drive, to the D drive, and successfully play, but everytime I set D as
the recording location, I get stuttering and/or freezes every time.
JW
of the MCE drivers from the Hauppauge Website since it appears that there is
some kind of time stamp problem with the current encoding and the graphics
card play back. I am not sure what the latest release number is.
You did not say if the audio also stuttered along with the video so I will
assume that it does not and therefore is not potentially part of the
problem.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:%23p$DM6rlF...@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
Nathan
DVDs work fine. I have the lastest non beta drivers for the 150's. When it
happens audio and video is effected. I tried a filter called ReClock that
keep the audio in sync with the video but get little audio hickups after
about 20 min. I down graded the bios on the motherboard today to a version
that does not have support for X2s, now the bios and windows thinks that it
is a single core cpu. Two hours of live tv later and no skips. I still think
that is it some kind of driver issue but not sure what driver. I am going to
ask Jim if he could try the same thing and see if that works for him also.
If it does I will search some other fourms and see if anyone is using a X2
with media center sucessfully, and if so what is there hardware.
Nathaniel
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:eedhTltl...@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
JW
I had not noticed before that both you and Jim were using dual core AMD
CPUs. I remember one case in the past that turning off HyperThreading
solved a problem for a user, however, I don't remember the details or if the
offending driver that was causing the problem was ever determined.
Since you are getting both audio and video stuttering I would like to know
what audio card you have and if you have checked for a recent driver update
for it.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:e%238uZ12l...@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
Nathan
I know that I had problems with HyperThreading and NVIDIA's video driver on
my last MC pc. The audio in built in to the motherboard and is a Realtek
ALC850. I am using the lastest drivers from Asus site version 5.10.00.5781.
It looks like there might be newer ones on Realtek's website but the version
says A3.74 but the date on them is two months newer than Asus. I might try
them later tonight.
Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
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Joe Horton
bringing it home from Gateway.
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
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Nathan
"Joe Horton" <j...@msn.com> wrote in message
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Nathan
Nathan
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
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JW
Nathan both you and Jim are using onboard RealTek chips and for both of you
the audio stutters along with the video. Neither of you have trouble with HD
encoded programs use encoded digital audio install of encoded analog audio.
In almost all cases that report stuttering programs that stutter when being
played in MCE do not stutter when being played with MCE this includes both
you and Jim. This is because MCE tries harder to insure that neither audio
or video fall between their real time playback rate then does Media Player.
The reason for this apparently is to enable MCE to be able to meet the
CableCard 1.0 standards in a future release.
Nathan do you by chance have another sound card you can try?
Joe,
Are you using a dual or single core AMD 64?
"Joe Horton" <j...@msn.com> wrote in message
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Nathan
I don't have a sound card I can try, but I could go to fry's and pick one
up. Any suggestions?
Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:Oy4Kz13l...@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
JW
supports so any of them would be good choice. I am not an audiophile so I
can't offer a suggestion.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:%23gHJwO4...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Jim Mallory
-- Jim
Jim Mallory
release that does not recongize the 4400+ as a dual-core chip. Live TV has
been running for over an hour without stutter.
-- Jim
Nathan
the BIOS to a X2 version and after a half hour of Live Tv it's doing the
samething. Back to the drawing board.
Talked to someone at The Green Button Forum and he is using the same board
as Jim but live tv works for him. The difference is he is running a 6600gt
in SLI and he is using 2 Compro VideoMate DVB-T300 for his tuners. Maybe it
is a tuner thing?
"Jim Mallory" <JimMa...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:549761C8-2343-4435...@microsoft.com...
JW
tuner card and its encoder. Both you and Jim have the Hauppauge 150 card.
If either of you have a friend who can give you a copy of an NTSC program
file recorded with another tuner it would be a way to test the card as the
cause.
If it is not that then it is the MCE code itself getting in trouble with
multiple processors handling of the separate threads in decoding and passing
the outputs to the graphics card and to your audio card. The software may
not have considered the fact that the video could be processed faster than
the audio in a dual processor system and your 6600GT and Jims 7800 are doing
just that.
If either of you have a friend who can give you a copy of an NTSC program
file recorded with another tuner it would be a way to test the card as the
cause.
The fact that a user with DVB-T tuners does not have the problem is, I
believe, because he is receiving a digital broadcast and not an NTSC analog
broadcast.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:OzGjVhCm...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Jim Mallory
Nathan
Nor do I. Question for you Jim when you setup you media center pc was the
right BIOS (for X2 support) on your motherboard before you installed
windows? Or did you flash it after windows was installed? I flashed mine
after I installed windows.
Nathan
"Jim Mallory" <JimMa...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:DAD144D3-4DE8-4F8B...@microsoft.com...
Jim Mallory
JW
are encoded time stamps are given to the video frames and to the audio so
that everything can be played back in sync. As I stated before MCE tries
harder than MCE to insure that all audio is played back at 1:1 times real
time and that the video keeps up with the audio. The timestamps are created
at encoder time so the different encoder chips used by different TV tuner
cards may not all create accurate time stamps. The timestamps created in
DVDs and in digital broadcasts apparently have no trouble making sure that
there are not any variation in the creation of very valid timestamps, of
course they are using encoder equipment costing thousands of dollars. With
the dual core system any difference in valid video and audio timestamps
seems to result in both the video and audio stuttering when played with MCE.
A recording from an ATI Elite 550 chip NTSC tuner card would make a good
test vehicle since the chip on that board was developed by ATI and is not
used on any other common Tuner cards.
I suggest both of you try watching or recording NTSC TV using both "best"
and "fair" quality and see if this has any effect on the stuttering.
Nathan, What was the source of the file you transferred from another system
that played without problem, digital or analog and if analog was it from an
Hauppauge tuner card?
Another interesting test would be to record a program using a single core
system and see if it plays correctly on a dual core system? The reverse of
this test might also reveal an interesting result.
"Jim Mallory" <JimMa...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:FA5EB97A-262A-45A1...@microsoft.com...
Nathan
The file from my last MC were analog and were recorded with the same tuner
card. I did some quick testing this morning and found that two shows that
were taped with the current MC having support for dual core but played back
with single core or duel core support skipped and stop after about 10-20
min. but play fine on extenders and in WMP. Shows tape with the MC having
single core support play fine on the MC with duel core or single core
support. So now the question is if I change the tuner with a ATI Elite 550
chip will it work? If someone made a card with that chip set with duel
tuners I would buy it today. I might wait to see if there are any new
features in the update due in August but so far all I have read about is
just rumors. Anything else I should try before replacing the tuners? Should
I try to send an email to Hauppauge? But I don't know if I have enough info
for them to change there mind. I will try changing the quality setting and
see if that makes a difference.
Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:e0aqJSGm...@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
JW
same tuner hardware as the Hauppauge.
The results you have were a surprise but certainly appear to point the
finger at Hauppauge. You might call them or better send their support
department an E-mail describing your configuration and recent findings. They
just might know something and in any case should be willing to investigate
since 2 of their users are having the same problem with their cards.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:u9ioasSm...@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
JW
Here is a link that discusses dedicating a processor to a task.
http://www.microsoft.com/resources/documentation/windows/xp/all/proddocs/en-us/sag_mpmonperf_18.mspx
If you are able to do this in your systems you might try dedicating the
Hauppauge driver to Core(CPU1) this will insure that multiple threads of the
driver are not running at the same time on different cores which might be
happening if the input from the card is double buffered.
JW
"Jim Mallory" <JimMa...@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:32781BF3-7AE5-4B8B...@microsoft.com...
> Nathan, if you open up a ticket with Happugage, drop me an email at
> jmallory"AT"glis"DOT"net with any ticket information and contact info you
> have and I will send them an Email saying I am having the same problem you
> are. When I was dealing with them they seemed to lose interest once we
> determined that the card worked fine with WinTV.
>
> -- Jim
Nathan
The Hauppauge driver does not run as a process though. But I thing I might
try setting ehrecvr and ehrec to the same cpu and see what happens. I might
even set all eh*.exe to one cpu. Then set my extenders to the other cpu. I
will let you know how it goes. Also I sent Hauppauge an email and copied Jim
on it. Waiting to here back from them. I did get a response back from
someone though that they were using a X2 and 150mce successfully in MC, but
they are using a Asus A8V board which is agp and has a different chip set
(VIA I believe).
Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:eiu0epUm...@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
JW
As I stated before MCE 2005 tries very hard to insure that the video and
audio are in a 1:1 real time playback ratio. Other playback programs such as
Media Player and the decoder and video chip in the Extenders do not seem to
be as concerned or handle the data inconsistency differently.
Since the problem occurs only when the recording is made with both CPUs
enabled then it appears that one of the following problems occurs during the
recording.
Some data is duplicated
Some date is missing
Some video and audio data do not have a proper match
This problem could be caused by either the tuner card and its encoder or by
the MCE control software which stores the encoded data received from the
tuner card.
It should be possible to insure that two threads of a recording are not in
conflict with each other by assigning the recording activity to one CPU .
As Nathan suggested, setting either or both of the "ehr" process to a single
CPU will hopefully prevent the problem. Doing one of these at a time may
help to determine if the problem is in the tuner card/driver or in the MCE
control software. I don't think setting the extender software to the other
CPU will provide any benefit since letting it use either CPU gives it more
flexibility and should not cause any problem.
As for the user with the A8V MB, did he confirm that his BIOS was set to use
both cores and that MCE recognized and was using both of them. I ask
because from the ASUS Website I see indication that the A8N supports the
dual core chips but I do not see the same indication for the A8V MBs.
Another suggestion would be to create a small recording file containing a
"bad" recording and try and find some software or someone who can analyze
and look for the data inconsistency that is causing the problem that MCE
playback appears to be stuttering over. A new thread here on the AVS Forum
may be required to obtain assistance in this process.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
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Nathan
I tried settiing affinity but because it runs as a service I get an error
that I am not allowed. I am going to try to look if there is a way to start
a service only using one CPU but so far I have not had any luck.
Nathan
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
news:eY$tyFemF...@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl...
JW
to help you.
By the way I inadvertently left out of my possible encoding errors what I
think is the most probable which is out of time sequence data.
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:ubof99Cn...@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Nathan
that will let you run services on one core. I am going to try to start with
the card drivers first them the ehr* services next.
"JW" <anon...@Nospam.Iam> wrote in message
Brad
cpu. I have an NVTV dual-tuner card. My solution was to affinitize
the ehrecvr.exe process to a single cpu using the imagecfg utility.
Recording and playback are now fine.
Nathan
ehrec.exe). JW thanks for all your help.
Nathan
"Brad" <bradr...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1123798431.8...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
JW
times, at least I will recognize it if it happens to someone else.
JW
"Nathan" <ngra...@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:ORCl2r0...@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
rupakg
stutter on and off, due to some windows update or driver update. I have
always restored back to a "working restore point" and managed. But, last
week, I did not update anything, and my TV recordings started to stutter. I
checked LiveTV and same stutter. Basically, the frames pause and play every
20 seconds. I tried all the latest Windows updates and also checked my
drivers using the MS driver check tool, with no avail. It tells me that it is
compatible with MCE. I have a HP 854n machine which uses a EMuxed tuner and
on-board AC97 sound card. I have put a MadDog sound card and use that instead.
Please help me as you guys seem to know a lot.
Thanks,
Rupak