Small School Network Startup -- Suggestions?
Scott Marquardt
I'm fairly new to networking, and am tasked with planning a new network for
our small private school. The network will need to serve both administration
and student needs. We will need good security and excellent reporting of
student usage. We will also want to set up Internet access with accounts for
each student--with strong controls and monitoring on email and web traffic.
We also have a lot of application development for admin, but that seems
almost trivial.
My uninformed initial question in a market in serious flux is this -- where
do I start discovering how to best build the system we will need? What's my
best course if I wish to become sufficiently literate in the next several
months to make wise decisions?
I'm fairly certain that NT is where we want to go. But I need to learn what
I need to bolt in place in terms of server components and, for that matter,
network hardware (so much good stuff waiting in the wings, it seems -- what
choices today will allow me to migrate to the next step in a few years?).
I'd welcome pointers to books, trades, mailing lists--or heck--just plain
long-winded advice. ;-)
Please copy to email if you follow-up to just one NG. Thanks -
Scott Marquardt
I.T.F.
Fox Valley Technical and Trade Center
North Aurora, IL
William Allen Scheer
Hi Scott:
Start by telling me how many computers are planned to be on this network -
3 years from now. That will help with some initial capacity planning, and
save lots of money and headaches down-the-line. Your of NT is an excellent
one, especially in light of the myriad applications you mention. Some of
your first issuse will be finding a good cabling contractor and an ISP, as
well a local MCSE to help you when needed. This will be a great learning
experience for you, but some of it really will require the assistance of a
'pro'. For server hardware, I'd strongly recommend Compaq, HP, Dell, and
AST - in that order. Clones are fine for your client workstations, but go
with a 'tier one' brand server. BTW - Bay Networks has an excellent
Networking primer on their website - www.baynetworks.com. Let's keep this
thread alive, it'll be good for a lot of people new to the biz.
Scott Marquardt <s...@wwa.com> wrote in article
<3383734...@news.wwa.com>...
> I'm fairly new to networking, and am tasked with planning a new network
for
> our small private school. The network will need to serve both
administration
> and student needs. ............. etc.
Kelly Martin
I'm gonna go the long winded advice route...
With all of the controls you want to set, yes I think NT is the route to
go for the workstations. Personally, I prefer Netware for the server,
but if everything else is NT and the network is going to be contained in
one or two locations, NT server will do you just fine. The other
obvious benefit is not having to learn two OSes.
If you want to make wise decisions, and keep informed about what is
happening with hardware and software, get some subscriptions to computer
journals. Specifically:
ComputerWorld
LAN Times
InfoWorld
Network Computing
PC Week
Also, check out their web sites continually.
As for hardware, be sure you get good equipment:
The best bet for servers would be Compaq or HP. Don't scrimp on the
server, it will be the heart of your network, and you want a box that is
designed to be a server, not some components slapped together at the
local clone shop.
Get good network cards and hubs. I personally like 3Com for network
cards and Cabletron for hubs. Cabletron is expensive, but worth it. If
you want to go a little cheaper for hubs, go with the 3Com.
Be sure you get a good, no great, cabling contractor. 95% of network
problems are tracked back to infrastructure. If the cabling is not done
right, nothing will work right. If the server is the heart of the
network, the cabling is the lifeblood. Check references thoroughly.
Get some training for yourself and whoever else will be helping you. At
least take the beginner and intermediate network administrator courses
for whatever OS you plan to go with.
And, check the newsgroups from time to time to see what kinds of
problems people are having and what the resolutions are. This is a
great method for getting real world answers to real world problems.
I hope this helps. Good luck!!
Kelly Martin
Martin Consulting
s...@wwa.com (Scott Marquardt) wrote:
>
> I'm fairly new to networking, and am tasked with planning a new network for
> our small private school. The network will need to serve both administration
Steve Sanders
Using Windows NT Server Special Edition by QUE $49.99
networking
deploying windows nt
administerating a network
wans & the internet
backoffice
etc.
--
http://www.yi.com/home/SandersSteve/
mailto:St...@HoTMaiL.com
Tomas Fazekas
Scott,
please also take a look on BriLAN, which is an multipurpose
networking software for Ethernet and FastEthernet:
http://rc.service.rug.nl/~ruiter/bratisla/managuk.htm
It acts as PC switch with many useful network administering
capabilities:
- usage accounting
- security tool (MAC level, protocol filters)
- build in continuous network monitoring (configurable alarms)
- build in network analysis (traffic graphs with selectable time scale)
etc.
Hope I helped you
best regards
Tomas.
> Scott Marquardt wrote:
> I'm fairly new to networking, and am tasked with planning a
> new network for our small private school. The network will
> need to serve both administration and student needs.
> We will need good security and excellent reporting of
> student usage. We will also want to set up Internet access with
> accounts for each student--with strong controls and
> monitoring on email and web traffic.
> We also have a lot of application development for admin,
> but thatseems almost trivial.
..snip
Dan Lyon
Running Windows Nt Server 4.0 by Russel and Crawford (Microsoft Press)
should tell you most of what you need to know.
As for software for the mail, news etc for the school/college, try taking a
look at http://www.fastraq.demon.co.uk/post
There is a school in Leicester, England (UK) running their entire school on
it. 1600 user mailboxes, and it handles them fine. it's not quite
finished yet (in fact, I am part of the development team) but it will be
ready soon, and we would really appreciate more use around the world.
Server wise, i have just been through this. I find that Dell stuff is cost
effective. Compa is really good kit, but a little over priced when
compared with Dell. HP stuff is really nice, but is really expensive....
Take a look at the Dell PowerEdge servers. They are well built, reasonably
priced, and come with an on-site set-up and test, which means that they
come and connect and situate for you, and all you have to do is install NT.
THe book which I mentioned above told me everything that I needed to know
(never having done anything like this before) and got me through the
setting up of the clients (Some DOS, some WFWG 3.11 and some Windows 95)
and I don't doubt that I could have got Mac's running as well (if I had
needed to).
It's not that bad. I really would recommed the book I listed, as it is a
step-by-step guide, and will allow you to understand what it is you really
need.
Hope this helps. If you have any more q's don't hesitate to ask me.
Rgds
Dan.
Kelly Martin
While Andrew is correct it stating that Compaq and HP are expensive,
Compaq has dropped it's pricing considerably, and is very competitive
with most name brand manufacturers. It also doesn't hurt that Compaq is
"in bed" with Microsoft (a solutions partner, and all), so you know
their systems will most likely work extremely well together. But, of
course, it is wise to shop around. Just remember that the cheapest is
that way for a reason.
As for the network cards and hub, while Cabletron and 3Com are the most
expensive, they are also the most reliable, have excellent technical
support (not necessarily the people, but response to technical
problems), and will generally have the least problems. You have to
decide where you want to spend the money - once, getting really good
stuff, or many times, replacing parts or spending hours troubleshooting
defective equipment.
Definitely heed Andrew's advice on the cabling. Go with CAT5 twisted
pair cabling. It will support 10BaseT now, and allow for expansion to
100BaseTX if you need extra speed later on. It is also much easier to
troubleshoot.
As Andrew noted about the cabling, it is much better to "pay a little
more now and save later". However, I feel that applies to the servers,
hubs, and NICs as well.
Please note, I am not affiliated with any of these companies. This is
just my opinion based on my experience (10 years, configuring and
maintaining networks).
Kelly Martin
Martin Consulting
pos...@skinner.topnz.ac.nz wrote:
>
> Scott,
> Whilst I can agree with Martin about training and magazine subs, I
> disagree about the hardware issues. I have been involved in computer
> h/w (mainly servicing side) for 20 yrs. Compaq and HP are very good,
> but also have drawbacks. The major drawback is price. I would assume
> that being a school, you will have limited funds, so go to suppliers
> like compaq, HP, Digital, AST, Dell and any other name-brand computer
> supplier and get pricing from them for your server/workstation needs.
> The reason I suggest name-brand is that if the computer supplier you
> get the gear from goes bust, then the manufacturer will carry
> warranty. 'Clone' computers, whilst very good these days and still
> cheaper than name brands are prone to losing the warranties if the
> supplier goes bust.
> As far as hubs go, cabletron and 3com are two of the most expensive
> on the market and your needs will not require 'Rolls Royce' hubs and
> network cards. Cheaper hubs and clone NE2000 n/w cards will fit your
> needs nicely and allow you to put the savings in those areas into a
> better server.
> Your cable installer should be familiar with structured cabling
> systems. Do not let anyone talk you into coax cabling. Though it is
> cheaper, you will have more probs with it later on. Better to pay a
> little more now and save later. Also, 10baseT cabling will allow for
> more flexability in the future.
>
> There is a bit more to chew on, a view from another perspective.
>
> Good Luck
> Andrew Postma
pos...@skinner.topnz.ac.nz
Harvey Brown
Scott,
I'm teaching at a grade 7 to 12 school. Over the last two years we built a network of 45
windows 95 computers networked to a server running Windows NT server. We have learned some things
that might be of value to you.
We chose NT because its educational price was much less than Novell. We find its security
for student accounts to be good - too good in a sense because it is time consuming to grant staff
access to student folders so they can check for things that should not be there. Our school network
is now connected to a school district WAN and hence to the internet, so students do occasionally
download pictures that are inappropriate for schools and we do have to check. We also have
relatively little hard drive space on the server so we have to check for students who have many MB
of useless graphics. NT does not seem to have any way to control student printing; an issue because
printing works too well and students often print out dozens of pages without even bothering to pick
them up.
We have found that ClarisWorks for Windows is the most productive software for students. We
also have Microsoft Office for our lab. The students are distracted by the myriad features of
Office and find Word's drawing tools extremely awkward in comparison to ClarisWorks' terrific draw
and paint programs. Fair warning, though, ClarisWorks 4.0 has some annoying bugs.
I set up Windows NT Server, the wiring and hubs in the computer lab myself. I recommend
this; it was a bit tough dealing with NT but if you do not do it yourself you will be forever
dependent upon whoever you hire to do it. We hired a contractor to do the first 10 network
connections to classrooms. Then we hired the janitor to run the wires to the rest and some students
and I put the connectors on the ends. We never had any trouble with this; if you have a teacher who
is handy and students who are willing, you can do the wiring yourselves and save a lot of money. We
assembled the last 16 Pentium computers ourselves. This was much less profitable; we saved about
$100 on each machine and could not have done it without the help of knowledgeable parent volunteers.
I recommend that you visit some schools who have Novell and who have NT Server and see which
you would prefer.
Stan Buskus
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------D0A77BEAED25269DD3FBF97A
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
I know this is a MS newgroup, but you might want to take a look at SCO's
Unixware for your server ( I know all the issues with NT/Unix, I use
both. We can argue all day and at best come to a draw). There are three
reasons we are using it at our school: the price, the features, and the
price. They have a special going on were you get the Unixware Internet
server for $20.00 (US)..
As far as platform, we are looking at the Dell 2100. The reason for Dell
is that we feel we get a better value with mail order, and of the mail
orders we feel Dell has the best support.
Stan Buskus
--------------D0A77BEAED25269DD3FBF97A
Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Description: Card for Stan Buskus
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf"
begin: vcard
fn: Stan Buskus
n: Buskus;Stan
org: AT&T Manage Network Solutions
email;internet: bus...@attmail.com
title: Technical Manager
x-mozilla-cpt: ;0
x-mozilla-html: FALSE
end: vcard
--------------D0A77BEAED25269DD3FBF97A--
Peter Szymonik
Another item I would add is to buy PCs from a mail vendor that bundles
software, this can save hundreds of $$$ in software licensing fees per
workstation.
Peter T. Szymonik
xo...@msn.com
...change is constant...
Scott Marquardt
I'm Bcc'ing several parties who responded in one of these NG's or by email.
Thank you all for your responses, which led me to several sources, helped me
rethink some matters, confirmed some intuitions, and generally kept me busy
the last couple weeks!
If you wish to keep a thread going on the subject of start-up networks and
support of persons starting from scratch, this is being posted in:
comp.os.ms-windows.nt.admin.networking
comp.os.ms-windows.networking.win95
microsoft.public.win95.networking
microsoft.public.windowsnt.setup
If you wish to duck out of the thread please disregard this email, and
thanks again.
I'm definitely planning on using NT for our server(s), but we'll likely have
to scale up from an initial collection of 3 or 4 peered 95 machines (which
we don't have yet). I understand I need to plan for CAT5 throughout our
facility. I also see no reason not to go with 100BaseTX right off. Several
of you gave a shortlist of mfg's for NICs, and I suppose I can't go far
wrong choosing any of them -- let's say, for example, 3Com for NICs as well
as for hubs. But I'll keep my eyes open for reviews and such.
I'm fairly confident about the basics, but while I'm doing my homework I'll
post the areas that concern me most (where I'm most ignorant ;-)
Any ideas would (again) be appreciated). CC to email if possible, please.
What do I need running on our server(s) to provide for Internet
connectivity? We want separate accounts for each student. I take it this
means a subnet and such. This also raises domain issues and the question of
what kind of service provider can supply us with the necessary connection.
Do I, like, need a router? And regarding firewall and proxy issues, I
consider myself presently ill equipped to reach any decisions on such
matters. I can read up on proxy servers, but firewall information accessible
to the layman seems a contradiction in terms. Furthermore, the functionality
of much of these technologies seems to overlap in striking ways. Sorting
through this stuff sure is troublesome. I can see why some of you took
consultants as a given in our scenario.
This post was pretty much to acknowledge the many helpful responses I
received. I'll post further as I make progress, CC'ing only those who
continue in the thread. Again, thanks to all.
Best,
Scott Marquardt
ITF
Fox Tech
North Aurora, Illinois
Scott Marquardt
Some of you have helpfully followed up and asked how the peered network
planning has been going. OK, I guess--though the machines I've received a
budget for might as well be Apple IIs. ;-)
At any rate, I'm looking at 3Com's 3C905-TX (PCI 10/100) for the machines
and their OfficeConnect or SuperStack hubs. I guess a switch would be
pointless at this point. I'm looking for a good PCcard adapter for our three
notebooks. I'm also wondering where I can get the least expensive CAT5 and
hardware. I'll be doing the cabling myself (I have a background in stringing
far too much cable in the Navy). I can borrow a tester.
Now on to peripherals and software licenses. I'm wondering about Microsoft
OpenLicense pricing, and I'm trying to figure out how the deuce to rig an
infrared port somewhere so printing can go from the notebooks to a
non-IRported printer without the notebooks having to be logged on. I guess
that's just impossible; the printer's gotta have IR.
Anyone heard of Mango's up and coming product?
Finally, I can get one real sweet machine. It's not budgeted as a server,
but, well, that's what I have in mind for it next year. I'd like to NT it;
heck, I'd like to run all the MS stuff including Exchange on it. I suppose
I'm dreaming, but I'm not going to get much equipment and I'd like to do it
all!
If anyone has any final advice before I start writing P.O.s, give me a
holler. Echo your response to email if you're reading this on the NG, I'm
copying this to comp.os.ms-windows.networking.win95 and
microsoft.public.win95.networking as well.
Thanks again to all for your advice a few weeks back. I'll return to your
helpful emails again in the next couple weeks.
Cordially,
Scott Marquardt
RTF or HTML email OK