My Microsoft Works adventure

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Scott Mace

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Mar 7, 2008, 7:49:03 PM3/7/08
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(Originally posted at www.calendarswamp.com)

I've never set up Microsoft Works to work with my Pocket PC.

So I installed ActiveSync 4.5 on one of my XP machines. ActiveSync tells me:

"To synchronize E-mail, Calendar, Contacts, Tasks and Notes with this
computer, do the following: Disconnect the device, run Outlook..."
Fortunately I realized I didn't need to run Outlook, just Works.

Ah, but wait a minute. Works Help says:

"Start the Works Task Launcher."
It took a Google search before I realized I had to start the Task Launcher
from the Start menu, not from within Works Calendar.

Classic!

Then I click "Templates." My goodness what a lot of templates there! Lessee,
where's the one I'm looking for...oh yeah, "Synchronization." Windows CE
device synchronization. I start that...

"Works will now run the ActiveSync setup program to install the Works
Synchronization files onto your Windows CE device. After the ActiveSync
application downloading is complete, please turn off your Windows CE device
and then turn it back on to complete the installation."
Followed by:

"Please check your mobile device screen to see if additional steps are
necessary to complete this installation."
And indeed, there were some clicks to finish installation on the Pocket PC.

Of course, this fairly-ancient Pocket PC then tells me:

"The program you have installed may not display properly because it was
designed for a previous version of Windows Mobile software [italics mine]."
I have to fight my way through a few more references to Outlook to get to:

"Welcome to the Pocket PC Sync Setup Wizard"


ActiveSync wants me to name the computer I'm syncing to. This part is
familiar to me from previous ActiveSync adventures.

But wait, why is Calendar grayed out, but something called Appointments
isn't???

Could it be that Calendar is an Outlook concept, but Appointments is a Works
concept?

When I try to sync, nothing comes over in either direction. What am I doing
wrong?

Do I have to set up a Mail profile in the Windows control panel?

I try that. I sync again. This time there's an error in ActiveSync:

"ActiveSync encountered a problem on the desktop. Support code: 85010014."
Anyone know what I should try next? How could I possibly have software
that's too old? Is it the age of the Pocket PC? It's a Dell Axim running
Windows Mobile 5.0.

--Scott Mace


Beverly Howard [Ms-MVP/MobileDev]

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Mar 7, 2008, 11:05:25 PM3/7/08
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>> Anyone know what I should try next? <<

Sorry, but back to step three... Outlook (and not outlook express) is
required to sync pim data (contacts, calendar, tasks, notes)

>> It's a Dell Axim running Windows Mobile 5.0 <<

Check the CD and other materials which came with the ppc... outlook
should be on the CD but you will need the outlook activation code as
well... which might be on the cd sleeve.

Beverly Howard [MS MVP-Mobile Devices]

Todd Allcock

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Mar 8, 2008, 1:39:52 PM3/8/08
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"Beverly Howard [Ms-MVP/MobileDev]" <BevNoSpamBevHoward.com> wrote in
message news:#sDJkGNg...@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

To be fair, the OP's correct- MS Works 8 (from 2004 or so, IIRC) did promise
the ability to sync Works files with "Windows CE devices" running Win CE 2.0
or higher!

Supposedly Works could sync Works contacts and appointments with PPCs, but
the fact that the OP said it tried to install software his PPC tells us it
probably wasn't synching to the PPC's default PIM database, but rather was
trying to create a separate Works PIM on the device. I doubt there's still
any support for recent WinMo OSes (the only MS KB article I could find on
synching with Works said that you had to upgrade from Activesync 3.0 to 3.1
for it to work!)

I haven't played with MS Works since the Windows 3.1 days (Works 2.0?) but
it sounds like the OP has a VERY old copy of Works and is expecting
functionality that I'm afraid has been long since forgotten. On the other
hand, our friends at MS have been "milking" the same version of Works for a
long time- Works 8, although introduced in 2004, was repackaged unchanged in
Works Suite 2005 and 2006, so that legacy sync functionality was probably
still in there waiting to disappoint WM5 owners!

AKAIK, references to synching with Win CE were dropped in 8.5 (except for
Pocket Streets maps, which Works apparently included!) and I don't think
there's any mention of Win CE or mobile devices in the current (9.0)
version, as Pocket Streets is no longer included.

Scott Mace

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Mar 8, 2008, 8:20:53 PM3/8/08
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I do indeed have MS Works 8.

It's sad news to hear that support for mobile syncing stopped there.

Scott Mace

"Todd Allcock" <elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in message
news:%23GxwPvU...@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

Todd Allcock

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Mar 9, 2008, 5:17:01 AM3/9/08
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At 08 Mar 2008 17:20:53 -0800 Scott Mace wrote:
> I do indeed have MS Works 8.
>
> It's sad news to hear that support for mobile syncing stopped there.

Well, to be fair, by that time all Win CE devices were including Outlook,
which syncs directly with Pocket PCs without having to install additional
software on the mobile device.

Personally, I'd take Outlook as a PIM over Works anyday It's the de facto
standard for Calendars, and has more sync options available- i.e. it can
sync with "cloud calendars" like Google and Plaxo, and sync with virtually
any PDA or mobile phone via Funambol/SyncML.

Scott Mace

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Mar 10, 2008, 1:29:12 PM3/10/08
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Outlook may be the de facto standard, but not all of us are happy with that
fact.

Anyway, thanks for answering my questions.

Scott

"Todd Allcock" <elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in message

news:fr0a02$hki$4...@aioe.org...

DevilsPGD

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Mar 10, 2008, 1:54:46 PM3/10/08
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In message <13tarvd...@corp.supernews.com> "Scott Mace"
<sc...@wiredmuse.com> wrote:

>Outlook may be the de facto standard, but not all of us are happy with that
>fact.

Have you spent any time with it? Outlook makes a very good PIM,
although it's far less functional as a mail client.

Scott Mace

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Mar 10, 2008, 2:18:33 PM3/10/08
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My main beef with Outlook is I don't want to use it as a mail client. I've
always found while installing Outlook that it didn't work well if another
desktop mail client (i.e. Thunderbird) were preferred. I'd love to find some
info on how to make the two coexist nicely. So far, no luck.

Scott

"DevilsPGD" <spam_na...@crazyhat.net> wrote in message
news:mbtat3d86iidafvng...@4ax.com...

r_z_...@pen_fact.com

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Mar 10, 2008, 3:34:01 PM3/10/08
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On Mon, 10 Mar 2008 11:18:33 -0700, "Scott Mace" <sc...@wiredmuse.com>
wrote:

>My main beef with Outlook is I don't want to use it as a mail client. I've
>always found while installing Outlook that it didn't work well if another
>desktop mail client (i.e. Thunderbird) were preferred. I'd love to find some
>info on how to make the two coexist nicely. So far, no luck.

Folks who have multiple computers, or at least multiple virtual
machines, can use my approach: I have Outlook on one computer that has
no email client and one virtual machine that also has no email client.
The virtual machine I use for email has no copy of Outlook.

>
>Scott
>
>"DevilsPGD" <spam_na...@crazyhat.net> wrote in message
>news:mbtat3d86iidafvng...@4ax.com...
>> In message <13tarvd...@corp.supernews.com> "Scott Mace"
>> <sc...@wiredmuse.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Outlook may be the de facto standard, but not all of us are happy with
>>>that
>>>fact.
>>
>> Have you spent any time with it? Outlook makes a very good PIM,
>> although it's far less functional as a mail client.
>

-----------------------------------------
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Robert E. Zaret, eMVP
PenFact, Inc.
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Boston, MA 02116
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Todd Allcock

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Mar 10, 2008, 4:04:30 PM3/10/08
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At 10 Mar 2008 10:29:12 -0700 Scott Mace wrote:
> Outlook may be the de facto standard, but not all of us are happy with
that
> fact.


Fair enough, I guess, but since I use my Windows Mobile devices as my
primary "PIM machines," WinMo compatibility is the most important feature
of a desktop PIM to me. I'll overlook a LOT of other shortcomings in
return for easy reliable synching.

I actually like Outlook just fine, although I think 2007 is a bit slow
compared to Outlook XP I used prior to Vista. I really like the lokk of
'07 versus older versions, so I'm willing to put up with it's
(comparitively) lagging performance.


> Anyway, thanks for answering my questions.


My pleasure- I just wish I had a better answer for you.


DevilsPGD

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Mar 10, 2008, 9:51:49 PM3/10/08
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In message <fr4gvu$3ir$1...@aioe.org> Todd Allcock
<elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:

>Fair enough, I guess, but since I use my Windows Mobile devices as my
>primary "PIM machines," WinMo compatibility is the most important feature
>of a desktop PIM to me. I'll overlook a LOT of other shortcomings in
>return for easy reliable synching.

I've been using SyncML to synchronize my PDA's PIM data with a central
server, then using applications of my choice on other systems.

On my desktop I use Outlook (with a backend connector), on my laptop I
use Outlook (with SyncJE), and Sunbird (Mozilla's calendar offering),
plus I have a web interface available. It all "just works"

DevilsPGD

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Mar 10, 2008, 9:51:49 PM3/10/08
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In message <13taurv...@corp.supernews.com> "Scott Mace"
<sc...@wiredmuse.com> wrote:

>My main beef with Outlook is I don't want to use it as a mail client. I've
>always found while installing Outlook that it didn't work well if another
>desktop mail client (i.e. Thunderbird) were preferred. I'd love to find some
>info on how to make the two coexist nicely. So far, no luck.

I use it for the same.

In general, turning off the "use as default mail client" then having
your choice of mail client take over mostly works, although some Outlook
functionality (specifically, external apps that talk to Outlook via
MAPI) will sometimes need you to set Outlook as a default mail client.

I found an acceptable middle ground, pointing the MAILTO protocol to my
mail client, letting Outlook retain the rest. Virtually everything uses
Thunderbird, but MAPI still works.

The odd time an app will call Outlook to send an email, but it's usually
pretty trivial to copy the message to my mail client of choice.

Todd Allcock

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Mar 11, 2008, 12:43:09 AM3/11/08
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At 10 Mar 2008 19:51:49 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:

> I've been using SyncML to synchronize my PDA's PIM data with a central
> server, then using applications of my choice on other systems.


I've just recently started using Funambol (an open-source version of SyncML)
to try and bridge Outlook OTA with my WinMo phones and my "dumbphones." I
tried it a couple of years ago, but the Funambol WinCE software was uber-
buggy and unstable. It's a LOT better now. I figured I'd give it one last
try before buying hosted Exchange service.


> On my desktop I use Outlook (with a backend connector), on my laptop I
> use Outlook (with SyncJE), and Sunbird (Mozilla's calendar offering),
> plus I have a web interface available. It all "just works"


I wish there was a Funambol Outlook Express connector for my less used PCs
that aren't worthy of yet another purchased copy of Outlook. Do you know
of an inexpensive SyncML OE plug in that isn't locked into a particular
provider like Plaxo or whomever?

Scott Mace

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Mar 11, 2008, 1:09:50 PM3/11/08
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"Todd Allcock" <elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote in message
news:fr52oa$ijg$1...@aioe.org...

> I wish there was a Funambol Outlook Express connector for my less used PCs
> that aren't worthy of yet another purchased copy of Outlook. Do you know
> of an inexpensive SyncML OE plug in that isn't locked into a particular
> provider like Plaxo or whomever?

Huh? According to
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/outlookvsoe.mspx,
"Outlook has a host of features that Outlook Express does not have, such as
a calendar..."

Scott Mace


DevilsPGD

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Mar 11, 2008, 1:33:40 PM3/11/08
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In message <fr52oa$ijg$1...@aioe.org> Todd Allcock
<elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:

>At 10 Mar 2008 19:51:49 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:
>
>> I've been using SyncML to synchronize my PDA's PIM data with a central
>> server, then using applications of my choice on other systems.
>
>
>I've just recently started using Funambol (an open-source version of SyncML)
> to try and bridge Outlook OTA with my WinMo phones and my "dumbphones." I
>tried it a couple of years ago, but the Funambol WinCE software was uber-
>buggy and unstable. It's a LOT better now. I figured I'd give it one last
>try before buying hosted Exchange service.

I can't say I've ever been impressed with Funambol, although it's been a
few months since I gave it a hard look. From a developer point of view,
Funambol went out of it's way to be deliberately difficult with regards
to ambiguities in the SyncML specifications, which is the source of a
large part of my disdain for this one.

However, beggars and choosers and all that...

>> On my desktop I use Outlook (with a backend connector), on my laptop I
>> use Outlook (with SyncJE), and Sunbird (Mozilla's calendar offering),
>> plus I have a web interface available. It all "just works"
>
>I wish there was a Funambol Outlook Express connector for my less used PCs
>that aren't worthy of yet another purchased copy of Outlook. Do you know
>of an inexpensive SyncML OE plug in that isn't locked into a particular
>provider like Plaxo or whomever?

SyncJE is a paid product with Outlook and Outlook Express support. It's
somewhat finicky, but once you get it working it's more or less
reliable.

Todd Allcock

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Mar 11, 2008, 4:48:27 PM3/11/08
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"Scott Mace" <sc...@wiredmuse.com> wrote in message
news:13tdf74...@corp.supernews.com...

> Huh? According to
> http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/community/columns/outlookvsoe.mspx,
> "Outlook has a host of features that Outlook Express does not have, such
> as a calendar..."

Ooops. You're right! I haven't used it in so long, I'd forgotten! I've
actually been using Outlook 2000 (came with my old Audiovox Maestro Pocket
PC I bought in 2002!) on that PC.

I found an older version of the Funambol connector that supposedly supports
Outlook 2K so I'll try that.

Todd Allcock

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Mar 12, 2008, 12:46:46 AM3/12/08
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At 11 Mar 2008 11:33:40 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:

> I can't say I've ever been impressed with Funambol, although it's been a
> few months since I gave it a hard look.

I hadn't tried it in quite awhile- it seems a bit more polished now. I
haven't tried it with a non-Funambol-based server, however. The last
Version I tried wouldn't connect to rgular SyncML servers.

> From a developer point of view,
> Funambol went out of it's way to be deliberately difficult with regards
> to ambiguities in the SyncML specifications, which is the source of a
> large part of my disdain for this one.


I can certainly appreciate that!



> However, beggars and choosers and all that...

Yeah, my eventual plan is to host my own server rather than "rely on the
kindness of strangers." This is all in the testing phase.

> SyncJE is a paid product with Outlook and Outlook Express support. It's
> somewhat finicky, but once you get it working it's more or less
> reliable.


I'll take a look, thanks!


DevilsPGD

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Mar 13, 2008, 1:12:56 AM3/13/08
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In message <fr7n8e$lb0$3...@aioe.org> Todd Allcock
<elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:

>At 11 Mar 2008 11:33:40 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:
>
>> However, beggars and choosers and all that...
>
>Yeah, my eventual plan is to host my own server rather than "rely on the
>kindness of strangers." This is all in the testing phase.

A good destination, definitely.

>> SyncJE is a paid product with Outlook and Outlook Express support. It's
>> somewhat finicky, but once you get it working it's more or less
>> reliable.
>
>I'll take a look, thanks!

If you don't mind, let me know how it goes.

Full disclosure, at $DAYJOB I am a senior tech responsible for, among
other things, our SyncML server product.

I'd be happy to offer free accounts (and have been doing so since the
late 90s, well before I started at this particular position) which
include SMTP/POP/IMAP, SyncML, a web interface, plus an "Outlook
Connector" product we developed which allows you to access your account
in Outlook's interface.

I run the server not as a function of my job, but just as a hobby
(although in all honesty, it gives me the real world experience I need
to understand how our products perform outside lab conditions)

Todd Allcock

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Mar 13, 2008, 12:43:17 PM3/13/08
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At 12 Mar 2008 23:12:56 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:

> >> SyncJE is a paid product with Outlook and Outlook Express support.
It's
> >> somewhat finicky, but once you get it working it's more or less
> >> reliable.
> >
> >I'll take a look, thanks!
>
> If you don't mind, let me know how it goes.


Browsing the Nexhaus site, I see there's no WinMo client. Since I'm pretty
sure my few remaining sync problems are on the PPC side rather than the
Outlook plug-in side, I'm not sure how SyncJE will help me, but I might
give it a trial, if only to rule out the Funambol OL connector beyond all
doubt. (Occasionally, recurring events with reminders fail to sound an
alarm on the device, as if "dismissing" them during one occurrance silences
them forever.)

> Full disclosure, at $DAYJOB I am a senior tech responsible for, among
> other things, our SyncML server product.

Neat. Now I know who I'll bug when I run into problems "rolling my own!"
;-)


DevilsPGD

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Mar 13, 2008, 1:39:57 PM3/13/08
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In message <frbm2t$fav$3...@aioe.org> Todd Allcock
<elecc...@AmericaOnLine.com> wrote:

>At 12 Mar 2008 23:12:56 -0600 DevilsPGD wrote:
>
>> >> SyncJE is a paid product with Outlook and Outlook Express support.
>It's
>> >> somewhat finicky, but once you get it working it's more or less
>> >> reliable.
>> >
>> >I'll take a look, thanks!
>>
>> If you don't mind, let me know how it goes.
>
>
>Browsing the Nexhaus site, I see there's no WinMo client.

On WinMo, go Synthesis hands-down. Actually, I'd go as far as to say on
any platform Synthesis supports, don't even bother with the trial, just
buy it and go nuts.

Don't get me wrong, I've run into a couple Synthesis bugs. The specific
bugs would be covered under an NDA since they started out as bug reports
against the products I support, but the ones that turned out to be on
the Synthesis side can easily be found in the "fixes" section of the
Synthesis release notes now.

>Since I'm pretty
>sure my few remaining sync problems are on the PPC side rather than the
>Outlook plug-in side, I'm not sure how SyncJE will help me, but I might
>give it a trial, if only to rule out the Funambol OL connector beyond all
>doubt. (Occasionally, recurring events with reminders fail to sound an
>alarm on the device, as if "dismissing" them during one occurrance silences
>them forever.)

In general, my experience has been to look to Synthesis first, SyncJE
second, and Fumabol third, based on which platforms are supported.

All three seem to be working to some degree on their various platforms,
and the interaction is getting much more reliable.

That being said, we offer our own Outlook solution, so although I do run
SyncJE in a lab setting (with my live data mind you, I run into far more
real life situations using real life data, plus it reminds me to keep
good backups), I use our own product as a primary tool.

>> Full disclosure, at $DAYJOB I am a senior tech responsible for, among
>> other things, our SyncML server product.
>
>Neat. Now I know who I'll bug when I run into problems "rolling my own!"
> ;-)

If you're using our products, I've be more then happy to assist...

If not, I may not be as useful, but I'm at least partially fluent in the
protocol (and working on becoming more of an expert in this area), but I
can't promise to be anything more then a sounding board to bounce ideas.

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