I Can't Sync My Palm Treo With Entourage 2008???

[joba...@officeformac.com]

I just upgraded and am stunned to learn this... a serious, woeful development and error on the part of Microsoft.

Too many problems. I will not, for a moment, consider using the sync services that involve iCal, Mail, etc.

I want my conduit back! This is ridiculous. I'm sitting here, now, with a relatively new Palm Treo 755p, the latest version of Entourage (which I love)... and no way to simply sync everything the way I've been doing for YEARS?!

Mircrosoft... when can we expect you to change course and release your own conduit for Palm synching? It's not like we're trying to do something obscure here. The method you're prescribing DOES NOT WORK RELIABLY. I will not use it. And I'll be returning Office 2008 if this isn't rectified quickly.

Please... anybody... help me out with some advice. Missing Sync is woeful in the face of this ridiculous development too.

[glas...@officeformac.com]

And you're right, Missing Sync is indeed woeful. It takes about 30 minutes to sync now, every single time, using Missing Sync, whereas under 2004 I could sync in a minute or less if I hadn't made many changes since the last sync.

Funny how M$ feels it's essential to create style sheets that supersede my choices of font and other design elements, but doesn't think to spend time on actual FUNCTIONALITY.....

[joba...@officeformac.com]

You know, I've got better things to do on a Saturday than rail on a message board... but this really is crappy.

I have so much business I need to accomplish and rely on my Treo. I'm not interested in using the Apple Apps. I want to use Entourage to sync and there's NO REASON... in this 21st century of ours, that this shouldn't be easy and taken for granted.

What are the odds Microsoft will address this quickly, do you think?

[Andy Ruff]

Entourage is standardizing on the OS’s device sync solution, Sync Services.  For Palm/Treo users, there are solutions out there for the OS sync system:

http://www.markspace.com/

-Andy

[Jolly Roger]

In article <C3B752C3.CB3A%ar...@microsoft.com>,
Andy Ruff <ar...@microsoft.com> wrote:

> Entourage is standardizing on the OS’s device sync solution, Sync Services.

That's just marketer speak for "we're not interested in supporting our
customers who want to synchronize Palm devices - let Apple deal with
them instead".

It's obvious to everyone and their dog that Sync Services is inferior to
Entourage 2004 Handheld Sync Conduit.

Microsoft is simply showing they don't give a rat's ass about these
customers.

--
Note: Please send all responses to the relevant news group. If you
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JR

[Adam Bailey]

Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> In article <C3B752C3.CB3A%ar...@microsoft.com>,
> Andy Ruff <ar...@microsoft.com> wrote:
>

>> Entourage is standardizing on the OSâ??s device sync solution, Sync Services.

>
> That's just marketer speak for "we're not interested in supporting our
> customers who want to synchronize Palm devices - let Apple deal with
> them instead".

It's silly for Microsoft and Apple to continue developing incompatible
methods for syncing.

> It's obvious to everyone and their dog that Sync Services is inferior to
> Entourage 2004 Handheld Sync Conduit.

For years and years people have been railing against Microsoft: "why don't
you support Apple's Sync Services?" I'm endlessly amused at how, now that
Microsoft has done as was requested, they continue to get abuse.

And I'm a loyal Treo owner, btw.

--
Adam Bailey | Chicago, Illinois
ad...@lull.org | Finger/Web for PGP & S/MIME
ada...@aol.com | http://www.lull.org/adam/

[Jolly Roger]

In article <slrnfp4fk...@peregrinus.akb.lull.org>,
Adam Bailey <ad...@lull.org> wrote:

> Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> > In article <C3B752C3.CB3A%ar...@microsoft.com>,
> > Andy Ruff <ar...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Entourage is standardizing on the OSâ??s device sync solution, Sync
> >> Services.
> >
> > That's just marketer speak for "we're not interested in supporting our
> > customers who want to synchronize Palm devices - let Apple deal with
> > them instead".
>
> It's silly for Microsoft and Apple to continue developing incompatible
> methods for syncing.
>
> > It's obvious to everyone and their dog that Sync Services is inferior to
> > Entourage 2004 Handheld Sync Conduit.
>
> For years and years people have been railing against Microsoft: "why don't
> you support Apple's Sync Services?" I'm endlessly amused at how, now that
> Microsoft has done as was requested, they continue to get abuse.
>
> And I'm a loyal Treo owner, btw.

Well those "people" (Microsoft customers) simply want a way to
synchronize ALL of their Palm contacts, events, and so on with
Entourage. With 2008, Microsoft has taken a step BACKWARDS by
complicating matters and synchronizing LESS data than 2004 did! They
deserve the abuse they get as a result IMO.

[Marty Mankins]

On Jan 19, 8:09 am, Andy Ruff <ar...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> Entourage is standardizing on the OS¹s device sync solution, Sync Services.
> For Palm/Treo users, there are solutions out there for the OS sync system:
>
> http://www.markspace.com/
>
> -Andy
>

How does The Missing Sync work with Entourage 2008? Feedback,
please. Details on what data syncs, what problems there are, errors,
etc.

- Marty

[Unknown]

Boy, I feel like this is one of those times that a little web research really paid off! I bought the new Office 2008 (basically free when I bought 2004) and, based on what I'm reading about the marginal improvements and the abandonment of the Palm synchronization that works so elegantly on 2004, I won't even bother to install it until I get clear guidance that they have "fixed" the Palm synch issues. Thanks guys! You probably saved my hours of aggravation!

[Marty Mankins]

On Jan 19, 11:16 am, Adam Bailey <ad...@lull.org> wrote:
>
> For years and years people have been railing against Microsoft: "why don't
> you support Apple's Sync Services?" I'm endlessly amused at how, now that
> Microsoft has done as was requested, they continue to get abuse.
>
> And I'm a loyal Treo owner, btw.
>
> --
> Adam Bailey | Chicago, Illinois
> ad...@lull.org | Finger/Web for PGP & S/MIME
> ada...@aol.com |http://www.lull.org/adam/

That is true. A lot of people did call for Sync Services support, but
even Microsoft's explanation of the limitations they run into with
Sync Services, they should have simply updated the Handheld Sync
software and Entourage conduit for HotSync. They updated it at least
once for Office 2004, but it was way before most of the current crop
of Treos were released.

Sync Services is ok for iCal and tasks/to do items, from my limited
testing of the function. It's the Contacts/Address Book translation
that I've had some issues with, lacking a lot of field translation to
similar of exact fields under Address Book.

- Marty

[glas...@officeformac.com]

I've only just installed and started using Missing Sync, so I may be missing things, but in my experience so far, Missing Sync:

1. Is EXTREMELY slow. Count on 30 minutes for EACH AND EVERY HotSync.

2. Is unreliable. Tasks and events I enter on the Treo don't make it to Entourage with any predictability. (Yes, I've checked to be sure I'm set to "sync" not "override")

3. Is incomplete. (iSync's fault, not Missing Sync) Because iSync doesn't support categories, there's no way for Missing Sync to bring them back & forth.

4. Provides superfluous features. (Not sure this is Missing Sync, but...) since "upgrading," now any time I have a contact's birthday or anniversary in their Address Book record AND in the Calendar, it shows up TWICE on my Treo calendar.

Again, I may be missing prefs, etc, that would fix some of these, but underscore twice and put in all-caps bold that MISSING SYNC IS NOT AN ACCEPTABLE SUBSTITUTE FOR AN OFFICE-NATIVE CONDUIT!

In my opinion, of course. Not that I matter--I just paid money for this headache of a software package.... (Grr.)

[an...@hitstate.com]

I am experiencing the same problems with Office 2008, ISync and my
Treo. Isync does not support my Treo. Office 2008 does not accept
conduits. I guess I will have to downgrade to keep my info intact.
Please can you point me to the old Entourage Conduit Download so I can
do this. I can not find it anywhere. Thanks.

[Marty Mankins]

On Jan 20, 7:56 am, a...@hitstate.com wrote:
> I am experiencing the same problems with Office 2008, ISync and my
> Treo. Isync does not support my Treo. Office 2008 does not accept
> conduits. I guess I will have to downgrade to keep my info intact.
> Please can you point me to the old Entourage Conduit Download so I can
> do this. I can not find it anywhere. Thanks.

The Exchange HotSync conduit for Office 2004 is on the install CD. If
you are trying to get it to work with Office 2008, it won't work
(according to another post out here). You will have to go back to the
full Office 2004 and Entourage 2004 in order to get the conduit to
work.

- Marty

[Marty Mankins]

Thanks for the notes on this. So in these 30 minute sync sessions,
does any data actually make it from Entourage 2008 to the Treo? and
vice versa (as you briefly mentioned with the tasks and events).

- Marty

[glas...@officeformac.com]

Yes, Calendar events, Tasks, and Contacts seem to make it okay from Entourage to Treo--just not in the other direction. (At least in my experience.)

[Marty Mankins]

On Jan 20, 11:00 am, glasg...@officeformac.com wrote:
> Yes, Calendar events, Tasks, and Contacts seem to make it okay from Entourage to Treo--just not in the other direction. (At least in my experience.)

That sounds like it's all iSync at that point.

I noticed on Apple's page for iSync that they recommend using The
Missing Sync for all Palm stuff, which means they most likely didn't
do anything for Palm users and using iSync. Bummer that there is only
one solution and it involves using another tool besides iSync or an
Entourage conduit.

- Marty

[Greg_Ar...@officeformac.com]

For those that use the Treo and others with smart phones, I have used Mark Space's Missing Sync for a couple years and upgraded when they release. It has been the best synching tool I know of and I was able to plug the proper conduits in. I'm not sure if Entourage '08 has any need for different conduits for Mark Space, but I won't know that since I don't think I will do this upgrade after reading the responses here. I might go to Daylite since they have made some great product changes.

In response to Andy, I respect the great changes they made in the upgrade that I see from the demo, but there are some long hard days ahead to make the strides necessary to make sure the product is well-rounded.

Entourage needs to:
1) Make cross-platform compatibility (it's what we expect from Microsoft)
2) Create sync services for multi-computer users without having to use Apple's programs such as iCal, Address Book, etc. through .Mac.
3) Make Projects update between multi-users to include links and mail.
4) Cut whatever red tape resides from within the Mactopia to get these things done. You're leaving money on the table.

Andy- Please pass this word around: you have made a nice product, but there is so much lost potential here. You have made it as glamorous as some of the other Apple products, but you can be even better by offering the solution your product needs to have to make it the best alternative. Right now it is not the best alternative.

I have used Entourage for years and waited for a better product to come along. I don't mean to keep touting Daylite, but I have been test-driving it for a week now and I am very impressed with it's solutions. I haven't tried it's server capabilities yet, but I understand it to work excellently with the Apple programs.

So Andy, do you think that by July 4th you might have a revolutionary update to Entourage 2008 so I don't have to spend the big bucks on Daylite?

Just a thought. Keep up the good work.
-Greg

[glva...@officeformac.com]

OK, after reading all these posts, I'm ready to reinstall Office 2004 so I can continue using the conduit that worked great with Missing Sync for my PalmOne Tungsten/T5. The question is, how? When I loaded Office 2008, it imported address book, calendar, etc., but not from Office 2004. It imported from Office X! if I reload Office 2004, will it be able to import backwards from Office 2008? If anyone knows, please advise. Thanks.

[JE McGimpsey]

In article <ee895...@webcrossing.caR9absDaxw>,
glva...@officeformac.com wrote:

Entourage 2004 will not be able to import from the 2008 Identity
database, but the original database should still be there, unless you've
deleted it.

[Michel Bintener]

Alternatively, Entourage 2004 can read archives generated by Entourage 2008,
so simply click on File>Export (in Entourage 2008), export your data as an
.rge archive, then open Entourage 2004, click on File>Import and choose the
.rge archive that has just been created.

On 21/01/08 21:44, in article
jemcgimpsey-5A74...@news.microsoft.com, "JE McGimpsey"
<jemcg...@mvps.org> wrote:

--
Michel Bintener
Microsoft MVP
Office:Mac (Entourage & Word)

*** Please always reply to the newsgroup. ***

[JE McGimpsey]

In article <C3BACB95.7030%mbin...@NOmvpsSPAM.org>,
Michel Bintener <mbin...@NOmvpsSPAM.org> wrote:

> Alternatively, Entourage 2004 can read archives generated by Entourage 2008,
> so simply click on File>Export (in Entourage 2008), export your data as an
> .rge archive, then open Entourage 2004, click on File>Import and choose the
> .rge archive that has just been created.

Ah - better!

[Unknown]

Try contacting Markspace and see if they are working on conduits. Or better yet, perhaps Mactopia could start this.

[Corentin Cras-Méneur]

<> wrote:

> Try contacting Markspace and see if they are working on conduits. Or
> better yet, perhaps Mactopia could start this.

As far as I know, MarkSpace turned exclusively on SyncService-based
syncing. No more Palm conduit.....

It works rather well for me, except that categories are simply not
supported by SYncServices and simply can't sync. I wish contact pictures
could sync too (and this is supported by SyncServices, so it seems to be
an Entourage limitation),

Corentin

--
--- Mac:MS MVP http://www.cortig.net/wordpress/ ---
http://www.mvps.org - http://mvp.support.microsoft.com
MVPs are not MS employees - Les MVP ne travaillent pas pour MS
Remove "NoSpam" to e-mail me - Retirez "NoSpam" pour m'écrire

[Glo...@officeformac.com]

I posted this elsewhere on this bulletin board, but just in case, here is how I solved the problem: I gave in and went back to Entourage 2004.

This is very sad because after 24 hours, I was starting to appreciate how pretty and Mac-like 2008 was, and how fast (compared to 2004) it opens and executes functions. And it's a bit depressing to realize that technology companies dare go backwards in their offerings and sell these as upgrades...

For those who need to go back to Entourage 2004, I hope you made a backup of your 2004 database with all your data before installing 2008. But that's not enough --obviously, you need to find your original disk and re-install Entourage 2004. I did a custom install, as I didn't want to reinstall Word, PowerPoint and Excel --after all, I may be able to use the 2008 versions.

The tricky part is to download all the updates, one at a time. If you don't, you won't be able to open Entourage, because your 2004 database has been saved in a more recent version than the one on your original disk.

The updates are at . You may want to download the AutoUpdate for Office 2004 first --it may speed up the process compared to downloading and installing every update one at a time.

Then you have to install the Handheld Sync Installer, which is located in your Applications folder, under Office 2004 / Additional Tools.

Then I performed a hard reset on my Treo to delete all the junk I had transfered through the lousy Entourage 2008 / iSync partnership. And in Palm's HotSync Manager, I opened the Entourage conduit and made sure that Entourage would override my device for the first sync. It took 30 minutes and I am now back in business.

Bottom line: I wasted $150 and a whole weekend, to reach the point where I was Friday night. No --I am totally bitter at the whole experience. I don't know whether it's Microsoft's fault, or Apple's, or Palm's, but this is not pretty...

[Marty Mankins]

On Jan 27, 3:29 pm, Glob...@officeformac.com wrote:
> I posted this elsewhere on this bulletin board, but just in case, here is how I solved the problem: I gave in and went back to Entourage 2004.

.....

> Bottom line: I wasted $150 and a whole weekend, to reach the point where I was Friday night. No --I am totally bitter at the whole experience. I don't know whether it's Microsoft's fault, or Apple's, or Palm's, but this is not pretty...

Thanks for the help and details, Glob. I'll be working on Entourage
2008 more when I get my own copy, but your experience is echoed by
others, including a company I do work for that went to Entourage 2008
and had to go back to 2004 for now.

As I've stated elsewhere on this board, I'm keeping my main system at
2004 and touching nothing. I have other systems I will be working
with to find some forward solution, but that won't be for some time.

In the meantime, I'm keeping up with the discussions out here in hopes
that someone else may find something or that Microsoft, Apple and/or
Palm will help with a solution.

- Marty

[glva...@officeformac.com]

Global, I basically did the same thing. I'm now running Word, PowerPoint, and Excel 2008, but reverted to Entourage 2004. Like you, it cost me a considerable amount of time and effort to deal with this mess. It's a shame that the best solution requires going backwards.

[luck...@officeformac.com]

I think what rags all of us and which is being somewhat buried by the valiant efforts to work around the problem is it's not like Microsoft is being asked to invent anything new or to develop for a foreign technology. We had the freaking Palm conduit that worked perfectly in Office 2004! Entourage hasn't changed that much, and God knows Palm's Mac software has hardly changed in ten years, so I am at a loss to see why Microsoft can't just do any minute updates required to its *existing code* to keep the Palm conduits functional.

I know they're always trying to push Windows Mobile and squash Palm so maybe they finally decided to not help Palm sales in this arena anymore.

Microsoft - in a world of easier interconnectivity, where accessibility is a lifeblood for applications, you are going the wrong direction. This is yet another reason why you are increasingly appearing so out of touch. Get it together!

[Unknown]

I am at a loss to see why Microsoft can't just do any minute updates required
to its *existing code* to keep the Palm conduits functional.

I support this one fully!

The 190 euro's I spent on 2008 are a gift compared to the hours I wasted trying to sync my palm using iSync. Useless and irritating slow unreliable sync results.

I'm also back to 2004 and that is a pity. i did like the look and feel in entourage 2008 and My Day is fantastic in concept (it worked very slow on my MacPro 10.4.11).

All I can do now is hoping for an entourage version for an iPhone and trustable sync with 2008.

[jdk...@officeformac.com]

Well, it has been a couple of months since anyone has posted anything regarding the synching of a Palm Treo and Entourage 2008. So I thought I would post and ask if anyone has heard anything more. I bought Office 2008 a couple of months back and have yet to be able to make time to even open the thing! I fear that I am out $150 since it looks like I cannot synchronize. Any ideas? I do have Mark/Space but it sounds like it will all be a pain. Please let me know!

[luck...@officeformac.com]

I haven't heard anything so far - not a good sign. I can sync my Treo with calendar and contacts since these things sync with Exchange server and my Treo can sync via ActiveSync to that server over the 3G wireless network, but tasks and notes are not coming over.

[glva...@officeformac.com]

Same here. I've just put Office 2008 back on the shelf and am continuing to use Office 2004, which syncs just fine using Missing Sync and conduits. I'd love to hear that there is some progress on this issue. Very frustrating.

[Per Rønne]

<glva...@officeformac.com> wrote:

I've just dropped Entourage altogether. It doesn't support CalDAV which
means it doesn't work the way iCal and Mail works.

You cannot subscribe to published calenders from iCal or iCal Server [in
Leopard Server]. In fact, you cannot even use iCal Server as this is a
CalDAV server.

<http://groups.google.com/group/microsoft.public.mac.office.entourage/br
owse_thread/thread/bfd65802479c798c>

Furthermore, Entourage stores everything in one file which is very bad
when talking about backup. Mail stores every mail in one file, at it
seems as if Address Book works in the same way.
--
Per Erik Rønne
http://www.RQNNE.dk