[ARCH] [VOTE] Definition of "MP Compatibility"

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Ken Finnigan

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Apr 2, 2020, 2:18:11 PM4/2/20
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MicroProfile compatibility is defined as a runtime passing all MicroProfile specification TCKs in the platform release.

Rules:

Rudy De Busscher

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Apr 3, 2020, 1:35:05 AM4/3/20
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Rudy De Busscher. Against

Martin Stefanko

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Apr 3, 2020, 2:42:04 AM4/3/20
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Martin Stefanko. For

Phillip Kruger

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Apr 3, 2020, 2:47:03 AM4/3/20
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Phillip Kruger. For

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Steve Millidge

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Apr 3, 2020, 3:36:09 AM4/3/20
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Steve Millidge: Against

Mark Little

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Apr 3, 2020, 3:57:27 AM4/3/20
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Mark Little. For.

Roberto Cortez

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Apr 3, 2020, 4:55:00 AM4/3/20
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Roberto Cortez. For

On 2 Apr 2020, at 19:17, Ken Finnigan <k...@kenfinnigan.me> wrote:

Jan Martiska

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Apr 3, 2020, 5:47:07 AM4/3/20
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Jan Martiska. For


On Thursday, April 2, 2020 at 8:18:11 PM UTC+2, Ken Finnigan wrote:

Sergey Beryozkin

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Apr 3, 2020, 8:58:25 AM4/3/20
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Sergey Beryozkin. For

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David Lloyd

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Apr 3, 2020, 12:28:36 PM4/3/20
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David Lloyd. For
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Amelia Eiras

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Apr 3, 2020, 2:34:52 PM4/3/20
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Amelia Eiras- For. 

Ondro Mihályi

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Apr 3, 2020, 6:19:19 PM4/3/20
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Against

Ondro

Emily Jiang

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Apr 5, 2020, 6:39:24 PM4/5/20
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Emily Jiang. Against.

Eric Wittmann

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Apr 6, 2020, 8:35:57 AM4/6/20
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Eric Wittmann.  For

Stephane Epardaud

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Apr 6, 2020, 9:11:16 AM4/6/20
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Stephane Epardaud. For.

On Mon, 6 Apr 2020 at 14:36, Eric Wittmann <ewit...@redhat.com> wrote:
Eric Wittmann.  For

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Ryan St. James

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Apr 6, 2020, 9:23:11 AM4/6/20
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Ryan St. James : FOR

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Mike Croft

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Apr 6, 2020, 9:25:54 AM4/6/20
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Mike Croft; Abstain

Jean-Frederic Mesnil

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Apr 6, 2020, 9:40:32 AM4/6/20
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Jeff Mesnil. For.
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Scott Stark

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Apr 6, 2020, 10:17:36 AM4/6/20
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For

Michal Karm Babacek

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Apr 6, 2020, 10:22:49 AM4/6/20
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Michal Karm Babacek. For


On Thursday, 2 April 2020 20:18:11 UTC+2, Ken Finnigan wrote:

Alasdair Nottingham

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Apr 6, 2020, 10:24:26 AM4/6/20
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Alasdair Nottingham. Against
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John Clingan

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Apr 6, 2020, 11:44:44 AM4/6/20
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John Clingan. For.


On Thursday, April 2, 2020 at 11:18:11 AM UTC-7, Ken Finnigan wrote:

Kevin Sutter

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Apr 6, 2020, 11:49:25 AM4/6/20
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Against (out of principle)

Cesar Saavedra

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Apr 6, 2020, 11:54:30 AM4/6/20
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Cesar Saavedra. For

Nathan Rauh

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Apr 6, 2020, 2:53:32 PM4/6/20
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Against.  TCK compliance must be one condition of compatibility, but not the only condition, which would enable implementations to disregard other spec requirements so long as the TCK is passed.


On Thursday, April 2, 2020 at 1:18:11 PM UTC-5, Ken Finnigan wrote:

Gordon Hutchison

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Apr 7, 2020, 10:34:06 AM4/7/20
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For. Gordon Hutchison.

(Mostly as I believe that this was the original understanding. The original base non-MP TCKs were, at that time, not all free-as-in-beer and
it was intentional not to require new-entrants to MP to pay for base TCK licenses. Changing it now, in the light of Jakarta TCKs, after people have invested
time and effort on innovative implementations is not fair on those implementors IMHO even if it is a better result from some perspectives.
PS, I work mostly on OpenLiberty which does pass the base
TCKs.
PPS I think the term provide an API would be written and read as implying the provision of compatible implementation and that would typically be verified with TCK compliance,

Andy McCright

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Apr 8, 2020, 2:20:47 PM4/8/20
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Andy McCright. Abstain.

David Blevins

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Apr 10, 2020, 12:56:26 AM4/10/20
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Abstain.  David Blevins

I'm not a fan of this style of voting and it's clear from the discussion thread we were maybe a bit quick to call a vote.  I don't fully understand all the objections, but they seem manageable so far.

On Apr 2, 2020, at 11:17 AM, Ken Finnigan <k...@kenfinnigan.me> wrote:

MicroProfile compatibility is defined as a runtime passing all MicroProfile specification TCKs in the platform release.

Rules:


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Ken Finnigan

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Apr 13, 2020, 9:45:33 AM4/13/20
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Apologies I forgot to close the vote on Thursday before the long weekend.

The result of the vote is that it did not pass. MP will continue without a definition of compatibility for now.

Ken

David Blevins

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Apr 14, 2020, 3:42:58 PM4/14/20
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FYI it was raised today that maybe we're not giving enough time to business-as-usual topic on our MP calls, particularly architecture as that timeslot has been completely overtaken by Working Group discussions.  Specifically, that it has to be very frustrating for people who are trying to get something to move forward amidst a distracted community.

We then agreed that the half-hour we dedicate on the regular MP community calls should be dedicated to any business-as-usual topic, including architecture.

Should we add this to the agenda for next call and see if we can get something to go forward?
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Ken Finnigan

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Apr 14, 2020, 4:40:02 PM4/14/20
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We explicitly disbanded the Architecture calls, irrespective of the WG discussions, to do things asynchronously.

I am against us re-introducing Architecture discussion into the Bi-weekly hangouts as it takes away from doing the work asynchronously.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/microprofile/E42E9301-D15E-44E2-B230-61DAE75C5E07%40tomitribe.com.

Amelia Eiras

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Apr 14, 2020, 5:27:19 PM4/14/20
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Ken, 

Adding the git issue where your preference was stated nicely yet it has not been talked about during the Community calls. Major step missed due to current focus: MP 4.0 and MPWG. 

 FYI that less than 40 MicroProfilers watch that REPO, so adding the ticket below for reference to Ken's follow up. 

https://github.com/eclipse/microprofile-marketing/issues/228



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Ken Finnigan

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Apr 15, 2020, 8:46:18 AM4/15/20
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Everything doesn't need to be discussed in Community calls, as long as there is a discussion on this list. Or is there a rule I'm not aware of?

Moving the Architecture discussions to async was discussed here: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/microprofile/hOBvkODOIGE

I'd forgotten that there was a ticket about marketing the calls, it can now be closed.

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Emily Jiang

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Apr 15, 2020, 11:32:56 AM4/15/20
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+1 Ken for the async Architecture communication!

p.s. I suggest we complete this thread as we should not hijack this thread for other conversations :o. Voting thread should not have discussions.

Emily
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