G10 Alternative Question

[Misha]

Hi guys,

I am not horribly familiar with composite materials, would this one work as well as the G10? It is twice the size for almost the same price as G10 on Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013HO3PM/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

Misha

[Misha]

As far as I can tell the difference is that G10 is a cotton laminate and this is paper with the same binder.  They have an identical Rockwell hardness and the only difference I can see is this one has a tensile strength of 16k PSI vs 33K for G10, but I don't think I have to worry about that too much.

[particleman]

I thought G10 was a glass-epoxy composite, while phenolic board was a paper-phenolic composite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FR-4

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phenolic_paper

No?

To the OP, G10 is significantly more rigid, but you may not need all of the rigidity of G10.

Only one way to be sure :)

[Misha]

Ah, you're right.  Problem is I need a 13 inch long piece of G10, but amazon only comes in 12 or 24.

[Ezra Zygmuntowicz]

Misha-

My source for G10 is a place called http://americanepoxy.com/ . You cannot order via the web you have to call them but they will cut to size for you.

Give them a call or email, ask to speak with Sam and tell him Ezra from TrinityLabs referred you to get a beer deal.

I think G10 is the best material to use for this use case. I tested a lot of different materials and for the price/thickness/rigidity ratio G10/FR4 is the way to go I am certainly convinced. But that is my own opinion.

Also know that were trying to ship you the 320mm x 320mm glass but ran into a snag with USPS not having xbox size that fits it with ought going way oversized and getting charged an arm and a leg for volumetric based shipping. Were looking today for a different box solution that will fit within normal rate size boxes.

Cheers-

-Ezra

[Ezra Zygmuntowicz]

That would be a "better" deal not a beer deal. Man I need a beer I guess(I don't drink though... hrrrmmm).

-Ezra

[Misha]

Thanks Ezra,

 

I already emailed american epoxy based on an earlier recommendation from you.  Sorry for all the hassle with the glass, I'd be happy to pay for shipping, let me know.

 

How hard is G10 to cut? It is cheaper on Amazon, especially since I can get free shipping but it only comes in 12x12" squares.

[Misha]

Ah, and it was the 320x250 glass.

 

How thick is the G10 you are using? 1/8"?

On Wednesday, October 31, 2012 3:39:14 PM UTC-5, Ezra Zygmuntowicz wrote:

[Ezra Zygmuntowicz]

G10 I use is 32.mm thick or 1/8th inch yes. G10 is not hard to cut but has *very* nasty particles that come off it when you cut or machine it. You can cut it with a hacksw or dremmel easily enough especially if its just a straight line you need to cut but do it outside or in a ventilated area and wear a dust mask or tshirt wrapped around your face as the carbon dust is hardcore bad for your lungs.

-Ezra

P.S.  320 x 250 i the glass size yes sorry.

[Alex]

Piece of cake!  I used my Palm Dewalt router with a down spiral cutter.

I did it out side with my 3M respirator on just in case. It is pretty heavy particles so I didn't even notice much flying around it just settled in my cutting area.

[Markus Lehto]

Carbon fiber plates cut quite easily with any kind of hand saw. Hack saw with a blade made for cutting metal works fine. I usually cut 2,1mm CF plates with ordinary wood type hand saw because it's faster than a finer toothed blade. You have to keep the saw tilted almost to vertical to make the cut clean but otherwise shouldn't be a problem. GF plates should be even easier to cut.

Do it outside, having CF or GF dust and fibers floating around is not nice. They tickle.

[Misha]

Ended up ordering a 12x12" sheet from McMaster as their price was the same as Amazon and I needed to restock some fasteners as well.

[Duncan Frazier]

Just to throw this out there, I'm lucky enough to have a laser cutter and since I want to design a lighter weight three point mounting system I'm looking for a G10 alternative I can laser. 

Settled on Delrin/acetal sheet which amazon prime sells pretty cheap. Might be a bit overkill but we'll see. This way I should be able to cut it to my exact design and put voids in it to save weight. 

If anyone knows why this is a bad idea let me know. Otherwise I'll report back when I finally get around to it. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 1, 2012, at 8:29 AM, Misha <mbt...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ended up ordering a 12x12" sheet from McMaster as their price was the same as Amazon and I needed to restock some fasteners as well.

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[Ross Shannon]

I've used Delrin and in my opinion its not stable in sheet form.
It's Great for bushings and other parts.

I guess if its supported properly it would work though.

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[Duncan Frazier]

That was my main worry, I know its great for gears, etc, but wasnt sure how strong a sheet would be.  I can cut up to about 1/4" I believe so I may order a sheet and see if that is rigid enough.  If it is and I can cut out enough internal material to keep it light then it may be an option.  Alternatively, I may just use laser cut plywood or mdf to get the design worked out and then take it to a machine shop to have a plate made.

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[Ross Shannon]

Another thing to consider about the delrin is how its made - the material I used was rolled to thickness and once I made a cut on it with an end mill the stress from rolling caused the piece to warp

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[Larry Knopp]

Also a great option is DiBond....
HDPE clad with thin aluminum.  Very stiff, very light-weight.  I use a 1/8" lower on my newly reassembled Y and and am very happy with it.  (I dumped literally over 1000grams from my original table with all the mods I made... the swap from 1/8 aluminum plate to 1/8 DiBond was only a minor part of the total, but was definitely significant...)

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[Ross Shannon]

I should have weighed my assembly before putting it back togeather - no G10 just two pieces of aluminium, a PCB heat bed, and Boro with binder clips and it prints great

On Nov 1, 2012 7:54 PM, "Larry Knopp" <lwk...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Mike Payson]

Hi Larry, 

DiBond looks interesting. You don't have any heat issues with the PE core? 

Mike

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[Larry Knopp]

Not as of yet...
And I'm running a 5w/sq.in. kapton w/o any insulation.
It gets mighty warm under there, but by no means "too hot".  One note...  the dibond I got happens to be painted white...  *may* be beneficial in deflecting some of the heat.

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