FW: launch of an interactive castles of Ireland map

[Leonard J. McCown]

This sure does look interesting. Thought others might also find it so. Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

From: Tyrone Bowes Ph.D. [mailto:tyron...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2012 5:39 PM
To: undisclosed-recipients:
Subject: launch of an interactive castles of Ireland map

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

An interactive Castles of Ireland map has been launched on the Irish Origenes website: http://www.irishorigenes.com/irish-castle-locations 

It features 1,375 castles associated with over 400 Clans and Families.

The Irish Origenes website is completely open access and contains all the resources that one will require to pinpoint ones Irish Genetic Homeland using the results of a Y-DNA 37 marker test.

 

Regards

 

Tyrone

 

--

Dr Tyrone Bowes

mobile: 00 353 872561120

www.irishorigenes.com 

www.scottishorigenes.com

www.englishorigenes.com

http://www.facebook.com/IrishOrigenes

Tweet: @BowesDr

 

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Okay that looks exciting!  So can someone who knows that DNA stuff line up Alexander and Frances descendants so we know where we fall and which castle is ours!

Thank you, Leonard!

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ANN MCELHANEY

annm...@aol.com

[Chris McCown]

We need a known descendant of Alexander to test first.

Based on Y-DNA, my current hypothesis has Francis McCown's male line in the Galloway region of Scotland sometime within the past 1000 years.

[ANN MCELHANEY]

So wouldn't that be you, Bill in Katy????

[Chris McCown]

Speaking of which, there is a new DNA test that has an AMAZING price.  It's tests all three aspects of your DNA( Y, mtDNA, autosominal ).  It costs $199.  I've probably paid at least 10 times that for less information over the years.

After you test it, transfer the results to FTDNA and join the McCown DNA Project.  

The DNA testing is actually done by FTDNA's lab, but it's for Nat Geo.

http://dna-explained.com/2012/07/25/national-geographic-geno-2-0-announcement-the-human-story/

You can order it here.

https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/

Chris

[McCown, Bill]

Yes there are several of us.

[Chris McCown]

Make that 5 times the price.  It's only 10 times if you count my Mother's testing as well.

[Chris McCown]

FYI,

I don't mean to discriminate against women when I say this but it's much better if you test a male.  

The reason for this is because men carry the Y and the X chromosome and women carry two Xs.  The Y chromosome is what we use to determine the origin of the direct male line and the McCown surname.  You can also learn the direct maternal line from a male's X.

So if you're female, try to find a a Brother or Father to test in your place because you can learn about the direct paternal and maternal lines from a male.  If a female tests you can only learn about your direct maternal line. 

Autosominal( the 21 chromosomes in the middle ), can be tested for both.

Chris

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Well for sure we know that.   That is why it is called YDNA, right.  So, Chris, do we know these results transfer????  And in the transferring what is scored differently.  I mean what markers have to be altered mathematically.  And how many markers does it show?  I am in the process of purchasing for my Morris line a 67 YDNA and like  you, Chris, I've sent a couple of thousand getting others tested so saving some would be nice.

ann

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Bill, are you serious!  Have you never had your DNA done?  Geeze, I've done my grandsons just as a means of making sure they don't ever get framed for something.  If I had Y chromo I would be delighted to get this done.

Please, cuz!

[Chris McCown]

Ann,

The Nat Geo, Geno 2.0 test is done by FTDNA's lab and rumor is that they will allow transfer.  There may be a marginal fee to do so.  However, Geno 2.0 is so new, you can only pre-order it.    The kits don't even ship until 10/30/2012.   Nobody has seen what the results look like, but according the description they will have what FTDNA has plus more... so the transfer should be straight forward.... I hope.  

If not, just share your results with me and I can determine which McCown group you belong to.

Chris

PS, the McCown DNA Project does not share any information without getting your permission to first.  If you have any privacy concerns, feel free to email me and I'll work with you to protect your privacy.

[lannie]

Hi Chis,
George and I have not received our 111 results back yet. I received
a notice that there was going to be a delay
and that they might have to send me a new swab kit (at no charge).
Hoping to hear something soon.
I downloaded Robert D Walker's Gedcom file and started looking at his
ancestry. First, We know exacly how
Fedorge and Robert are related and they both descend from Patrick
Walker (b 1648 Aberdeen,Scotlan) through
his son Alexander (b 16 Feb 1675) to Alexander's son John (b 15 July
1706 in Petrcutter Aberdeen) then to his son
James (b Aug 1744) .

This is where Robert and George's lineage splits. For Robert,
James(1744) son Matthew (b 1764 in N.C. USA)
then on down to Robert.

For George, from James (b Aug 1744) to his son Moses (b 1765 N.C.) then
on down to George.

From all of this I have determined, using birthdates for my Samuel and
the sons of James (1744) that I do not descend from
Matthew(1764) or Moses (1765) or Robert (1766).

Now, nothing is known about Robert(1766) but from his birthdate, my
Samuel(b 1770-1780) it is most unlikely that he
could be my Samuel's father, even with my Samuel being born in 1780,
Robert would be only 14 year of age.

Now John (1706) had two other sons besides James(1744), John (Nov
1736), and Alexander (Oct 1739).

I am discounting them because of the closeness of my DNA match with
George and Robert . I just cannot
visualize a mutation schedule that would allow that, but nothing is
known of John(1736) and Alexander(1739).

I don't know what the nominal mutation rate is but trying to divine just
where the mutation occurred that
caused George's and my DNA values to be one off in 67 from Robert's, to
me asks the question; can we know if
that mutation occurred between James(1744) and Matthew(1764) or
somewhere between Matthew(1764) and
Robert D Walker also knowing that my ancestor could not have been
Matthew (1764) or Moses(1765) .
We can know that either is possible without disturbing the matc between
George and myself.
My brain is numb I quit!
Lannie

Chris McCown wrote:
> We need a known descendant of Alexander to test first.
>
> Based on Y-DNA, my current hypothesis has Francis McCown's male line
> in the Galloway region of Scotland sometime within the past 1000 years.
>
> On Aug 9, 2012, at 10:56 PM, ANN MCELHANEY wrote:
>
>> Okay that looks exciting! So can someone who knows that DNA stuff
>> line up Alexander and Frances descendants so we know where we fall
>> and which castle is ours!
>>
>> Thank you, Leonard!
>>
>> On Aug 9, 2012, at 5:54 PM, Leonard J. McCown wrote:
>>

>>> *This sure does look interesting. Thought others might also find it
>>> so. Leonard*
>>> **
>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> **
>>> *Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History*
>>> *leo...@mccown.org
>>> <mailto:leo...@mccown.org>--http://www.mccown.org
>>> <http://www.mccown.org/>*
>>> *People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to*
>>> *their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790*
>>> **
>>> *From:*Tyrone Bowes Ph.D. [mailto:tyron...@gmail.com]
>>> *Sent:*Thursday, August 09, 2012 5:39 PM
>>> *To:*undisclosed-recipients:
>>> *Subject:*launch of an interactive castles of Ireland map

>>> Dear Sir/Madam,
>>> An interactive Castles of Ireland map has been launched on the Irish
>>> Origenes website: http://www.irishorigenes.com/irish-castle-locations
>>> It features 1,375 castles associated with over 400 Clans and Families.
>>> The Irish Origenes website is completely open access and contains
>>> all the resources that one will require to pinpoint ones Irish
>>> Genetic Homeland using the results of a Y-DNA 37 marker test.
>>> Regards
>>> Tyrone
>>> --
>>> Dr Tyrone Bowes
>>> mobile: 00 353 872561120

>>> www.irishorigenes.com <http://www.irishorigenes.com/>
>>> www.scottishorigenes.com <http://www.scottishorigenes.com/>
>>> www.englishorigenes.com <http://www.englishorigenes.com/>

>>> http://www.facebook.com/IrishOrigenes
>>> Tweet: @BowesDr
>>>
>>> --
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>>> Groups "McCown Family History" group.

>>> To post to this group, send email tomc...@googlegroups.com
>>> <mailto:mcc...@googlegroups.com>.

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>>> tomccown+u...@googlegroups.com
>>> <mailto:mccown+un...@googlegroups.com>.

>>> For more options, visit this group
>>> athttp://groups.google.com/group/mccown?hl=en.
>>
>> ANN MCELHANEY

>> annm...@aol.com <mailto:annm...@aol.com>

>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> mccown+un...@googlegroups.com

>> <mailto:mccown+un...@googlegroups.com>.

[ANN MCELHANEY]

What are 111 results?

ANN MCELHANEY

annm...@aol.com

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Thank you, Chris.  This is exciting.  Well I won't have any YDNA but I am hoping someone in the Col James line who bears the last name will do so!

[McCown, Bill]

Ann, I thought that Mic Barnette had done the DNA profile?  If none of the other Col James or Sampson descendants have, then I could be a candidate.

[msimp...@aol.com]

Yes,Yes...I agree Ann!

Lisa Simpson Luke -- Sent from my HP TouchPad

---

[Chris McCown]

Does Col James descend from Alexander?

The current McCown DNA results don't have anyone claiming Alexander as their deepest known ancestor.  I sure would be cool to find out if Francis and Alexander were related.

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/mccown/default.aspx?section=ycolorized

Chris

[McCown, Bill]

From viewing the dna results in the table, it doesn’t appear that anyone from Alexander has done a DNA profile. 

 

Mic, I think you and I ought to do a profile to see the alignment.

[Chris McCown]

Here is my hypothesis on Francis ancient line which was the first to test positive(publicly) for newly discovered DF41 SNP.

DF41 appears to be about 2000 years old( at the moment ).  It currently contains 3 distinct haplotypes so far.  1) Francis' haplotype( 1426 ) - which has a whole slew of Scotch-Irish Americans surnames 2) Royal Stewards who are believed to be descendants of the former Kings of Scotland and UK.  3) Two Irish lads.

I hypothesize that Francis's type( 1426 ) is from the Galloway and/or Strathclyde/Cumbria region.  I believe this for two reasons.  1) We match a slew of McClellans whose clan is from Kirkcudbright/Balmaclellan.  2) Most surnames in Francis's Y-DNA matches is from this bellow list.

http://boards.ancestry.com/thread.aspx?mv=flat&m=98&p=localities.britisles.scotland.kkd.general

Barton, Bratton, Burney(McBurnie), Cannon, Cowan(McCown), Chambers(Chamberlain), Gordon, McClellan, McCune, Miller, Morrison, Nichols(Nicholson) Ramsey, Robinson, Smith, Tait, Turner, Wilson, Wright.

The second haplotype, The Royal Stewarts trace their line back to Brittany, but believe they were pushed back into Brittany from SW Britain by the Saxons.

The third haplotype, the Irish lads, appear to have ties to Mayo/Connacht.

The one tribe that fits all three of these locations knowns as the ( Dumnonii, Damnonii, Domnann ).   The Irish version of the Tribe would be the Fir Domnann that lived in Connacht.  The Stewarts would have been the Dumnonii variety in Cornwall that migrated to Brittany with Conan Meridoc.  1426(Francis) would have been the Damnonii variety that lived in Strathclyde.

Keep in mind this is just my current hypothesis.   As more and more data become available, it is subject to change.

If you want to see an drawing of a genetic tree with McCowns in it, you can do a control-F and search for DF41... or P66( for the Maguire line ) at the bellow links by Alexander Williamson.  You can also just search for McCown.  The kits in green are verified for DF41.  The other kits are currently speculative.

67 markers:

http://www.littlescottishcluster.com/RL21/Files/R-L21%20Tree%2020120727.pdf

111 markers:

http://www.littlescottishcluster.com/RL21/Files/R-L21%20Tree%2020120803.pdf

Enjoy,

Chris

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/mccown/default.aspx?section=ycolorized

[James McCown]

I have taken the 12 marker y-DNA test and it showed an exact match with known descendants of francis McCown and also a descendant of the six brothers. I need to get it upgraded to the 111 marker test.

I am the gg -grandson of col James McCown.

[James McCown]

There are many who say Col James is the grandson of an Alexander McCown and I respect their opinions. I have yet to see any solid evidence of who the father of Sampson McCown b south Carolina in 1775 was.

It may be his fathers name was alexander,  but I think there were at least 3 different mccowns by that name at that time in s Carolina.

[Chris McCown]

James, for the price of the 111 marker upgrade, you should consider ordering the Geno 2.0 instead.  

[Chris McCown]

Actually, James, maybe I'm wrong about that. Maybe 111 would be useful.

There is a lot of confusing and conflicting information going on with Geno 2.0.

http://genealem-geneticgenealogy.blogspot.com/2012/07/geno-20-q-with-bennett-greenspan.html

"STR results will not be supplied by Geno 2.0 and all regular genealogical marker tests should be ordered through Family Tree DNA.  These two tests go hand in hand."

But from this link... it says.

http://dna-explained.com/2012/07/25/national-geographic-geno-2-0-announcement-the-human-story/

"The days of sequencing 12 markers in the lab are gone forever, replaced by high-speed sequencing that looks at half a million markers, or more, at a time, and for the same price as a 12 marker test and the mitochondrial DNA test, together, would have cost in Nat Geo 1.0."

"The standard STR (Short Tandem Repeat) markers we know and love will become the leaves on the branches of the tree and these will likely be used when there are no more SNPs to determine family groupings and line marker mutations within families. "

Chris

[James McCown]

Chris, isn't Todd McCune a descendant of that Alexander? His dna is an exact match with the descendants of francis

On Aug 10, 2012 10:14 AM, "Chris McCown" <chris...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Chris McCown]

I don't want to give away which kit is Todd's without his permission.  All I can say is that no McCown DNA Project member has claimed Alexander as their deepest known McCown ancestor.

Chris

[James McCown]

Chris, perhaps you and i are thinking of two different Alexanders? When/ where was the man you refer to born?

[Chris McCown]

I'm referring to the one that was a Presbyterian minister that had the 6 sons... that I've so often heard about on the boards( the Reds and the Blacks ).  Everyone has always suspected that Francis and Alexander were related, but I don't think anyone has ever proved it.

[Annmclpc]

As I understand the story, Col James is supposedly the descendant of  the Alexander of the 6 brothers.  Tell me if that i not correct.  I realize we do not have the 'proof' but decades before me someone decided this.

Ann W McElhaney

[Annmclpc]

Thanks for that McCown DNA page. . some one has James McCown kit #N42581. . .any idea who that might be?  Is there anyone on that page who claims Sampson or Col James ?

Ann W McElhaney

-----Original Message-----
From: James McCown <jjjun...@gmail.com>
To: mccown <mcc...@googlegroups.com>

[Chris McCown]

This Alexander....

http://books.google.com/books?id=Op3cC6_UNnQC&pg=PA76&lpg=PA76&dq=alexander+mccown+6+sons+reds+and+blacks&source=bl&ots=U0lEUNXaoy&sig=yF1f_QC7UawmDs_aXLASExl_SsY&hl=en&sa=X&ei=x0slUOTmC4H48wSwpYGoBw&ved=0CEIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=alexander%20mccown%206%20sons%20reds%20and%20blacks&f=false

What an interesting book title that is...

[Annmclpc]

Isthis James in Oklahoma?  You have a match with the first 12 markers and that tells us something but I am not sure how far back.  I am sure you told us your kit number at one time.  Would you share that again please?

Ann W McElhaney

-----Original Message-----
From: James McCown <jjjun...@gmail.com>
To: mccown <mcc...@googlegroups.com>

[Leonard J. McCown]

Sadly, Mic can only test for the Barnette Y-DNA study. He has researched the McCowns for years, but still does not have the surname. SO, Bill, we need you, and would be nice really to have two test from that line, maybe off different brothers. Just my 2 cents worth. Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[Leonard J. McCown]

Thanks so much Chris!

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

From: mcc...@googlegroups.com [mailto:mcc...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris McCown

Sent: Friday, August 10, 2012 11:00 AM
To: mcc...@googlegroups.com

--

[Leonard J. McCown]

Do we know how many markers the Geno 2.0 will have?

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

From: mcc...@googlegroups.com [mailto:mcc...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Chris McCown

Sent: Friday, August 10, 2012 11:42 AM
To: mcc...@googlegroups.com

[Leonard J. McCown]

Todd McCune is a descendant of Rev. Alexander McCown, b. abt 1680/90, Ballymoney Co., Antrim, Ireland. There are many many Alexanders. I don’t think this is the same one. Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[Annmclpc]

This SNP thing:  does it show up in the marker tests or is it inferred in them or is it totally separate.  That is interesting about the names as I also have a Gordon line! 

 

Can I forward this email to my Gordon group, Chris?

Ann W McElhaney

-----Original Message-----
From: Leonard J. McCown <leo...@mccown.org>
To: mccown <mcc...@googlegroups.com>

[Chris McCown]

I thought it was going to have half a million but then I read elsewhere that it would not have any.

It basically sounds like Geno 2.0 replaces the Deep Clade, mtDNA and aspects of the Family Finder.

It sounds like STR markers( 37,67,111) are still only done by FTDNA.

Not that any of it is all that clear at the moment.

[Leonard J. McCown]

That kit is Ashby’s, so probably a different James. I show James Ross McCown as the only one from Alexander. HOWEVER, some members of the group have never posted a family tree chart, so difficult to know how they might fit into the mix. That is an important step too. Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[Leonard J. McCown]

According to what I have, and not sure if Mic shared this with me, or perhaps his Mom did. Col. James McCown is from the same Rev. Alexander McCown, b. ca. 1680/90, Ireland, though his son Alexander, then, Major John McCown, then Sampson, then Col. James. How sure how firm the paper trail and documentation is on this. That is a Mic question . . . Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[Chris McCown]

Sure, However, there are many Gordon lines.  

http://www.familytreedna.com/public/gordondna/default.aspx?section=ycolorized

[Chris McCown]

If Todd descends from Alexander, then Alexander and Francis are related.

[James McCown]

That's the alexander I was thinking of. Many have said Sampson McCown,  who was born in south caroline in 1775 is his grandson by alexander of the six brothers.

[Kathy L Tennimon]

McClune 45814 and mine is 21624.   We both matched but mine goes back to Francis. 

Kathy Tennimon

Sent from my iPad

[James McCown]

Yes this is james Ross McCown in Oklahoma. My kit number is 20664.

[Leonard J. McCown]

Todd matches the descendants of Francis very well. He was the test that told me that the Pennsylvania and Virginia (Francis) were kin.

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[McCown, Bill]

Leonard, I never felt so needed. Which test should I do?

[Leonard J. McCown]

SORRY, I didn’t intend to reveal Ashby’s kit number. Was not thinking . . . what else is new. Sorry Ashby. Hope you don’t mind. Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[Thomas Ashby McCown]

Leonard,

 

A fair number of kit numbers are coming out in this discussion.   I hope we are all bound by the deepest oaths of confidentiality.   May Saint Comgan strike us all mute (and banned from the internet) if we ever disclose  a digit.

 

[Seriously, we all need to be concerned about identity theft.]

 

The conversation, however, is getting very interesting.

 

Ashby

[McCown, Bill]

This does not line up with the info I have gathered on the line from Alexander to Sampson? Where did Major John come from?
 

From: Leonard J. McCown [mailto:leo...@mccown.org]
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2012 01:32 PM
To: mcc...@googlegroups.com <mcc...@googlegroups.com>

[Leonard J. McCown]

Bill, I think Chris would agree with me that do the test to take your markers on up to 111 or at least part of the way. You might want to wait until they have a sale though. They have done the one for this summer, but usually do one again near Christmas. Not always the best time, because of vacation and Christmas gifts, but probably no good time. I am in 7 surname studies so wait for the sale!

 

Chris, if you think different, speak up please. Leonard

[Leonard J. McCown]

Thanks Ashby. Hopefully no thieves are amongst us!!! I agree our discussion has been a good one today.

 

I expected a Gaelic curse . . . : )

 

Leonard

 

---

 

Leonard J. McCown, Irving, Texas -- McCown Family History

leo...@mccown.org -- http://www.mccown.org

People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to

their ancestors. -- Edmund Burke, 1790

 

[McCown, Bill]

Thanks Leonard. Is there a web site I can monitor or get on a list?

[Chris McCown]

Without seeing everyone's family tree's, it's hard for me to know which branches we're trying to connect.  However, I will never discourage someone from taking the 111 marker test unless you're trying to pinch pennies.  It's always nice to have more participants in the project.

My only request is, don't order a kit with less than 37 markers.  67 is the current standard and all the researchers are trying to move to 111.

Chris

[Chris McCown]

I don't think anyone can steal your identity based on these markers or kit numbers.  They only reason to not share it is if you don't want anyone to know that your related to us McCowns.... or if you're some type of criminal that's left a trail of DNA at all your crime scenes.   These markers probably wouldn't hold up in court but they might provide a clue as to the ethnicity of the perpetrator.

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Well I think we agree that they are indeed related.  How do you prove that as I thought we thought they were brothers or at least uncle and nephew.

[ANN MCELHANEY]

Thank you, James!

On Aug 10, 2012, at 1:41 PM, James McCown wrote: