embedding MathJax in sigil

[Marc Grober]

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There was some discussion in the ereader area about Sigil (which as
noted there is not really a reader.) Some posts I have seen suggest
that js could be added to an epub via sigil either by including it as
CDATA or by renaming the js file to a css file and placing in the
Sigil Styles directory (of course, the result would only be viewable
under a reader that was moving towards epub3.) If a simple usage could
be identified then folk who want to self-publish epubs with Mathjax
could manage that via Sigil. Has anyone explored this at all, or have
any suggestions?
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[Peter Krautzberger]

I think Sigil is still only an epub2 authoring tool. Javascript is forbidden in epub2, so you will never get a valid epub2 file.

That being said, iBooks (which I think is the only reader with javascript showing up in such a discussion) does not care, I think.

Peter.

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[Marc Grober]

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while Sigil is an epub2 app, that would not in and of itself keep one
from adding js for reading in an epub3 app. It would just mean that an
epub2 app will not employ the js. iBooks, on the otherhand, is WAY
too proprietary

On 2/14/13 4:20 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
> I think Sigil is still only an epub2 authoring tool. Javascript is
> forbidden in epub2, so you will never get a valid epub2 file.
>
> That being said, iBooks (which I think is the only reader with
> javascript showing up in such a discussion) does not care, I
> think.
>
> Peter.
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 10:16 AM, Marc Grober
> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> There was some discussion in the ereader area about Sigil (which
> as noted there is not really a reader.) Some posts I have seen
> suggest that js could be added to an epub via sigil either by
> including it as CDATA or by renaming the js file to a css file and
> placing in the Sigil Styles directory (of course, the result would
> only be viewable under a reader that was moving towards epub3.) If
> a simple usage could be identified then folk who want to
> self-publish epubs with Mathjax could manage that via Sigil. Has
> anyone explored this at all, or have any suggestions?
>

> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this group
> and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
> mathjax-user...@googlegroups.com

> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>. For more

> options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
>
> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this group
> and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
> mathjax-user...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit
> https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>

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[Peter Krautzberger]

I know three applications that execute javascript in epub3 files -- some versions of Readium, Helicon Gyan Reader and iBooks. The first two will provide MathML support through MathJax.

So I guess my main question is: what are you trying to achieve?

Peter.

PS: To answer your original question "Has anybody explored this?" Yes, I have :)

[Marc Grober]

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I am looking for a way to put the js in the epub using epub 2.x tools,
so for example one could create an epub that would use mathjax in
sigil, and then view it, for example, in calibre or Azardi (both of
which support mathjax.) As I mentioned, some of the discussion
around Sigil indicated that there were kludges to get the js in the
epub with Sigil, but details were scare and/or unconfirmed.

On 2/21/13 6:45 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
> I know three applications that execute javascript in epub3 files --
> some versions of Readium, Helicon Gyan Reader and iBooks. The first
> two will provide MathML support through MathJax.
>
> So I guess my main question is: what are you trying to achieve?
>
> Peter.
>
> PS: To answer your original question "Has anybody explored this?"
> Yes, I have :)
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 9:41 PM, Marc Grober
> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> while Sigil is an epub2 app, that would not in and of itself keep
> one from adding js for reading in an epub3 app. It would just mean
> that an epub2 app will not employ the js. iBooks, on the
> otherhand, is WAY too proprietary
>
> On 2/14/13 4:20 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>> I think Sigil is still only an epub2 authoring tool. Javascript
>> is forbidden in epub2, so you will never get a valid epub2 file.
>
>> That being said, iBooks (which I think is the only reader with
>> javascript showing up in such a discussion) does not care, I
>> think.
>
>> Peter.
>
>
>> On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 10:16 AM, Marc Grober
>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>

> <mailto:marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>>>

> wrote:
>
>> There was some discussion in the ereader area about Sigil (which
>> as noted there is not really a reader.) Some posts I have seen
>> suggest that js could be added to an epub via sigil either by
>> including it as CDATA or by renaming the js file to a css file
>> and placing in the Sigil Styles directory (of course, the result
>> would only be viewable under a reader that was moving towards
>> epub3.) If a simple usage could be identified then folk who want
>> to self-publish epubs with Mathjax could manage that via Sigil.
>> Has anyone explored this at all, or have any suggestions?
>
>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
>> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this
>> group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
>> mathjax-user...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>

>> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com>>. For more

>> options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
>
>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
>> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this
>> group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
>> mathjax-user...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>. For more
> options, visit
>> https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
>
> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this group
> and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
> mathjax-user...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com>. For more
> options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
>
> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the
> Google Groups "MathJax Users" group. To unsubscribe from this group
> and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to
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> https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
>
>
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[Peter Krautzberger]

I'd love to help but I have the feeling I'm not getting it. What would you use MathJax for if you succeeded to include it in your epub2 file?

Peter.

[Marc Grober]

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Hash: SHA1

displaying math when viewed in almost epub3 apps

On 2/21/13 8:13 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
> I'd love to help but I have the feeling I'm not getting it. What
> would you use MathJax for if you succeeded to include it in your
> epub2 file?
>
> Peter.
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:17 PM, Marc Grober
> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I am looking for a way to put the js in the epub using epub 2.x
> tools, so for example one could create an epub that would use
> mathjax in sigil, and then view it, for example, in calibre or
> Azardi (both of which support mathjax.) As I mentioned, some of
> the discussion around Sigil indicated that there were kludges to
> get the js in the epub with Sigil, but details were scare and/or
> unconfirmed.
>
> On 2/21/13 6:45 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>> I know three applications that execute javascript in epub3 files
>> -- some versions of Readium, Helicon Gyan Reader and iBooks. The
>> first two will provide MathML support through MathJax.
>
>> So I guess my main question is: what are you trying to achieve?
>
>> Peter.
>
>> PS: To answer your original question "Has anybody explored
>> this?" Yes, I have :)
>
>
>
>> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 9:41 PM, Marc Grober
>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>

>>> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com>
>> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%25252Bun...@googlegroups.com>>>. For

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[Marc Grober]

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or I should say I want to look at doing what calibre and azardi do
without having mathjax in the reader.

On 2/21/13 8:13 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
> I'd love to help but I have the feeling I'm not getting it. What
> would you use MathJax for if you succeeded to include it in your
> epub2 file?
>
> Peter.
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:17 PM, Marc Grober
> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I am looking for a way to put the js in the epub using epub 2.x
> tools, so for example one could create an epub that would use
> mathjax in sigil, and then view it, for example, in calibre or
> Azardi (both of which support mathjax.) As I mentioned, some of
> the discussion around Sigil indicated that there were kludges to
> get the js in the epub with Sigil, but details were scare and/or
> unconfirmed.
>
> On 2/21/13 6:45 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>> I know three applications that execute javascript in epub3 files
>> -- some versions of Readium, Helicon Gyan Reader and iBooks. The
>> first two will provide MathML support through MathJax.
>
>> So I guess my main question is: what are you trying to achieve?
>
>> Peter.
>
>> PS: To answer your original question "Has anybody explored
>> this?" Yes, I have :)
>
>
>
>> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 9:41 PM, Marc Grober
>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>

>>> <mailto:mathjax-users%2Bunsu...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com>
>> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com

> <mailto:mathjax-users%25252Bun...@googlegroups.com>>>. For

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[Peter Krautzberger]

Ok. Have you seen this?

[Marc Grober]

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Had not, thank you. This is great.

Quickly opened in Sigil and saved. So, what I think you were
suggesting is that Sigil forces the creation of valid epub2, creating
a toc.ncx and otherwise shuffling directories and files resulting in
major changes in zip structure which results in no display of the
MathML (which will otherwise work in iBooks.)

Based on what I had read I had been hoping that Sigil would simply zip
what you fed it :-( as if it could do that then it could be used as a
quickly GUI to edit text and assemble. It is never easy , lol....

Did notice, btw, that your solution is not visible when you reverse
the background (night mode?) - that is to not to say the math is not
displayed properly - the math does not display at all. I am assuming
that MathJax does is displaying the math black on white so it is
there, but just not visible.



On 2/22/13 7:19 AM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
> Ok. Have you seen this
> <http://boolesrings.org/krautzberger/2013/01/13/how-to-include-mathjax-in-an-epub3-file-to-work-with-ibooks-and-possibly-others/>?

>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 10:41 PM, Marc Grober
> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> or I should say I want to look at doing what calibre and azardi do
> without having mathjax in the reader.
>
> On 2/21/13 8:13 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>> I'd love to help but I have the feeling I'm not getting it. What
>> would you use MathJax for if you succeeded to include it in your
>> epub2 file?
>
>> Peter.
>
>
>
>
>> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:17 PM, Marc Grober
>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>

> <mailto:marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>>>
> wrote:
>
>> I am looking for a way to put the js in the epub using epub 2.x
>> tools, so for example one could create an epub that would use
>> mathjax in sigil, and then view it, for example, in calibre or
>> Azardi (both of which support mathjax.) As I mentioned, some
>> of the discussion around Sigil indicated that there were kludges
>> to get the js in the epub with Sigil, but details were scare
>> and/or unconfirmed.
>
>> On 2/21/13 6:45 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>>> I know three applications that execute javascript in epub3
>>> files -- some versions of Readium, Helicon Gyan Reader and
>>> iBooks. The first two will provide MathML support through
>>> MathJax.
>
>>> So I guess my main question is: what are you trying to
>>> achieve?
>
>>> Peter.
>
>>> PS: To answer your original question "Has anybody explored
>>> this?" Yes, I have :)
>
>
>
>>> On Thu, Feb 14, 2013 at 9:41 PM, Marc Grober
>>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>
> <mailto:marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>>

>>> <mailto:mathjax-users%252Buns...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%25252Bun...@googlegroups.com>
>> <mailto:mathjax-users%25252Bun...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%2525252Bu...@googlegroups.com>>>>.

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[Peter Krautzberger]

Good point about night mode. Yes, that's probably what's happening. It's the fate of the SVG output which can't adapt to the CSS changes. The only way would be to add an interactive toggle somewhere that switches the SVG output styling -- not optimal. 

Oh well, I wanted to spend some time trying to get the HTML output to work anyway ;)

Peter.

[Marc Grober]

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Hash: SHA1

What is the hit for including more than just the svg (other than the
headaches)? To what extent might the same design be used for jsxgraph?
WHile I am older enough to remember early modems and hard drives, I
also am "young" enough to understand that file size imposes only
relative impacts, lol. One digital picture from an OLD cell phone
camera is 4 to 8 times larger than most ebooks ;-)

I did post to the Sigil forum as to whether sigil might have a dumb
switch so that it didn't force epub2

and thanks....

> <mailto:marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>>>
> wrote:
>
>> or I should say I want to look at doing what calibre and azardi
>> do without having mathjax in the reader.
>
>> On 2/21/13 8:13 PM, Peter Krautzberger wrote:
>>> I'd love to help but I have the feeling I'm not getting it.
>>> What would you use MathJax for if you succeeded to include it
>>> in your epub2 file?
>
>>> Peter.
>
>
>
>
>>> On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 8:17 PM, Marc Grober
>>> <marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>
> <mailto:marc....@gmail.com <mailto:marc....@gmail.com>>

>>> <mailto:mathjax-users%25252Bun...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%2525252Bu...@googlegroups.com>
>> <mailto:mathjax-users%2525252Bu...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:mathjax-users%252525252B...@googlegroups.com>>>>>.

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[Peter Krautzberger]

There's no reason not to include more (except the headache ;) ). Size goes up from 1.4MB to 3MB at most. The problem is that the HTML-output is broken due to some iBooks weirdness. 

The basic problem even the largest publishers face is that epub reading systems do too much weird stuff -- they're constantly in the way of well authored content because they try to fix up badly authored content.

JSXgraph works fine wherever I have tested it.

[William F Hammond]

Peter writes:

> The basic problem even the largest publishers face is that epub reading
> systems do too much weird stuff -- they're constantly in the way of well
> authored content because they try to fix up badly authored content.

I've found that properly formatted html using mathjax works well on
small screens except possibly for webfont speed issues.

-- Bill

--
William F Hammond
http://www.albany.edu/~hammond/
Email: gel...@gmail.com

[Peter Krautzberger]

Well, you're lucky, Bill ;) The #eprdctn tag on twitter reveals the every day horrors of ebook production.

An interesting read is also  http://toc.oreilly.com/2012/11/ebook-problem-areas-that-need-standardisation.html and Baldur's follow up http://www.baldurbjarnason.com/notes/standardisation

Peter.