What's the maximum layer height for the stock 0.4mm nozzle on a Replicator 2X?

[Steve Johnstone]

Hi All,

Could someone tell me what the maximum (biggest) safe layer height I could go to on the stock 0.4mm nozzle?

I have printed at 0.3mm and was just wondering how much further I could push this.

Cheers

[AGG]

The max I printed successfully are a few spacers with 0.6mm layers at half speed. The feed rate and layer thickness should be related but I didn't experiment how fast it can print reliably for each thickness.

[Gregory Sullivan]

do you want to exxtrude or just lay it down. I think .28 is the max for most slicers to cope with on a .4 nozzle for real extruding. the cake makers may know more.

[Dan Newman]

Too little data. With ABS you can go higher than, for instance, PLA owing to
die swell. Also will depend upon how strong the object needs to be. The higher
you go, the less interlayer bonding you will achieve. If the object is to just
be visually nice and not terribly strong, then you can go higher. If, however,
it's single walled object which needs to not have layers separate and you're
using PLA, then even 0.3 mm may be too tall.

At the end of the day, you need to experiment and see what works for you. For
example, at speeds over 60 mm/s, molten ABS coming out of a 0.4mm orifice swells to
a diameter around 0.55 mm. (Faster you go, more shear stress on the melt passing
through the orifice and as a result it explands more upon exiting the orifice.
The amount of swell tapers off around 0.6 mm, or so I recall. That is, there's
an upper limit to just how much it will swell.)

Dan

[Mark Durbin]

I extruded T-Glase at 0.4mm with a 0.4mm nozzle and that worked perfectly, but that's only because it was recommended, I haven't tried more than 0.35 in PLA.

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[Steve Johnstone]

Thanks all,

A bit more info -

Material, 1.75mm ABS

I'm trying to get Simplify 3D to do a dual height (I think it's called stacked) printing i.e. the shell to be say 0.1mm and the infill / supports to be 0.3mm. A a ratio of 3:1

Although I haven't tried, you are able to do this in some other slicers i.e. crudely the tool path / layer for the above would be -

1 x shell at 0.1mm

1 x shell at 0.1mm

1 x shell at 0.1mm

1 x infill at 0.3mm

I will do some tests at 0.3mm and see how I get on.

[Enginwiz]

Hello Steve,

On the user forum of Simplify3D I made a feature request for stacked infill.
Clayton suggested to set up a virtual extruder for infill with a different nozzle size
and use it for stacked infill. You will find some more information in that thread.

[Enginwiz]

Hello Steve,

Do you post as Nextgen3D on the Simplify3D forum?

I use Wingcommanders profiles in KISSlicer pro.
Stacked infill with 90 micron shells and 270 micron infill
works very well on a Rep2 printing PLA.

My calibration prints with Simplify3d went up to 0,25 mm layer height.
You can download my profiles for ABS, Nylon and PLA on Thingiverse.
The shells are already ugly in my eyes at that layer height.
Infill doesn't have to look good and layer bonding is not crucial.

With stacked infill 0,4 mm infill layer height could be worth a try.
I will set up a profile in KISSlicer with 0,2 mm shells and 0,4 mm
infill layer height and print a test part tomorrow.

[Steve Johnstone]

Hi Enginwiz

Yip that's me on the other forum. I had a go at the setup that Clayton suggested but no joy so far.

I will have another try in the morning. If I still can't get it to work I will try one of the other slicers.

I just finished my longest print to date today - 25.5 hours :). I would say that at least 65% of the print was supports and infill so any suggestions to save some time would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for letting me know about your profiles.

Steve

[Steve Johnstone]

Enginwiz,

I have just used your 0.1mm profile to print the 20mm test cube.... AWESOME!!!

Easily the best quality print I have done to date!

Thanks again for sharing these - http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:147628

[Enginwiz]

Thank you for the feedback. My calibrated profiles for some layer heights are only a workaround.
I am glad to hear that it works for you.

Wingcommander and Jetguy suggested to implement proper 5D calculation into Simplify3D.
Hopefully the next release will have this feature.

[Enginwiz]

Hello Steve,

as promised I am printing an Astrobot with 0,2 mm layer height and 0,4 mm stacked infill

sliced with KISSlicer pro. I paused the print at the lower belly and made this picture.

Infill doesn't look too bad. The layers of infill are still bonding

crosswise through the layers. This is black PLA printed at 215°C. 

So using stacked infill at 0,2 mm layer height and 0,4 mm stacked infill

is no problem on a Replicator 2. For technical parts that do not

require a surface in high resolution this is a very efficient option.

Any news on stacked infill in Simplify3D Creator?

[Wingcommander]

as promised I am printing an Astrobot with 0,2 mm layer height and 0,4 mm stacked infill

To get better infill bonding you can actually slow down the infill speed to 80mm/s and even though you are printing at a slower speed because you have a more efficient tool path, you get through the print quite quickly. This can provide better strength for parts that need it.

[Enginwiz]

Infill is not the problem at 0,4 mm layer height - its gaps in the perimeter and droping loops.

I did a calibration cube first to make sure the extrusion rate is correct. It didnt't look too bad.

Then followed an Astrobot printed with one loop, one perimeter and 25% infill.

The print order per layer was loop, perimeter and then infill.

The Astrobot has nasty overhang areas on the lower belly, at the fingers and on the helmet.

The perimeter fell over board in some of these overhang areas.

On the front of the belly and on the helmet there are big gaps in the perimeter.

The infill still holds the little guy together, but the outside is not a closed shell anymore.

At least with PLA a layer height of 0,4 mm exceeds the capability of a 0,4 mm nozzle

to produce a closed shell on my Replicator 2.

The print time at 0,4 mm layer height was 33 minutes. At 0,2 mm layer height with

0,4 mm stacked infill the print time was 37 minutes and the print quality is far better.

[Steve Johnstone]

Great work Enginwiz,

The 2 - 4 profile looks great.

I think I will need to try KISSlicer until S3D catches up.

What are the other slicers that offer stacked infill?

I like wingcommaners idea of slowing down the infill slightly to insure good fusion.

[Enginwiz]

Maybe you should still give ABS a try with 0,4 mm layer height.

ABS extrudes differently and your Replicator 2X has modified hotend compared to the Rep2.