Former 5th Gen owner, should I get a 2X?

[Doombot]

Hi everyone,

I am the ex owner of a Makerbot 5th Gen. Long story short, I originally bought the printer from a third party online marketplace and was gladly able to get a credit (gift card of equal value, which is OK in accordance with the laws of my place of residence) in exchange of the faulty printer.

Now, I have some credit to spend on the website's marketplace and they sell other models of 3D printer, such as the Replicator 2 and 2X. I already worked with a 2X as a FIRST mentor and I am satisfied right now but the troubles with the 5th gen make me reluctant to go with a Makerbot again. Sadly, the website do not sell kits or enough spare parts to build a printer from scratches, so

So, my question is: Giving that I am willing to spend some time fiddling with my 3D printer to make it work / replace some components to improve it, should I go with a 2X? I mean, I am pretty sure some people out there prefer other models and it is ok. I just want to know if people using a MB2X are still able to use it after some time. FYI, what enraged me with the 5th gen is that I was not that much able to repair it by myself; I got three "smart extruders" under warranty and was not able to solve the failures because nothing was accessible on it. If it matters, I've got a bachelor degree in electrical and electronics engineering and I am often doing electronic projects.

Of course, if anyone has a forum thread answering this, feel free to point to the resources!

EDIT: I would rather be able to print ABS. I've experienced both and like the relative flexibility over PLA. So I would tend to use a 2X vs a 2.

[Dan Newman]

Personally, I like the Rep 2: it's likely MBI's best printer (modulo the
closed source on the electronics and hardware). But if you really think
you will want dual extrusion, then the Rep 2X. [Me, I'm not big on having
two extruders.]

For a Rep 1, 2, and 2X, stiffening the ABS plastic Z stage arms helps, especially
if you either install an HBP (Bottlework's aftermarket HBP;
http://www.bctechnologicalsolutions.com/) or have an HBP (1, 2X).

Dan

P.S. I judged for a FIRST FTC event recently. Was quite rewarding.
Something I will definitely continue to do.

[Scott Booker]

I have a few R2X's in a production environment printing ABS only.

Pains me to say this, but if I had to buy another printer for my farm it would be another R2X. The clones have made some good progress in certain areas (enclosures, structure) but in my opinion have taken some steps backwards in other areas (extruders, MB configuration stability).

I'm not a fanboy and I wish this wasn't true.

[Ryan Carlyle]

I like my R2x. It does require some upgrades (particularly Z arms) to be a "good" printer, but it's solid after that.

[Jim Fouch]

+1 for R2X.

I have had mine just over a year. It printed pretty good right out of the box. I did do stiffer aluminum arms for the Z platform. I almost use ABS exclusively. I don't have a ton of hours. probably about 450 now.

Only other 3D Printer I have to compare it to is a Thing-o-Matic. I will have to say the Thing-o-Matic took a ton of tweaks to get it properly dialed in. Some of the issues were being a new user, but most were due to the poor design. The R2X was leaps and bounds better.

[Gian Pablo]

I have a Rep 1 Dual and a Rep 2X in use (also some older Makerbots).

The Rep 1 Dual required some tweaking and upgrading before being rock solid, but the 2X has been pretty solid out of the box. I haven't upgraded anything on it except X axis idler gear, and am considering the bottleworks arms + platform. However, I don't feel any urgency to do this, it's really worked pretty well so far.

I use ABS exclusively, frequently use dual extrusion and soluble support (HIPS).

I haven't seen anything that matches those specs reliably. You will certainly have a functional printer.

On Thursday, January 8, 2015 at 3:55:58 PM UTC-8, Doombot wrote:

Hi everyone,

I am the ex owner of a Makerbot 5th Gen. Long story short, I originally bought the printer from a third party online marketplace and was gladly able to get a credit (gift card of equal value, which is OK in accordance with the laws of my place of residence) in exchange of the faulty printer.

Now, I have some credit to spend on the website's marketplace and they sell other models of 3D printer, such as the Replicator 2 and 2X. I already worked with a 2X as a FIRST mentor and I am satisfied right now but the troubles with the 5th gen make me reluctant to go with a Makerbot again. Sadly, the website do not sell kits or enough spare parts to build a printer from scratches, so

So, my question is: Giving that I am willing to spend some time fiddling with my 3D printer to make it work / replace some components to improve it, should I go with a 2X? I mean, I am pretty sure some people out there prefer other models and it is ok. I just want to know if people using a MB2X are still able to use it after some time. FYI, what enraged me with the 5th gen is that I was not that much able to repair it by myself; I got three "smart extruders" under warranty and was not able to solve the failures because nothing was accessible on it. If it matters, I've got a bachelor degree in electrical and electronics engineering and I am often doing electronic projects.

Of course, if anyone has a forum thread answering this, feel free to point to the resources!

[Scott Booker]

To build on what Ryan, Jim, and Gian have said.  I'd get an R2X, put on some of the "Chinese wrap" Z arm stiffeners and then hook-up with Al to get an aluminum X idler with bearings.  Then I'd run the snot out of it until the filament drives go wonky.  Then I'd either rebuild/blueprint those, or pop for some aluminum upgrades.

Oh yeah... I'd also upgrade it to Sailfish, print off a reinforcement bridge for where the Teflon tubes enter the filament drives, fix the PID settings and make up a set of Ryan's printable limit switch reinforcements.

Sounds like a long list, but really it's not all that bad.

[Musk]

Roll your own Rep2x by using a Rep2.  Buy a used Rep2 ($1200) and install the Bottleworks heated bed ($200), bigger power supply ($85), Chinese arm stiffeners ($15), and plexi windows ($30).  This in effect turns the rep2 into a rep2x but gives you a few big advantages:

1.  Gain a wider printing area than the 2x (because of the single nozzle setup)
2.  Easier build plate system because the bottleworks glass platforms are removable for easier kapton application and part removal
3.  You won't have an unused second nozzle waiting to screw up an otherwise beautiful print.
4.  You have the ability to print PLA using the more reliable rep2 extruder.  (rep2x extruder doesn't work well for PLA)
5.  You'll get a great machine without contrubting to Makerbot's bottom line.

[Jeff Davis]

I don't mean to hi-jack your post but I too would like something to replace my 5th gen.

I was looking at the Wanhao D4S but I did find a place that still sells new Rep-2 and 2X machines.  http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/buy/3D-Printers/ci/21279/N/4000227851
So between the Wanhao (much cheaper) and the Real Makerbot (much more money) is the quality of the Wanhao on par with the Rep 2/2x?




Jeff
http://homecnc.info

[Jetguy]

It's not quite that simple. I wish it was and want to tell you buy the D4S but I want to be honest and open too.

The D4s is an impressive metal frame.

There are tons of upgrades all over that are better than MakerBot. 

For example, the X axis idler is already ball bearing on all D4 models.

The Z stage is the all new metal design and bigger linear bearings VS the MakerBot with plastic Z arms and bushings.

The Wanhao D4 series extruder (same on MK9 or MK10) is similiar to the Replicator 2 but no chance of the drive gear slipping on the motor shaft (supposedly fixed on newer Rep-2s)

Comes with a glass bed stock and is heated.

Comes with a genuine Meanwell 350 watt PSU

Comes with a complete enclosure

My only gripes are:

Still use a PTFE lined hot end, but they do work for PLA or ABS.

New D4S might come with a funky bootloader that means that updating to Sailfish might require a programmer.

The Replicator 2 has the best all metal hotend money can buy. This extruder can print nearly any plastic type.

Also a metal frame

Cons:

no heated bed

Stock PSU cannot support a heated bed

Single nozzle

Acrylic bed stock (no upgrade to glass bed inlcuded)

No enclosure

Replicator 2X:

Has my least favorite hotend for PLA. "Designed for ABS printing"

Has a heated bed but no glass upgrade

has an enclosure

Most expensive.

[Jetguy]

Forgot cons on the 2X:

Still uses plastic Z arms (really, on the most expensive printer STILL plastic ????)

Non ball bearing X axis idler wears over time if not frequently lubed (true for Replicator 2 as well)

So again, pros and cons both ways.

I love the Replicator 2 hot end. If I could get that in a D4S as a dual extruder- there would be no discussion to be had.

I'm being serious. That is the one selling point to me on a Replicator 2, at least I know the extruder is one of the best ever made.

MakerBot screwed that up and changed it on the 2X to a totally different design all the way around- then further screwed it up on the 5th gens.

It's insane. They made the best extruder- then discontinued it- because it showed how crappy their other designs were.

[Scott Booker]

I don't disagree with Jetguy at all.

If you can get a D4S.. and then put on a different extruder system (R2, Carl, etc..) then you'd have a real winner (IMHO).  There's still the annoyance with the bootloader, but I'm hoping that will be a "thing of the past" in the very near future.

[Doombot]

Thanks to everyone for the info, as well as for some thoughts on some other models. Given my situation (with the credit on the 3rd party store limiting my options), I have bought a Rep 2X.

I will be improving it over time though; I am finishing my master's thesis  in a couple of months so I will have more time then. Having access to an engineering dept in a university, I plan to conduct some stress tests on 3D printed ABS parts compared to similar parts in other materials, 3D printed or not.

Also, a question: As pointed by some of you, small companies are selling upgrade parts. I happen to have access to CNCs and I plan to design my own Z arm replacement and machine them. I wonder though if there are any "open source" drawings and designs known to the community? Reinventing all of the wheel is not always useful (you might as well point to a relevant thread you know on this user group).

Thanks!

[Rob Griesbeck]

I've got 2 stock 2Xs, one with 2500 hours, one with 1500 hours. Only issue has been the XY cable, but that's a common MakerBot thing. I also have 2 stock Rep2s,they work well too. Each plastic has its pros and cons.

Good luck