Nylon Bridge and MB R2X

[Squbel]

Hi,

I would like to share my experience using Nylon Bridge filament with Replicator 2X (MB R2X). I've found printing with Nylon very challenging - even when using the more user friendly Bridge filament. It took me multiple attempts before I was able to develop the workflow allowing for reliable printing of slightly more dense or complex models. I am sure that my workflow is not perfect and can be improved even further. I hope this post can serve as a guide for other users struggling with Nylon Bridge filament and that it will provoke some discussion and advice from more experienced users.

Why use Nylon?

I presume that anybody that is experimenting with Nylon already knows theoretical advantages of this material. In my experience successful prints made with Nylon Bridge feel multiple times stronger than anything I have seen printed with ABS. Tensile strength and layer adhesion is amazing. Prints are also more flexible compared to PLA or ABS.

Basically if you want to print a strong part that is able to withstand repeated loads - go for Nylon (Bridge).

(I am unable to compare the strength and ease of printing of Nylon vs. PETG as I've not used PETG yet. I have read somewhere that PETG is as easy to print with as PLA. It also allows durability above ABS but it's not as strong as Nylon.)

Equipment

My setup consists of Makerbot Replicator 2X modified with:

1. Dual AluCarriage http://shop.raffle.ch/shop/alucarriage-dual/

2. 3-in-1 Universal Extruder Upgrade http://www.devilsinthedetails.ca

3. Glass plate (cut from old picture frame) clipped to Heated Build Plate with large paper clips

I am using Simplify 3D for slicing. This software provides unbeatable customisation, speed and reliability.

Issues

I have struggled with the following problems:

1. Bed adhesion

Working solution:

- UHU stick on glass + Rafts. Good bed levelling is critical.

 So far no failed prints due to warping/curling with this combination.

What didn't work?

- Painters tape with UHU stick - excellent Nylon adhesion to tape. Unfortunately warping/shrinkage forces were too strong for tape/HBP interface. Tape was slowly lifting off the bed allowing model warping.

- UHU stick on Kapton tape - good Nylon adhesion to tape. Unfortunately tape was getting wrecked/shredded with each print due to super strong adhesion. Dense prints would also lift the Kapton tape off the bed.

- PVA Elmer's glue on glass (1:20-30 dilution) - reasonable adhesion but not good enough. Prints with higher density (infill 75% and above) would curl after 30-40 min.

2. Filament jamming/clogging

The subsequent steps need to be followed to prevent extruder jamming:

- Use the stronger bearing spring provided with 3in1 Universal Extruder Upgrade

- Filament needs to be really dry. I have to heat up anticipated length of filament (cut off the spool) at 80deg C for 2h before each print.

Ziplock bag with kitten litter didn't work - there was too much moisture in the newly opened filament anyway. Drying whole spool didn't work - factory spool instantly deformed when heated. (I tried to dry the filament at 150 deg C for 30 min - this made things even worse - for some reason my filament would swell up in fairly irregular fashion up to 2mm of diameter causing almost immediate extruder jams).

- Leave the acrylic enclosure lid partially opened - I have propped it on two 5cm high blocks along the posterior aspect of the lid. I believe this is important step to prevent overheating and softening of the filament inside the extruder. I think that Nylon filament becomes too soft when the lid is completely closed resulting in extruder jamming secondary to slipping of the Hobbed Drive Gear.

3. Print settings

- Use Rafts - if you have problems with adhesion/warping.

- Use Retraction. Retraction Distance 3-5mm, Retraction Speed 1200.

- Extruder Temperature 248-255 deg C. Higher extrusion temps provide better layer adhesion?

- HBP Temperature 85-90 deg C.

- Print slow. I use 1800mm/min.

- I print at 0.2-0.3mm Layer Height.

 

Here are some pictures of my prints at 90% infill

 

And standard 3Dbenchy print at 10% infill

Let me know if you have any comments.

 

[Bruce .]

I have been experimenting with Nylon for the same reasons as yourself. My experiences have however been very different. I am using T Glass and that maybe different to Bridge.

I print on a glass plate that has a coating of PVA glue mixed 50-50 with water. Multiple sequential prints and no lifting.

Bed temperature 70c and extrude at 240c

0,2mm layer height at 3600mm per minute

No raft

I have also had very successful prints on a Rep 2 using cold Garolite plate with all of the above settings - no bedheat and glue stick as the adhesive layer.

I find it interesting that there can be such a big difference in printing techniques with good outcomes.

​

On 28 July 2015 at 12:03, Squbel <tpi...@googlemail.com> wrote:

Hi,

I would like to share my experience using Nylon Bridge filament with Replicator 2X (MB R2X). I've fund printing with Nylon very challenging - even when using the more user friendly Bridge filament. It took me multiple attempts before I was able to develop the workflow allowing for reliable printing of slightly more dense or complex models. I am sure that my workflow is not perfect and can be improved even further. I hope this post can serve as a guide for other users struggling with Nylon Bridge filament and that it will provoke some discussion and advice from more experienced users.

Why use Nylon?

I presume that anybody that is experimenting with Nylon already knows theoretical advantages of this material. In my experience successful prints made with Nylon Bridge feel multiple times stronger than anything I have seen printed with ABS. Tensile strength and layer adhesion is amazing. Prints are also more flexible compared to PLA or ABS.

Basically if you want to print a strong part that is able to withstand repeated loads - go for Nylon (Bridge).

(I am unable to compare the strength and ease of printing of Nylon vs. PETG as I've not used PETG yet. I have read somewhere that PETG is as easy to print with as PLA. It also allows durability above ABS but it's not as strong as Nylon.)

Equipment

My setup consists of Makerbot Replicator 2X modified with:

1. Dual AluCarriage http://shop.raffle.ch/shop/alucarriage-dual/
2. 3-in-1 Universal Extruder Upgrade http://www.devilsinthedetails.ca

3. Glass plate (cut from old picture frame) clipped to Heated Bed Plate with large paper clips

I am using Simplify 3D for slicing. This software provides unbeatable customisation, speed and reliability.

Issues

I have struggled with the following problems:

1. Bed adhesion

 

Working solution:

- UHU stick on glass + Rafts. Good bed levelling is critical.

 So far no failed prints due to wrapping/curling with this combination.

 

What didn't work?

- Painters tape with UHU stick - excellent Nylon adhesion to tape. Unfortunately wrapping/shrinkage forces were too strong for tape/HBP interface. Tape was slowly lifting off the bed allowing model wrapping.

 

- UHU stick on Kapton tape - good Nylon adhesion to tape. Unfortunately tape was getting wrecked/shredded with each print due to super strong adhesion. Dense prints would also lift the Kapton tape off the bed.

 

- PVA Elmer's glue on glass (1:20-30 dilution) - reasonable adhesion but not good enough. Prints with higher density (infill 75% and above) would curl after 30-40 min.

2. Filament jamming/clogging

 

The subsequent steps need to be followed to prevent extruder jamming:

 

- Use the stronger bearing spring provided with 3in1 Universal Extruder Upgrade

 

- Filament needs to be really dry. I have to heat up anticipated length of filament (cut off the spool) at 80deg C for 2h before each print.

 

Ziploc bag with kitten litter didn't work - there was too much moisture in the newly opened filament anyway. Drying whole spool didn't work - factory spool instantly deformed when heated. (I tried to dry the filament at 150 deg C for 30 min - this made things even worse - for some reason my filament would swell up in fairly irregular fashion up to 2mm of diameter causing almost immediate extruder jams).

 

- Leave the acrylic enclosure lid partially opened - I have propped it on two 5cm high blocks along the posterior aspect of the lid. I believe this is important step to prevent overheating and softening of the filament inside the extruder. I think that Nylon filament becomes too soft when the lid is completely closed resulting in extruder jamming secondary to slipping of the Hobbed Drive Gear.

 

3. Print settings

 

- Use Rafts - if you have problems with adhesion/wrapping.

[adam paul]

T-glasse, pet(x), is very different then nylon. And will print significantly different.

[Squbel]

Hi Bruce,

Your 3dbenchy print has an excellent definition.

My understanding is that T-glase filament is PETT. This is very different to Nylon and is supposedly much easier to print with than Nylon (less curling). From what I've red it's not as strong as Nylon.
I think that discrepancies in our workflows can be well explained by the different material properties.

Regards,

Squbel

[Bruce]

Hi Squbel

That print was done on the New Clone R1, I am a beta tested for the printer, the quality it can deliver is amazing.

Thanks for that info I was told by the local dealer it was a nylon type filament. I will hunt down some nylon and give that a shot as I really need to make some items that will withstand a lot of abuse.

Regards

Bruce 

[Squbel]

I've just googled Clone R1...  OMG, what an awesome project! Does it have HBP auto-leveling?

[Ryan Carlyle]

No need for auto-leveling, with the Clone R1 you do it once and it stays leveled. Benefit of making the entire thing out of aluminum. Although Sailfish supports auto-leveling if you want to add it.