New Member - Carnis Swarmed

[Matt Weinberg]

Hello all, 

New member and first year bee keeper. 

Was planning on coming to tonights meeting for my first meeting but as I got home I noticed one of my hives had swarmed. 

They landed in a cedar tree about 20-30ft. up and about 10 yds from the hive. 

This was certainly unexpected, I inspected the hive on Friday and thought I had another week or so to add a super. 

Clearly I was wrong. 

Certainly would like some input from the group on what next

This is one of two hives I have and currently only want to stay at 2 hives. 

Does anyone want these bees? 

Proper next steps for the hive they left? 

I have numerous other questions as I am kind of reeling from having it happen tonight. 

My information is below, would greatly appreciate any helpful input. 

If anyone wants to stop by to take them, inspect, help discuss proper next steps for the hive they left, etc. I can easily be available to meet. 

-Matt Weinberg

920-602-2210

Address:

N7700 Edgewater Dr

Beaver Dam WI, 53916

[John Thompson]

Let the original hive alone for at least a week. Queen should hatch out by then. 

You can inspect then if you want, but be careful, a virgin queen can be harder to spot sometimes. 

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "madbees" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to madbees+u...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CAAUd6Vqqy%2BZ8ECDSL0MY77nMDtoGx1iDWPy1SrZeP9%3DMMQAWag%40mail.gmail.com.

[Matt Weinberg]

Thank you John, 

Is adding the super i had planned on putting on make sense since they are pretty full now?

Or will they be fine with the room they have now until a new queen starts laying?

Also have read and heard different camps of practice on whether to cull the queen cups down to a couple or 1 or just let nature take its course and wait to inspect for eggs from the newly mated queen. 

Thank you

-Matt

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CALTujN_%2BHcHi3OYpv46RGf6sa83Zr0vpV9Zo8w0wOdgGNsX%2BjA%40mail.gmail.com.

[John Thompson]

How full was your hive? I take it you didn't spot the queen cells(s) on your inspection? 

You can follow the old 80% "rule", that when 8 out of 10 frames are filled, add another box. 

Obviously, your bees were probably feeling crowded, so I'd put another box on. 

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CAAUd6VoA%2BdtjgR4S%3D6-ZEAWPQc-eZXs1hcyQriLzm0z8eJnuXA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Matt Weinberg]

Photo was to large so here is a link to it 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/YvLk81H3hpdejBx87

On Tue, Jun 24, 2025, 7:03 PM Matt Weinberg <weinb...@gmail.com> wrote:

On Friday they were just starting on the 2 outer frames, so going by the rule I thought I would error on the side of waiting a bit.

Chose wrong. 

Today after they swarmed I did a quick inspection and they were packed full so I added a super. 

I don't recall seeing any queen cells but again my limited experience thus far could of lead to that. 

I spotted the attached photo and thought it seemed out of place but thought it might of been drone cells 

Thank you 

-Matt

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CALTujN9%2Bk89nTG8pXJbmAJkrhsYX4OwArdbbTT3wPfVT_9AkFA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Jeanne Hansen]

Yes, add another box/super.  When you do, take half of the original frames, containing brood, and put them in the middle of the new box.  Push the remaining frames into a group, and fill in with fresh frames from the new box.  This alerts the bees that there is a second story in place, and they will start using it right away.

Good luck!

JEANNE

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CALTujN9%2Bk89nTG8pXJbmAJkrhsYX4OwArdbbTT3wPfVT_9AkFA%40mail.gmail.com.

--

Jeanne Hansen

824 Jacobson Ave

Madison,WI

608-244-5094

[Jeanne Hansen]

The cells in your photo are not individual drone cells.  I think they are queen cells.  BE CAREFUL WITH THEM.

My notes say, "The bees swarm the day after the first queen cell is capped.  The old queen departs with the swarm, leaving the colony with only queen cells.  The new queen will emerge 7 days after the swarm left.  If the population has been decreased enough, (or space has been increased enough) the bees accept the first young queen which emerges, destroying the other queen cells with pupae inside them.  Then it takes the virgin queen a short 2 weeks to mature, gain strength, mate, and start laying eggs."

Be patient.  Don't inspect too often.  Trust Mother Nature and the bees!

JEANNE

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CAAUd6VpBqR_Ts7s4ZykwueXAiMmVQdS%3DoONjhTiJ%3DcSZBL_O%2Bw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Matt Weinberg]

Thank you!

Super helpful

I am going to leave them alone with their new super for 2 weeks and the inspect from there. 

Let the bees do their thing and hopefully get their new queen going!

Thank you all,

-Matt

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CAJgVapoUrcLMw_zB1Q0VBcLz-uGJC6x69rxOo_kBqHVSHpb%3D2Q%40mail.gmail.com.

[Joseph Bessetti]

Did you see them swarm out of your hive or just saw the swarm and assumed it was from your hive? 

Those cells look a bit odd to me.  

Joe

Sent from my iPhone

[Paul Zelenski]

I agree. Those do not look like queen cells. They look like accidental drones. It would also be very peculiar placement for swarm cells. Of course the place I would expect swarm cells is not in that pic, so there could be a bunch of them hanging off the bottom of the cells. 

I’d definitely give them more space and I’d even take a look in the hive. If there are eggs and young larvae your hive didn’t swarm. If there are capped queen cells, they probably did. If you do go into the hive, just be careful not to destroy all the queen cells. They’ll need them to make a new queen. Or destroy them ALL and buy a queen; I hear some good virgins might be available. 

On Jun 25, 2025, at 10:49 AM, Joseph Bessetti <jgbes...@gmail.com> wrote:



To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/F3A0B61D-9E47-4B47-9EBE-D3960F2FE636%40gmail.com.

[Joseph Bessetti]

Yeah, irregularly sized cells in worker comb will often go unfertilized (drones). 

If these are queen cells they appear to be built out of a block of worker brood comb.  The queen cups that are laid in before a hive swarms are more conspicuous and frequently built along the bottom edges of comb, but even when they are built elsewhere those cups are placed so that the bees only need to extend the cells downward.   This is all more suggestive of supersedure than swarming, again, if they are queens at all.  

Regardless, there's no harm in giving them more space.  If your queen is being superseded she may keep laying while the new queen gets established.  If the queen is gone there will be no open brood (larva or eggs) 10 days after she is gone, no capped worker brood 21 days after she is gone, and no drone brood 25 days after she is gone.  The presence/absence of these will be your best means of estimating when to expect a new queen to start laying. After a swarm there can be a gap in egg laying of up to about two weeks before the new queen is laying.  There may be no gap at all with supersedure.  

If you check them regularly through this process this will help you know what to look for to estimate timing.  Just keep in mind that inspections during this time can increase your chances of a new queen getting rejected.  The safe bet is to just wait 1 month to check them again. The curious new beekeeper will be in there every week - it can be a great opportunity to observe and learn.  If you check them in 3 weeks and don't see eggs or larva, you'll be advised to wait another week (queen may be in there but not quite laying yet) and check again, to add a frame of brood from another hive to see if they make emergency queen cells.  If they make queen cells you'll have to decide whether to try to let them raise a queen (and wait another month) or buy a mated queen.  

Good luck,

Joe

---

From: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Paul Zelenski <paulze...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2025 11:30 AM
To: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: mad...@googlegroups.com <mad...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [madbees] New Member - Carnis Swarmed

 

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/9DE50371-15E5-4C8E-94EF-C56A85A06EAD%40gmail.com.

[Matt Weinberg]

Thank you Joe, 

Really appreciate the detail and laying out what to expect in the next few days/weeks. 

If I've learned one thing so far, when there is a question regarding bees it usually starts with "It depends.." 

haha

I can appreciate the grey area in this hobby, it keeps it interesting that's for sure.

-Matt

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/DS4PPFDFE548CA87EC23EFFC14E2C308979AE7BA%40DS4PPFDFE548CA8.NAMP221.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM.

[Matt Weinberg]

Good question, 

When I got home around 4:30, I got out of my truck and could hear them audibly from there - hive is on the other side of the garage. 

Walked back there and they were all in a massive swarm in the air

Took the dog for a 20 minute walk and when I came back they had clumped up in the top of a nearby cedar tree

So seemingly everything points to from my hive but could be wrong. 

They were still clumped up in the tree this morning. 

Yeah I dont know what to make of them

Only hive had those and i did notice them last Friday

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/F3A0B61D-9E47-4B47-9EBE-D3960F2FE636%40gmail.com.

[Matt Weinberg]

Thank you all, 

Appreciate the feedback and insight. 

I did put another super on last night for more room. 

I plan on inspecting my other hive this weekend if the weather cooperates so then I might take a look at the Carni hive and see if I can gather more information on what is currently going on inside the hive. 

My other thought was to just give the hive 2 weeks and inspect after that. 

Thank you

-Matt Weinberg

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/9DE50371-15E5-4C8E-94EF-C56A85A06EAD%40gmail.com.

[Scott Mckay]

Where are you roughly I may possibly come and get them.

You can call me at 608-212-8696. 

My name is Scott McKay.

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/madbees/CAAUd6Vr180yJF2iJwX_o1keqq38GJFQncUMvVVRQF3dYEjjo4w%40mail.gmail.com.