Converting multiple line-paths to one polygon-path
K
10/19/199 12:09 PM), but not answered completely satisfactorily.
Perhaps the question can be expressed in multiple parts. The overall
question is this:
--Can I / how can I join several line paths into one (regular or
irregular) polygon path?
I, too, was trying to make a triangle path using lines (line tool), but
I was also going beyond that and using (copy/paste) many triangle-groups
of lines to construct a large, mathematically accurate shape, and
deleting the inner-lines I didn't need to come up with the final shape.
Trying to "Join" these (as Linda R suggested) simply groups them
together; it does not form one closed shape/path within which you can
add a fill color. Placing two line paths with ends touching and using
"union" just makes them disappear. (That seems counterintuitive!) And:
are line "paths" considered open or closed? Are things drawn using the
line tool paths, even? The help files are particularly unhelpful / lack
detail in these areas. Must I do it all over using the pen tool, as
Joseph Lowery implies? (I think that is probably the only answer, but
I'll post this anyway, for the benefit of others who've been wondering /
burning time hunting for help.)
Thank you in advance for any clarity you can shed on the issue!
Best regards,
Klint Hull
Senior Communication Specialist
TeamVision Inc.
http://www.teamvisioninc.com
(The reply address is just a bitbucket; please use the webmaster mailto:
on the website for direct replies. Thanks!)
L. Rathgeber
K wrote:
>
> Hi! I have a question that was basically asked before (Edwin Blosch,
> 10/19/199 12:09 PM), but not answered completely satisfactorily.
> Perhaps the question can be expressed in multiple parts. The overall
> question is this:
>
> --Can I / how can I join several line paths into one (regular or
> irregular) polygon path?
Look here:
http://www.flash.net/~lightly/shapes.html
Linda R.
-------
K
> --Can I / how can I join several line paths into one (regular or
> irregular) polygon path? [and please see other line-related questions in
original post.]
I see the "union" command seems to work with triangles having one side
touching. (Join still leaves them separate, and trying to drag the points
moves one point but leaves the other, "unjoining" the joined triangles.)
But I'm still curious to have the several line-specific questions answered.
(Thanks for your help in pointing me to the shapes page; that's got me
started in the right direction. :-)
-K
K
Let me describe what I'm trying to do, and then you can tell me why it
doesn't work (or what I'm doing wrong). It isn't working with the line
tool *or* the pen tool, and I haven't yet been edified about the nature of
the line tool's lines (see original post), so I'll relate this in terms of
using the pen tool and hope someone else answers the line questions in a
separate reply. (By the way, I'm using FW 2.0.2, upgraded from 2.0.)
1. Using the pen tool, hold click-hold shift-drag-doubleclick to create a
horizontal line with handles on either end.
2. Set the line to length = 60 using the Info tab. (W = 60.)
3. Copy the line and paste it twice, dragging the new lines off to the
side.
4. Numeric transform the new lines; rotate one by 60 degrees; the other by
-60. (We're making an equilateral triangle.)
5. Move the lines together so they form a triangle. (I'm making the point
on top.)
6. Now we have three (somethings) with handles all touching each other,
forming a triangle.
The question is now: how can we merge all three segments to make one single
triangle path? "Join" doesn't allow us to do fills, so join does not make
it one path. And Union makes all three lines disappear. Hmph!
Please note that the question is not "how do we make a triangle?". This
has uses far beyond making simple polygons, and more useful for making
mathematically correct complex shapes than adding Bezier points to a simple
shape and tweaking them ad infinitum.
Hope that clarifies the main question. Thanks! :-)
"L. Rathgeber" wrote:
> K wrote:
> >
> > Hi! I have a question that was basically asked before (Edwin Blosch,
> > 10/19/199 12:09 PM), but not answered completely satisfactorily.
> > Perhaps the question can be expressed in multiple parts. The overall
> > question is this:
> >
> > --Can I / how can I join several line paths into one (regular or
> > irregular) polygon path?
>
> >
>
> Have you tried the polygon tool? :-)
>
> It's very hard to imagine what you are talking about. Can you send a
> sketch of it?
>
> Linda R.
> -------
L. Rathgeber
L. Rathgeber
K wrote:
>
> Have I tried the polygon tool? Yes. :-)
>
> 1. Using the pen tool, hold click-hold shift-drag-doubleclick to create a
> horizontal line with handles on either end.
It's easier this way: Click-release to drop the first point. Move the
cursor to where you would like the next point to be (you'll notice a
string following the path of the cursor) then click-release again. Note:
Single click. You now have a line with handles on either end. Let's call
those "handles" end points.
> 2. Set the line to length = 60 using the Info tab. (W = 60.)
Yes. If you wish.
> 3. Copy the line and paste it twice, dragging the new lines off to the
> side.
No. That's where you are going wrong. I'll explain at the end.
> 4. Numeric transform the new lines; rotate one by 60 degrees; the other by
> -60. (We're making an equilateral triangle.)
> 5. Move the lines together so they form a triangle. (I'm making the point
> on top.)
> 6. Now we have three (somethings) with handles all touching each other,
> forming a triangle.
>
> The question is now: how can we merge all three segments to make one single
> triangle path?
"Join" doesn't allow us to do fills, so join does not make
> it one path. And Union makes all three lines disappear. Hmph!
>
> Please note that the question is not "how do we make a triangle?". This
> has uses far beyond making simple polygons, and more useful for making
> mathematically correct complex shapes than adding Bezier points to a simple
> shape and tweaking them ad infinitum.
>
> Hope that clarifies the main question. Thanks! :-)
It does. Fireworks cannot, at least in version 2, fill the shape unless
you've created a "closed" path. A closed path connects it's two end
points, the beginning and end of the line. You can wander all over the
canvas with that line, but you must end it on top of the first point you
dropped.
Is that clearer?
Best regards,
Linda R.
----------
K
Linda, please don't take this the wrong way, but your posts do not
address the specific questions I am asking; rather, they answer a
slightly different question or miss some things entirely. But I do
appreciate your spending the time trying to help. Perhaps someone else
can help us out on this thread?
In any case, let me respond to what Linda wrote, and throw the questions
open to everyone:
"L. Rathgeber" wrote:
>
> It's easier this way: ...
Easier or not, that wasn't the question. *Is there a way to join two
separate, PRE-EXISTING line paths into one path?* (Please note the
subject of this thread.) And the underlying question that needs to be
answered: Is a line treated as an open path, closed path, or some
amorphous blob that Fireworks doesn't know how to handle? Or what?
> > 2. Set the line to length = 60 using the Info tab. (W = 60.)
>
> Yes. If you wish.
>
> > 3. Copy the line and paste it twice, dragging the new lines off to the
> > side.
>
> No. That's where you are going wrong. I'll explain at the end.
The example is not "where [I am] going wrong." The example was
presented as a way to clarify the underlying questions of how Fireworks
treats *existing* lines, and whether Fireworks can join them into one
path, open or closed. This isn't a question of wishes or "going wrong";
it's a question of precision. What is a pen-drawn line? Can two or
more be joined to form one path? Would that path be open or closed?
The larger question remains:
> > The question is now: *how* can we merge all three segments to make one single
> > triangle path?
Basically, I need to be able to join *existing* line segments into one
unit. I realize that shapes can be drawn at one time by the method
Linda described, but that's not what I'm trying to do here. I have a
pre-existing set of segments that I need to join together to form a
single entity. I'm not starting from scratch, I already have the
pieces--I just need to put them together to form the finished product.
((Once those questions are answered, then the further question is
resolved: whether we can construct complex, non-regular shapes with
mathematical accuracy by building a set of various accurate line
segments and subsequently join them into one path.))
If Fireworks isn't capable of merging line segments, that would answer
my question. If someone could fill me in on how Fireworks treats these
segments (are they open paths? closed paths? pseudo-paths that can't be
operated on using any of the normal path operations? bitmap lines with a
phantom path on top?), that would also be helpful.
Again, to Linda: I don't want this to sound like a flame (it's not meant
to be). It's just that your posts aren't answering what I'm asking, so
I'm trying to put things as plainly as I can. Thank you for your time
and efforts in any case, and thanks in advance to anyone else who can
help out. Sorry that the post had to be so verbose! :-)
-K
Mark Haynes
There is a tool in the toolbox called the subselect tool. It's Icon is
an arrow that is filled with white. Click on this arrow and then click
on the end point of one of your lines, then hold down the Shift key and
select the adjoining line and click on the end point of the adjoining
line so that you have two end points selected. The selected points will
have white fills instead of the cyan fills that unselected points on a
selected path have. Once you have subselected the two adjoining points,
choose Modify > Join. That will join your two points. You have been
trying to join paths and that creates composite paths. You need to join
Bezier points. When you learn to do that you will be able to join lines
to make single paths any way you want.
For the life of me, I don't know why you don't use the Polygon tool.
It's in the Rectangle tool group. Click and hold the rectangle tool down
and then select the Polygon tool. Once selected, double click on it to
bring up the tool options. Set the sides to 3 and then hold down your
Shift key to draw your 60º triangle. Why waste time trying to connect
lines when Fireworks already does this for you?
There are various ways to get rounded corners on your rectangle. I
prefer using the knife tool to cut through a selected circle placed over
the end of the corner and the corner of the triangle simultaneously,
then delete the unwanted part of the corner and the circle and use the
method described above to join my Bezier points to create the rounded
corner.
enthusiastically,
mark haynes
macromedia tech support
K
looking for (along with the explanation of why it wasn't working for me
before). You've put into words what Macromedia's telephone technical
support somewhat conveyed in a roundabout way, which gave me enough to
discover the rest myself. Other answers, in case anyone is wondering
(these according to my phonecall with Macromedia):
Lines are open paths.
Fireworks doesn't have the pinpoint accuracy that other drawing programs
do.
Despite that, if you want to construct accurate complex shapes (in our
case, our company logo = a 3-d moebius triangle; see
www.teamvisioninc.com for an example), if you make lines with the right
length, you can angle them and move them so their end points are pretty
darn close, and then link those end points. Constructing triangles with
the polygon tool didn't give us enough control over their accuracy...
rotate the triangle in increments of 60 degrees, and one horizontal or
vertical side would not be precisely x-axis or y-axis aligned for some
reason. Even with the line-join technique we worked out here, there are
sometimes flaws. But it works, and the polygon approach didn't, so I'm
satisfied. :-)
Thanks again for your help!
-K (just one)
Mark Haynes wrote:
>
> K, K, K.....
>
> There is a tool in the toolbox called the subselect tool. It's Icon is
> an arrow that is filled with white. Click on this arrow and then click
> on the end point of one of your lines, then hold down the Shift key and
> select the adjoining line and click on the end point of the adjoining
> line so that you have two end points selected. The selected points will
> have white fills instead of the cyan fills that unselected points on a
> selected path have. Once you have subselected the two adjoining points,
> choose Modify > Join. That will join your two points. You have been
> trying to join paths and that creates composite paths. You need to join
> Bezier points. When you learn to do that you will be able to join lines
> to make single paths any way you want.
>
> For the life of me, I don't know why you don't use the Polygon tool.
> It's in the Rectangle tool group. Click and hold the rectangle tool down
> and then select the Polygon tool. Once selected, double click on it to
> bring up the tool options. Set the sides to 3 and then hold down your
> Shift key to draw your 60º triangle. Why waste time trying to connect
> lines when Fireworks already does this for you?
>
-snip-