Turkey's Chat Archive

[Zvi Mowshowitz]

11:22 AM	You can each access your own by selecting "messages" and I encourage all to share. I am writing a LW post with a summary of the game and a link to this group. (To: Global, from Germany) - Well done turkey. Are we going to go back over this on LW? I don't think much actual formal game theory was used, but discussing the game could still prove interesting.
Tue 03 PM	(To: Global, from you) - Aside from potential center shuffle in Brest, only one question remains: Will Italy survive?
Tue 03 PM	(To: France, from you) - I am supporting Mar-Spa on the last turn with Por, and using Mid to cut Gas, if you want to pick up a center and punish the Italians for their betrayal.
Tue 03 PM	(To: Global, from you) - Reminder to all: I will be publishing my full communication logs at the conclusion of the game, and encourage others to do the same. If there is anything you wish me to censor (so far no one has requested anything) please say so before the conclusion of the game.
Tue 02 PM	(To: Global, from you) - ...and that's game. Moscow supports Ukr-War, Gal-Vie, Vie-Tri, Rom S Ven, Ion-Nap and the eastern 17 are safe plus Portugal means 18. Good game, everyone!
Tue 11 AM	(To: Global, from Russia) - Spring, 1908: Aw shucks, France really did cooperate! I admit I did not expect that to happen given our previous interactions, but I am glad that the desire to win won out, so to speak. I figured France would defect, Turkey's victory was guaranteed, and that I would get the highest ending score by taking as many SCs as possible this turn. Good game guys. This has been eating my life and I am VERY eager to move on.
Mon 05 PM	(To: Global, from Russia) - Spring, 1908: Best of luck to you, Turkey!
Mon 05 PM	(To: Global, from Russia) - Spring, 1908: Okay, the moves for this turn are finalized. Russia: StP-Bar, Gal-Ukr, Tyr-Boh, Mun-Sil, Kie-Ber, Hol-Hel, Ruh-Mun, Par H. England: Nor-StP, Den-Bal, Lon-Yor, Eng S Bre-Mid, Gas S Gul-Spa France: Mar-Pie, Bur-Mar, Bel-Pic, Bre-Mid Italy: Gul-Spa
Mon 04 PM	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1908: I can't seem to send the message inside GTalk, so: Coasts don't matter for support actions.
Mon 8 AM	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1908: Support the fleet in Spain hold.
Sun 10 PM	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1907: gg no re
Sun 10 PM	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Your call; he may make a mad dash to try and finish with as many centers as possible.
Sun 09 PM	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1907: think I might go for glascony anyway... brest should fall either way.
Sun 09 PM	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1907: i agree. interesting he supported portugal in favor of the channel. weakens my position in iberia but strengthens [potentially] on the mainland. Russia won't be happy that it's getting crowded.
Sun 09 PM	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1907: Understood, good game my friend.
Sun 08 PM	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Let me know what you'd like me to do with Mid and Spa (and if necessary GoL) in the Spring.
Sun 08 PM	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Actually, given I can support you into Brest it's an interesting option to retreat off the board and build a fleet in Edi.
Sun 06 PM	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Nothing personal, but I have a game to win. Couldn't pass it up.
Sun 06 PM	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Wow he actually bought that; gives us an extra unit. Gascony is the obvious retreat.
Sun 06 PM	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Done.
Sun 06 PM	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1907: Hmmm. Yes.
Sun 8 AM	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Italy's problem is that it's hard to get big. You're often stuck at 4 centers, attacking Turkey leaves you exposed to Austria and France while not attacking Turkey leaves you with an ally who has tactical advantage on you and wants to go through you in the midgame. Neither option is fun, and often you do all right but are outpaced by another player. Austria's problem is survival, and for him centers are vital. If you can pick up the entire Balkans, Austria becomes strong, but Turkey is still very hard to work with without giving him the edge and Russia will often outpace you as an ally. Italy should be first choice if you have that option. The issue for Germany is that he's never strong enough to survive an attack by everyone, and if he gets into a 2-on-1 in the west as the strong 1 then what happens this game tends to happen: Eventually Russia or Austria shows up. Many players will see Germany take Belgium and then feel like the German isn't offering enough or is greedy or can't be trusted, whereas once England or France is taken down you can split the centers however you like to make it fair.
Sun 8 AM	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Perfectly understandable. Can't hurt to ask, and good to know I can count on you in the Spring.
Sun 3 AM	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1907: I don't trust you enough to support from Tyrolia at this point. You did tell me you would attack me this turn, which you did, but it is not entirely credible that you would stop now. I'm not going back to assisting you until your armies are out of my centers, which is presumably next turn.
Sat 06 PM	(To: Global, from Germany) - Autumn, 1907: I would have thought that Austria is weaker then Italy, as Austria can be attacked by G/I/R/T, while Italy can only be attacked by F/A, neither of whom generally want to attack Italy, and given openings like the lepanto Italy can get off to a good start in the opening. And as I said, Germany's 3 nearby SCs mean Germany can build up a lot of strength quickly if he can avoid being attacked from all sides. The stats I found said that Italy is 7th, Austria is 6th and Germany is 3rd - so you're right about Austria and Italy. Germany isn't a poor starting country, but I'm lumping it in with Austria as a central power which can be attacked from all sides, so perhaps the two countries should be considering similar strategies. The problem with giving Belgium away is that it can make the other country too powerful - for instance France could get 6 SCs in the first year, and once England is defeated Germany can still be attacked by Russia and Austria, or whoever has conquered them and taken their place, while France boarders Italy (the weakest country) and a Russian fleet or two. Basically, I would have thought Germany needs to take more SCs then it's ally to compensate for it's vulnerable flanks.
Sat 05 PM	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: You don't need to tell me which way you're going, since my move doesn't change either way and there are arguments for both.
Sat 05 PM	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1907: You chose Russia, but he clearly wants you dead. The good news is, I'm going after him either way, so he should be highly distracted soon, and I don't need much in the west. I have no interest in going north of Mar-Spa-Por, and there's a good chance I only need one (or even none) of them since I only truly need them on the last turn, whereas I very much want France to remain viable in the north to the extent this is possible. I've repeatedly urged you to pull out of Italy, and given you a free path to do so rather than trying to harass you. It doesn't really matter now, since you'll presumably be disbanding them. Let me know if we can help each other. One offer: If you use Brest to support North Africa into the Mid-Atlantic and move Spain into Portugal (so he doesn't retreat or move there), I will use it and my fleet in Spain to defend you and retain only Spain.
Sat 05 PM	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1907: My other piece of related advice: F Kiel - Denmark. A fleet in Belgium and an army in Denmark are both out of position and annoying, and neither works out all that often.
Sat 05 PM	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1907: In general, my biggest piece of advice to future players of Germany is: Do not take Belgium. Trade it to France or England, depending on who you want to work with.
Sat 05 PM	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1907: My opinion is that Italy is very weak, but that Austria is fine and Germany is solid. The statistics back this up. Austria is high variance, if not quite as high as Russia; a successful Austria can get very big quickly.
Sat 05 PM	(To: Global, from Germany) - Autumn, 1907: Thanks for the game guys, I look forward to going over the game and perhaps trying to think of some strategies for G/A/I to stop them getting crushed from all sides in future! Not that I am blaming my defeat upon bad luck in starting country - Germany has strengths in starting near 3 SCs, unlike A/I who are just very weak. Hope to play again soon.
Sat 8 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Move would be: Bud-Tri, Tri-Ven, Ven-Pie, Rom-Tus, so unless Mar S Pie, which it won't, we make maximum progress.
Sat 8 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: If you trust me enough to be willing to order Tyr S Ven-Pie, that would be great, but I don't expect it.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Alternate play, by the way (devil's move): Mid-Bre, Lon-Nts, Nts-Nwy, Nwy-Fin, Wal-Yor. This gives you a lock on St. Petersberg next year, and he likely orders Bre-Eng leaving Brest open.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: OK, tactics. Bur-Par, obviously. Mun-Bur is also obvious. Then it comes down to England. If he will support you into Holland, wonderful - take it with Kiel and move in Baltic Sea. If he won't, you can move to Hel and take care of the whole problem yourself. I expect him to let Mun-Bur work, at which point you pick up Bel/Hol next year and only have to give England Brest.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: I recommend supporting English Channel in with North Sea this turn. Norway and Denmark can intentionally clash in Sweden just in case Russia gets cute, since it's a free action.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Support Western Med to Spain. I don't see any other reasonable choices.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1907: My proposal: You'll move to Portugal. I'll support an attack on Spain. He can't stop both, it's his call.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1907: Nicely done. I hear winter in Paris is lovely.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1907: I actually don't mind too much France being in Tuscany and Piedmont, because that keeps his units in a place where they can't do anything while you walk into Paris and I walk into Spain, and England tries for Portugal and/or Brest. Next turn it's a free action to knock out Piedmont on the way to Marsellies, which I will walk into in Spring 1908 either way; Tuscany can watch while this all happens or disband in the winter depending on how it plays out. (btw I assume Ven means Vie). Also note that France made Italy the offer to support him last turn, and I have no doubt Italy said yes but then France's support never came. France isn't the supporting type.
Fri 7 Jan	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1907: I am well aware you could have productively stabbed me earlier. I am moving Rum-Sev and keeping Tyr and Ven in place. It is up to you now. France thinks he is double-supporting me into Tyrolia, or so he claims. It wouldn't surprise me if he of course does not do this. If he actually does, well, that makes his units particularly vulnerable this turn...
Thu 6 Jan	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1907: I agree that brest is the better target. I'll take Portugal and you can have spain.
Thu 6 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1907: I will make sure Italy doesn't bounce him, and that tells us that he's representing he's going to cover Portugal with Spain since otherwise he could support in (or possibly support Bre-Mid, if he's that crazy but he isn't tactically sharp). Leaving Bur open doesn't strike me as something he should be willing to do especially since you walk into Paris, although obviously it would be great if it was that easy; Paris falls as does Brest and he's done. In the eastern three, I am going Sev-Bla, Ank-Arm, Con-Bul; I can convoy Arm straight to Bul so nothing lost there. As for what I do with Ven/Tri/Ser, I am going to make the move I would make if I thought you were hostile. The only thing lost is that I don't get to strike at Piedmont this turn, which would have been nice but it isn't a big deal either way. As for going to your centers and not backing off, it makes no difference whether I'm in them or not in the summer. Last fall I could have issued Ser-Rum, Bla S Ser-Rum, Tri-Bud and been 100% to get both. The bottom line is that you have been exposed for years, and I've declined to stab you; if I'd gone for it last turn I'd have a lock on Budapest, Romania and Sevastopol. You decided you wanted to move units out of position to strengthen your negotiating position. I feel the need to respond in kind, and in fact they are not unproductive moves because they will give the impression we are at war which will presumably cause some highly suboptimal moves from France; in any case I can't risk advancing on Piedmont at this time for obvious reasons, although I can next turn. Bottom line is that this is a risk you're going to have to take. The moves I make won't do any permanent damage, and the only annoying one is that I have to go back to the Adriatic, which sets back the naval reinforcements one turn. All you have to do is move Rum-Sev and make no further moves towards the border. If you want to keep your armies in Vienna and Tyrolia for now, I think that's perfectly reasonable. If you actively trust France to abandon, Kie-Ruhr, Ber-Mun, Mun-Bur, Bal-Kie, Pru-Bal is quite powerful and it doesn't really risk that much. I think he's likely to turtle into supports mostly, so support into Ruhr probably isn't needed. We should have a lock on at least one southern center if England is with us, plus Paris for a walk-in, plus Holland will be en prise.
Thu 6 Jan	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1907: I am obviously in no position to be attacking you, let's be serious. My main concern is that you're going to take a bunch of my supply centers, and then not actually back off. I will need units in the area to retake whatever you're going to capture next turn, but I think the fleet in Rum and the army in Vie are sufficient. What moves are you going to make? I trust England for now. France is also offering to work with me, he said he would double-support me into Venice. He also agreed to retreat from Bur to Mar, but is concerned he will bounce against Italy. I was thinking I would move into both Bur and Ruhr this turn, if France really does trust me. What agreement should I make with him around Venice to best support your advance?
Thu 6 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1907: Getting the army into Iberia doesn't matter; what matters is getting them out of England. One should definitely go to Norway because you need to not have that hanging over your head. The other should try to get into French territory, but I wouldn't bother getting it that far south. Brest is potentially a great target if you're supported, as is Picardy. If you agree that I get Spain, you can have Portugal.
Thu 6 Jan	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1907: Not sure what I want your move to be yet, but for now support Tys-Wes just in case.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1907: I plan to take Spain in the fall if it's vulnerable, definitely, but I plan to do it with my own fleet; Italy will support. No idea if he plans to cover Portugal. Reason I ask is because if you're trying for Portugal no point in Italy trying to sneak into Spain so he can cut a random support instead in case I get attacked, or support me into Western Med.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1907: are you planning to take spain w/Italian fleet if I take portugal? I was thinking also about retaking the channel and convoy an army into iberia, though I have to think if armies would be wasted over there.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1907: As we discussed earlier, once I have a turn knowing you're backing off and not coming after me I can return the situation back to normal. I'll be slowed down a little but nothing too bad. My recommendation in Germany if you think England is loyal is to move into Ruhr.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1907: Let me know if you're planning to move to Spain or Portugal, so I can direct Italy's fleet.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1907: Let me know if you're planning to move to Spain or Portugal, so I can direct Italy's fleet.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Yes, but I have the army/fleet choice so making sure everyone knows.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1906: aren't those the only places you CAN build?
Wed 5 Jan	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1906: In order to aid in negotiations not being held up: Turkey is building F Smy, A Ank, A Con.
Wed 5 Jan	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1906: In order to aid in negotiations not being held up: Turkey is building F Smy, A Ank, A Con.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1906: I agree that an overt move on him right away is a mistake, because it's impossible; your goal should be to keep the formal peace long enough to convoy an army in for protection first and see how open Russia wants to be.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1906: I agree, I was not actually intending to go to war with you now, I merely wanted a little bit stronger bargaining position during the build to convince you to leave the Black Sea. I think we can still profitably be allies, depending on the terms of the agreement.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1906: france could possibly buy my loyalty by trading Port and/or spain
Tue 4 Jan	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1906: i'm certainly not against you. my plan (which should seem obvious given my position) was to grab a piece of france. Now that germany is gone, i have no real love for russia, but my scandanavian position is fairly weak right now so its still useful for me to be at peace with russia.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: I will note, however, that technically you *didn't* break a promise that turn, so I'm not locked into this war and neither are you. I will have to attack next turn of course regardless, but I don't actually want to fight you right now. It dramatically increases the chance this game ends in a draw.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: I didn't on previous turns in order to get you think I wouldn't later and cash in the chip. I'm that good. But not *quite* good enough to hold Adriatic Sea, because I thought you'd realize I couldn't stab you yet. This may well have cost me the game even though I think I can win this war.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1906: He beat me in by one turn. This is life. Doubt it's going to make that much difference. Wish you'd left Tuscany so I could know my flank was secure and you were safe in the south, but you can't have everything. The offer is full alliance, of course. I'm sure Russia is offering the same, but I'm a far better ally. E/T/I is a winning group at this time; we're already at 17, don't have to protect against stabs and have at most two dead units (England's two armies), plus the early part of the war is us taking centers from you in Por/Spa/Mar and me going into Bud/Rum while Russia takes over Den/Swe/Nor, and perhaps Ven/Tri could be in trouble to compensate but no more than that. Whereas with your help this war is easy.
Tue 4 Jan	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1906: I even thought to myself that if I were you, I would attack Sev. Oh well! Thanks for the luck. :)
Tue 4 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1906: I don't know if France intends to join Russia or not, but either way I'm at war. Are you with me?
Tue 4 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Serves you freaking right. Good luck.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Assuming you withdraw from the area, I can have Italy de facto done at the end of this turn, which frees me up for a stab in Spring 1907; if it works as expected I can secure at least three of Vienna, Budapest, Romania and Sevastopol in 1907. I intend to win outright, of course, but no reason you can't survive at 6-10 or so centers when that happens depending on what England does.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: This allows better movement of the fleets while also cutting down on the backfire if Italy stabs us, without any cost if he doesn't.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Talked to Italy, looks like France is at least pretending to try to make a deal with him, offering to support Rom-Ven, which means the right move becomes Apu-Rom. New support is for Ven H. Sorry if this is confusing.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Hope you're right. The timing here depends on the exact board position. Might be Spring 1907, might be Fall 1907.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: OK, confirmed that Tri-Ven is the support. I can't actually get into Marseilles for several turns and if I attack him he can disband and build a new fleet which I want to prevent.
Mon 3 Jan	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1906: On being ready: Remember that the game only proceeds if *everyone* clicks ready, and you can always take it back later. Thus, if you're ready to proceed in the situation where everyone else thinks they too are ready, you can safely click ready. I might well change my orders, but if everyone else doesn't think I need to, then I won't, so I'm ready.
Sun 2 Jan	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1906: Tys S Rom-Tus, Rom-Tus seems like the move, so it looks like we didn't plan it and they don't defend against it the next time it happens.
Sun 2 Jan	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1906: Unfortunately they weren't- I didn't know which of my centers England was planning on attacking, so I had to defend Belgium. I should be able to hold out against England and Russia indefinitely, though, so the road to St. Petersburg should stay open.
Sun 2 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1906: OK, he's splitting his forces then. A mutual clash in Sweden and a clash or English convoy to Norway shuts him out. It prevents the blitzkrieg but that can't be helped. They can then attack Kiel twice (Ruhr/Holland), or Munich twice (Ruhr/Burgandy). Covering both requires Berlin and Bohemia to support holds, which frees Tyrolia to support Tri-Ven or Ven-Pie; default to Tri-Ven for now. Alternative would be to try to get Ruhr in the hope France isn't willing to support Germany here, if you think Germany went north without a deal. France has no reason not to support him though, it's a free harass, unless he thinks you're allied to him.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: Assuming he retreats to Ruhr and Hel, meaning he's taking a shot at Holland or perhaps Kiel (as futile as that is), and we want to keep the deal with England (which given what you just did, it seems we do), we agree with him to hit Holland. England convoys to Belgium supported by North Sea. You go Munich-Bur to cut Belgium. Kiel-Ruhr. Berlin-Kiel with support from Baltic Sea and Denmark (so if he attacks you get in anyway). Bohemia to Silesia, Prussia to Berlin. Tyrolia supports Trieste to Venice for now. StP to Barnets Sea. We have plenty of armies in the north, so build is of course F StP(nc). England will have just been supported into two centers and you didn't take Norway, so he'd presumably put up with it, but you're setting up to roll the tanks on him once we break France.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: How dare you not support the alliance! I've quite the mind to be cross with you right now. Given France is out of Ruhr, there's no reason to use Tyr in the north this turn, so might as well throw a support south. Not sure what the right support is yet, but my gut says it's Tri-Ven. Cause I'm a greedy bastard like that.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: It's actually fine for us, though, if he comes through in the fall. He gets me into Piedmont, you cut Tuscany. The Tys fleet can safely proceed to Gulf of Lyon since there's no way he's going to cover that given his disband, or we can go Western Med. GoL seems better since Mid should be covered short term.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1906: Reminder to all: You need to order both the army to move via convoy AND the fleet to convoy the army to its destination for the order to be valid. Either order by itself does nothing.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: I guess Russia's playing the same semi-sabotage game with me that I'm playing with him. Will debate whether we have to plan on his not helping this time.
Sat 1 Jan	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1906: I will explain the convoy rules in my Spring update. Damn.
Fri 31 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: Especially since you so clearly promised to do so.
Fri 31 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: I am supporting Nap-Tys and have told Russia to support Ven-Pie. I expect Tys-Wes, and potentially Pie-Mar outright. France claims to be withdrawing.
Fri 31 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1906: Not supporting Italy would be a damn shame indeed. Of course that would never happen in a million years. Of course not...
Fri 31 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: Eng/Lon is on him since it's a guessing game. Assuming England is still entitled to Denmark: Norway-North Sea, Sweden-Denmark, Baltic S Sweden-Denmark, StP H, Mun-Kie, Ber S Mun-Kie, Boh-Mun, Vie-Boh, Tyr S Ven-Pie, Sev-Bla. Pru H. That knocks out Denmark, prevents retreat to North Sea. If you choose not to do the support for Italy, you'd go Tyr-Mun, Boh S Tyr-Mun, Vie-Tyr instead.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1906: Let's assume that England and I are working together this turn. Send me your suggested moves, I will pass them to England, and I will make my own decision from there.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: (if you choose not to support him, and do something in the north instead, well, that would be a crying shame and I'd have to be very cross with you when I talk to Italy. A real crying shame.)
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1906: E/R war might happen too after that fleet. I'd try to get England paranoid, could be your best shot. Now that I see it's north coast I'm pretty sure Russia plans to kill me last.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: OK, verified the plan with Italy; unless I say otherwise please support Ven-Pie. In the north, the question is whether you plan to keep your word to England, but if so presumably we pick off Denmark this turn and launch and attack on Kiel in case France lets that happen.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: ok, I'll assume Naples is the one moving then.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: You, from Italy) - Spring, 1906: That sounds good
Thu 30 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1906: If you decide to try a convoy, I think Brest is your best percentage play because he has the option to intentionally clash in Belgium using Picardy to deny you the other two, although I make it only about 50/50 to work. Also, I'd make sure to leave the question of a garrison in Norway at least ambiguous; Russia shouldn't know that it is open even if it is (and leaving it open sets up a convoy and/or supported attack, so it has big upside)
Thu 30 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1906: Needless to say, no reason not to throw some support to Kiel if Holland and/or Ruhr are free.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1906: I'm planning Ven-Pie with promised support from Tyrolia, so that's our story there. Not sure that's what we're actually *doing* yet, though. It depends on my read of the overall situation, especially figuring out France's intentions. Disbanding GoL was not expected.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: Ven-Pie, Rom-Tus is pretty much automatic, assuming Russia supports with Tyr. Then the question is who moves into Tys. I prefer Naples do it, but if you prefer the other way for whatever reason I wouldn't mind switching. Let me know and confirm the other attack so I can get Russia's support on board.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1906: I didn't even *consider* he'd lose GoL. I need to think it over; presumably we hit Piedmont (Ven-Pie with support from Tyr, Rom-Tus to cut support, Nap-Tys) since we can lock it in. Tys-Rom doesn't do anything beyond expose GoL and Wes in the fall given we have Apu.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1906: Thank you. I'm worried that was the wrong fleet, since England has a free shot at Portugal, but we can hope he doesn't notice and I won't point it out.
Thu 30 Dec	(To: You, from France) - Spring, 1906: As you can see, I'm complying.
Wed 29 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: (Note that if you want to go Ion-Tys rather than Nap-Tys, I'm pretty sure that's also fine)
Wed 29 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: All right, going ahead with it then. The Adriatic fleet serves the same purpose as this year's fleet, basically, so I don't lose much postponing it in terms of getting into the Atlantic, which is where I need to be to get to 17. Tyrolia, by the way, is going to be used in the south for the Spring but not for the Fall if things go as planned.
Wed 29 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Actually think we can do better. I'm building an army rather than a fleet to guard Russia and make you more at ease. If Russia gets a little ahead of himself, of course, the stab could come sooner than expected. Fall 1906 is a real possibility, especially if England wants to do it.
Tue 28 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: I didn't tell England we had a fleet agreement, so you are free to build an army.
Tue 28 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: I'd actually like an army, if you're ok with that, because I think it will make Italy go quietly.
Tue 28 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Let me know how it turns out; my official offer is we agree to both build fleets. I may need an excuse to tell Italy why I'm doing it same as you need one for England.
Tue 28 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: OK, so there are 3 sets of possibilities now. He could disband Tus/Pie (either one is the same), he could disband Tys (unlikely but possible), or he could disband in the north. If he disbands in the north, he's taking us down with him and Tys is our most important target to take out. If he uses GoL to protect Tus or Pie we can't succeed; it's crazy but this line of his means he might do it. In that case, we can launch an attack on one or the other, Tyrolia either supporting Venice into Piedmont or cutting support there; I'd rather he do a support so we don't accidentally place him in Piedmont. Thus, I think we attack Piedmont with support, Rome cuts Tuscany and we move Nap-Tys. If Rome is dislodged he can retreat to Naples and we kick him out with plenty of margin to spare. If he disbands Tys I'm not sure why, it seems strictly inferior; maybe he's trying to signal. I'd expect a withdrawl. Trying for Western Med and Tys seems right, and we can do the auto-attack to knock out Tuscany then wrap up Piedmont and GoL in the fall, perhaps even steal Mid-Atlantic. This is the awesome scenario but it won't happen. Finally, most likely I think he disbands Tuscany (or perhaps Piedmont but same thing). We launch a double-supported Nap-Tys and try for Tuscany as above. Either way we get Tys, and then attack for Western Med + Tus in the fall. All of that work for you?
Mon 27 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: North Coast is too hostile, though, as much as it's better; England needs to know Norway is safe so he can move to North Sea, but you need to know St. Petersburg is safe (or so you'll say). Note that holding in StP doesn't cost us much, at least for a turn, if he wants you to do that.
Mon 27 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: We have 17 centers, superior tactics and a solid overall position. I don't think England has much choice but to play ball, and you can say it's an agreement that we both build fleets this turn. We can even make that true, as it's a close decision on my part; the fleet is right tactically, with the cost being that I don't want Italy to think I'm about to stab him - whether I am about to do that or not.
Mon 27 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Depends what France does, but it can support for a bit until he's out of the way. If he flees, we can convoy it to Tunis then on to Spain.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: I know what you mean about the focus. Haven't talked to England about this build yet. A fleet might make him wary (north coast is still obviously hostile), but maybe he'll understand the necessity. I was going to suggest that we will want to redistribute which supply centers we hold, if we can coordinate that, to make our units more useful.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1905: What are your plans for the army in Apu?
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: The disband is an option, and it's worth taking time to think about but I think you need to keep the fleet in Sweden.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1905: I meant E/R
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1905: This is ridiculous: G/E/F/R are all at war with each other, except E/F.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1905: Ok, well I am at war with everyone. Damn.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Success! Ok, you know what to do, build F Nap and we'll use it to retake Tys while we expel France from Italy.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Figured out you had no intention of letting Germany hold and were making a deal with Italy, so you weren't being straight with me. There was no deal to be made. You didn't even trust me enough to tell me you were headed to Naples, although I knew you were. If you withdraw from the Italian area in a way that lets me freely absorb Italy, I will pause to do so, you'll have units for the north and I can hopefully use the builds to fuel my invasion of Russia. I have no interest in the fall of France, I can't win the game that way.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: In other news, can you build a fleet here without England going nuts?
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: It interferes with my focus - my mind is constantly distracted by the tension. I think it'll be fine but I need to cut down.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: Wow, this game is interfering with you and Laura? That's a big deal. Is it just the time commitment? It certainly is eating a significant amount of my life, but I am also curious to see where it goes. I am highly unlikely to play another Diplomacy game any time soon, that's for sure...
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Sorry about the build, I guessed wrong, but I actually think this is better.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Was afraid of that. Sorry.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: England is right to be worried since he might not. Didn't tell him which way to guess. Did advise Germany to cover Holland, but no idea if he'll do it. Game is really getting in the way of things again, in annoying fashion. Might be hurting relationship even, more than its worth, so I might propose a draw.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: Okay, I locked that move in. England is worried about not taking a center this turn. Oh well. Less than one hour! Flight got canceled due to weather... crap.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Won't go to Naples unless you give me the ok, to avoid confusion. If it happens to be free I'd appreciate the shot at an extra center.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1905: The more I think about it the more France not going to Ruhr only makes sense if he's headed to Holland. Might want to cover. But then, a lot of moves haven't made sense this game.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Well, the man says a lot of things. I wouldn't be totally shocked by a move to Mid-Atlantic, but if he does so much the better. He'd be doing it to try and build a fleet probably. And the supports might well be fake.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1905: Got work from France. He claims he's supporting German troops temporarily to slow russian expansion, but has no hostile designs on myself. We'll see about that, I guess. He says he's not going to move into the channel, as well.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: or if you want support in, I can do that too
Sun 26 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: But to repeat the question, should I order Ionian Sea to Naples?
Sun 26 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Might as well support Munich if he's not doing anything, but as you say it's going to be cut. Budapest is far more likely to be open than Vienna.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1905: No, I won't attack Venice. Do you want a (probably worthless) support into Vienna from Tyrolia?
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1905: ok, that makes sense to me now.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Also, in terms of the division of Germany, he's supported you into Sweden and Denmark, so while it would be great if he gave you Kiel long term he might not go for that. I'm not getting in the middle of that negotiation, cause it's between you two; we can talk about Spain and Portugal when the time comes.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: The concept is not to take Kiel but to cut any support Kiel is offering for an attack on Berlin or a hold of Munich. However, Berlin supporting it is a free action (in the sense that I expect anything Berlin does to be cut) so I think it's fine for him to do that.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1905: If russia agrees to support with Berlin, I could do it, but he has little incentive plus he'll likely use that Army to take munich (or to take Kiel himself).
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1905: I might try that move (F Lon -> Channel) again. Russia shared the moves you thought up. Good, except F Den-> Kiel seems a bit pointless to me, without support I'd be lucky to take it (G fleets in North sea and baltic could retake denmark, Norway or sweden or support kiel) plus i'd be stretching myself. No obvious solution to get to 7 centers this turn come to mind.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Not sure what you should cover in the north; I think going to Norway is reasonable and so is not going there. Mixed strategy probably right in long run. Definitely good you bounced the channel.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Hasn't responded to me either. Hard to set up a guy who won't talk.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1905: I agree its odd. Considering he told me last turn that he was going for holland. He hasn't responded to my communication since last turn. I'm glad I bounced the channel. Lets see if he responds this turn
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Spring 1905 summary up on mailing list; I sent emails upon my return last night.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Slight fix: Boh-Tyr, Gal-Tyr is *slightly* better since if he goes Mun-Boh for some bizarro reason the move still works, and it has no downside. Beyond that, think it's pretty solidly right given we don't have Prussia. As for A Gal, I read it instantly as insurance against me, and I'm sure the rest of the board did the same. I was a little sad because I saw the value of Prussia, but I can respect such things so long as I'm in a position where I clearly don't have to worry myself. Of course, next time I say your move is obvious, say what it is, and you think it's not obvious, you can always ask me why, and I would of course have said "to support Berlin" although I figured it would be after England kicked him out and he retreated there.
Sun 26 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: I have sent that to England and locked that in myself. I will be able to check at least once tomorrow afternoon, possibly for a period of time up until I have to leave for the airport.
Sat 25 Dec	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Russia is saying Galicia was to support into Vienna, and I *almost* believe him on that. In any case, it only gets in the way of the stab if he actually uses it that way. I'll need A Trieste for the east, of course, but let me know if you need a support cut in Venice (or if you can support me in somehow, although Tyrolia is obviously cut if it tries). Also, let me know if you're taking a stab at Venice, since it's free for me to try if you're not going to.
Sat 25 Dec	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1905: France's move indicates he may try GoL-Tys, Tys-Rom, Tus S Tys-Rom, in which case Ven-Tus holds Rome; Tyr-Ven is basically inevitable so Venice's support is cut. But of course he could attack Venice and try for Naples. I'll try to gather intel, but let me know which way you want to go.
Sat 25 Dec	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1905: OK, France staying in Belgium is odd, since I'd think it was Ruhr for F/G and Holland for the stab. Talking to Russia about the tactics of the situation, but it's basically a big guessing game. Your thoughts?
Sat 25 Dec	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Let me know if you want tactical advice. In Christmas mode for the most part, though. Hopefully France stays loyal, but him not going to Ruhr is making me wonder what's up.
Sat 25 Dec	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1905: Just got back. OK, here's how it goes. Tyrolia is going to be cut, he knows it, so that unit is going to cut Venice. Germany's obvious plan is to attack Berlin. Munich might even move to Silesia. If you assume he's on level one (which he seems to be), Denmark-Keil, GoB-Baltic and Silesia-Munich holds it by cutting all possible supports. After that, it's a question of whether to gamble to try and get Munich (unlikely) or secure Tyrolia (certain). The big question is, can I represent properly that I'm stabbing you without sacrificing anything; I don't *think* I can, but it's actually close. You'd certainly need to cover, and I think that's the part that hurts more. France staying in Belgium is weird (as opposed to Ruhr); dunno if that means stab or no stab. Germany might take a stab at Norway; the chance of him trying for *Sweden* is very low, but not zero. If you cover Norway but not Sweden you can't take the Baltic, which is annoying. Lot of options out there, I'll sleep on it; let me know when your check-ins will be if you're worried. Gut reaction: Den-Kie, GoB-Bal, Liv-Pru, Swe-Nwy, Ber S Sil-Mun, Sil-Mun, Boh S Vie-Tyr, Vie-Tyr, Gal-Vie, Lon-Eng, Wal-Lon, Edi H.
Sat 25 Dec	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1905: I decided on Galicia over Prussia because I thought France might turn on me, and that unit would be in a position to support move into Vienna or support hold. If the move from Silesia had worked, I could have slid the army into there just as easily from either province. Unfortunately I did not anticipate the fleet's move into the Baltic (I really need to watch more games), but that army could still come in handy this turn nonetheless. It also works in concert with my Sev bounce to make the alliance look uncertain. Anyway, it looks like we are facing a France-German alliance after all. England and I can definitely beat the two of them over the long run, and if you are right and France stabs, Germany will be crippled and we can move in quickly. We won't have long to coordinate, with the first day eaten up by holiday festivities. England and I would appreciate your tactical genius in this matter.
23 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1905: I will be away on Christmas Eve and much of Christmas Day, so I plan not to check in during that period. I should be back on the night of the 25th, but don't read anything into it if I don't reply until the 26th. I will assume that many of you have similar tasks to attend to, and as Tom Leher says: On Christmas Day you can't get sore. Your fellow man you must adore. There's time to rob him all the more the other three hundred and six-a-ty a-four... Merry Christmas, everybody!
23 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1905: If France isn't lying to me he is moving Piedmont into Tuscany. Nap-Rom, Ven-Tus is the obvious response if we believe him.
23 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1905: The Trieste army has... other matters to attend to, starting next turn.
23 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1905: Agreed. Pushing him out this turn accomplishes nothing and reveals what we're up to for no good reason.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Spring, 1905: OK. In that case, I won't be able to support you into Venice this turn- I need to defend Munich from Tyrolia and prepare to defend or retake Rome with Piedmont. I'll do it in the fall, though.
23 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1905: The plan is to do it in the fall turn, yes. That turn seems clearly like the right time to do it tactically.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Spring, 1905: Are you going to attack Russia next turn? I'm worried that if I commit myself to support Germany without you at least distracting Russia, they and England will just steamroll over me and Germany.
23 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1905: I don't think England is lying to me because I think that he wants to be in a E/R/T situation, and he thinks he is in one (which is fine by me for now, it works as a real alliance), so lying on this seems kind of pointless. Also, England is almost certainly headed for Denmark just from the tactics and nothing I've heard says otherwise.
23 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1905: You can't usefully support yourself into North Sea, so moving there works only if either he moves out or he supports Denmark. I think he might go to Norway, he might go to Holland, he might support. The channel bounce works but we don't know if France is planning on becoming hostile or whether the miscommunication excuse would fly. I also don't think that while it's not friendly by any means it's especially aggressive to deny him the Channel; what is aggressive would be taking it yourself. Telling him you're doing so would be one way to make it non-aggressive and not all that hostile, since it will bounce and you know it, but risks his reaction. Also, you have to judge whether Germany will try to hold anything in the north at all. Tough call.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1905: England says France is heading for Holland, and France says England is heading for Denmark.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1905: England told me the same thing, but what makes us think he is not lying?
23 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1905: The best possible scenario for me is to pull off a fall stab of Russia for Bud/Rum that leaves Vie/Sev impossible to defend, split Italy with France while keeping his fleets out of my area and effectively unify the south. Second best is to bring R/T over the top and beat him on tactics late, presumably with England as an ally. For now, the goal is to hold Germany together to the extent it is possible, and to get Russia as far out of position as possible. Off the record, England told me that France told England he was moving into Holland (and English Channel). The problem is, I don't see how you can make a deal with Russia that he would take, so there's nowhere else to go.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1905: Ok, as you said in your analysis of the game, Germany is screwed, but I can still act as the kingmaker and play a pivotal role in deciding who wins/draws. Given this, as you have been my ally through the game, supporting you is now my goal. I assume the current best situation for you is to negotiate E/G/F vs Russia?
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1905: I think we can trust France, he seemed very trusting early in the game, although he might have wizened up now. Anyway, if he stabs me there is absolutely nothing I can do about it.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1905: In my case, would you use the fleet in london to bounce France out of the channel (which could signal aggression since he told me his plan I can use the miscommunication excuse) or use it to try and retake the North sea?
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1905: France just told me that he's planning to take the channel and move A Bel -> Holland. This suggests no deal. His next move should be telling, in that case
23 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1905: If I was France and made a deal with Germany I would ask for North Sea supports Brest to English Channel, on the theory that if you go to North Sea anything he does is cut anyway.
23 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1905: OK, there are two possible moves. In theory I could be moving to Venice.
23 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1905: Germany *thinks* there's a deal. The question is, does France think this too?
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1905: The Balkans are secure, time for the Black Sea to demilitarize.
23 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1905: Actually, your army at Trieste has a few interesting possibilities. I am not so sure your moves are uniquely pinned down after all...
22 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1905: It depends on communications with France. Will thinks Fr-G may have struck a deal because of the decision to disband the fleet at Holland. That would make securing the channel important (as important as retaking the north sea?). Either way, I think I'll go for Denmark.
22 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1905: You're too smart for your own good. Your moves are obvious since no one can stop you from taking the Adriatic or the Ionian this turn. You will have a very commanding position in the south soon enough. A France/Germany alliance, interesting prospect. Makes sense if they are worried my alliance with England is secure. It also allows Germany to keep fighting England!
22 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1905: Assuming you don't feel you can/must dispute the channel, this turn the plan is clearly to use Sweden as support and hit Denmark from Ska and move London to North Sea, which cuts the only possible support, then try to get an army convoy over to Norway from Edi to break the lock for good.
22 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1905: I've made a deal with France as well, or at least we agree on principle, conditional on him keeping his deal with you. Tactics are vital if we're going to pull this off; Russia needs to be drawn into a position where he can't defend himself. Do you think we can trust France?
22 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1905: Germany reports you've made a deal with him. Keep in mind that Russia will likely keep England on his side at least at first, so you'll want multiple fleets for the north. I'll have two fleets to help you finish off Italy, so if we use A Pie and F Rom as well that should be plenty to beat a two-center Italy with no fleets; you'll help me into Venice and I'll help you into Naples.
22 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1905: The opening Russia played on my suggestion is a double-edged sword; it's obviously superficially aimed at Austria but can be a setup of Turkey. I certainly don't think it offers anything that dooms the two to a war, but it's the most powerful thing R/T can do against Austria quickly. The Bulgarian Gambit I've never seen pulled off successfully, but it's obviously beautiful if you do. I've offered my own strategic commentary, but I think that your comments are mostly on point. There are certainly a lot of ways things can go down.
22 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1905: You made the right call; long term you benefit from a northern fleet but short term it's too useless and glaringly obviously hostile. With south coast, you get what you need against England long term, which is fleets, without seeming hostile. We need to keep England on our side. Germany obviously thinks he has a deal with France but I doubt France intends to use it for much beyond sneaking into Holland and keeping you out of Munich. Effectively we have E/R/T/I. As you note, it's good that they think we're not truly together, so I'm trying to give that impression. My move is obvious, and I doubt you'd get a detail wrong. I bet I know yours as well - Fin-GoB, StP-Liv, War-Pru, Boh+Ber S Sil-Mun, Sil-Mun, Bud-Vie, Sev H.
22 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: Trying to figure out what to do with England. I can build in either the north or south coast of StP, if I am not mistaken. NC seems blatantly anti-England, there is no way I could utilize that fleet well in any other way. But if I build SC, that unit is in a good position to support my existing front, and it shows trust to England. I am risking StP, but that seems a small price to pay given the upside here. The more probability they put in our alliance breaking down, the less inclined they will be to ally against us.
22 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1904: And stab Russia before he stabs you.
22 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1904: I have made a deal with France now. With regards to Russia, let me know if there is anything I can do to help you take him down.
22 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1904: --------------- The has worked out well for Russia because of England initial mistakes and disinterest on placing pressure on Russia's north. Germany's current collapse puts Russia in a very strong position. --------------- In addition because I feel like it my 2 cents. Interested in feed back from Zvi on flaws in my view. --------------- England has recovered a bit and looks to be working with Russia. Will they try a backstab and go for ST.Petersburg? How are they going to handle the German fleet in the North Sea? What do they expect to get long term from an alliance with Russia? -------------- Germany, can they make peace with France and hold off collapse? Doing so would probably not gain them a win but would prevent destruction. They still could be a king maker. How does Germany feel toward France vs Russia? Who do they want to win? ----------------------- France, if they can make peace with Germany and convince England to attack Russia the game would find balance. They could push though Italy or perhaps better give Italy back rome hold Tunis and work with Italy and place pressure on the Russian/Turkey alliance. If Turkey can not move forward they are forced to stab Russia. ---------- Russia, keep the status quo, keep the alliance with England, Crush Germany, Stab Turkey before they stab you, Win. -------- Turkey, you need to grow quicker. Can you use diplomacy to slow Russia down while keeping him your friend? Can diplomacy get you into Italy and the centers you need to keep pace with the northern bear?
22 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1904: I did not study that much book but I found this to be of use. http://www.diplom.org/Online/Openings/interactive.html? I don't know if Russia meant it but this is the description of his opening: UKRAINE SYSTEM, AUSTRIAN ATTACK VARIANT Russia's second most popular opening, this generally means that Russia is confident he has a Turkish ally against Austria. A drawback is that the fleet in Rumania is poorly placed. Russia must usually choose between a northern or southern strategy. This means putting her eggs in the appropriate basket. Here she is allied with Turkey against Austria. If there is a stand-off in Galicia or Rumania, there will be support for the same order in the Fall. [BULGARIAN GAMBIT] This Austro-Russian combination requires a careful diplomatic setup of Turkey, but guarantees to keep the Turk at three SC's by the end of 1901. Austria opens with Tri-Alb and Bud-Ser, while Russia sends the Sevastopol fleet to Rumania. In the Fall, Turkey is convinced by one or both of Austria and Russia to attempt a move out of Bulgaria, and A/R combine to dislodge the unsupportable Bulgaria. Doug Beyerlein wrote an article on the Bulgarian Gambit.
22 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Italy) - Autumn, 1904: To be fair, as Italy or Austria I'm going to want to kill any Turkey that takes the Black Sea Spring '01. Either Turkey has Russia completely flummoxed or has an alliance. Either way Turkey has a safe North border so either he'll rape Russia or move west. I was going after Turkey regardless of the player.
21 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1904: Agreed. Keep my posted. I'm not all that comfortable with fr fleets in the channel (I'll try to negotiate something) especially if I wind up allying with R and stabbing F.
21 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Also note that while E/T right now only has 13 units, if Italy is in we have 15, Germany would likely be neutral or better and potentially a well-timed backstab could put us over the top. I'm going to keep an eye out for it. Certainly E/F/T or E/R/T are each strong triples that easily beat the rest of the map.
21 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1904: It's an odd situation because if we force out Rome he moves to Tys and that it potentially harder to outguess than him being in Rome. His most likely move is to go into Tuscany, and we could gamble on stopping that but it is risky. Basically we have to hope he's not willing to commit that many units, so I have time to arrive and help kick him out properly. Also trying to get France to use Tyrolia in the north. England says France is taking the channel, so we're only up against two fleets although I'm not sure how many armies. Obviously it's your call; let me know if you want support for Venice.
21 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1904: There is a bug in the game that prevents disbands from being locked in. We're simply going to wait until the time runs out; not Germany's fault.
21 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Yep. Trying to get France to show his hand but this is by no means over for you.
21 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1904: WOOT, not the first eliminated!
21 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: I actually think giving the impression we're divided to everyone else has its benefits, but no need to make this that complicated. If France doesn't head south, all we have to do is stick together and we unite the south with a foothold in the north, which wins the game for R/T.
21 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Is there any chance you could be part of a deal with France? He claims he's been trying, and if his terms somehow haven't changed there's no real alternative. Russia clearly won't deal in a way that leaves you viable at this point.
21 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1904: See what you can do. I think your proposal is beyond generous to you, but I'm more interested in the bigger picture, I understand that your growth would be stifled for a bit if we went after Russia. I'm not comfortable with some of the details you proposed, but I can see doing a deal based on a 3/1 split in Italy. Frankly, I think 2/2 is fair, but if a 3/1 that makes me secure is the price to get F/T as the game's main alliance I'd be willing to take it.
21 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Right now we're in a weird limbo because Germany and Italy are designated victims and theoretically the four of us can get along for a while because of that, but that won't last. I have two basic plans. I can divide Italy with France and play everyone (potentially including Germany but not Italy) against Russia, or I can keep my deal with Russia and play everyone (and potentially including Italy and/or Germany) against France. France wants to build fleets and he wants the English Channel. That's interesting. Are you comfortable with that? I've confirmed the negotiations between Russia and France. If they get together, they're going to be very hard to stop. My top priority is breaking them up.
21 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: How much do you intend to help England out? He'll need multiple fleets to get anything done against France, and nothing stuck in the north counts. England I'm sure knows that if you can grab Norway/Sweden with no effort, you will, so I figure he's going to keep those two where they are. He even thinks right now that France is going to take the channel.
21 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1904: England's neutral, for now. Russia told me that they were allied with you, and England told me their cooperation with Russia would end once Germany was "put down." We may be able to recruit him. I've been offering Germany peace agreements semi-continuously since the start of the game, with my only demand being that I get Belgium, but I haven't had any luck with that. I'll try again, though.
21 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1904: At the moment. He's planning on some fleet builds and to take over the channel so we'll see how that goes. I also know that Russia and France have been talking and have a temporary truce. Both have been "courting" me to go after the other and (after that) you. Of course, they're probably planning with each other to go after me.
20 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: I was trying to get France to go after you so that England could backstab him most effectively and make rapid progress. Then the units disband and we swoop in for the kill.
20 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Are you allied with France at the moment?
20 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: You're doing it wrong. You're not supposed to try and get France to attack me, you're supposed to get him to fight England. Of course, he thinks that a fair division of Italy is three for him, one for me and Ionian is empty. I'm struggling on how I can make a *fake* counteroffer to that.
20 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Thank you for the warning. I'm confident he's not ready to start attacking me yet. I'm not so foolish as to think this game ends 17/17 with Russia. He has no intention of doing that, and he knows I have no intention of letting that happen unless we're on a stalemate line. I am watching the border very carefully, as I would advise you to watch yours up north. Are you planning on making a deal with Germany to stop Russia and England from eating the rest of it? If I make a deal for Italy that only gets me one center I need Russia to stop growing.
20 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1904: I take Naples with a fleet, leave another in Tunis, and keep Rome; you take Venice with a fleet; we establish the Ionian Sea and Piedmont as DMZ's, so it's impossible for us to surprise attack each other. Also, a word of warning: Russia's trying to get me to attack you. I'm not going to (you're too tough a target for me to make any progress), but you may want to watch your northern border, especially after he gets a ton of new builds following the conquest of Germany.
20 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Austria went out taking one for the team. I'm strangely impressed. My next move is all but scripted unless France wants to help me into Venice. Unless France devotes major resources to the south, I get to swallow the whole of Italy and that is obviously the plan. How soon can we get England fighting France?
20 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1904: What do you consider a fair division of Italy? No reason for us to fight over it when we both have better things to do.
20 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1904: It isn't
19 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1904: I'm supporting Venice with Trieste for now; if for some reason the unit is moving let me know.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: I agree with your plan of supporting England's attack on Sweden, because it's the best way to keep him from attacking StP and also keep him on our side. I think he's much more inclined to go with R/T as allies than with France or Germany now that I've thought about his attitude more. This goes double if we're helping his attacks while countering those from France by cutting Tyrolia.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: A stronger England is to our advantage if you believe he intends to turn on France; what we don't want is for England to get back in the game and form a strong E/F we have to fight on fair terms.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: If Austria had kept Budapest, we would have destroyed it anyway but it would have prevented you from marching on Berlin. Austria's only ally is France, so he wants you to march. Yes, he keeps Trieste for a turn and that's fine, but then we're in Serbia, Budapest and Vienna so it falls anyway. Instead, this allows him to force me to go Greece-Albania to get Trieste in the spring, which then gets him Ionian Sea, which in turn allows them to attack Naples. If France is smart, he'll know that I will likely attack Ionian Sea, so if he doesn't support Austria into Naples I will retreat him into Tunis. The alternative is for France to cover Tunis, in which case Italy re-forms and we quickly expel him from Tunis next year. Thus, Austria will likely survive in Naples! Then I have many places I can try to go and they can only cover half of them, so things go well. I agree that Italy has given up hope, but I don't think he's going to quit, and while Austria said he needed a chance to win to play his move says otherwise, although he's kind of surly.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: I told England that if he goes Nor-StP he has a high chance of losing Nor, netting 0. He needs another build, I know he does, and a stronger England is to my advantage. I can guarantee him Sweden, if he believes I will help him.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: I am extremely curious what you think Italy and Austria are going to do this turn. Scott disbanded his army and let us march in. Scott and Andrew both seem done with the game.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1904: It's very doomed. Austria first of course, but England is crippled too and in any case Russia is out for himself and very much does not want Germany to lose to France. We just need to keep France from building so he doesn't get a fleet.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1904: F/E/A is looking to be pretty strong. Cracking and ultimately doomed, but strong for now. Not sure how much help I'm going to be on Russia at this point.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: Also, it is time to move the fleet out of Black Sea, its tactical use there is finished. Once the area is vacated, we can have our two units bounce each turn, or you can utilize it in the med, your call.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Any help you can offer convincing Russia to save Munich is appreciated. France is not our friend.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Also, to point out the obvious: Do you trust England to not try and steal StP?
19 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1904: Trying to convince Russia to save Munich even as he takes Berlin; he agrees that France growing is not good for anyone except France. He also has some amusing thoughts about what would capture Sweden, but I'm confident you know what to do there. If Russia plays it cool I think we can keep you holding on, and if he goes in too far I can backstab him effectively.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: This plan requires that you stop France from getting into Munich. Otherwise, France will build F Brest most of the time here, assuming Austria doesn't steal Tunis. Co-operating with England makes perfect sense if he's planning to turn on France. Note of course that Iberia isn't open if I get there first, and England currently has no fleets he can get to France in a reasonable amount of time. However, I do like the concept and I do think that we want to keep England and Germany both in the game for now. Germany would be willing to work with England if he knew he had no choice, but right now he doesn't have any respect.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1904: Had a chat with Zach/England. Our plan was to take Berlin and Sweden, and then convince Germany to disband two fleets and ally with England against France and me. England thinks the quickest progress he can make is turning against France, since Iberia is basically open and France has no fleets nearby, but doesn't think Germany would be willing to work with him. Right now the plan is for him to move Yor-Edi to cover, Nor-Swe (supported by Fin in theory), Ska-Nor. This should get him another supply center for next turn, where he could build another fleet. A stronger England would help to balance things up north, and France would be more distracted in the south. At the same time, I think I can swallow Germany, and it strikes me that telling Germany England's moves could allow him to cripple England further and make gains to even out what I took. France and Germany stay in conflict, and I can swallow pieces of Germany. Thoughts?
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1904: or tunis for the backstab.
19 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1904: Translation: Please attack Nap with ion (tus->rom) so I can move aegean into ion ;
19 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1904: While I am officially allied to Italy and at war with Austria, and will likely be supporting Italy in Venice to keep it that way for a bit, if you wanted to support Austria into Rome or Naples (or Venice but I assume Tyrolia is busy), this would not in any way upset the Sultan.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1904: I will likely be supporting Venice, and I will definitely cover Greece. If you wish to survive, plan accordingly.
19 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1904: <Russia to me from E-mail> I am sure you will stab me at the optimal point, but it seems to me like we could keep going quite profitably for some time in our current direction. So what political situation in the west is in our best interest? We want the battle to go as slowly as possible, AFAICT. France with no fleets in the north makes for a very interesting situation, and England and Germany can't bring both to bear on France at the same time. Plus I doubt Germany is going to leave my attack undefended, so he has to try something with at least one of them, and France can't actually help him against England. I also have to swallow someone, and Germany looks easiest right now. Then there is the whole France/Italy/Austria tangle. All right. Germany can't save Berlin, so he has no reason to try. He'll defend beyond that, but you have no interest in going beyond that and he may understand that. In fact, for now defending Germany is better than attacking it beyond taking Berlin, since the longer you wait the bigger a share you will get. Also, we don't want France getting builds to make fleets. Thus, I think we should offer to save Munich. You'll have to make sure England doesn't steal StP and also keep it open, since you'll need fleets in the north, but if you can manage that you can start getting into a better and better position. Note that only Norway is in any danger of falling, and if you go Finland-Sweden that prevents Germany from taking it without losing Sweden, which prevents a retreat into St. Petersburg. As for the triangle, I'm going to assume you're in no way attached to Italy at this point. My plan is simply to move in and annex the whole place sooner or later. The fewer units are in my way doing that, the better. As for the eventual stab, well, yeah, of course - if I see a win I'm going to take it. But realistically for the medium term you can't get to me in any worthwhile way and no stab of you no matter how effective is going to get me past Vienna and Romania, or possibly Sevastopol, and then I'm facing a quagmire while someone else eats you. That's not relevant to my interests unless it gets me to 18, so you have nothing to worry about until I get into the Mid-Atlantic, and frankly it's a more elegant win NOT to stab you if I can get to 18 anyway. The main way I stab you is if you get the Russian Steamroller going too fast relative to the Turkish Armada and you'll win the game if I don't.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1904: Anyway, for now unless there's something I don't see Trieste is happy to support Venice in place should you need it, since it doesn't have anything better to do.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1904: Also, Russia has created a strange situation. He's at war with Germany, which makes us de facto pseudo-allied to France. Awkward. How would you propose we deal with that?
18 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1904: Damn. I was hoping you'd cover Tyrolia, but this does give me another reason to ask for Vie-Tyr. If Russia walks into a trap, I can form G/I/T with a great position and a majority of the centers.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1904: I'd say the most likely event is that Austria and France clash over Tunis, but either could try for Naples and France could try for Rome. I'm going to take the Ionian Sea from Austria, so you'll need to cover Naples to stop a retreat from working. Whether to also cover Rome (and risk Venice) is up to you; if you do decide to do that, I'll order Tri-Ven (and Ser-Tri) so that if you vacate Austria doesn't keep his fleet.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1904: I'm satisfied that things are secure. If I see a tactical way to get that fleet in Sev disbanded safely, we'll do it, but for now it stays in Sev as part of the deal so you can't build another. You need some sort of safety garrison anyway, so this saves us building it in elsewhere. Note by the way that we *don't* benefit from the total collapse of Germany, because England/France would get most of it. Eating Berlin is great, but France getting Munich is bad for business so I kind of like cutting Tyrolia's support for Bur-Mun while taking Berlin. In a weird way, we can extract slowly bigger pieces of Germany in exchange for not turning this into a massacre.
18 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1904: Time for black sea to demilitarize, BTW.
18 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1904: Supporting from vie, rom taking bud, armies moving to Germany.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1904: OK, move is: Gre-Alb, Ser-Tri, Vie S Ser-Tri, Rum-Bud, Apu-Ven, Rom S Apu-Ven and Austria is out with some support orders in the fall. If you wanted to you could also start your German war now; France says he's going into Tyrolia to bring the pressure, although I think Germany knows that and will block. I'm curious if he will cover Ruhr or shield Belgium; I think France is a favorite to go for Belgium. His army build is pretty dumb.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1904: The tactical gap is pretty sick. I know Russia has been working and studying hard, but the final doesn't come until later since I'm scripting the war against Austria.
18 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1904: France simply does not understand diplomacy tactics, and England isn't too great either, which is why Germany, with 7 SCs should be able to beat their combined 10 SCs, unless of course Russia intervenes in which case it gets complex. By spring 1905 I should have got England on the run, and be able to attack St Peterburg if absolutely necessary, although of course more time is always better.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1904: I will of course let you know when I'm ready to move on Russia, should you be in a position to offer assistance, but it definitely won't be this year. France building an army baffles me; I assume he's going up through Tyrolia in some fashion since that's what he agreed to with me and little else makes sense. I don't think Russia is going to move on you right away, but the disbanding of Budapest makes it thinkable. Depending on how much he commits, I would be probably be able to respond in Spring 1905.
18 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1904: I am waiting on confirmation with Russia then will lock in.
17 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1904: Never mind, thought that was a fleet. We're good.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1904: Oh well. Austria's decision is interesting. Not having to surround Budapest frees up your units quite a bit. Romania can walk into Budapest without a fight, and I'll advance into Trieste with support of Vienna. In theory you could even use the two free units to walk into Prussia and Silesia if you wanted to... Trying to figure out what Albania is actually going to do.
17 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Spring, 1904: What exactly are you looking for in the South?
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: France, soon as you're ready we can proceed to Spring 1904.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Italy) - Autumn, 1903: I take a nap and general chat explodes
17 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1903: Your analysis seems accurate, meaning if that Russia reaches the same conclusion he may come after me, so I shall be on my guard. Incidentally, if you do decide to strike first against Russia, while I wouldn't send help for several reasons such as being occupied fighting England, I would obviously keep it secret from Russia.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I'd also note that it sounds like next time I should probably be Gamemaster rather than participate, since there are going to be multiple players who are going to want me dead from the start! That turns it into a very different game.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I understand why you view Tuesday night the way you did, but believe me when I say I wasn't meta gaming and I don't think anyone else was, either; I certainly didn't think I was talking to Russia or Austria, unless you were Russia, and I wasn't thinking about anything but the fact that it was too good not to talk about it. You're right that Turkey/Austria is a one-sided deal. The problem is that Turkey ends up with the edge of the board and naturally flanks Austria. He is safe and can't be effectively attacked, while Austria remains vulnerable, so eventually Turkey can either get a better and better deal and/or stab Austria for the win. That is also, of course, why I was so eager to work with you the whole time! The problem is that you can't choose a middle path here. If Italy/Russia wants Turkey dead, joining them is a good plan. Pretending to do that then joining with Turkey is also a good plan, but striking out on your own was an invitation for them to let me join up which is what happened. By the time you were willing to talk, it was one turn too late to turn things around once I was confident Russia was willing to let me script the attack and Italy was willing to support into Greece. And frankly, the withdraw of support in Fall 1902 while I was already on a train to New Haven and the explanation you gave said to me you weren't prepared to think and play as a team. Your play makes a lot more sense now; you basically saw other people playing one way because of my identity, and didn't want to play along which is admirable, but also saw the other option as unacceptable for strategic reasons, and tried to take a third option where there wasn't one. Diplomacy is not about setting up interesting alliance matchups and then playing fair! It's about crushing the opposition like a bug and then going to find new opposition.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: Yep, Tuesday was very sad. Over all the game has been a sour one for me. I did not join Russia's and Italy's attack against Zvi because from Russia's correspondence it was clear the attack would be purely motivated on the belief that Turkey's was Zvi, a player considered to dangerous to let live. At the same time I did not want an alliance with Turkey. The bit of book I read said it rarely works out for Austria. I started off the game in a bad place. To make things worse I messed up my and moved alb ->tri instead of alb-> Greece. Later, to my surprise after being so against Turkey, Russia rejected my offer to align against Turkey by disbanding the fleet in Rum instead of Gal. I was also surprised that Turkey and Italy did not work together and take Greece the turn beforehand. I had hoped for a Russia/Austria against Turkey/Italy that would have been victorious yet make for an interesting game. To top it off Tuesday night gave me way more meta-game then I ever wanted. For me it changed the game from Diplomacy to... I don't know what. Germany at some point if you don't mind I would like you to send me Russia German correspondence. I would like to know what I sound like. Sali...@gmail.com
17 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: Sounds like a plan! Let's hope this gets turned around quickly. Austria is not long for this world. I wonder where France will build the fleet? I'm hoping north...
17 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I think the plan is, you send the built army to Livonia and the fleet to Gulf of Bothnia. Then you send both back to St. Petersburg for a clash, which lets you build a fleet there off of Budapest. In the south it depends on Austria and Italy's disbands, but it's hard for us not to get him mopped up.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Process of elimination, but I never would have suspected either. Very interesting.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: Wait, so.... wait, Scott is AUSTRIA?! Tuesday must have been awkward.
17 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: That's entirely possible. I hope it doesn't come to that yet, because I can grow easily by taking Tunis first, but if it does I should have Italy on my side if I restore him to health or absorb the place myself if I don't. Either way, he is going to be a 7-center power, 8 if he steals Trieste, and the north will require at least 2 units to prevent a stab so that's 6. I can get 5 units in Tri/Ser/Bul/Bla/Arm, so with the help of Ven and at least one defensive unit behind the lines I have a lock at a draw minimum plus he's exposed in the north and I have no flank. I'm not worried.
17 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1903: Indeed, that was what I expected. What I was more driving at, is what happens after Austria collapses? You and Russia can't bring more then 2 or 3 units to bear on France, and so it seems likely that after the defeat of Austria you and Russia will turn on each other. Just wondering what your plans were for this.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: is that true for anyone who takes a nap?
16 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Pretty sure Ska is the right retreat if you trust France.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I agree with your instincts re the west. If we attack Germany now while we're distracted I think it's bad; we're better off letting them face off with each other for another year. Better to mop up Trieste for me and Budapest for you and get you in a position to build a second northern fleet, then decide where to go from there.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: It's an alliance that also includes Italy, at least for now. Given France's stance, you're effectively the fourth member. In terms of centers, I get Trieste and Russia gets Budapest as you might expect.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from France) - Autumn, 1903: Yo. I'm Alex Richard, from Atlanta.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Italy) - Autumn, 1903: I take a nap and general chat explodes
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I'll let you know if I find a tactical reason why not, but given Italy's not going to get in the way I don't think it's necessary.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1903: Yep, that's great. You need any help fighting Austria?
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1903: Interesting advice re England failing to fill in move orders. Thanks. BTW, what is the current arrangement between you and Russia?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: And. It. Gets. Better!
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Masks off: I would have honored my offers up through the end of 1902. Spring 1903 I was going to decide the next turn whether to keep or not based on what you agreed to and the tactical situation. Last turn was simply too late once it was clear you weren't on the same page with France. This was (more or less) how I would have done the alliance if I'd decided to go the other way last turn, except I'd have had you go Bud-Vie and saved Vienna.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Germany) - Autumn, 1903: "Germany's writing style was obviously Scott" Fail! I'm the newbie, 'sceptical lurker'.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: I guess I should have trusted you last night when you said you were going int Serbia ;
16 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Sorry about Tunis, I hoped it would go differently. But I'm pretty sure France has no more use for Austria, so retreat the army to Rome and disband the fleet. You should be in Venice by end of the year.
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I got you Tunis, and the idiot is no longer useful. Italy won't be knocking on your door again, I assure you. Couldn't risk saying what I was up to in case you revealed to Austria. I'll ask Italy to disband the fleet, which renders him harmless, and you can build in Brest, head off into Tyrolia and flank Germany. Sound good?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I felt I had to tell him, because if I didn't I thought you'd notice I wasn't willing to tell him, which would have caused you not to believe me. I saw no reason France would reveal, or why Russia should believe him; it's the kind of thing France would make up.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: France has talked to Russia about fighting Germany, I've seen some of his messages copied. But Russia and Germany have a cease fire, and France is allied to you, so the two of them are on opposite sides at the moment. But they've talked in the past; I think all 21 pairs have talked by now.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: If we are working together I am not sure your telling him so was a good idea.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: If I were France that would be the friend I would want.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: How confident are you that France does not talk to Russia?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: If you think it's the only way, then tell France that you're going in, where you're going in from, and hope he backs down and supports you. It might work.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: I lose if I don't get ven, it is not an option.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: FWIW, I didn't establish priors, but besides for Zvi being Turkey, I wasn't confident about labeling anyone. Though, I've missed the past couple RL meetings.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: France and Austria, welcome to OB/LW NYC! Introduce yourselves.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: I deliberately was trying to conceal my identity during the game, and I am curious to know how effective it was. It had Zvi fooled at least. I was most worried about my particular writing habits showing up. Feedback?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: <reliable narrator voice> No. Way. In. Hell. </voice>
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: He's obviously wrong about collapsing, but I think he knows that. The precommitement is pretty evil. I have to admire it. You pretty much either have to give him what he wants or refuse and use Tyrolia together with Budapest to defend Vienna instead, and lose all prospect of direct cooperation. What else can you do?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: I wonder if people will be less willing to backstab given the reveal. Knowing this group, I doubt it...
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: I agree, I am loving this right now. :)
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: nm again triple support bur.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: nm, paris support bur. pick attack bell.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: My crazy idea is that he double attack bel.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: "Anyways, in all seriousness, I am going to be attacking Munich this turn. If I don't take it, then he'll get Burgundy with three (?) supports, and I'll practically collapse. I'd really, really appreciate it if you did support me in" Any ideas?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: By the way, I am actually laughing out loud right now. I love it. This is like a whole new level of the puzzle! Plus it passes the tension while I wait for the turn to trigger since I locked in everything a while ago.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I figured you couldn't be Russia both because of how long it took you to communicate with me, contrasted with how obsessed with the game you obviously were, and because you clearly assumed I was Turkey, and several of your communications didn't jive with my model of you if you thought you were talking to me. In particular, the communications surrounding the building of the second southern fleet.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: To actually answer your question, Zach... I figured out Zvi almost immediately for the reasons he posted. The first Tuesday after the game started, I had lots of conversation with Andrew and Zvi, before I had figured out who anyone else was for sure, and that got me to Andrew/Scott being Italy/Germany. Once I had that figured out, Germany's writing style was obviously Scott. Andrew's bad mood post came just a few hours after Italy checked after the Venice backstab. Then this most recent Tuesday, with my guesses in mind, I watched microexpressions on Andrew and Scott, and they reacted appropriately during the discussion for those countries respectively. Incidentally, I dropped MANY clues about being Russia during our in-person discussions. So many that I was shocked no one noticed! But hey, I could still be proven wrong...
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Austria: Turst?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I didn't realize until you built the second army that it was even an option to build a second army with the first stuck at home. It completely transformed the game. So did Austria's typo on turn two to not get Greece, although in that case I have no idea what happens next. First games are like that. If we decide to play again, quality will be much higher.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: Yes the mile high walls of text were a give away. I was surprised you did not go turst in your writing at least at first.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: Will, same with me. though, being water locked, I think being unfamiliar with the rules cost me a bit more than for other nations
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: And by zero entropy I meant maximum entropy... Christ.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: Zvi, I think you underestimated how low of a priority this game was to me (especially in the very beginning). I very nearly didn't sign up to play at all, and I didn't learn the rules until a few turns in. Obsession didn't take long to sink in though...
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I was obvious, if only because my analysis and my statements in-game always line up and the writing style is hard to miss. Also, who else would write this goddamn much?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: My priors were zero entropy of course. Then people contacted me.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: I'm curious how you established those priors
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: If we can get a DM I'm fine with moving to email entirely. And wow. I had you as Germany, but I suppose there's no reason you *couldn't* be Russia aside from coming late to the party.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: Oh, my predictions were p~=1 that Zvi is Turkey, Andrew is Italy, Scott is Germany. For Zach I was p~=0.8 he was France and p~=0.2 he was England. Damn you Zach!
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: Well, you asked for it... william...@gmail.com HAH! :D Are you having fun yet, Zvi? Austria makes an excellent point, my older correspondence is already disappearing - we really should save what we have now. Looks like e-mail is strictly superior. We could also move the game entirely over to e-mail, but we would need someone other than Zvi to resolve the turns, or Zvi hands over Turkey to someone else.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Austria, that's not *quite* right. It purges it from the listed here to save time, but if you click on "messages" you get the whole archive.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: zdk...@gmail.com
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: FYI as far as future record keeping this site purges itself. It looks like it keeps a certain amount of characters. I have all of my correspondence with the UK for instance but little with Turkey.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: We are revealing, and allowing outside communication so we don't have to check here all the goddamn time. I still suggest we all communicate here most of the time, since it's an easy way to keep track of everything now and for future record keeping and do it quickly, but use email (or poke with it) when something is urgent. I want to both keep track of everything I said and am keeping a journal of my own thoughts, so we can go over it afterwords, and I hope many of the rest of you are doing the same!
16 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I actually suspect that if you support it you might keep Venice, so make sure to do that. Just when I thought this game couldn't get weirder, it did. I love it.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: we are revealing, as well as moving to e-mail?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: He messaged me "about" two hours ago, but the messages here are wonky so it could be off an hour either way. He didn't mention Rome, I just wanted to make sure.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: OK, that's everyone. I can be reached at the...@gmail.com; everyone else who wishes to communicate in this way please share name/contact info here so we know no one's faking.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: When did you talk to him? At the moment I have no clue what he is going to do. I did not offer him Rome.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Autumn, 1903: not dropping out, just had a busy day yesterday (which won't be the case for the next few weeks, at least). I vote yes as well.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: England has been talking to me, but still hasn't put moves in. You may want to watch to see if he actually does enter them, and switch your orders at the last minute if he fails to; I'm sure it changes things for you. He clearly doesn't put the same kind of time into this game as some other players, and it's showing.
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: If I don't hear back I'll assume I just misread #1 and that you meant next turn, now that I think about it. In any case, if he's willing to gift a center to you so you can build us a unit, that's his business.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Heard back from France. He seems almost too happy with you. What did you promise him? I don't want to clash with him over Rome in a year or what not.
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: My hat is off to you if he did convince you of that, and I'd love to work with someone that gullible. Guess he overcompensated for his inability to deal in the east. Nice negotiating!
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: He told ME he was going Tyrolia-Venice. Are you saying that's not going to happen and he's going to support into Munich?
16 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Interesting. When I say "vote on the reveal" I mean that I proposed we reveal who we are and how we can be reached so we can negotiate without constantly checking the site. The rest of us are good with the plan, but obviously it requires everyone to agree. Vote in the global channel.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1903: Oh, and just because I think you might be interested, because you your metagame analysis, getting Frances F-MAO -> to West Med wasn't strategic. I was MIA yesterday, so we didn't coordinate his occupation of the channel, which was a risk I was willing to take. What do you mean "vote on the reveal"?
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1903: 1: Heh. I think that Austria agreed to support Bur -> Mun from Tyr anyways. 2: Nope, no problem. (As long as I get Tunis.) 3: I don't think he's lying, but I'm not very confident. 4: Yes, I'd switch sides. Frankly, my alliance with Austria never did extend past the destruction of Italy and the capture of Munich.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I take back the support-cut request, because there's a very good chance the move would *work* and I don't think you want France slipping in to Munich by accident.
16 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Also, please vote on the reveal; if you say yes we're good to go.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: France didn't reply, although England did.
16 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1903: They're teaming up on Italy. I tried to talk France out of it, he called Austria a useful idiot and he wants a build. If France is willing to back off, we can chop Austria up then chop up Italy while getting aid to you against Germany next year. If France is determined to help Austria, that makes things complicated and Russia will be very busy in the south for at least a year.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: Have you heard anything from France?
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1903: Just noticed that A tyr supported A Mar-> Pie. That's going to complicate your 5-2 idea if France and Aus are teaming up against Italy (but not Germany?).
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1903: yes, I can talk to him about this. I'm sorry I didn't log on all day yesterday: super busy day IRL which has got me behind, tactically.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: roger, good to go
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Russia's going to go for Vienna, as expected. We're good to go.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Yes I meant Sev S Rum H. Good to go?
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: yes yes, i am getting to you. boh-vie, gal-bud, rum s bul-ser confirmed. sev s bul-ser is impossible, did you mean something else?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: OK, that leaves England, who I'm worried is about to slip into Civil Disorder; if he doesn't move then I'll take that as a Yes. I'll also see what we can do about replacing him if he's dropping out; he'll still have four centers so the position will still be viable.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Please confirm since our moves require each other to work.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: i vote yes
16 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I have strong reason to believe that Austria and Germany are also in favor; if either of you is not, please respond here. That leaves England and Russia.
16 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: OK, the current plan is Boh-Vie, Gal-Bud, because we think he's abandoning Vienna (based on conversations) to go retake Venice and it likely hasn't occurred to him that we might go in unsupported, or that Russia would work with me to the extent he's agreeing to. With this move, any support Tyrolia gives will be to attack Venice (in which case you can't cut it) OR it will be to Bud-Vie in which case we actively *want* the support so we take Budapest. Either way, holding and then supporting with Apulia is a strictly better play. You could also announce that you will have Apulia support Venice and Venice support Piedmont to Tyrolia, and so inform France. You have no reason to lie and he might take the offer. I'm asking Russia to go Boh-Vie, Gal-Bud, Rum S Bul-Ser, Sev S Rum H. Please back me up on this.
16 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1903: I'm supporting Aeg to Greece. Ven->Tyr and Apu->Ven. I've spent 6 hours total this turn in my room. No free time. I actually have a life, who knew?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I'm representing to France using Exact Words that I am going to switch sides, so that he'll confirm this to Austria, so don't panic if you hear about it. For now, Ionian Sea supports Aegean Sea - Greece is default. Let me know in your next note when you'll be available to check in the future since time is running short.
16 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: It was a cool idea to get your army into Venice instead of Austria's, but he's simply not buying it and asked me to confirm this to you; he's determined for it to be his army Tyrolia that moves in. It turns out that I can, in fact, reason with him, but it took a triple alliance to get him talking for real. He's going to support me into Ionian Sea and abandon Greece. Also note that the division he agreed upon with me gives me both Rome and Naples; if you have a problem with this, best to speak up now while you have leverage. My opinion of him hasn't changed. I'd appreciate your estimate of the probability that Austria is lying his ass off, and would ask you this as insurance: If after this deal he stabs me AGAIN, will you switch sides in exchange for me getting Italy to hand over Tunis without a fight?
16 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: OK I will let him know.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: ok in, if you were cordinating with france please let them know to support tyr. I will message but don't want confusion.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Looks like Bud is going to be supporting. The best play (if he does as he says) is Boh-Vie, Gal-Bud, Rum S Bul-Ser, Sev S Bul-Ser, I go Bul-Ser Aeg-Gre. If Italy supports me into Greece, great, if not so be it.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Germany's not coming. I agree that Vie is his choice most of the time, it's the obvious move and it's the max-min. Support move seems solid.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: What do you think the probability is he'll take the bait? He's arguing tactical details enough that my gut says it's genuine, but I'd appreciate your perspective. Did he ever argue tactics with you? The plan he's on at the moment is Gre-Ser, Alb S Aeg-Ion, Ser-Rum, Tyr-Ven, Tri S Tyr-Ven, with Bud up in the open. He might not tell me. The risk is that Bud S Ser-Rum saves Serbia unless we go Gal-Bud, but he could also defend Vie. Getting into Serbia is important because it both wipes out a center of Austria's and gets me an extra relevant unit next turn and one more in reserve. Going to think through the scenarios in my head, but it's a guessing game. Any thoughts? Gal-Bud is also great if he plays total about-face and tries to save Vienna, in which case it's beautiful.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: If I was not with you the choice for Russia would be to try for Tyr and Bud or Vie. Unless Germany is brought it. I think Vie is the choice most of the time. given this I think Bud will not be attacked that that it can be used to assist rum. ----------------------- Russia does not trust you a lot. Attack both so that Rum can not be taken? ------------------ End of the day I think bud can be used to assist Serb into Rum.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Also, for heaven's sake send in your preliminary orders!
15 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I suggested he not retake Venice, he didn't bite. Apparently he was planning to move an army in the whole time, although he's trying to pretend he's smarter than he is. For a sociopath though he's actually thinking semi-clearly. He's arguing enough tactics with me that I'm inclined to believe he's genuine and we can play Best-Response. That means supporting Aegean-Greece, and Russia supporting Bulgaria-Serbia. He's willing to abandon Vienna to get Venice back, so Russia can walk in to Vienna and also cut Budapest - I think Austria will basically never think such a thing is possible.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Now he wants to talk tactics. Won't know best move until we finish talking.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I wish we could talk like that too, would make things much easier - if you vote yes that makes 4 out of 7 for the reveal. France was never not getting in - what's the chance anyone else wanted Piedmont? If you were so sure it was Bohemia, you should have bounced the move. I would have been impressed. In any case, on Venice/Vienna you're right. I assumed you wouldn't be OK with Vienna falling because I figured you'd be unwilling to let go of a home center. If you're all right with that, then I'm fine with that switch. What do you want to do with Budapest?
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: ** This is why I would like to just phone you and argue tactics. Also why in the past I have not trusted you. I see things that don't make sense to me and think trick... I planed for Russia/You not to take Vie this turn. I knew they would go Boh. I also knew Vie would fall the second turn no matter what I did. Why not guarantee france in. I also gave up Ven on purpose with the plan of getting the tank back in. I was confident pre your talk with france I would get the switch out. I understood that my fleet would be able to retreat to Tri or end up in the Adr. If in the Adr I lost Greece but gained adr as a consolation. What am I missing?
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: ------------------- Why not let Vie fall and move the army into Ven. The army is needed in Italy. Budapest can be defended next turn.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: --------------------------- France: Western Med - Tyrrhenian Sea, Piedmont supports Tyrolia-Venice. He'll expect Italy to cover Tunis, and he'll probably be right. Austria: Tyrolia-Vienna. Budapest supports Tyrolia-Vienna. Serbia-Romania. Greece-Serbia. Albania supports Aegean Sea to Ionian Sea. Mistake you meant tri -> Ven not Tyr -> Ven. Same for Frances orders? Should this not bounce?
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I know what Austria promised to me. Dunno how likely he is to fall for it, but he might. Working out the best response.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from France) - Autumn, 1903: Yes
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: ----- FYI: 12:54 AM What would it take to get you on my side? ~05:24 PM you cant get me on your side, at least not this turn. we will talk about terms in the future, obviously
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: I'm in.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Trying to set Austria up; if it works I'll need your support into Greece from the Aegean, and we'll be able to knock him down to 3.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Sent him a proposal. Hopefully he goes for it.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Italy) - Autumn, 1903: I vote yes
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: okay, i told him peace was off the table for this turn
15 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: OK. Here's the plan, based on what I think I can sell, but please confirm before I set it up: France: Western Med - Tyrrhenian Sea, Piedmont supports Tyrolia-Venice. He'll expect Italy to cover Tunis, and he'll probably be right. Austria: Tyrolia-Vienna. Budapest supports Tyrolia-Vienna. Serbia-Romania. Greece-Serbia. Albania supports Aegean Sea to Ionian Sea. Italy: Apulia supports Venice holds. Venice holds (dislodged). Ionian Sea to Tunis (dislodged if France goes to Tunis). Russia: Bohemia to Vienna supported by Galicia (bounce with Tyrolia/Budapest). Romania to Serbia. Sevastopol to Romania. Turkey: A Bulgaria-Greece. F Aegean Sea-Ionian Sea. A Constantinople-Bulgaria. F Black Sea supports A Serbia-Romania. Russia is dislodged from Romania and must retreat to Ukraine and disband a unit. You likely don't get Venice back, but stay at five units and disband Albania. Italy builds a fleet but is facing fleets in Tyrrhenian Sea and Ionian Sea, so he's contained. I get a build, which can be either an army to go to Armenia or a fleet to fight Italy; not sure which is better. We then have 12 active units including France, Russia/Italy will have at most 8 if Italy has 4 and Russia is willing to lose the northern fleet. Moving Tyrolia-Vienna rather than Budapest-Vienna protects against an Italian or German cut of Tyrolia's support. Let me know if you're in.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Austria says he's asking you for peace terms. I think it's in our best interest for you not to pretend to agree, so you can play that card later and we know which world he has to try and be in.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: I have a few things to say to you but not the time to write. For now though I basically agree to your term. I will check this tonight again. " I will settle for Bulgaria, Greece, Romania, Sevastopol, Moscow and Naples. You can get Warsaw, Venice, Serbia and Rome; France will at least for a bit get Tunis, if he doesn't get anything I'll take Tunis instead of Rome." Would you swap rum for rome? ------- "My proposal is: You surrender Greece," I agree to this. --------- Other thing you need to know now is that I have sent RU a message asking him what terms he wants for peace. Work this as you will.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: i doubt italy will not defend tunis, but that is up to him. i am on board with any reasonable plan, of which yours above qualify
15 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Autumn, 1903: A general announcement: After getting a sufficient number of affirmative votes (5 of the 6 other players including a non-NYC player) I am revealing my identity; yes, I am the one writing the summaries at lw-dip...@googlegroups.com which are open to all. When I write those summaries I am in "reliable narrator" mode and what I say is trustworthy, since a large part of the point of this game is to give us a basis for analysis and building our rationalism along with our Diplomacy skills. Anything I say as Turkey, of course, is in-game talk so take it as you wish; if I wish to make global commentary as Turkey I'll do it here. I'd also like to state that I'm not alone in that this game is taking up far more time than I would like, because of the fact that we have to constantly check for messages and that the turns last two days. If ALL players approve via lw-diplomacy we can take this game into e-mail mode so it goes faster and stops destroying our lives. Not that I'm not gaining oodles of utility out of the game on net, but the time sink is getting silly, so I vote yes. I assure you non-NYCers that we'd much rather be rational, make good moves and win than help our friends.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Austria is talking a little. I suspect he's too inept to backstab at this point, but I can try to figure out what he's planning/thinking. He did reveal that he expected to lose Greece last turn (Italy said no to me) which makes his move make even less sense since he'd totally collapse in that case. There are a number of possible moves for us and for Austria now. My gut tells me our best shot to cripple Austria/France is to cut Greece with Aegean, support me into Serbia and support you into Vienna. They can't both fail, we grow and chances are Austria emerges with four centers one way or another. If we're willing risk Tunis on the theory that France doesn't matter and can be dealt with later, Ionian Sea can support a triple attack on Greece instead, you cut support by going to Serbia and that always gets Greece, and he can't hold both Vienna and Venice so that locks him at four no matter what. The advantage of that plan is that going forward from there is easier for us; the disadvantage is that it risks Tunis. I'm talking things over with Italy. Are you good with whichever variation we decide upon?
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1903: austria is asking what he can do to get me back on his side. could be a good chance to manipulate him, especially on the western front. i dont want italy crushed too quickly, nor germany to burn through england/france. maybe ask him to move tyr-mun? what moves are you thinking right now on the eastern front? take gre and vie/bud?
15 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I didn't take Greece because Italy felt he needed to move into the Adriatic to get Venice back, so he turned me down. I didn't push him hard for it because I felt it would look untrustworthy, plus I still hoped you'd play ball. In fact, that was one of the reasons I hoped you'd play ball. Basically, I am currently attacking because you refused to give me any hope of victory whereas this alliance promises me the chance to grow to six centers by the end of 1904 most of the time; France being willing to move his fleet in, which seems crazy (he needs it in English Channel to get Belgium) changes things; we could have protected Venice, let Italy into the Adriatic and I slip into the Ionian while you help me into Romania. Ah well, too late now. You want a chance of winning; I approve. The problem is, despite France you NEED to make a deal with me to survive. You know this. Italy wants you dead. Russia wants you dead. They think you're a sociopath, more or less - you've lied to everyone and allied with no one, despite genuine offers from all sides. I want you alive at least in your three home centers and Venice, because it would be in your interest to stay loyal and you'd be a valuable ally, and I've been playing you honest the whole way because your death doesn't interest me. Yes, you're going to shrink, but that sixth center was never yours to take and you knew that when you abandoned Venice which kind of baffled me since even if France doesn't insist on being the one going to Venice (and he might do that) you have to use Tyrolia to get it back and if you do you're going to lose a home center to Russia. Greece does interest me, because frankly you owe it to me (remember: You CHOSE Greece for me over Romania when we started!) and if I have it I can secure my flank and have a route to Italy. This isn't a case of unconditional surrender - yet. Wait another turn and you may be in too bad a shape for me switching sides to work, and depending on the board there might be nothing I can do. So here's the deal. I said Serbia and Greece, but given France's involvement and your clear willingness to see Vienna burn to spite me, which I obviously don't want, I will settle for Bulgaria, Greece, Romania, Sevastopol, Moscow and Naples. You can get Warsaw, Venice, Serbia and Rome; France will at least for a bit get Tunis, if he doesn't get anything I'll take Tunis instead of Rome. You survive at a good size and get to play the mid-game, plus we'll be able to trust each other and work together. From that position, with my tactics we can take on the world and win. I've seen players come back from far worse to win. My proposal is: You surrender Greece, since we could take it anyway if we wanted to. That also keeps them in the dark, so I'll be able to know Italy and Russia's orders in the Spring. We can then figure out what they're doing (he's out for himself, but he trusts my tactical acumen) and at least take Romania at no cost to us, securing my flank and letting me use all five of my units properly. With France's help, Italy falls by the end of 1905 and with my tactical acumen and a first strike we can grind down Russia. There are three things that you need to keep in mind. One, if you don't trust me you're of no use to me and there's no point in me keeping you alive. Two, I'm not exactly thrilled with Russia after what he did and I'm happy you saved me from a triple alliance, but given your history I need a sign that you trust me before I can trust you. Three, I have consistently tried to work with you and save you from this fate, and proposed moves that would have given us the best possible results. I'm offering you a lifeline. Yes, it keeps getting worse, but that's your fault. Yes, I could be lying, but that's how the game works. I doubt very much you'll be offered another that has any chance of being real, and there is a good chance that any deal we make on a future turn would end up leaving you a rump state in your home centers or worse. There's only so much I can do.
15 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Can you help get France to not harass Italy? Assuming I'm reading the situation correctly, you guys need the extra fleet and the complication is going to make it much harder to open an eastern front on Germany. We're happy to make this a 5-on-2 against Germany/Austria if he'll play along. He thinks Italy is some sort of threat, which is silly.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: Sorry, I assumed that no matter what you would work with IT and take greece. Still baffled as to why you did not. ------- France has passed on your advice that I offer an unconditional surrender to one of the three about to take me apart. This will not work. I need some chance at a win to play.
15 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: I'm trying to sell France on insisting on Piedmont-Venice. If Austria agrees, it's very much in your interest to cut his support off. Also, it will make it easier to sell Russia on siding with you instead of England/France once we digest Austria.
15 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: In that case, let's see how useful an idiot he really is. Tell him you're moving Piedmont-Venice, and tell him to support it if he wants your involvement. If he doesn't give it to you, he was never that useful. If he does give it to you, you get your center.
15 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1903: I regard Italy as a dangerous threat, and Austria as a useful idiot, though I can see your point of view. I'll join, but not until after Italy is destroyed. Italy's previously lied to me about his moves, and then tried and failed to stab me, so there's no way I can trust him. However, I then need to keep an army in Marseilles and a fleet in Spain; otherwise, Italy, who's obviously allied with Germany, can just stab me again. But I can't fight a war against Germany and ward off Italy with my current supply centers So, in the short term, all I care about is getting one more supply center in the Mediterranean, plus distracting Italy. Austria is more trustworthy, if only because Germany is a much better target than me. However, if you say he's a mad dog, then I'll indeed join you in putting him down- right after Italy is dismantled.
15 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1903: You probably thought I was going to ally with Austria when you agreed to move south. I thought so too for a while. I apologize for not letting you know it was otherwise, but I didn't think you could spare the fleet since it was securing Belgium. Obviously I'm with Russia and Italy, and here's why: Austria is basically a psychopath. He's impossible to work with. He's lied to me outright multiple times, he's refused to offer any support, he's thought of nothing but securing his own short term gain at every turn. He also lied to Russia multiple times and also passed up a solid triple alliance against me in order to pick off Venice in a way that precluded any additional gains... then refused to make even a half-reasonable alliance offer to me. This man is not your friend, because he is no one's friend. If he's offered to let you be the one to take Venice my jaw will be on the floor. Plus, he'll be gone in a few years because none of us want to have this psycho around. This is something you want to happen, because once he's gone we can all move on Germany; if you want it to be this game is a five against two. We can even get Italy to support you into Tyrolia right away to get you a flank on Munich, and next year we can probably spare at least one army and probably second a new army as well. We can dismantle Italy at our leisure later, and we'll split it down the middle. There's no need to rush into that while he's still useful. If you complicate matters you'll likely end up forcing the alliance into Germany's arms, and no one wants that.
14 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Doubt Austria is going to negotiate. Rather annoying that he has France, makes things harder.
14 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Any chance I can get Munich to Tyrolia to cut support?
14 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1903: Fair enough. Good job getting France in. Of course, if you'd TOLD me you were bringing France in we could have made a deal. If you want to make an offer, make one.
14 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1903: ------
14 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: OK, time for some straight talk. You're right. You could have made an alliance earlier and avoided that, but it's too late. Any strategy with any chance of working opens you up to a stab by me. But let's face it: If I want you dead, you're dead. I can have you dismantled into a rump state or worse within two years even if you know it's coming and you guess right every time, and neither Italy nor Russia will have any interest in saving you. No one else can arrive in time to make a difference. So you have no choice: Either you give me what I want and trust me, or you die. So here's what is going to happen. I'm going to attack Greece while you move up your forces to defend and get ready to attack Romania. You're going to let me, and you're going to trust me. If I get Greece, I will support you into Romania in the fall and we'll continue on together. If you don't give it to me, I will take Greece and Serbia by force and then see if keeping you alive after that is relevant to my interests.
14 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1903: ------- I understand you position and find you arguments very compelling. If the board was not what it was I would probably follow your advice. It is hard to tell if my idea of what good tactics are correct. It is even harder to tell if others tactics are just bad or aimed against me. It is hard to see the disbandment of rum as good for RU unless she trust you. It is easy to believe IT would be willing to form an alliance with you. ------------------ You are the only one I have a chance of dealing with though. I think you understand that a slow disbandment of me will not benefit you. Problem is that I don't see any strat you can offer that does not open me up to a stab and helps you.
14 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: I'm assuming the game won't fire until the deadline this turn with only one lock in.
14 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1903: i agree mun is unlikely to help, but i want to see his response. moving gal-boh and war-gal now. still waiting to lock in if we get any more info today
14 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: If we trust Germany, and what he said to me seems consistent with your impression of him and with a cease-fire, then Bohemia is the play because it's the one thing Austria isn't going to cover. I doubt Germany is going to actively help against Austria because he is smart and it's not in his interest - he'd rather see the fight last as long as possible. Austria is going to bounce Italy in the Adriatic, so he'll be safe in Venice for a turn and will then use Tyrolia to protect Vienna. We then cut Serbia to secure Greece, and you pick up a center too if he guesses wrong.
14 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1903: austria is being very curt with me, i am telling him i will move on germany. germany and i have a cease fire, and he seems like the type to uphold agreements. i have asked him what he is doing with mun, to potentially coordinate against austria still supporting ukr-rum, and supporting bud-vie barring further notice. if germany moves mun-tyr after all, i go gal-bud. i still like gal-boh, war-gal as a move, since it applies a lot of pressure next turn
14 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Austria isn't talking at all so far. Very frustrating and means he might well protect Greece but does mean I keep my credibility to set him up later. My intelligence so far in other areas and my gut instincts point to Germany not heading your way for at least a year but it wouldn't shock me; I'd say 20% chance. Default plan now becomes to get into Romania this turn, then assuming he protected Greece you hit Serbia to cut support so I get into Greece no matter what he does.
14 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: You need to talk to me, and you need to do it soon so we don't run out of time. I have no idea what you're willing to do this turn beyond throw a token support behind Bul-Rum that probably fails, I have no idea if you're willing to help me sneak into the Ionian Sea, I have no idea what you're willing to do in the future, and you've altered our deal multiple times in these first four turns. I refuse to sit here indefinitely with four supply centers while Germany wins the game.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: All right then. To make sure we don’t run out of time, I’ll go first. Starting with Russia: Russia will almost certainly support a move into Romania this turn at least once and more likely he'll support it twice; there's a small chance he'll try to sneak into Vienna or Budapest, or flank you with Bohemia. In theory he could also go into Silesia and Prussia but I doubt we're that lucky. If I had to guess: 65% double-support, 15% Vienna, 10% Bohemia, 8% Budapest, 2% Silesia-Prussia. That leaves the following options that seem reasonable to me: Option A) Greece->Serbia, Serbia->Budapest, Budapest->Vienna, I move into Greece. That gives us a unit in Vienna almost all the time. This covers any move by him to flank you, and gives us an additional unit to attack him with. I then double support you into Romania in the fall. Option B) I'll support Serbia to Romania (Budapest to Romania exposes your homeland, so it's basically not on the table). Presumably you support it as well, so it's a lock to work. You get Romania and I get Greece while your army moves up to Serbia. Option C) I'll move into Romania from Bulgaria supported by both Serbia and Budapest. We get an army into Romania automatically, which I can keep there with double support without your help. Then there's your proposal which I'm assuming is either: Option D) Budapest supports but Serbia does not, because you want to use Serbia for support on Greece. Basically we're sacrificing the use of two of your units, Serbia and Greece. We don't cover Vienna, a move to Budapest cuts the support and if he double supports we bounce. If we get in, it’s because he’s in Vienna or he’s flanking in Bohemia, neither of which is fun when we left armies behind in Serbia and Greece. I don't see this option making progress, and if you never trust me then we never will. Option E) Serbia supports but not Budapest, so Budapest can help cover Vienna, and we see what he does: If we get in we’re very happy unless you exposed Budapest and he snuck in. If we don’t, we’re faced with the same situation as before but his decision scrambles and we haven’t solved anything; we’re basically a turn behind. I consider it vital to bring all the force to bear that we can and end this quickly before Germany becomes a monster in the north. I recommend Option A, which I believe is best for both of us, my second choice is B and my third is C. All three of those are perfectly fine. Option E I’m not happy about but I’ll take it grudgingly. Option D isn’t acceptable. It flat out doesn’t work and I refuse to be caught in an avoidable quagmire. Now on to Italy. Most of the time, his armies attack Venice and his fleet goes to Adriatic. You must respond. You can if you wish choose to move Venice into the Adriatic with support. If you do, he ends up in Venice and your only play is to move Adriatic back into Venice with two supports, since Ionian Sea will cut any support from Adriatic. Thus, moving there doesn’t work. Our choices are (F) to bounce him in the Adriatic or (G) to let him in so I can sneak into Ionian Sea and get to an undefended Tunis.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Definitely no reason to lock in yet. I'll talk to Austria and see what I can get him to agree to.
13 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1903: germany and i have a cease fire, the fleet has to be for england. they are both hesitant to reveal their enmity towards each other france communicates very sparsely with me. i will let you know when i know more about the western diplomatic situation right now my move is to support bud-vie, but it seems worth waiting if we can get any insight into austrias thinking
13 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1903: Definitely don't need the help. Good luck in your endeavors against whoever you're up against.
13 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1903: No, not anytime soon at least. (But don't tell anyone). The situation seems to be secure down there, you don't really need any help against Russia right now.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Actually, if Austria is going to do what I think he's going to do, there's a really evil thing you can do: Support Austria's move of Budapest to Vienna! He then succeeds in that move, and if I got into Greece then we can support me into Serbia, which then gives me the leverage to get you into Budapest.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: I asked, no reply yet. His builds don't actually make sense. If he's going after you, building two armies is much better as he'd want to move into Prussia while doing a convoy into Livonia or Sweden, and the second fleet doesn't have much to do, but he might not realize that. You said France wants to attack Germany; that's the only reason I don't think Germany is headed for England. We can spare an army to defend the north, if you want to, although it makes things slower and makes it less likely you'll pick up Vienna or Budapest this year; by far the best thing to do with it would be to send it to Livonia. The fleet can try to block Finland, which seems better than holding, or it can retreat back into St. Petersburg proper. It depends on our read on Germany (and England) in the north, and on Austria's plan if we can find out what it is. I certainly wouldn't pass up a shot at Vienna if it looked like it would work.
13 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1903: what about germany though? fleet in ber suggests he is coming for me, stp is in danger
13 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Trying to figure out if he's going to leave Vienna open. My best guess right now is he will use a self bounce with Tyrolia and Budapest, and support me into Romania with Serbia. That lets you waltz into Romania with Ukraine, move Galicia over to Bohemia and slide Warsaw into Galicia while I strike at an unsupported Greece, then in the fall we strike at Serbia and Vienna.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: I'd like to hear your perspective on how this plays out, then if I disagree I'll offer mine.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: You'll have to explain what you're offering to me and why you think it's going to work.
13 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1903: Not a problem. Couldn't hurt to ask.
13 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Spring, 1903: I'm fairly certain I need to move into the Adriatic sea, either to bounce Austria or to take back Venice. If he holds I can't unseat him without all my forces and German help.
13 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1903: I was... The board is different now.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1903: Are you offering the support of both Serbia and Budapest?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Ignore the support request, of course, that was for Austria. Setting him up.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1903: That fleet in Berlin has me wondering. Are you headed for St. Petersburg?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Not that it would save him anyway at this point, of course, but it's like he's not even trying.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Austria thinks he has a strong negotiating position and isn't willing to give up Greece. It's kind of cute that he doesn't realize he's already at war on two fronts and doesn't have much choice.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1903: If I asked for support into Greece this turn, would I get it?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1903: Are you offering support from both Serbia and Budapest this turn?
12 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: I'm just not willing to give up Greece until I have more of IT. I'm willing to signal to the board I am on your side by taking or helping take a RU zone but not looking to lock myself in but not with a move that makes me weaker. I know I can take Adr next turn so a stale-mate is not so bad for me.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Either way, only one way to find out. He's locked in so I doubt you can change his mind.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Moscow->Warsaw was probably a mistake actually; I would have kept that army in the north and lost the northern fleet, but now he has to shield StP.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Warsaw seems far more likely than Ukraine if it's an army, and it could be a fleet as well.
12 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: I think he will disband Ukraine right?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Long term plan is good.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: What happens if he defends it with three units? Then we've made no progress and Italy is in the Adriatic so Tyrolia becomes busy.
12 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: How about I bounce bud and tyr off of vie? Take rum with your assistance. defend ven from tri. ---- Next turn assist you into sev from rum. -------------- Long term I take war assist you into mos.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Oops, I obviously meant Ukraine as well above. We'll talk more after the builds/disbands.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Looks like Russia's ready now. Shall we proceed to the Spring?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Also, feel free to point out to him that when you disband in Galicia (which he thinks you're doing) it'll be obvious to 'wicked smart' Turkey that you've made a deal with him of some kind whether you two hit the button together or not. No reason not to get on with the show.
12 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: I pointed out that him attacking Romania is more than a little risky if you keep Galicia in place (since he needs three units to cover Venice), and that if you disband Warsaw or Gulf of Bothnia we can't actually take Romania at all, but promised it to him if he gets you to disband in the south and he wants to do it. Of course, I won't do it from anywhere but Serbia...
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: The problem is that if you don't build in Trieste or move there then Italy moves to Adriatic and retakes Venice (if you don't support the hold, he gets it right away). That means if Galicia is still there you need to expose either Vienna or Budapest, and if either falls then even if you retake it Venice falls because he cuts supports. If he disbands Warsaw or the northern fleet we can't even take Romania since he triple defends it, but if he disbands one of the three southern units (Rom, Sev or Gal) then we can do it that way if you prefer.
12 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: from austria, after agreeing to disband gal Going to hold off pressing my button for a bit, TU is crazy smart if he sees we both pushed at the same time he may think of a better strat. Going to talk up TU while I wait see If I can get him to assist me into rum.
12 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: Any reason not to take Rum the first turn?
12 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Disbands are with builds.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: When do people disband. I expected RU and IT to have disbanded by now.
11 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1902: I assume you're headed north rather than east at this point from your moves. I thank you for the assistance, and I believe that I have stabilized the situation. I hope we can work together again in the future!
11 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Are you talking to France? My intel isn't that reliable but it says he wants to be on your side against Germany. And make no mistake; if Germany builds another fleet you've been stabbed.
11 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Keep Sev and disband Rom. Sev is useful because you can use it for support into Rom with an army, which is important for leverage into Austria, and to cover Sev (trust but verify!) I'll see what Austria wants to do, and we'll plan things from there. France's note is interesting. If he's saying that to you it means he pretty much has to go east rather than north, or at least he currently plans to. The problem is that it's very hard for England to DO anything and France doesn't have much leverage either; it's not clear Germany doesn't just *win* against both of them, but I will do my best to get them working together. Germany winning this war isn't good for any of us.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: from france England and you do something up north that stops the German advance. I take Munich, supported by Austria, and probably lose Burgundy. England takes Belgium, supported by me. Germany loses SC's, we gain them, we wiped him out. And, on a side note, would you be willing to stop attacking Austria until the war with Germany has been resolved, and to set up Galicia as a DMZ?
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1902: We're on the same page.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: this worked out well, i did not lose rum and can still disband a southern fleet. i am willing to trust you at this point, and i certainly dont trust austria. which to disband? a fleet in rum doesnt seem very useful, unless it is just holding while my armies move north
11 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Not blaming you for trying, it was a free action. I presume you'll disband Eastern Med; as long as you agree that I get Greece and Serbia, we'll call it even.
11 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Austria said he would support me, so I thought it would work either way and I couldn't go Bul-Rom because I felt the need to cover Bulgaria against an Austrian stab and Smyrna against a Turkish stab, in addition to trusting you, and any combination of the three, which precluded the other move. Austria has no idea what it means to have allies, it's kind of sad. Here's my proposal: You'll retreat the northern fleet and disband Rumania, then Sevastopol can be used as a support unit and with Germany leaving Silesia and you in Galicia we can move Ukraine into Romania safely. If you go down to one southern fleet, I will trust you, you can keep Romania and we can clean up the fleets from the black sea later. Italy took a stab at me cause it didn't cost him anything, but I won't hold it against him. Austria will soon be forced to trust me, and he will pay the price.
11 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: You could have told me this earlier so I could alter my plan of attack; I didn't get this message until too late. I would have gone the other way and attacked Bulgaria to Romania, but it's too late now. We have to fight Italy and Russia; postponing Russia's collapse is known as Not Helping. If we don't work together as allies, this all gets a lot harder especially since Germany looks like he's going to be turning on England rather than helping more against Russia. You're going to need a unit in Trieste to hold Venice. Then I would build an army in Vienna. You can then bring Greece to Serbia and Serbia to Budapest; I'll secure Greece in case Italy takes a stab at it and support you into Romania. I think that is our best bet.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: Guess RU is going to attack me. Lets talk before the build.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: I am going to hold back a turn on providing my support. I don't think I benefit from the immediate collapse of RU.
11 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: i am going ukr s war-gal, mos-war, sev s rum-bla. this way you can go bul-rum, get the depot, and i bump you from black sea. then i disband a fleet, and we move on austria from there. i dont trust you to hold both rum and the black sea, mostly because i dont trust you to trust me now
10 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: It is done. Russia is wavering, but his cooperation doesn't matter much until after this turn.
10 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1902: I'll play ball.
10 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: No. That would mean trusting you AND trusting Italy AND backstabbing Austria in order to not grow. I'd be crazy to do that. There are two possible worlds. If I'm facing all three of you right now, I'm dead and what I agree to matters little; an Italy that agreed to a fake stab isn't backing down and if you insist on keeping your fleets with Germany on your northern flank we will lose even if the two of us work together. If I'm allied to Austria, I'm also allied to Germany and it's easy to see that we'll win; even if Romania doesn't fall Austria will have 6 units that matter, I will have 4 and Germany will have 3. You'll have 5 and Italy 3. So either I have the upper hand or I am already dead.
10 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: not sure if i agree yet, losing a supply depot to you is a dangerous move. i would rather see italy gain a depot at the expense of austria before the build. would you support him into greece?
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from France) - Autumn, 1902: Yeah, I've contacted him.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1902: Everything Austria has said to me since the stab indicates that the stab is real, but it could all be part of the deception. I'll talk to Austria about supporting him to Galicia.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: This turn, he's no doubt going to go Vienna-Galicia and give Serbia and Greece support orders. Venice holds. He then builds A Budapest and A/F Trieste (my guess is fleet but who knows). After that it depends on the tactical situation but I expect at least two units to go west, then he will make a play for Galicia and perhaps Romania depending on our negotiations, and I should be able to set him up to abandon or not defend Greece, after which I get leverage into Serbia and he falls apart. At the very least, I will know what supports and moves he wants from me, which will let me figure out the rest.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: what is austria going to do?
9 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Austria has promised his support. Hopefully he's telling the truth. If you can figure out whether Italy was actually stabbed last turn, and whether he's going to withdraw, that would be great, although presumably that won't happen. Dunno what he thought one lone army would do.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Sent him a proposal. He's not going to like it but we've been positioned quite badly and I had no choice but to call in Germany, so if he's confident Austria is hostile to him he won't have much of a choice but to play ball. I have to hand it to Austria.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: This is going to be long, because doing this is complicated, and because frankly I love this sort of thing and think it's fun to chart it out, but I believe it is in both our interests. In my opinion we simply can't afford to have three useless fleets in this battle with Austria at six centers and still defend (or just as important, show you CAN defend) your northern flank at all. Given your response to this proposal last time I made it was to stab me (twice), I recognize you may not feel the same way. If you disagree, I'm willing to listen to your plan, but at least one must go. My proposal is: This turn, I will do what I would do anyway. I will attack Romania, either from Bulgaria or Black Sea (not saying which). Moscow to Warsaw (which we half hope bounces so we can use the army in the north), Warsaw to Galicia and Ukraine supports Warsaw to Galicia. That should normally get you into Galicia. You will not support your unit in Romania, and it will be destroyed. Sweden will retreat to defend St Petersburg and you will disband your southern fleet. At that point, I will know I can trust you. I will then attempt to convince Germany (I estimate 75% chance this will work if France plays ball which he should and it's clear you're prepared to defend yourself in the north) to make peace with you and backstab England together with France, which he should be willing to do since England only has two fleets and will be easy prey for him if he builds two more fleets; he'll keep Sweden but there won't be any more damage, and it's possible the army in Silesia can be used on our side. Your north side is now secure for a few years. The northern fleet heads home but the other three units are free to attack. Italy can get all three surviving units into battle quickly (he confirmed he'd heard from you, but didn't say if he'd play ball) either through Adriatic Sea or a convoy to Apulia, then disbanding the one that doesn't matter; he doesn't have to guard Ionian Sea since Austria's fleets will be bottled up (I expect him to build a second one but he might not). Italy's play frees up my resources, so I can bring my southern fleet and one or two armies to bear right away. Add in your armies in Galicia and Ukraine and that's enough to win the war, leaving a second unit of yours to defend the north if you like or we can work faster with all three. We put pressure on multiple centers right away and I'll return Romania to you; my share of the spoils is Serbia and Greece, you get Romania and Budapest, Italy gets Trieste and you can negotiate with him over Vienna. I will vacate the Black Sea once it is no longer tactically useful against Austria along with the previously offered agreements: DMZ in Armenia and Black Sea, No fleets for either of us in Black Sea, Sevastopol, Romania, Bulgaria (nc) or Ankara. After that, my natural next move is to head west into the Ionian together with whoever wins the west, who oddly enough I'm guessing will be France, which then allies the three of us against Germany, who will likely be a monster at this point and need to be stopped, but of course a lot will happen between now and then and we'll see where we are.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Are you interested?
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1902: Russia proposed the same to me
9 Dec 2010	(To: France, from you) - Autumn, 1902: I haven't had occasion to talk with you yet, but I wanted to say: Well played! And if you haven't, talk to Germany. You're in a strong position and there's no reason you can't make a deal with him.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Russia says he wants to talk peace and a I/T/R alliance vs. Austria. Let me know if he proposes same to you. Will keep you posted.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: France is going to survive for a long time because of England's tactical blunders; He's going to stay at 5 centers for at least one year and probably two. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Germany makes a deal with France and turns on England. I will mention it to Italy; probably good to send him a feeler as well. What do you propose?
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: He may decide to go to Syria, he may decide to go to Smyrna, he may decide to head home. None of these change your turn since there's nothing to cover and holding Venice is vital - you'd have to be damn sure he was headed to Apulia or the Adriatic to try and bounce him in either, and neither is clearly better than the other plus he might keep going east. I'd say this turn you hold tight, then you have builds and he disbands, at which point we see where he positions.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1902: You're not going to get anything in the west for a long time; I'm curious why you passed up the western move. There are now two possibilities: F Venice is a fake designed to disguise the fact that I'm facing an Austria/Italy alliance that for some reason doesn't want to work with Russia, or Austria just struck out at you and is on my side. If we are in world one and the alliance holds, there's nothing I can do. I have England and Germany on my side but they won't save me in this case. However, you'll also be at Austria's mercy given where your units are and how many of them you have so you'd better hope he doesn't stab you either now by staying in Venice or later. If we are in the second world, you messed up big time by going for MAR in an attack that was never going to work instead of covering Venice and just got stabbed by Austria (either he's my ally or he's playing all three of us for fools) or are about to face him not leaving which is the same thing. At that point, you need to get your forces back to Italy as quickly as possible. You're facing a likely disband this turn, and if that happens the war on me is over. I knew this was a possibility, and I considered trying to stop you, but I decided I couldn't afford to because of the rest of my situation and had to gamble since the right move in my mind was heading west. I'm not mad, you didn't promise me anything and if you leave I won't hold this against you. Now, you have a choice. You can trust Austria to leave Venice and try your convoy, or you can defend against Austria by doing a convoy to Apulia (disbanding the second fleet) or a move to Adriatic/Ionian and disband the army in Tunis. You take a chance either way, I leave it to you.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1902: i am willing to talk. austria was very shortsighted in that move, maybe we can agree on a temporary peace with italy to split him three ways and go from there. surprised germany split his forces and moved on two fronts, france will be much harder to digest now
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: You have the support of serb. ----- Tacitly do you have any ideas about how to handle IT.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Austria is playing both sides to try and grab centers, Germany (and by implication, England later on) are on the march in the north and I have my own problems. If you're willing to talk, so am I. If not, I'm curious as to why exactly you're so out to get me when all my moves were due to agreements we made in advance but you can explain it after the game.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1902: Not your fault, he was always going to tell you that. Thank you for the support. I was *this* close to going to Eastern Med, or informing him I was going to do a mixed strategy involving it (I do love playing with LW players but you can't mess with heads that aren't aware enough). Italy knows how this game works and if he wanted me to think he was headed west (and if he is headed west he wants me to think that) he builds F Rome not Naples. The moment he didn't I got a chill down my spine but I didn't know that he'd know to do the Lepanto... and sending an army west while doing it was monumentally greedy and dumb. I'm hoping I can get him to fold. Austria is banking on the fact that no one is headed his way to try and play all sides - he's representing that he doesn't know the rules and that's why he didn't help into Romania. I don't believe him but I have to admire what he's doing, although I suspect he's going to at least have Italy at his throat if he tries to hold Venice, and he's not in good position to end that quickly. If Austria and Italy are allied against me, of course, France makes four and things look pretty grim especially for me. What I think we should do now is to offer him support into Galicia on condition that he helps me into Romania. Army moves up to Sweden. Russia then has to lose two units, and can't defend StP in the north without leaving the northern fleet alive which would be suicide elsewhere.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1902: I very much did want to be in Rum. I asked you for your support, and you declined to give it - if you'd given it I would be there. I ask again in the fall and this time it's completely free - Serbia isn't doing anything else and it's not like there's any way I'm allied to Italy after that move. Ask Germany for your help into Galicia, and there's a good chance he'll give it to you. This was the Italian move I feared, not a move to Greece, but I felt I couldn't afford to cover after last turn. If we'd gone with my plan, we'd be in both Romania and Galicia with Germany's help and be halfway home. I brought Germany in to join us, but didn't want to reveal that in advance. Now I need to spend a unit defending Smyrna, although I don't *really* need to since he's almost certainly going to either convoy to Syria or withdraw and he's going to have to disband a unit - if Germany is headed east he's not about to assist Italy in taking MAR. My proposal is: Army Serbia and Army Bulgaria support Black Sea to Romania, which we take 90% of the time. Vienna goes to Galicia, hopefully with Silesia's support. Germany knocks down Sweden and Russia becomes a 4-center power while you grow to 6 and I get to 5, and Italy shrinks to 3. Then Russia is facing a supported attack into StP in the fall, multiple units facing Warsaw and multiple units facing Sevastopol. In other words, he is toast. Italy will fall before France.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1902: My apologies, I actually did think Italy was heading west. Anyhow, I intend to take Sweden and march on Warsaw and St Petersburg, so Russia will be fighting on at least two fronts.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: ------------- Anyway I would like to work against IT while you work against RU. This ok with you?
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1902: Interesting you did not want to be in rum.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Will do.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: attack from black sea not bulgaria. support from bulgaria.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Assume the following orders: Russia: F Sev S F Rum-Bla, F Rum-Bla, A Ukr-Rum Then, scenario 1: Turkey: A Bul-Rum, F Bla S A Bul-Rum. Black Sea is dislodged and its support is cut, moves to Romania are a standoff. Turkey: A Bul S F Bla-Rum, F Bla-Rum. The moves each have 1 support, so it is a standoff/bounce and neither unit moves. Sevastopol's support counts as support for Romania here, so I don't win.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: If you move from bulg to rum with support from the black sea your support gets cut off right? If you move from black sea to rum with support from bulg then you are not cut off and are 2-1 and win?
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: If your worry is that we aren't covering Greece, don't be because even if Italy does convoy there (which I very much doubt since he's exposing Venice and getting himself into a quagmire, but is possible) F Aegean Sea and A Serbia can take it back if Trieste moves to Adriatic or Albania and cuts off support from Ionian Sea.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Russia's lied to me twice, so it's not going to come to that. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice can't sound like George Bush. I don't know *why* he's done it, but he has. According to the rules, two units cannot exchange places with each other - if the move into Romania is stronger than the move into Black Sea then the move into Romania wins and his fails, leaving him nowhere to retreat and his unit is destroyed. In any case, it's a free support from Serbia since you're going to Galicia and therefore not fooling anyone, but it's your call. My move is the same either way.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: ----- btw RU will never team up with you. I think I could betray him and he still would be willing to team up with me against you a turn later.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: why would he not take the black sea?
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Ah. OK, here's how the rules work: Equally supported mutual attacks bounce. So if I go Bla-Rom with Bul's support, and he goes Rom-Bla with Sev's support, we bounce. Thus, without Serbia's support nothing will happen this turn. With Serbia's support, I succeed and he fails. If he's going Sev-Bla, then I get in but he wouldn't be asking for your support *into* Romania so he's intending to go the other way. Either way, I will do as you think is best.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: OK, so let's do it. Black Sea to Romania supported by Bulgaria and Serbia only fails if he for more strange reason stands pat with Ukraine and Sevastapol supporting, at which point you take Galicia with Vienna/Budapest and he's in an actively worse spot than last turn.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: You should have enough power to get in on your with RUS taking the black sea. RU expects me to assist him into Rum
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Will you support me from Serbia?
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: I think you should take rum from the black sea.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: I will check again before 9 (eastern), then again just after 10 and continuously in the last period.
9 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Just woke up.
9 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: ping you on?
8 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1902: You didn't propose anything so I might as well try and make a suggestion. I've got nothing to lose, and believe it or not there's still a way. We can still do the disband-the-fleet trick, potentially (and you'd keep one around for a while at least in Sevastopol where it doesn't get in the way). Austria's worried about Italy and only has four units so good chance we can show him a fight and then catch him totally unawares in the fall; it can even be *his* unit in Romania and the trick works just as well since it's then logical of him to expose Serbia and the fleet can snag Greece. Alternatively, I could attack Romania from the Black Sea, wiping out your fleet, then you could re-attack Romania and kill my fleet off. Could potentially fool Austria for the whole year. Italy is likely interested as well (and will certainly be at least neutral unless you know otherwise). If the second fleet is gone and the Black Sea secure I'd have no reason NOT to trust you, since you can't retaliate, and you know you can trust me because I can trust you and because it's in my interest to play along: Why would I fight a long battle I may not even be able to win and probably hand the game to England/Germany when I can take Austria apart quickly instead? Also, the story of being double stabbed and STILL making the alliance work would be so unbelievably cool and full of bonus points for me that there's no way I'd wreck it. The alternative even if you get Austria is that unless you also have Italy you're on the wrong side of a four-on-three. Italy/Germany/England/Turkey becomes a de facto quadruple alliance, and even if I die before the cavalry can save me you'll be flanked and France will be dead.
8 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1902: How confident are you that Italy is headed primarily west? He's managed to say so little both Austria and I are worried about him.
8 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Ah, thought it was the word it. Whoops. I think you're his third most likely target.
8 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Spring, 1902: I'm going to attempt to take either Marseilles or spain this year.
8 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: IT = Italy.
8 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Sure. If you don't want to do it don't click ready yet so I can switch to new orders. On reflection there's a bigger chance than I thought he tries to go Sevastopol to Black Sea instead, since otherwise I can according to the rules stall him completely by going Black Sea to Romania with support from Bulgaria (equally supported attacks in different directions, which is a standoff). If he guesses wrong on who is taking Romania, he loses his fleet completely unless he sends Sevastopol to Armenia, which is at best theoretically possible. Also, if you tell me what Russia is asking you to do, I can probably figure out what his move is going to be...
8 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: Thinking about IT...
8 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1902: My hope was a 5 on 2 against Austria and France, but Russia stabbed me. I'm assuming for now that the likely alliances are Russia/Austria/France (effectively) against England/Germany/Italy/Turkey, which is great for the three of you as much as that puts me in an awkward spot. I have hope Austria will help me against Russia while I wait for the cavalry from the west but I have doubts that will happen. It's your call how much of your forces you want to commit to the east versus the west. Any heads-up regarding your plans would be appreciated.
7 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1902: I think that's an excellent question, and the second fleet should bother you - I would warn him not to build a third, would have tried to steer the first to Denmark and kept him at one, if it was me, but it's a newbie game and neither of you probably thought that through. Bottom line he's got a good thing going. He gets to pick off Sweden to go to six centers and carve up France with you, then has a natural second target in Russia. He'd be pretty dumb to come after you. I'm more worried about Italy. If he knew the game and was friendly to me he'd have built F Rome to let me know he was going west, and he chose not to, so it's a little scary, but this turn tells all for him. He can help distract Austria for sure. My hope is that Austria is with us and we have 5 against 2, but if not I'll obviously throw my lot in with E/G/I. Austria is not going to be neutral in my war with Russia - if he's not with us, he's against us. I'm offering to hand him Romania in the spring, and hopefully he'll take it.
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1902: I need to march on Paris. Maybe in 1903...
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1902: How much do you trust Germany? With an E/G/I assault on France, I don't expect it to hold for too long. It seems that Aus and Ger are friendly and I have an alliance with Ger. Neither myself nor Russia can afford war in the North sea for now, but if we can pit I/Aus against each other, it would leave E/G/T alliance free for a three pronged assault on Russia and France is carved up. Lack of action between R/G is a question of diplomacy, however.
7 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Here's the plan: The hope is he messes up, but presumably he doesn't. We'll get Romania, he'll dislodge me. At that point, I retreat to Ankara. My army in Bulgaria goes to Greece, Constantinople to Bulgaria. Aegean Sea moves to Con, Ankara cuts Black Sea's support to protect Romania if necessary, supports Aeg-Con if not. Russia is now a five center power since he's lost Romania and must disband, or a four if Germany knocks out Sweden (but he presumably gives up that fleet then). I build an army in Smyrna. If he's in Armenia, the army in Smyrna cuts the support and I reclaim the Black Sea. If not, your army in Romania cuts support from Sevastopol the same way (Bulgaria can back up another army moving in, and we can just get it back either way if we lose it) so he has no defense and we get Black Sea back in Spring 1903. Then we have a minimum of four units on him: Galicia, Romania, Black Sea and Armenia/Smyrna. Galicia cuts Ukraine to allow Romania to move into Sevastopol with Armenia/Black Sea supports, cutting him down to 3 units that matter and either a guessing game or an opportunistic England and/or Germany later and we're home free to start on Italy. Long term division is presumably Romania/Warsaw to you, Greece/Sevastopol to me, and you can have Moscow; I'm assuming England/Germany will confiscate Sweden and St. Petersburg before we can get to them, and/or we use them as bribes. That plan works even if Russia doesn't end up using units to defend the north, and he probably will; I expect it to be at least a part-way 4-way pile-on by the end of 1903.
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1902: I need to march on Paris. Maybe in 1903...
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1902: How do you plan on dealing with the black sea?
7 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1902: Thank you. Much.appreciated. I realize you cannot spare an army for Silesia.
7 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1902: That depends on Austia and Italy. Austria is playing both sides and I suspect his failure to support me was no accident. If he is friendly then we have time. If not it is pretty bad. If I face all three I probably lose so fast it does not matter. Italy is looking. A lot like a Lepanto move to East Med; he says he will go west but he is at least keeping options open...
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1902: Well, judging by Russia's lies to you, his moves and builds I would say he is about to launch an all-out attack on you, at which point I am honour-bound by our defensive pact to retaliate against Russia, for instance by taking Sweden.
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1902: Russia's no friend of mine, but I can't afford a two front war right now. In a couple of turns, I have plans to turn toward StP, but can't right now unfortunately. I hope to do this while it's still strategically useful for you. Please let me know in advanced how long you think you can wait. Thanks!
7 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1902: Now that he's clearly hostile (Romania was supposed to be a deal to get rid of the fleet, and he said he wouldn't build in Sev), I'm recruiting allies against Russia. It would likely take little effort to walk into St. Petersburg reasonably soon, and there's little Russia could do to strike back.
7 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1902: The Romania attack was actually a plan I had with Russia to take out his southern fleet and then go after Austria (although I obviously had a second option as well at that point, and hadn't decided which to go with), so he has now lied to me twice and he is exposing his northern flank as your builds indicate you've noticed. Can I persuade you to head north and take out Sweden?
7 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1902: Our best move is clearly to attack Romania. By default I will support Serbia to Romania with both Bulgaria and Black Sea. You can choose whether to support with Budapest there or use it to attack Galicia, depending on what you think Russia is going to do. Greece can wait until the fall. It looks awkward, but Romania is impossible to defend and Russia has no valid attack on any of our supply centers. Meanwhile, he's totally exposed in the north if he wants to put up a reasonable fight in the south, and there's no reason E/G wouldn't jump him sooner rather than later to pick up Sweden and St. Petersburg as it costs them little or nothing.
7 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1902: I bring offers of peace, but for now I presume we are at war. Precommitement: If you tell me the truth from this point on, I will play only to survive as long as possible or if another player's actions cause it I will actively favor you. However, If I catch you lying to me again, for any reason, and I haven't broken any promises I've made to you prior to that, I will no longer speak to you in-game and will consider us at permanent war. If then I conclude that I cannot survive, I will attempt to hurt your position as much as possible before I go. (Of course, no meta gaming. In game retaliation only.) What's done is done. You've now outright lied to me twice, this second time completely pointlessly as *I had said I would build F Smyrna regardless of your stated intent* since it's so bad to expose the Aegean Sea. You could have simply said "I will take your statements under advisement" or even nothing at all, and built the fleet. Clearly you are now going to be in a commanding position in any negotiation or deal we make, but that is life. I am angry but I am committed to working with what is, not what might have been. Thus, if you still wish to make peace and work with me rather than against me, I am willing to cooperate in your plans whatever they may be. I will not move a second fleet adjacent to the Black Sea (aka no fleet in Con or Ank, including builds) while I continue to hold it, to give you incentive not to take it. Let me know if there is anything else that would change things.
7 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1902: i am truly sorry
7 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: England unless you are waiting on dipl, you are not, press your ready button.
7 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1901: You have to click the "ready" button near the save button or we wait for the full two days to pass.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Autumn, 1901: ready!
6 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Everyone else is ready to proceed if you are.
6 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: A fine plan for all concerned.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: More bad news for me.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1901: the orders were preliminary of course. i agree that your first turn was not blatantly offensive towards me, and that you declined the opportunity to backstab me last turn, so i dont think you are trying to attack me, but disbanding the fleet was a bit too much to swallow. i like your plan to not build in sev, and move the fleet back to defend next turn. enjoy that serbian vacation, sir, see you in vienna
6 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: I think E/G/I is going to take down France. Germany told me about Italy in advance, so I presume they have a deal of some sort. England is obviously on board too so progress should be rapid.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: Think IT and Ge are working together?
6 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: (tldr: Don't build in Sevastopol and all is forgiven so we can get back to attacking Austria more or less on schedule) I see you've issued orders so presumably you've read what I wrote but haven't responded. I will make my case. First, I am clearly not intending to attack you for real. If I was, my actions to this point do not make sense. I've advised you to keep Austria out of Galicia. I've advised you to send the army into Ukraine, which allowed you to defend Romania against my attack; if I'd wanted to attack Romania I would have tried to make it impossible to defend. Going back a turn, I would have sent my second army to Armenia and used it to attack Sevastopol. I also wouldn't have telegraphed my move in the fall. If I'd wanted to stab you last turn I would have convoyed my army in Constantinople to Sevastopol, which was going to be open whether you were letting me attack Romania or not. What I've done only makes sense if I'm allied with you (and Italy) against Austria. There's also no reason for me to choose the hard road and work with Austria when Italy would be hostile to him. Progress would be extremely slow at best and it's easy to defend from the north if Germany is neutral and off limits. Even if Austria was allowed in Silesia it's extremely slow going even with Italy neutral. There's no reason to take that road when we could have Austria off the map in short order. Yes, things are *slightly* harder than expected, but not much harder and if Greece is open and/or Italy with us it's still trivial; I should be able to vacation in Serbia next winter. My proposed division doesn't change, and I continue to promise Vienna and Budapest. The basic plan didn't change either. Now, as I see it, there are three potential builds you can make here: Option 1: A Moscow, Unit St. Petersburg. This makes it easy for us to trust each other. I will take Greece and head west while you get into position. I'll support the move from Ukraine into Romania with the Black Sea. Option 2: A Sevastopol. I'll do the get-rid-of-the-fleet play in the Spring. We'll be back to normal once the fleet is gone, rebuilding trust; I'd still abandon Black Sea once we got far enough for that. Option 3: F Sevastopol. I'll assume you're hostile and attempt to assemble an alliance of whoever I can starting with Austria but also England and Germany.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1901: thanks for your understanding. i am not sure what austria is playing at either. with ven-pie is italy moving west? that makes this easier. agreed fleet build in sev means war, war is to be avoided
6 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: It happens in real Diplomacy with typos. I missed my whole first turn in a practice gunboat game on the site and was lucky to survive to the end. I'll do what I can to salvage the situation for us, as long as Italy goes west it's not so bad.
6 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: All right, that was just weird; Austria first told me I could have Greece, then in the Summer told me he was taking Greece then didn't take it. No idea what the motivation on that was. Then clearly you didn't want to do the Romania move so we'll have to keep it around for a bit now, but I get it and I know why you didn't tell me so since you knew this gave you a good defense and guarded against a backstab. I'm still on board. New proposal: We make a deal on unit building to position ourselves where we can attack Austria but not each other. You build Army Moscow and a unit of your choice in St. Petersburg. I'll build a fleet in Smyrna. That orients us both in the right direction, then the fleet in Romania can move back to Sevastopol and we move in the army from Ukraine (we can still do the retreat next turn if you like, it still works, but I'm assuming you don't want to), while Moscow moves up to Ukraine. Getting the army into Romania to cut support from Budapest is how we get control of Serbia. Needless to say, with or without a deal if you build a fleet in Sevastopol I will assume we are at war.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: I'm so pissed I would quit if it was not so lame for the rest of the players.
6 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: Computer error :(
5 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: I could have waltzed into Greece, or you could have supported me into Romania. Instead, neither happened. Why?
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1901: I'm thinking of splitting the difference and taking a cut of France with England and Germany. Tunis and Piedmont this move, then have one army stake out a claim in French territory and the rest of my forces move on Austria.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Going to try for Romania from Bulgaria, I think it's the best option even without help. Any support is appreciated, but I understand completely either way. Hopefully Italy is friendly.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1901: i agree with your analysis, it is done. i believe italy.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Got word from Italy, he's claiming to be on our side in a way that makes this 5-on-2 against France and Austria. If he's telling the truth this all goes much faster, but all we need is for him to remain neutral.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: I agree that once I can safely move out of the Black Sea I will move my fleet out to the Med and it will become a DMZ along with Armenia, and Ankara will be armies-only as well. Here's my proposal: Austria will support himself into Greece. I will move up from Con-Bul and Bul-Rum with support. You'll use Ukraine to support into Galicia - I suspect that Austria will cover Trieste this turn but assuming we don't want to piss off Germany with a move to Silesia there's no downside to supporting, so it doesn't matter what he does. He'll get two builds, which he'll use for two armies (presumably). Next turn, he'll think that I am going to move against you, and so he will use Budapest and Vienna to attack Galicia. Trieste will either guard against Venice, move up to Tyrolia to flank you or move into Budapest/Vienna to replace the unit previously there. Greece will either hold or attempt to sneak the Ionian Sea. He'll only have one support into Galicia, so your move is to flank him in Bohemia and Galicia with your armies while the new army in Sevastopol goes to Romania. Romania moves to Serbia with Bulgaria's support while my new fleet moves into the Aegean to attack Greece. Once I have Constantinople free and Bulgaria/Romania are fully secure I will transfer the fleet to the Med.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Sounds good to me.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Italy) - Autumn, 1901: I'm thinking of splitting the difference and taking a cut of France with England and Germany. Tunis and Piedmont this move, then have one army stake out a claim in French territory and the rest of my forces move on Austria.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Autumn, 1901: that plan leaves you alone with a fleet in the black sea, which seems suicidal for me. will you agree to move your fleet west in return for disbanding mine? give me your proposed moves for you, me and austria
5 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Wow. I have the same worry about him (Germany says Italy's headed west, but I don't give that too much credit either at this point). Italy hasn't said one word to me either, but it makes no sense to give up Tunis to bounce you off Greece even if he's hostile. I wouldn't even mind it, since you get it next year no matter what anyway and he gets no builds. In either case I'd build a fleet in Smyrna and he'd be under tremendous pressure right away. If he's going to attack you I'd assume it would be to steal Trieste. If we feel like we need to support into Greece we can stick with the original plan since it doesn't cost anything (Albania supporting Bulgaria while Black Sea supports Serbia) while also guarding against the sneak convoy into Albania combined with an attack on Trieste, which is the most aggressive play he can make; the reason to switch is to put a third (fourth if Vienna counts, but if you're nervous you're probably guarding Trieste) unit up against Russia and max our builds. I also think that if Italy is actively hostile I can probably sell him on signing up for a triple with both of us, which together with France gives us a dominating position - it's much harder than it looks to beat a smart France quickly if you're under pressure elsewhere.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: IT is playing coy with me. I'm not willing to take the risk.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Austria is refusing to give me Greece now, which is annoying for the time table but makes it very clear which side he is on. He didn't explicitly promise no F Albania but there's no other reason for it. If you trust me, I have an idea: When cooperating against Austria, the southern Russian fleet is useless and gets in the way. If I take it out, it can choose to disband and we can replace it with an army in Sevastapol, giving you three southern armies while leaving room for a fleet in the north, or you can build a fourth army in Warsaw. Meanwhile, you take Galicia and he thinks I'm with him, so he'll probably leave Serbia exposed to an attack from Romania, and you can move your army in right behind. We're basically up a unit. Your share of the spoils doesn't change. However, if you don't want to do it I understand completely.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Could I get support from Serbia for Bulgaria-Romania? That gives us a lock on it. Potentially we could pick up both Romania and Sevastopol and have a lock on at least one. I assume Italy is going to Tunis.
5 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Yeah, Tunis is obvious, and I get that anything anti-France is very explicit. Austria kinda a semi-stabbed me in the spring so I got a little paranoid.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1901: I think Italy was waiting to see what England and myself would do before making an aggressive move against France, and so now he is willing to attack France. And Italy almost always goes for Tunis in the first year.
5 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Autumn, 1901: I'll go the latter but I need my support for success. You should have a good shot at either run or sev.
4 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1901: I hope that you're right. His initial move certainly doesn't look like that is his plan - he's setting up the convoy to Tunis and leaving his fleet in Ionian Sea without moving to Piedmont. Then again, his saying *nothing* to me at all kind of means he doesn't care what I do, which if he was planning to attack me he very much would.
4 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Autumn, 1901: Italy is also planning to attack France, so I don't think you have to worry about him.
4 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Looks like we both got what we wanted out of the deal. Assuming the west is what it looks like, are you having any luck getting Italy in on the fun? He's been silent and that worries me.
4 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Are you pro or anti Austrian? If you're anti Russia is on board and we can slice him up quickly; if you're pro, I can head north into Russia while you pile onto France.
4 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Looks like England's headed south after all and Sweden is secure; looks a lot like England+Germany vs. France. No idea if Austria still wants to hand me Greece but I'm working on the guy. If you want to keep up the ruse, there are a few ways we can mock fight that bounce off harmlessly.
4 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Autumn, 1901: Plan still for me to take Greece in the fall? If so let me know if you want support for Serbia-Romania; he could stop it with Ukraine but good chance he won't to either cover Sevastapol or support into Galicia. Alternatively, with your support we could take Romania from Bulgaria against any defenses, and you could take Greece and trade later.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: You can also say I lied to you and said I wouldn't go there if you would like. That is easy to buy.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: I think he is playing that up, but he is a little concerned yes. I think that the treaty provides a justification for you letting me have Black Sea without it looking weird, since you can say Germany would have denied you Sweden.
3 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1901: austria is worried about the germany/turkey alliance and wants to side with me against you. do you see strategic value in pretending not to be allied? giving you black sea is an obvious alliance
3 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1901: kk
3 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: OK, we have a Russia, so back to the original plan.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: Fleet in St. Petersburg should definitely go to Sweden, but whether you get it is up to the German. If you're confident England is on the attack, you should send Moscow north leaving one army and the fleet. That leaves Warsaw to hold the south, with Galicia being the safe move since you either get in or prevent him from getting in.
3 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1901: i have intel england is going north, i am tempted to take sweden so i get units and have defenses in place, but that doesnt leave much to attack austria unilaterally
3 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: Thank goodness you're here, Russian man! All right, my proposal is we carve Austria first. He's agreed to give me Greece, so I'll take the Black Sea and move my armies up to Con/Bul and then in the fall occupy Gre/Bul; once we have Greece we can move on the rest. Assuming we don't need to give Italy a piece, you can have Vienna, Budapest and Romania. I like Moscow-Ukraine and Warsaw-Galicia to put him under pressure right away.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1901: And we have a full game. On the repeats, I find you have to hit the Global (or similar) button to avoid repeats.
3 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1901: both germany and austria are asking for peace
3 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Russia) - Spring, 1901: russia here, natural allies i agree, what moves do you propose?
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: Sorry about repeated messages guys... it's happening by accident when I refresh the page.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: Is it possible to kick/replace them?
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1901: France is in the house, which is good, but I don't know how to replace Russia and we definitely can't do it before Spring 1901. I'm acting like Russia is in Civil Disorder until we see orders or a message.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: Is it possible to kick/replace them?
3 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: If you're here, please let me know as soon as possible so there's enough time to actually talk before the turn.
3 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1901: I'll take that as a no. Shall we all agree that unless they show up this is a five player game and carve them up accordingly?
3 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: Needless to say, if this turns out to be a five player game I'm headed straight for Sevastapol this year, then it makes sense to go after Italy while he's busy in the west carving up France.
2 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1901: I'd definitely be open to something like that, although obviously it will be a while before the two of us can meaningfully interact. Might not be that long if Russia's not in the game at all, but that would be a shame.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1901: Has anyone received a message from either of them?
2 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: Didn't anticipate that read, although I see how you could think that. On the contrary. It's designed (on my end) to get Russia to give me the Black Sea and I think there's a good chance I can get him to deny Sweden to Russia, and together these make it much easier to take him apart very fast, potentially denying him any builds at all in year one. There's also the question of whether he's even playing; he hasn't sent me a message yet and I presume by your global comments he didn't send one to you either. The pact will be irrelevant in a few turns once it's clear I'm going after Russia anyway.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: I mean 5 on 2, obviously.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: I mean 5 on 2, obviously.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: 4 on 2 alliance against F and R if they don't move within, say, 5 hours from the end of turn?
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from England) - Spring, 1901: 4 on 2 alliance against F and R if they don't move within, say, 5 hours from the end of turn?
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Austria) - Spring, 1901: ------- Are France and Russia playing?
2 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1901: --------- I read your agreement with Germany as indirectly hostile toward me.
2 Dec 2010	(To: You, from England) - Spring, 1901: I see that you that you have formed an alliance with Germany. FYI, I'm negotiating a tactical alliance with Germany as well. This information could be useful to you for mid-game tactics: if Germany decides to backstab either of us, perhaps we can coordinate retaliation? Not a bad insurance policy for either of us, to maintain control of our respective spheres.
2 Dec 2010	(To: England, from you) - Spring, 1901: Let me know if you're ever interested in going after Russia, as sentiments seem to be headed in that direction and it could be an easy raid to pick up St Petersburg. Either way, curious what's happening over in the other corner of the world. Tell everyone I said hi.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: Pact with Germany is purely defensive; he suggested it and it seemed like a harmless bit of fluff. It doesn't include Sweden, so I don't see any reason I'd have to act on it unless you have actual designs on Germany. If/when you want to do that, we'll talk.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from you) - Spring, 1901: Affirmed by Turkey. Good luck, everyone!
2 Dec 2010	(To: Global, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: Announcing mutual defence pact between Germany and Turkey: if Russia moves or supports a move against Germany, Denmark, the Baltic sea, Turkey, Bulgaria or the Black sea, both Germany and Turkey will retaliate.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: I wouldn't have it any other way.
2 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1901: Sounds good.
2 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: And also I shall claim Denmark and the Baltic sea if that is ok with you?
2 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: Logical plan then is I'll go to Black Sea with the fleet and use my armies to take Bulgaria and Greece. I expect a clash over Black Sea in the spring, but I could be pleasantly surprised in which case I can help with Romania right away together with the armies presumably in Serbia and Galicia. I can then build a 2nd fleet and an army to take out Sevastapol in year two. I'm also trying to stir up some trouble for him in the north.
2 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: If you announce, I'll confirm as soon as I see it. Any attack on Turkey or Germany by Russia is an attack on the other. If you want it to be especially helpful, you can note that I consider the Black Sea part of Turkey, given its proximity to three of the four core Turkish centers (Bulgaria counts).
2 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: Ok, that's agreed then. I might deny him Sweden anyway unless he can persuade me otherwise - it costs me nothing and costs him a supply centre. Shall we announce the defensive pack publicly in global chat then?
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: Sure, let's do it.
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: Ok, that's agreed then. I might deny him Sweden anyway unless he can persuade me otherwise - it costs me nothing and costs him a supply centre. Shall we announce the defensive pack publicly in global chat then?
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: It does seem that way. Site's clearly been wonky today. Happy to do a purely defensive pact, since there seems to be very little downside. He has a strong interest in neither of us messing with him. It's generally quite bad if he provokes you to do as little as deny him Sweden.
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: I might be interested in attacking Russia later, but not as an opening gambit.
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: Hmm, it seems repeatedly sending messages happens a lot...
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: A defensive pact is all I am currently interested in. We could publicly announce it, which should deter Russia from attacking either of us.
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: A defensive pact is all I am currently interested in. We could publicly announce it, which should deter Russia from attacking either of us.
1 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: Sounds good to me; In exchange I get Bulgaria and Greece.
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Austria) - Spring, 1901: I'll go serbia romania.
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: Oops, it seems that reloading the page resends the message. Odd.
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: Do you have an offensive in mind, or something solely defensive?
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: Do you have an offensive in mind, or something solely defensive?
1 Dec 2010	(To: You, from Germany) - Spring, 1901: Hi! Well, the one thing we could discuss is a mutual defence pact against Russia?
1 Dec 2010	(To: Germany, from you) - Spring, 1901: Hi, this is Turkey. Welcome to the game! I don't expect us to have too much business to discuss for a while, but it's always possible that we do if you intend to head over to Russia or Austria. Let's just say that I don't believe in fair fights when I don't have to.
1 Dec 2010	(To: Italy, from you) - Spring, 1901: Hi, this is Turkey. Welcome to the game! I'm hoping we can work together, or at the very least give each other the freedom to go our separate ways until that becomes more practical. I'd much rather fight an easy battle than a hard one, so I see no reason to be on opposite sides. Let me know which direction you have in mind!
1 Dec 2010	(To: Austria, from you) - Spring, 1901: Hi, this is Turkey. The first LW game has a highly successful alliance between Austria and Turkey against Russia, which are very hard to stop if done right for tactical reasons. If you're willing I'd be all for it, and you can pick any two of Serbia, Greece and Romania for yourself in exchange for the other one plus Bulgaria.
1 Dec 2010	(To: Russia, from you) - Spring, 1901: Hi, this is Turkey. I've always felt Turkey's most natural ally has always been Russia and it's doubly better given that in both LW games Italy hasn't been able to resist the temptation to jump on Austria. The first order of business of course is what to do with the Black Sea. Ideally I'd buy it off of you in exchange for other things, starting with support for Romania whenever you need it and a DMZ in Armenia, but I'm open to any possibility that doesn't involve a Russian fleet ending up there (including an intentional clash).