Hormann and UAP1

[JVD]

Hi,

Does anyone here have experience with linking a Hormann garage gate via UAP1 into Loxone?

I bought the UAP1 for my garage door, but want to make sure to wire it up correctly.

Since I'm not that experienced with connecting hardware to the Loxone, I would like to ask for some information.

Would you be able to detail how you wired the UAP1 to the Loxone?

ex: which connection pins on the UAP1 to which connection on the Loxone Miniserver or extension?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Regards,

Jasper

[smartbusinesstools.be]

Inputs to Hormann:

17+20 on a DO: pulse to close

15+20 on a DO: pulse to open

23+20 on a DO: pulse to stop

Outputs from Hormann:

24V from Loxone on 01.5, 02.5, 04.5

01.8 on a DI: fully open

02.8 on a DI: fully closed

[JVD]

Thanks for the fast response, this helps a lot to confirm my thinking.

Just a few practical questions to be 100% sure:

- For inputs to Hormann: does it mean that I have to run 6 wires for this section from Loxone to Hormann? Or is it possible to reuse the wire for 20 in some way by looping on the UAP?

- For outputs from Hormann: Does it mean I start on the miniserver (or extension) from the 24V in the section of the DI's to 04.5 and then from there loop that to 01.5 and 02.5?

   Or do I understand it incorrectly?

   

Op vrijdag 13 januari 2017 10:06:20 UTC+1 schreef smartbusinesstools.be:

[JVD]

Hi,

Thanks for the advise, I was able to get it working from the first attempt.

There is only one detail I didn't yet figure out:

There is a pulse input signal on the UAP1 for 'Stop', but I don't find in the gate controller in the Loxone Config an output for stop.

Only for pulse to open and pulse to close.

Does anyone know how to configure the stop output?

Or doesn't it make any sense to have the stop connected to a loxone output?

Regards,

Jasper

[smartbusinesstools.be]

You can add a 'stop' pulse via some simple logic

[Brad]

Does anyone have suggestions for a good garage door integration for us here in the USA?

[MM10]

Hi JVD, 

I am having my Hormann Garage doors fitted today. I have also purchased the UAP1 Module for both doors which i am hoping to play around with this weekend. 

Would be interested on how you configured loxone to work with the garage doors. Any chance you can post/send me some screenshots? 

Also if anyone else has done this. :) 

Thanks

[Karl Peterson]

Brad:

You can modify a garage door remote to remove the builtin button(s) and solder some leads on, then use a loxone relay in momentary-contact mode to trigger the remote. You can even rig up a constant voltage power supply so it doesn't need to use a battery. I've seen this done and it works well in some retrofit instances.

The alternative to this is to do essentially the same thing with your your existing garage door opening button, again with the loxone relay, but this time interface with the button on the opener switch.

Finally, many commercial garage door openers can interface with simple contact switches, and thus can be directly controlled from a loxone relay without interfacing to it's existing control buttons.

Once you have the control portion figured out, you can use magnetic reed switches and digital inputs to read the open/closed status of the door. You may already have these for alarm purposes.

Thanks, Karl P

Edit: I should also note that if you are interfacing in zwave devices by way of a slaved ISY or similar, you could likely use the GoControl Z-Wave opener and just build the command and feedback mechanisms off network calls.

[David Wallis]

I just cant cope with this, why would you want to rely on automating the button pushing on a remote - if your going to the trouble of that then why not dig into the controller and solder on in there.. and also unsolder the reciever module at the same time for a little more security.

But even easier, why not just drive the motor directly? A relay could be used to control interlocking on the motor and another to control the power. so could be done with two outputs, and prob 3 inputs, Fully Open/Fully Closed/Stop

[Karl Peterson]

A few reasons:

In the States at least, many of the garage doors on the market now don't use regular contact closures to trigger their up/down motions, but instead some sort of communicating protocol.

This means that there is no direct way to ask it to go up and down in the absence of their controllers - hence my statement about modifying an official controller.

You could indeed go through the effort to modify the opener control circuit itself, but this might be much more difficult than you imagine. Modern openers are quite technically complex and "hacking" them is much easier said than done. There won't be simple up/down controls on them, as a micro controller will be running everything, a micro-controller which receives commands over it's comm bus. You could hack the comm bus, but I doubt it'd be worth it.

As to running the motor directly, three problems. First: A meaningful percent of openers are using motors which need specific motor controllers - controllers you would need to cut out if you're going to try and pull out it's control solution. This isn't a problem on all openers, but it is on some of them. Second: If you do the modification, no garage door repair company will ever touch it, so whoever does the modification will be responsible for keeping it working forever. Third: There are actually a lot of building codes and UL listing guidelines around openers. You'll be breaking almost all of them to perform this modification. In doing so you inherent a lot of liability. Hopefully nothing bad ever happens, but if it does you'll be liable for it. For all these reasons I wouldn't do it.

But all of this is besides the point. I answered the question presuming that the poster had a pre-existing consumer door he wanted to control. Thus I answered the question of how that is typically done, in the States.

If you wanted a more robust answer to this question, you'd just buy an opener with good support for remote control systems. They exist and are relatively common here.

While they are a higher cost than a typical residential opener, something like the LiftMaster T series can easily be ordered with an interface for a 3rd party control system. https://www.liftmaster.com/t-trolley-operator/p/T

An opener such as this is not only more robust than your typical opener, but will also easily work with an automation system while maintaining all its listing and code needs.

Thanks, Karl P

[David Wallis]

I appreciate that some don't use contact closures, and understand regarding protocols. - And also how weak most of them are security wise. I've automated a couple before - not with loxone though.

A nice touch can be a rotary encoder / multi turn potentiometer to actually know the position but might be a bit ott..

as for reverse engineering protocols, why re-invent the wheel? http://blog.bouni.de/2018/reverse-engeneering-the-hormann-uap1-protocoll.html :D

Even if you have a pre-existing door you could add a KNX roller shutter controller, anyway this is a bit irrelevant as I dont have one of these doors.. i have something pretty old and simple and currently plant to drive the motor and interface with limit switches and add and a safety edge, instead of the IR beam which is mounted higher than our dogs head height :o

I suppose maybe the thing is that the typical electric doors in the UK are quite different to the US ones.